When on M mode...what is the first setting you decide on?

[Kauaicrazed]

So this might sound like a dumb question. But what is the first setting you decide on? ISO, Aperture or Shutter speed? Does it depend on what you are trying to achieve? What lens you have or what?

[elysium]

First thing is you do is look at the exposure bar. Is the shot going to be exposed.

Then depending on what you are shooting, adjust your aperture or shutter speed. If you shutter speed is not quick enough, raise the ISO to compensate.

It really depends on personal preference. I know some people will always raise ISO as a last resort.

[tonylong]

Yes, it depends on what you are shooting. Experience leads you to sometimes think along the lines of aperture priority, sometimes along the lines of shutter priority, and taking lighting under consideration when setting your ISO. But, again, experience has you in Manual able to consider all these things as equal parts of the equation, whereas in an Auto or semi-Auto mode you're letting the camera decide.

[Kauaicrazed]

First thing is you do is look at the exposure bar. Is the shot going to be exposed.

Then depending on what you are shooting, adjust your aperture or shutter speed. If you shutter speed is not quick enough, raise the ISO to compensate.

It really depends on personal preference. I know some people will always raise ISO as a last resort.

Thank you! Another dumb question. But the goal is to have the line in the middle of the exposure bar?

[tonylong]

Thank you! Another dumb question. But the goal is to have the line in the middle of the exposure bar?

That is only what the camera suggests when metering the scene, and it also depends on what metering mode you are in and what the camera is metering on. When the camera meters a scene or a subject, its suggested "middle position" will render that scene or subject a middle tone. Sometimes this is desireable, but if, say, you meter snow, the camera will underexpose it, whereas if you have a scene with shadows and highlights and you meter for the shadows, the highlights will be blown. Experience will help you to work with your meter in various scenes: for example, if you have a clear bright blue sky you can meter the sky and adjust it to +1 EV as a good starting point for a sunlit foreground. But such assumptions are starting points that, in a scene with a lot of dynamic range, might throw you off. I bracket exposures a lot: start off with an assumed "correct" exposure, then take shots with adjusted settings to give different renderings. Also, the histogram is your friend!

[elysium]

Thank you! Another dumb question. But the goal is to have the line in the middle of the exposure bar?
You do not need to get it bang on but its the cameras in built meter telling you it is the "correct exposure". You can get it slightly off since you can process later. Most people do aim for this since when shooting at higher ISO's, under/overexposing photos can show more noise/grain/

And you can also chose to ignore it in certain situations such as when using flash.

[sgogula]

Thank you! Another dumb question. But the goal is to have the line in the middle of the exposure bar?

May not be always. When i am shooting portraits in the night I keep the shutter speed to 1/focal length to avoid blurred images. In this case, you may see the bar towards left (-ve). flash would compensate for the correct exposure. But you may get background dark.

Experts could correct me if i am wrong.

[Lowner]

"Does it depend on what you are trying to achieve"?

Yes, always.

[KarlosDaJackal]

Usually you would set the creative options first.

1a. Aperture, would be top of the list as DOF is a really useful tool for the majority of images.
1b. Shutter, would be next to avoid camera shake blur and to give you the option of showing movement, or frezzing action.
2. ISO, set the other 2 first and then adjust the iso to allow those settings. Better to get the image you want with a bit of noise, than to get no image at all (there are many strategies for removing noise in PP, why not use them)

I realise I have the number one down twice, but they are nearly equal. If its a static or slow moving subject aperture can become more important, if its moving Shutter can be more important.

I know depending on the lens what sort of settings to start with to get the best though. So when the nifty 50 goes on, usually the apeture is set between 1.8 and 2.8 and the shutter 1/50 to 1/80, then iso as low as it will allow me. When the sigma 70-300 apo goes on, shutter goes straight to 1/320 apeture 5.6 to 8, and iso as low as it will go but usually 800 with the dull irish weather.

This converstation kinda is starting to veer towards metering modes, but to be honest, once you pick a metering mode that works for you I think you stick with it (or throw it straight to evalutive if you keep getting it wrong ;))

[hitmanh]

Does it depend on what you are trying to achieve?

This is it, for sports I want to keep the shutter speed fairly high (at 1/2000 as a minimum) and I tend to want to keep DoF fairly narrow (to cut down on background clutter). After that I try to keep iso at lower speeds to keep noise down, but this is usually somewhere between 200 and 1250, depending on lighting conditions. I fine tune exposure with the aperture. I don't mind under exposing a little, but avoid over exposing as much as possible to avoid blowing the whites.
For other stuff, I stick with keeping shutter speed at twice focal length or faster. This helps control handshake. Otherwise, it's all down to the effect I'm trying to achieve.

Cheers

M

[TheHoff]

I don't think I've ever looked at the camera's exposure bar when in M mode -- that is the whole reason to go to M, the exposure bar is stupid and easily fooled.

[timmyeatchips]

I don't think I've ever looked at the camera's exposure bar when in M mode -- that is the whole reason to go to M, the exposure bar is stupid and easily fooled.

So do you use a seperate meter?

[hitmanh]

So do you use a seperate meter?

Or you can use exposure guides or basic exposure rules (sunny 16, etc)...

http://www.fredparker.com/ultexp1.htm

Cheers

Matt

[TheHoff]

So do you use a seperate meter?

Yup; Sekonic L-398A usually. You can also take the exposure that the camera suggests in Av mode and then adjust based on experience and the histogram but watching the exposure bar between frames is still basically going by the in-camera meter. I'll normally get two manual exposures set in my head -- a shade exposure level and a full light exposure level -- so I have a range that I'll go between in M depending on what the light is doing at the time. This is almost always more consistent than letting the camera do it in a program mode.

[timmyeatchips]

Yup; Sekonic L-398A usually. You can also take the exposure that the camera suggests in Av mode and then adjust based on experience and the histogram but watching the exposure bar between frames is still basically going by the in-camera meter. I'll normally get two manual exposures set in my head -- a shade exposure level and a full light exposure level -- so I have a range that I'll go between in M depending on what the light is doing at the time. This is almost always more consistent than letting the camera do it in a program mode.

That's what I tend to do, but lacking a meter I tend to point the camera at the highlights and shade to see what the arrow says and try to compensate with a bit of common sense.

hitmanh - cheers for the link, but you live in the UK right? When's the last time you had a day where you could actually apply the Sunny 16 rule? =D

[PhotosGuy]

For a good starting point, first set the f-stop & shutter speed you need. Then adjust the ISO.
Need an exposure crutch? (http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=89123)

[TheHoff]

So you're using it as a guideline. Are you going to M mode? That is the next step; take that exposure, go to M mode, then you have the ability to adjust aperture and shutter independently rather than have just one dial for EC.

[KarlosDaJackal]

Or you can use exposure guides or basic exposure rules (sunny 16, etc)...

http://www.fredparker.com/ultexp1.htm

Cheers

Matt

Also you can put the camera on its spot mode (called partial on some model I think) and meter off a medium tone (like green grass) and when you shoot people/animals/cars standing on that grass in that same sunlight you will have a nice exposure.

When you move the camera from the meter point to the subject you can then fine tune your exposure based on the subject also if you need to. (Subject might be very bright/dark subject). Its a useful way of using the in camera metre for info but making the decisions yourself.

Remember exposure is a creative option, its not a scientific equation that is always correct/incorrect. If it was the on camera meter would always be correct :p

[hitmanh]

hitmanh - cheers for the link, but you live in the UK right? When's the last time you had a day where you could actually apply the Sunny 16 rule? =D

I believe there was a day in 1968 when the sun came out :p

Cheers

Matt

[Sorarse]

I usually set my ISO first. If I want best quality I will set it low, which happens to be my default setting. If I know that I am going to want to use higher shutter speeds or smaller apertures to capture motion or increase my DOF, I will use an ISO setting that will allow me to use the speeds and/or apertures I envisage needing to use.

[Wilt]

So this might sound like a dumb question. But what is the first setting you decide on? ISO, Aperture or Shutter speed? Does it depend on what you are trying to achieve? What lens you have or what?

I first decide if the creative element of any shot is more speed related or DOF related, and set that control appropriately first. Then set the other control element to suitable value for exposure, then adjust ISO to bring the second control element closer to what I would like to achieve.

[rral22]

If you want to learn about using your in camera meter in manual mode, start here:

http://www.completedigitalphotography.com/index.php?p=344

[Hermeto]

I first decide if the creative element of any shot is more speed related or DOF related, and set that control appropriately first. Then set the other control element to suitable value for exposure, then adjust ISO to bring the second control element closer to what I would like to achieve.
Exactly!
Aperture and shutters speed are creative elements of the exposure, ISO is not.
F-number and SS are adjusted because you want to; ISO, because you have to..

[gymell]

I use the in camera meter and always shoot manual mode with spot metering. If there is something that is medium tone in the same light as the subject, then I meter from that. If there is something white or very light, I meter from that and make sure the camera meter is overexposed by about a stop. For something very dark, I do the opposite. I adjust ISO if I need to make sure the shutter speed is high enough. This works much better for me than using an automatic exposure and then trying to apply exposure compensation.

[nicksan]

On anything other than sports/action shooting I will set my aperture first, then the shutter speed, keeping in mind the lens and focal length I am using. If my shutter speed is too slow, then I will up the ISO to whatever I need to get the shot.

But it really is situation and lighting specific.

For sports/action shots, I am always thinking fast enough shutter speed.

Unless I have inconsistent lighting (such as partially cloudy day, etc) I'll figure out the settings beforehand and then shoot. I may adjust it occasionally as needed. If I am feeling "lazy" or the lighting is changing too fast and too drastically, I will use Av/Tv modes...otherwise it's always M.


So this might sound like a dumb question. But what is the first setting you decide on? ISO, Aperture or Shutter speed? Does it depend on what you are trying to achieve? What lens you have or what?

[ibdb]

My vote for best answer:

I first decide if the creative element of any shot is more speed related or DOF related, and set that control appropriately first. Then set the other control element to suitable value for exposure, then adjust ISO to bring the second control element closer to what I would like to achieve.

My vote for second best answer:
Exactly!
Aperture and shutters speed are creative elements of the exposure, ISO is not.
F-number and SS are adjusted because you want to; ISO, because you have to..

I approach most situations in terms of DOF first, because that's generally how I visualize a scene. I'll set a shutterspeed appropriate for the subject, and adjust the ISO to get the correct exposure given my first two choices. I don't have any artificial ISO limits in mind. A "noisy" high ISO shot is better to me than a motion blurred lower ISO shot.

[airfrogusmc]

What I usually do is make a couple of very quick spot meter reading to see how much reflective contrast there is in the scene. Then I decide what is important, shadow vs. highlight then make my exposure decision on that info.

[Wilt]

What I usually do is make a couple of very quick spot meter reading to see how much reflective contrast there is in the scene. Then I decide what is important, shadow vs. highlight then make my exposure decision on that info.


Yup...my real process is a combination of what airfrogusmc wrote and what I wrote earlier! I described the camera setting sequence, and airfrogusmc describes my metering procedure which is done before my camera setting process.

[airfrogusmc]

Yup...my real process is a combination of what airfrogusmc wrote and what I wrote earlier! I described the camera setting sequence, and airfrogusmc describes my metering procedure which is done before my camera setting process.

Wilt, great minds think alike ;):D

Everything I decide f stop/aperture all comes from the initial readings then after I decide on density (sorry old film term) I then decide on thing like aperture/shutter speed which will effect DoF and movement or lack of.

[Kauaicrazed]

WOW...You are all awesome! Thanks so much for all the replies. I am gonna read them now...appreciate the help!

[debaire]

Or you can use exposure guides or basic exposure rules (sunny 16, etc)...

http://www.fredparker.com/ultexp1.htm

Cheers

Matt

That was a great read. I'm still a relative newbie so that info was invaluable.

[cdifoto]

I usually go ISO first. It's pretty easy to pick one based on what you're shooting and where you're shooting it after a little while. In other words, after some practice you'll eventually get to the point where you know you need to jack up the ISO or you know you can leave the ISO at a lower setting for a cleaner shot. That's why I set it first. When I go inside, I know I need a higher ISO than when I was outside, so it's the first thing I change. Or vice versa. If I was inside shooting for awhile then I step out into daylight, there's no sense fiddling with any other settings until I get my ISO down.

[Boucher]

First thing I do is almost always set the ISO on 100. then figure out if I can get a decent shutter speed + aperture combo. I usually shoot wide open for portraits or close to it so it doesn't tend to take too long.

[Picture North Carolina]

You should never focus on any setting. Each scene is different. Darker scenes are more susceptible to noise, so that may determine ISO settings. Subject matter and background may determine both aperture and shutter speed (DOF and movement). Don't place your priority on any setting. Place your priority on the image. Study it for a full 30 seconds and decide what you want to do. Then use your settings to achieve it. Don't view your settings as individual functions, but rather as a unified package of variable to achieve your goal

[gymell]

Study it for a full 30 seconds and decide what you want to do. Then use your settings to achieve it.

If only I had that luxury ... there are many times when the shot will be long gone by then. That's why a lot of us do focus in advance on things like what shutter speed we want.

[KarlosDaJackal]

Its digital, be ready, take the picture, think about it a bit, take another, think about it some more, take another. Usually you'll end up keeping the 1st one or the last one, everything in the middle is just a backup plan.

[sapearl]

The first thing I'll do is evaluate how MUCH light I have, and WHERE is it coming from. This drives everything in most of my workflow. My attitude is that I photograph the light, and not things.

Once I know how much I have to work with, then I decide what is more important: a faster shutter speed to freeze action, or a smaller aperture to give me a greater DOF.

I use the above regimen for both landscape (non-flash) photography as well as my wedding/event work. - Stu

[Deckham]

Without reading all the replies:

First I check light, mentally. make sure ISO is at 100
Perhaps fire a shot off and check my meters.

Next, I (depending on whether I am after stopping motion, or DoF primarily), I adjust Tv or Av to give the exposure I need and meet my requirements.

If need be, I then boost ISO.

Finally, I tweak settings as light/situations change.

[Picture North Carolina]

The first thing I'll do is evaluate how MUCH light I have, and WHERE is it coming from. This drives everything in most of my workflow. My attitude is that I photograph the light, and not things.

A timely comment relative to a recent article.

A good read (http://twipphoto.com/archives/1044) for noobies. Simple and basic, but valuable.

[sapearl]

I'll also use a hand held exposure meter - an old analog Sekonic L398, for bridal/portrait work outside.

I like to use it incident mode, with the white plastic dome covering the meter's sensor. I position the meter at the subject, and point the dome back towards the camera. This way, you measure the total amount of light that is falling upon the subject, and not being reflected back to the camera. Done properly you can get an excellent reading this way.

Using the meter then, I will manually set the camera, and also adjust my flash (580ex, on AUTO ETTL) for a pleasing amount of fill.

So do you use a seperate meter?

[sapearl]

Thank you canned - appreciate it :D.

I've always felt that it's the proper recognition, and skilled use of dramatic light that can result in stunning and memmorable images. The trick is to recognize those everyday mundane things that may look boring and uninspiring in the harsh light of a midday sun, and then wonder how those same scenes might be creatively "seen" in the cool early hours of the morning, or under the later slanting rays of an afternoon sun.

Remember these things about light: it has angle, intensity, temperature, contrast, and direction. Experiemnt and play with these things and you can create some wonderful images.;) - Stu

A timely comment relative to a recent article.

A good read (http://twipphoto.com/archives/1044) for noobies. Simple and basic, but valuable.

[airfrogusmc]

Thank you canned - appreciate it :D.

I've always felt that it's the proper recognition, and skilled use of dramatic light that can result in stunning and memmorable images. The trick is to recognize those everyday mundane things that may look boring and uninspiring in the harsh light of a midday sun, and then wonder how those same scenes might be creatively "seen" in the cool early hours of the morning, or under the later slanting rays of an afternoon sun.

Remember these things about light: it has angle, intensity, temperature, contrast, and direction. Experiemnt and play with these things and you can create some wonderful images.;) - Stu

Absolutely Stu...
It is always about the light and all it nuances. I use both incident and spot meter. Spot mostly because I can really get a range of contrast and figure exposure according to that.

Hey, did you have your show yet. I'm old and my memory is not as good as it used to be? (sorry to hi-jack) If do how did it go?