hello Canon ... wake up!!

[petiot]

http://www.dpreview.com/previews/SonyDSLRA900/

once again canon is late. And once again, IF there is a 5DmkII, it will be hard to beat the competition Specs:

- 9 point AF with 10 assist points
- 100% coverage, 0.74x magnification
- SteadyShot INSIDE full frame image sensor shift stabilization (world first) (you either like it or not, but on a full frame, technologically, this is something worth applauding to)
- Supplied with wireless remote control
- Magnesium Alloy body and RUBBER SEALS (not foam tape) for dust and moisture resistance
- AF micro adjustment

It is one thing to make (loosy) teaser. that is something completely different to keep up with the pace imposed by the competition.

[Jim G]

IS on a full-frame sensor... gotta find out how that works... pretty damn funky!

[elysium]

http://www.dpreview.com/previews/SonyDSLRA900/

once again canon is late. And once again, IF there is a 5DmkII, it will be hard to beat the competition Specs:

- 9 point AF with 10 assist points
- 100% coverage, 0.74x magnification
- Supplied with wireless remote control
- Magnesium Alloy body and RUBBER SEALS (not foam tape) for dust and moisture resistance
- AF micro adjustment

It is one thing to make (loosy) teaser. that is something completely different to keep up with the pace imposed by the competition.
STILL, this is a Sony product and their servicing for these products is horrible. I work for the consumer electronics dept and trust me, their service dept service DSLR's like any other product. Canon have a better service history from experience and other reviews I have read.

Plus the limited amount of Sony lenses avail for the Alpha series is not not exactly worth jumping ship for a very few longer lenses to keep up with Canon or Nikon.

This sounds like a great camera on paper but real life, would you really want to switch?

[timnosenzo]

Wow, that's a lot of camera for $3k.... and a helluva lot of pixels!

I couldn't have less interest in a Sony camera, but there are probably a lot of photographers out there with Minolta lenses from film cameras that will be a happy bunch.

[In2Photos]

That has got to be the ugliest camera I have ever seen! Specs look good though!

[JC4]

No doubt Canon got lazy at the top. Competition is good!

Take a look at the example images in the review. Even the ISO800 images are noisy, even at web size. Doesn't look like Sony has caught up on IQ, but the camera does have some appealing features.

[petiot]

That has got to be the ugliest camera I have ever seen! Specs look good though!

lol.. ..true. this one is truly ugly. And true noise seems to be high, although iso 1600 is not that noisy... but with a 4 stop image stabilization high iso might no be used as often (for static subject). The View finder seems to be amazing according to dpreview

[runninmann]

The grip looks to be very ergo friendly.

[basroil]

Sony has really changed the face of the game... It bloodied it up and made it ugly as hell... Seriously, who designed the shape of the body? This camera belongs in 1970s along with disco.

EDIT: Man the files are huge, but that camera has serious image quality issues... If I interpolated my MKIII files to 24MP it'd have less softness and much, much, much less noise (and higher detail). This camera is a joke. If nikon releases one with the same cmos/settings, it will be a laughing stock once the novelty dies down.

[Jman13]

Have you looked at the images? This is not a threat to Canon. I'd take the 50D over those files. It's HORRIBLE at ISO 1600, and absolutely horrendous above that. Huge, blotchy color noise. My 30D handles noise at ISO 1600 and 3200 better than that. In my experience, the blotchy color noise can't be removed in post. I'd take grainier images without the color blotches over smoother highlights with unusable shadows. Even the ISO 800 and 400 images are pretty noisy. I'd say it's about equivalent to my 10D in noise handling, though, of course, the added resolution will mean prints will show noise less with the A900 than with a 10D. Still, the resolution advantage won't offset that horrible noise handling with any modern DSLR.

The 5D II, even with a lower resolution, will trounce this in IQ, and the 1Ds III already smashes it in image quality.

[form]

Except for the ISO6400 image I didn't see any noise that was noticeable at respective on-screen resizing.

I think it's an interesting design, and very good in many ways - not least of all being price.

[sadatk]

That's a damn nice resolution, but as said above--it just can't keep up with the iso performance.

1DS III, NR OFF, 1600: http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/E1DSMK3/FULLRES/E1DSMK3hSLI1600.HTM

http://localhostr.com/files/a2aeb9/Picture+2.png

A900, NR OFF, 1600: http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/AA900/FULLRES/AA900hSLI1600_NR_OFF.HTM

http://localhostr.com/files/8f720d/Picture+1.png

Don't write off the 5D II just so fast. Word I'm hearing is that it's about a stop better than the 50D in ISO. ;)

[egordon99]

Ugly camera, and too bad it doesn't take Canon lenses. But yeah, 24MP FF for $3K! Sure gives the D700 and EOS-1DS MKII a run for their money.

[basroil]

Except for the ISO6400 image I didn't see any noise that was noticeable at respective on-screen resizing.

I think it's an interesting design, and very good in many ways - not least of all being price.

Maybe, but I didn't see any fine detail either :rolleyes:

They have so much noise reduction applied even at iso400 (where there are still colored blobs ON THE BRIGHT SECTIONS), the fine detail is lost. ISO 1600 looks worse than from the fujifilm f50fd... and that's a point and shoot...;)

[lefturn99]

Don't forget to figure in a new hotrod computer and a couple of terrabyte external drives in the cost of the camera.

[Jman13]

Look at how much more detail the 1DsIII image has above, even with the 3MP resolution disadvantage.

[DC Fan]

Relax.

The biennial Photokina trade show in Köln (http://www.photokina-cologne.com/index.php) happens at the end of the month. The approach of the show is time for product announcements. It's the marketing ritual of the imaging business. The Sony announcement is part of the ritual. It's a silicon-and-glass version of "signing day" for college football fans in the U.S.

For the last decade, there's been steady improvement in all areaa of digital imaging. If you buy a camera, it's already obsolete and the new model already is being designed.

Nothing announced at Photokina is going to mysteriously cause your existing camera to stop working and force you to buy a new one. :)

[flickserve]

Do you think Nikon will use this Sony sensor?

[thatkatmat]

I'll tell you what, looks pretty good to me, $3k? The system overall is getting better and better, with all the nice G and Zeiss glass, looking much better than a year ago for Sony/Minolta users. I wish we could get a slew of Zeiss primes with AF, something to choose from between the L's and another premium line.
Kinda funny though...they put this new a900 out for $2999 then a 16-35/2.8 for $1800. So if they don't get you on the body, they WILL get yopu on the glass and accesories..
Wish I could get a 1Dsmk3 for even 5K:(
I also hope if and when the 5Dmk2 comes around that it is reasonably priced....but I doubt it, it will sell like hotcakes for $3200

[scorpio_e]

Do you think Nikon will use this Sony sensor?

I understand the NEW top of the line Nikon is NOT using a Sony sensor.

[Tee Why]

Here is a field preview, the reviewer compares it against the 5D I think.
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/cameras/a900-nr.shtml

[Colorblinded]

Do you think Nikon will use this Sony sensor?
Hopefully no for Nikon's sake. I'm not impressed by the images I'm seeing from the Sony. I haven't seen mention of whether the Sony is 12 or 14 bit either.

[ImRaptor]

That's a damn nice resolution, but as said above--it just can't keep up with the iso performance.

1DS III, NR OFF, 1600: http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/E1DSMK3/FULLRES/E1DSMK3hSLI1600.HTM


A900, NR OFF, 1600: http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/AA900/FULLRES/AA900hSLI1600_NR_OFF.HTM



Okay, while I'm no fan of the Sony camera, doing an ISO comparison against a 1Ds MK3 is a bit of an odd choice. While the MP count is similar, the cost discrepency is a bit to much to overcome. Basically, the 1DS MK3 had better be leaps better at the price tag that comes with it.

[apersson850]

I assume you've seen that Sony have now introduced their full frame camera body?
It has nothing directly to do with our Canon cameras, of course, but offering a camera that pixelwise outranks the 1Ds Mark III with 24.6 megapixel in full frame format, at a cost of around USD 3000 instead of USD 8000 for 21.1 megapixel simply can't go unnoticed through Canon, Inc.

Sorry for making this post so long, but I can't find a link to post to this text:

SAN DIEGO, Sept. 9, 2008 — Sony is introducing its full-frame α (alpha) DSLR-A900 camera, aimed at serious photo enthusiasts looking for traditional SLR performance with the added benefits of digital photography.

It is designed to deliver ultra-fine picture quality with the world’s highest resolution, 24.6-megapixel, 35 mm full-frame CMOS sensor and fast image processing with a new dual BIONZ® processing engines. The camera is also the first to have a body-integrated image stabilization system for a full-frame sensor with Sony’s SteadyShot® Inside anti-shake system.

One look at the camera’s distinctive pentaprism and nostalgic body design will evoke its full-frame optical performance. It features a bright, clear optical viewfinder with 100% field of view coverage that would impress even film photography loyalists.

“The α (alpha) DSLR-A900 introduction solidifies Sony’s position as a leading camera manufacturer that can meet the demands of serious enthusiasts,” said Phil Lubell, director of digital camera marketing at Sony Electronics. “It represents the best in sensor and image processing technologies and offers enhanced functions, performance and reliability so photographers can push their creativity to the limit.”

Ultra-Fine Images As The Human Eye Perceives Them

The camera’s Exmor™ CMOS sensor delivers the photographic expressive power of wide angles and perspective that only a 35 mm full-frame sensor can offer, and is designed to take advantage of the resolving power of high-precision α (alpha) lenses. Its high pixel count and large size provide enhanced image detail and a wider dynamic range for natural color reproduction and subtle tonal gradations.

The sensor is produced using proprietary Sony planarization technologies to ensure an ultra-flat surface across the entire imaging area. Instead of a single analog/digital convertor, the sensor uses over 6,000 on-chip, column-parallel A/D converters to convert analog signals to noise-resistant digital signals at the earliest possible stage. The result is reduced noise and high-speed transfer of data.

Image processing gets a boost in speed and power from the application of two BIONZ image processing engines. Large amounts of data captured by the 24.6-megapixel sensor can be quickly processed to achieve a fast shooting response. Additionally, this dual BIONZ processing system applies advanced noise reduction algorithms producing images of exceptional quality and detail, especially at high ISO sensitivities.

World’s First Anti-Shake System for a Full-Frame Sensor

The camera’s newly-developed, body-integrated SteadyShot Inside unit achieves an anti-shake effect equivalent to shutter speeds faster by 2.5 to 4 stops. This new unit provides stabilization for Sony, Minolta and Konica-Minolta wide angle, large-aperture lenses, which is difficult for lens-integrated systems.

State-of-the Art Optical Performance and Responsiveness

The ultra-bright viewfinder with 100% field of view coverage and 0.74x magnification enables accurate framing and preview. It features a high-power condenser lens, an eyepiece with high reflective-index glass, and a multi-layer, anti-reflective coating on every optical surface to deliver its extraordinarily bright and accurate view.

Additionally, the focusing screen is user-replaceable, with additional L-type (grid pattern) and M-type (super spherical acute matte) screens sold separately.

The camera’s newly-developed autofocus system consists of nine wide-area sensors with 10 assist points for improved tracking of moving subjects. A center dual cross sensor comprised of two horizontal and two vertical line sensors as well as a dedicated f/2.8 sensor are included to achieve greater precision, especially when using fast-aperture lenses.

It also offers high-speed continuous shooting of 24.6 megapixel images at five frames per second. A newly-designed mirror box features a unique parallel-link mirror mechanism that moves on two horizontal axes to accommodate both 100% viewfinder coverage and the body-integrated image stabilization system without increasing the camera’s size. The mirror box also has a new moving magnet actuator, a high-powered coreless motor for a faster shutter charge, and a magnet catcher to minimize mirror bounce and light refraction within the box.

Versatility to Unleash Creative Possibilities

The model’s innovative intelligent preview function takes the guesswork out of setting up a shot and the hassle of taking multiple shots to achieve a desired effect.

After pressing the depth of field preview button, the camera “grabs” a RAW preview image which is processed and displayed on the LCD screen. You can then fine tune white balance, determine the best level and effect of dynamic range optimization, adjust exposure compensation and check histogram data, all before you actually take the picture. Preview images are not recorded on the camera’s memory card, thus saving capacity.

Other key features aimed to expand creative options include the Dynamic Range Optimizer (DRO) with five levels of user-selectable correction as well as DRO bracketing for enhanced scene analysis and graduation optimization. EV bracketing with ±2EV range makes it easy to create high dynamic range composite images.

Thirteen creative styles can be selected to enhance images and then fine-tuned by customizing contrast, sharpness, zone matching and other parameters, while 3 user-programmable memories provide instant access to as many as 26 different mode settings.

Powerful RAW file processing control is put in the photographer’s hands with the included Image Data Converter SR3 software that delivers faster file processing speeds, easy adjustment of image parameters, Dynamic Range Optimization and a new Peripheral Illumination function that compensates for corner light fall off.

With the camera’s HDMI output and Photo TV HD mode, your creative output can be enjoyed on a compatible HD television. This mode brings the look of actual printed photography to the television, by fine-tuning such image parameters as sharpness, gradation and color.

Comfort in Your Hands

Its construction features rugged, lightweight magnesium alloy with moisture-resistant, rubber seals for buttons and dials, an anti-static coating to prevent dust adherence to the imager, and a high-endurance shutter rated for more than 100,000 release cycles.

It has a 3-inch, Xtra Fine LCD screen (921K) makes it possible to check focus and image quality with accuracy. It incorporates an easy-to-see display with a quick navigation menu to easily access common functions without interrupting your creative flow. A backlit LCD panel sits on top of the camera and displays key settings.

System Expansion with New Accessories

The A900 camera will be accompanied with an array of accessories like the recently-announced Sony HVL-F58AM flash unit with its innovative Quick Shift Bounce system, powerful performance with a guide number of 58, and wireless auto flash ratio control.

The Sony® VG-C90AM vertical grip offers the same ease of operation when shooting vertically as horizontally, with its button layout and low-position shutter-release button. It also houses two InfoLITHIUM® batteries (sold separately) for longer shooting and playback.

The DSLR-A900 body will be available in November for about $3,000 along with related accessories. All will be available at authorized dealers, at military base exchanges, Sony Style retail stores (www.sonystyle.com/retail) and at sonystyle.com. Online pre-orders begin online on Sept. 10.

[Nathan]

Sony is certainly becoming a pretty noticeable contender using the former Minolta line. Megapixels alone do not determine IQ, though. Haven't compared the specs.

[krb]

Some of the other posts I've seen on these boards about the Sony have said that it has poor dynamic range and lots of noise even at low ISO. I don't know how true those statements are, but it does well to point out that there's a lot more to a camera than MPs.

[apersson850]

Yes, that will be very interesting to see, once these cameras come out to the public users. As you say, all pixels are created equal, but some are more equal than others.

[Jman13]

Yeah, but that noise handling is worse than my 30D...and that's pretty sad.

[Sfordphoto]

to make its 5D replacement good:

http://www.dpreview.com/previews/SonyDSLRA900/

a900 is old news, but we get a better idea with this preview
not that i'd consider getting a sony, but its supposed to compete in the $3000 market, which is around where the old 5d debuted

mods feel free to move this thread, wasn't sure where to put it

[DDWD10]

Looking at the sample shots, the 50D seems to perform better at ISO 6400 than the A900!

[DDWD10]

ISO 6400

50D Top

A900 Bottom

[Sfordphoto]

the one of the old man in the suit also has pretty horrible noise, its also iso6400

[folville]

I'll have to get my hands on one to really find out, but it looks horribly non-ergonomic.

I also feel that a camera of that caliber should have more than nine AF points. the D series is pushing nine points to the limits of its practical usage, and this camera may weigh in at three times the cost.

[DDWD10]

the one of the old man in the suit also has pretty horrible noise, its also iso6400

Very blotchy, messy noise on the Sony. The Canon's noise is much finer and shows more detail.

Come to think of it, haven't Sony DSLRs always performed the worst at high ISOs? I guess not even a full-framer can help them :rolleyes:

The top status LCD looks like an afterthought and shows about 1/3 as much information as the similarly-sized LCD on my Elan IIE does. When you're using exp comp, all it shows it [+/-] and not the value?? C'mon Sony.

[Sfordphoto]

ouch

does not bode well for the nikon d3x, which is supposed to use this sensor

well i don't know what kind of pressure this puts on canon, but its in the same price bracket, likely

[DDWD10]

I'm hoping that people who spend this kind of money on an SLR look at more than the MP count. The new 5D will beat this thing senseless.

[basroil]

http://a.img-dpreview.com/gallery/sony_a900preview_samples/originals/dsc00101.jpg

if you tell me that is any danger to canon, i'll tell you that my mkIII at iso 3200 AND interpolated to 24MP has better noise... and that this shot looks like a fujifilm f50fd took it.

[Sfordphoto]

The new 5D will beat this thing senseless.

I'll drink to that! :D

[PhotoSportsOnline]

No doubt Canon got lazy at the top. Competition is good!

Take a look at the example images in the review. Even the ISO800 images are noisy, even at web size. Doesn't look like Sony has caught up on IQ, but the camera does have some appealing features.

Absolutely, resting on past greatness is a bad thing. IMO i believe Nikon as taken the lead with the D70 and D300. What do I know though

[Sfordphoto]

i posted only after reading the intro, so apologies. i only read full frame, $3000.

at this point, i hope canon pays attention to these, in order of decreasing importance:

0.74x 100% viewfinder

5fps advance

and to a lesser extent, 920k dot 3" LCD and new vertical grip

those are all features i'd like to see in the new FF canon pulls out

[Sfordphoto]

oh, and one thing...the sony is made out of 5 separate pieces of magnesium alloy...kinda strange

hopefully canon continues with its one piece method

but...sony has a mag alloy batt grip...awesome! i wish canon made theirs that way

[randomlinh]

Canon SEEMS to have been asleep at the wheel for a while now. For good reason, they had no competition really in the upper realm. The 1DmkIII troubles were not helpful either.

But I would hope for a company the size of canon, they'd be able to catch up (or possibly had something in the works, just waiting to see what comes out to tweak it more). Reserve sleepiness until early Oct I'd say

[Sfordphoto]

whats interesting about the sony VF is that it looks like it demarcates the 1.5x or 1.6x (whichever) crop

[DDCSD]

What does price, specs, FF and MP count matter when the resulting image looks like it was recorded on toilet paper? ;)

[DStanic]

Wow based on those pictures the noise at ISO1600 looks the same as something shot from my XTi!

Maybe Sony just wanted to have the title "digital camera with most MP in the world". Considering how ugly the body looks, bad ergonomincs, it doesn't look like Canon has anything to worry about...

[Alexei TND]

specs aside
that is the ugliest piece of hardware i have seen in AGES
honestly.
I know its the image quality that counts and the tools are just that but COME ON?!!
honestly?!!? THIS is what they came up with design wise?
they oughta take a leaf outta canon/nikons book because that thing makes childen cry

[thatkatmat]

I don't know, those D3's while being very good, are ugly too.

[KayakPhotos]

I wonder why thy chose not to include live view in this camera? Most people seem to like Sony's implementation of the feature best, so I kind of expected it in this camera. Other than that, it seems like a fairly limited camera. For studio work with good lighting, it appears that this might be a good choice:full frame, fairly light weight, high resolution, etc. After all, it is $5000 cheaper than a 1Ds Mark III. High ISO noise seems pretty bad, but Sony ran into the same problem when they tried to throw in too many MP in the A350. I do like the fact that it comes with a remote. To my awareness, none of the 1D series do, and this should be a gimme. If a rebel can have it for free, then why not an $8000 camera? Just a random thought. Anyways, I am curious to see how many people jump on this. People with a bag of minolta lenses are probably pretty happy in general.

[egordon99]

Re. Live View, I've seen comments suggesting that sensor heat build-up precluded them from doing Live View.

I'll say it again, the A900 is FUGLY!

I actually like the D3 (and even the D300), Canon has a much better lens selection but I almost went Nikon when I left Pentax.

[cloose]

According to the DPReview announcement, the A900 has a mag-alloy FRAME and a plastic body.........

$3K for plastic??!?!?!?!?

[Colorblinded]

Plastic doesn't bother me one bit. Depending on what they use it could be lighter and just as good or better than the metal alternative.

[DStanic]

No live view?? :roll: Looks like this camera is a flop.