Memory Cards for Shooting a Wedding

[dphoto]

Hello all,

I'm piecing the last bit of equiptment together for a friend's wedding that my wife and I are going to shoot. I've got a 20D, a 300D, and four 1gb cards between them. I'm looking at buying two 2gb Kingston ElitePro cards for $115/each (after rebate at newegg.com). The question is, will this be enough? This is probably a stupid question because it depends on so many factors, but I just don't want to end up with too little memory. If I end up using 300-400 shots, that means I'll probably have to shoot triple that number of images. Most shots will be done using fine jpeg mode, although I am (strongly) considering shooting the formals in raw mode. I know shooting style comes into play as well... I do tend to shoot a lot of shots at events. Does anyone have a rough "rule of thumb" that they use? Even if you don't shoot digital, how many shots do you usually take compared to the number you end up using?

Thanks for any help! The day is getting closer... :D
-Deva

[MrChad]

If you shoot the entire thing in high JPEG you will have a huge amount. Stills seams alot in RAW to me.

A buddy of mine can do a wedding with 2 1gig cards.

[tim]

Are you doing the shoot as a favour for someone?

I've never done a wedding, so take my thoughts with a bowl of salt. I would suggest just trying to restrict the number of shots you take. Don't use the 20D's great rapid fire mode except for very special parts, and then try to avoid it. Remember one days shooting that many images could come to two days viewing, editing, and correcting the images.

[robertwgross]

For my camera, the RAW files are roughly 7MB each. On average, I shoot at least 150-200 shots per wedding, depending on the job. A short wedding might get only 120 or so, and a big all day long affair might go over 250. But that is just me. The next photographer might feel compelled to shoot twice as much (and his editing job will be twice as big as well).

---Bob Gross---

[MrChad]

Assuming you shoot in RAW let's assume 125 shot per 1gig. That 1000 shots. total for you.

I've only shot a wedding or two for a friend with film. that would = 27 rolls of 36x.
I've never needed that much film maybe about half that at most, but that's just me.

Maybe full time pros shoot more then this.

[donlavange]

You have plenty of space! And you can always chimp the obvious dogs.

[dphoto]

Hey guys,

Thanks for the replies.Don't use the 20D's great rapid fire mode except for very special parts, and then try to avoid it.LOL! I hadn't even considered using the great rapid fire mode, but now that you mention it, yes, that would be a complete disaster! OK, maybe for a bouquet toss, but that's it... no more. Ahhh... that's a good one.

Wow, it sounds like if I do this right, I should have enough as it stands. Hmmm... time to look at those lists of photos again and do some heavy math. Yes, the trick will be to shoot less than what I'm used to. I've been doing a lot of sporting events lately, and that takes a lot of shots. Here's where I have to be a little careful... my wife will primarily be acting as my assistant, but before the ceremony, she'll be shooting the bride and I'll be shooting the groom (they don't want to see each other beforehand). Also, when we're not shooting formals, my wife will be snapping candids. This "two cameras in use at the same time" action is what has me worried. Can I get everything I need on two 1gb cards... probably. Could it get a little close for my comfort... probably. Hmmm... well, maybe just one more card instead of two.

Thanks again for the input, and by all means keep it coming. Yes, the key will be to cut down on the number of shots, or I'll be editing this wedding for the next three months! And yes tim, I am *mostly* doing this gig as a favor for someone, although I am charging them a small fee since the date of their wedding is causing me to miss one of my few paying shoots. Of course I am hoping for a few great shots to supplement my portfolio, but we'll see how it goes. I will be happy if I can give them good shots and good coverage. :D

Thanks!
-Deva

[MrChad]

When ever my friends and myself get roped into this kind of thing for other friends.

I usually just give the couple the raw proofs and let them pic the ones they like. Then only edit those. I'm not going to spend time editing hundreds of shots for friends that for the most part are using me, because they are cheap :D

I find weddings to be alot of pressue, especially if they are your friends. I think they expect alot from you being you are friends.

A good studio photographer friend of mine told me once, "Weddings are what he did until he could afford to shoot what he wanted." No offense to those that do this for a living but I never envy the paid pros at a weddings.

Good luck with your wedding, I think you have plenty of CF card space even with 8mp of 20D goodness.

[Citizensmith]

The most I've ever shot was 900 at a particularly long wedding (on site at 10AM, left at 8PM). I did it with two 512Mb cards and a laptop. Of course with memory being as cheap as it is now I'd just go with a couple of 1GB cards.

Anyway, editing for me didn't take to long. I use a basic, fast image browser, skip through once and delete any that obviously suck. I then skip through again and make copies of the best, normally aiming for around 20 to 30 images. Those 20 to 30 get edited and printed. Everything then gets stuck on a DVD and given to the bride to do with as she wants. Some people may take a lot longer than me. Some people are also a lot more expensive. I'll do all the extra stuff (albums, framing, etc) if wanted but only if specifically asked.

[dphoto]

Hey MrChad,

I'm actually OK with being roped into this. I think it could actually be enjoyable at some point. Whether it will be or not is another story... :D

As for processing... yeah, that's a tough call. I usually show proofs over the Internet, and I've tried it both ways... that is, fully processing all the photos and then uploading them vs doing minimal processing and then doing the full processing after orders are made. Each method has its ups and downs. We'll see.

Citizensmith,

Thanks for sharing your methods. Yeah, I think I'll printing many more than 20-30 images. I'm not too keen with handing over the "negatives", so I don't think I'll be doing that. Still, it sounds like your method works very well for you. You mentioned the "extra" stuff like albums and such. I'm going to do that for them for "free", that is they will just be paying for the materials and I'll put it all together for them. I'd kind of like the experience, so I offered to do it. I hope I don't end up regretting that. :D

Thanks agian!
-Deva

[poke]

An x-drive, or similar is a really cheap way of expanding your memory capacity... but from my limited wedding experience, I would say you have heaps of space. If worst comes to worst, and you getting towards the end, with a dwindling supply of empty cards... you can always switch from RAW to JPEG as a last resort.

[tim]

You could always give them a CD with low res or watermarked images on it. It's pretty easy to set up an action to do that in photoshop.

[dphoto]

An X-Drive (or similar) is a good idea. But I don't know if I'll have the time to be messing around with something like that. Don't those things take 30 minutes or so to unload 1 gig? I suppose if you plan well it wouldn't be a problem. Still, a good idea... I do need something like that for another project I've got cooking up for this summer, but I don't want to open that can of worms until I'm done with this wedding. :D

Tim, I like the CD idea. That's basically what I do now, except they view their images over the Internet. Giving them a CD as well might be a nice supplement. There's so many options. Has anyone made one of those DVDs that sets a slideshow to music? I'm sure that would be cool, but more of a time kill. Where does it all end?

-Deva

[WestFalcon]

I shoot about 15-20 weddings a year. We shoot about 400 high res jpgs at a typical wedding so 2 -1 gig cards should be plenty. Use your histogram often to judge exposure. Weddings are a lot of work but digital weddings can be awesome with all the photoshop manipulations you can do. Have backups of everything. I take 3-10D's and 2 -20D's to weddings...it may sound like overkill but I feel good having all the redundancy.

[CyberDyneSystems]

No time to futz with an X-drive is an easy possibility,.. and you certainly won't be able to save space via "chimp and cull" .. this is to be saved for AFTER the wedding.

Grab some 2 GB cards,. you can only fit about 80-90 RAW files from a 20D on a 1GB card.


Of course if your shooting jpeg this is a totally differnet story,. still more CF is better than not enough.

[dphoto]

Hello again,

WestFalcon, do you mind me asking how many of your 400 shots you typically end up using? Do your subjects select the images they want, or do you put an album together for them?

Hey CDS, I totally agree with the "more is better than less" approach here.

But all this makes me wonder... should I shoot any raw images at all? That's pretty much a rhetorical question since I'm sure all the standard raw vs jpeg arguments apply. I just hate to add that extra level of processing, although the extra flexibility may be able to get me out of a pinch. Sigh. Maybe if I just do a lot of "chimpping" as was suggested, I can shoot jpeg all the way through. Sigh.

Thanks again,
-Deva

[phili1]

When I shot weddings I usually would take between 250 and 350 shots after that it is overkill.I did allot of /candids.

If you shoot Raw your 1 gig card will hold on the 20D 108 picture X 4 = 432 shots, I think with that you have it covered. By the way your 300D is 6 Mega pixels so between them you should get 500 shots Raw.

[WestFalcon]

DPPhoto......We edit down to about 300 and send them via cable modem to my lab in Cedar Falls, Iowa(American Color Imaging). I would say the editing takes us 10 hours. My lab prints our proofs to 4x5. I save as 4x5 @ 250DPI (jpgs). The lab will only take jpgs and I think that is true of almost all labs. We do colorized B&W, a few montages, some smart blur closeups, some sepias, some B&W.....special effects. The time from sending them in to getting our proofs back is 2 days and they are only 30 cents. All are put into a proof book and delivered in less than 2 weeks. We save all jpgs on Cds(3 different brands) and one DVD. I also have a portable hard drive away from my house where all files are stored for safety. I'm pretty cautious but people tend not to like to get married over again so I need to get it right the first time.

[Mark_48]

The thing I worry a little on is if a card should fail and isn't evident until attempting to transfer to PC. Would it be better to use more small capacity cards than just a couple large capacity, thus not putting your eggs all in one basket. A least if one card should fail you still have something from the others.
That said, I haven't had a card failure yet. Has anyone run into this?

[dsze]

I've done 2 weddings with about 3GB's of memory and been fine. I shot a combo of RAW and jpg and shot about 600 frames at the weddings. HOWEVER;

I've regretted doing both weddings...THEY WERE BOTH FOR FRIENDS/FAMILY. The images I produced were great in everyone's opinion, but I WILL NEVER DO FAVOR SHOOTS AGAIN. I will do it for free OR charge full price. Don't make that mistake. You will regret it. I wish that I had listened to the people who told me that, but I was too confident I guess. What I've found is that no matter how good your photos are, when you mix friends/family with business, things change.

-daniel

[dphoto]

Wow, thanks for all the great input everyone!

WestFalcon, I took a look at American Color Imaging's web site... it was a little confusing, and I didn't see any prices listed anywhere. I think I'm missing a plugin to view their site properly because half the screen is blank. Anyhow, it looks like they use the Kodak ProShots system. Do you like the overall system? Do they use Kodak paper? I currently have two printing methods: (1) print it myself using my Canon i9100 or (2) send the files via the Internet to a 1 hour lab that uses a Noritsu laser printer that prints onto Fuji Crystal Archive paper. Each method has its goods and bads. The prints from my printer look better than the ones from the laser printer because of a wider color gamut, but the prints from the laser printer are much more durable. Ah, I know this is a topic for another thread, so I'll start another thread soon, but this has been in the back of my mind for some time. What do they charge to print a 5x7 or 8x10, BTW?

Mark_48, you make an excellent point, and if I end up only buying 2gb worth of memory instead of 4gb, I just might get two 1gb cards. I did have a Viking CF card fail on me once. I was able to recover the images off the card, I just wasn't able to save more than 400 megs or so on a 1gb card. So, in a case like that, the smaller the better. On the flip side, if you're shooting raw with an 8mp camera, a 1gb card just doesn't hold that many shots. And, if I would like to use these cards on my next camera, who knows what kind of memory requirements that will have, so in that sense, the bigger the better. Of course, I don't plan on buying another camera any time soon, and memory prices just keep falling, so maybe that's not a good reason to buy bigger. Also, with both cameras firing away, smaller cards allow us to distribute the memory better between us. Good thought!

dsze, uh oh... is it kind of like selling a used car to a friend? I did that once, and I will never do that again (buy or sell). Well, we're not really that close of friends, more like acquaintances. I figure this will either make us friends or make it so that we'll never become friends. It's going to go one way or the other, so we'll see. Too late to back out now! :D

Thanks again!
-Deva

[Citizensmith]

Has anyone made one of those DVDs that sets a slideshow to music? I'm sure that would be cool, but more of a time kill. Where does it all end?

-Deva

Get PhotoStory3 from Microsoft. Its free if you have a licensed copy windows XP. Very easy to use and it'll do the musical slide show thing in a selection of formats and styles.

As for the 'handing over the negatives' thing. I'm not dependant on follow on work so I do it to keep people happy. I do still get some callbacks as someone who knows how to print and has a decent printer can get much better results than the 3 year old piece of junk most people seem to have that rarely sees anything other than mapquest directions. :)

And, on the friends topic. When I got married we had to rely on friends because the dick of a pro photographer we'd hired backed out the day before because 'something didn't feel right' and the ******* even had the cheek to put up a fight when we demanded our deposit back. He never did explain more, so we put plenty of effort into making sure as many people as possible knew not to trust him. Fortunately one of the bridesmaids was a good photographer so her role changed quickly and we still got plenty of good shots.

[WestFalcon]

Wow, thanks for all the great input everyone!

WestFalcon, I took a look at American Color Imaging's web site... it was a little confusing, and I didn't see any prices listed anywhere. I think I'm missing a plugin to view their site properly because half the screen is blank. Anyhow, it looks like they use the Kodak ProShots system. Do you like the overall system? Do they use Kodak paper? I currently have two printing methods: (1) print it myself using my Canon i9100 or (2) send the files via the Internet to a 1 hour lab that uses a Noritsu laser printer that prints onto Fuji Crystal Archive paper. Each method has its goods and bads. The prints from my printer look better than the ones from the laser printer because of a wider color gamut, but the prints from the laser printer are much more durable. Ah, I know this is a topic for another thread, so I'll start another thread soon, but this has been in the back of my mind for some time. What do they charge to print a 5x7 or 8x10, BTW?

Mark_48, you make an excellent point, and if I end up only buying 2gb worth of memory instead of 4gb, I just might get two 1gb cards. I did have a Viking CF card fail on me once. I was able to recover the images off the card, I just wasn't able to save more than 400 megs or so on a 1gb card. So, in a case like that, the smaller the better. On the flip side, if you're shooting raw with an 8mp camera, a 1gb card just doesn't hold that many shots. And, if I would like to use these cards on my next camera, who knows what kind of memory requirements that will have, so in that sense, the bigger the better. Of course, I don't plan on buying another camera any time soon, and memory prices just keep falling, so maybe that's not a good reason to buy bigger. Also, with both cameras firing away, smaller cards allow us to distribute the memory better between us. Good thought!

dsze, uh oh... is it kind of like selling a used car to a friend? I did that once, and I will never do that again (buy or sell). Well, we're not really that close of friends, more like acquaintances. I figure this will either make us friends or make it so that we'll never become friends. It's going to go one way or the other, so we'll see. Too late to back out now! :D

Thanks again!
-Deva

dpphoto.......the site is really easy to use. You may need to talk to them in customer service. They are very efficient and friendly. They use the same kodak paper for negatives as they do for digital. They also have a very neat paper called "metallic". The 5x7's are $.79 and 8x10's are $1.89 as long as you do the color correcting. They will do it for you but it more than doubles the price. They have some software that must be installed before it will function properly. Go to their website and get their phone number and talk to them about getting an account. I've used them for over 20 years and am delighted with their work. They have a lot of new digital products too and within the next few months, you will be able to put all of your proofs on the site for the brides to peruse.

[FlyingPete]

I've done 2 weddings with about 3GB's of memory and been fine. I shot a combo of RAW and jpg and shot about 600 frames at the weddings. HOWEVER;

I've regretted doing both weddings...THEY WERE BOTH FOR FRIENDS/FAMILY. The images I produced were great in everyone's opinion, but I WILL NEVER DO FAVOR SHOOTS AGAIN. I will do it for free OR charge full price. Don't make that mistake. You will regret it. I wish that I had listened to the people who told me that, but I was too confident I guess. What I've found is that no matter how good your photos are, when you mix friends/family with business, things change.


Yeah, like the man said! I have done both the friends and family thing, they were great shots in everyones opinion, but as said above things did change. The first one I did, I did on film, the understanding was I paid for the film (wedding gift), they paid for the developing. Well five years later I still have some of the images in my wee draw waiting to be paid for. Perhaps I was stuborn, things did change, misunderstandings etc, but I didn't want to cross that 'oh well I've written that cost off now, you might as well have them' bridge.

[dphoto]

but I didn't want to cross that 'oh well I've written that cost off now, you might as well have them' bridge.LOL! I think I've crossed *that* bridge before... well, you keep holding your ground! Don't they want their images? Sometimes I wonder.

WestFalcon, thanks for the great info! Do you know what kind of printer they use? Do they use that cool Kodak paper that says "Professional Photographs--Do Not copy" (or something like that) on the back? I like that paper. :D But I also like the Fuji Crystal Archive paper. It's nice there's a choice of papers out there.

Citizensmith, I can't believe your photographer did that to you! Something didn't "feel right"? Was it his own guilt for what he was about to do? What kind of excuse is that? And he thought he could still keep the deposite?! Sometimes I wonder about people. Hopefully he got out of the business because it sounds like he doesn't have any basic understanding of people and common decency. Thank goodness you had someone who could step up for you. :D

Thanks again everyone!
-Deva

[Marvinspu36]

DPhoto,


Hello from Sacramento! I have done one wedding so far, just for fun! I am going to do another in April and another in June. However, I don't do them for a fee, and I also don't do them for free! I do them as a wedding gift to the couple (only friends). I don't want the stress of being the official wedding photographer, but I love shooting weddings.


The first one I did was a wedding and reception. I took about 400 pictures over 6 hours. Had about 150 fairly nice shots, and culled it down to about 80. I used those 80 to create a slide show with transitions and music. I burned that to a standard CD as an EXE file and also to a DVD so they could view them on a TV with friends. They absolutely loved it. And had it a lot sooner than the official photographs from the paid photographer. Along with the slide show, the CD also included all 400 pictures in a separate directory. That wedding was shot using my Olympus C-4000, so the pictures are not the sharpest and lack a nice shallow DOF. But they came out better than I expected.


The next wedding will be with my new 20D. I'm just a beginner, so this will be interesting. I am practicing! Hopefully I will get enough good shots to make the slide show for them too!


I am going to use 2 1GB cards. I will probably keep my laptop in the car just in case.


Best Wishes

[FlyingPete]

And had it a lot sooner than the official photographs from the paid photographer.

Ah 'backup' photographer, that's different :D

Have done that a couple of time to further my skills, there is no presure then! I quite enjoy doing that. My sisters wedding was the last, my shots were better than the paid photographer, and they had them and a web site the following week, took six months to get the album sorted from the pro.

BTW my 20D has not been on a wedding outing yet either!

[tim]

I'd love to be a 2nd photographer for a wedding, but not for a few months while I get used to the 20D. It'll take a bit of time to work out how to get the best from it in a variety of situations.

[Marvinspu36]

I'm still trying to sort out what lenses I will use, and various settings. I will probably take my C-4000 along too, just in case. I've got almost 3.5 months to practice. Thank goodness!

[FlyingPete]

I'm still trying to sort out what lenses I will use, and various settings. I will probably take my C-4000 along too, just in case. I've got almost 3.5 months to practice. Thank goodness!

Hmmm, lets see the 50mm is the first one I would bag (nice bright lens, narrow depth of field - be careful close up though at f/1.8 ), the 28-135 will be good for general shots, 18-55 to cover wide angles should there be any (check the venue first, BTW this is VERY important!), and the 70-200 would be excellent for 'sniping' candids.

When you check the venue's (also the reception place) see what the ceiling is like to see if you can bouce your 580 or not, this helps heaps in darker environments.

In fact take all your kit along, you never know :D

By the way did I say to check the venue first so you know what you are working with!

[Marvinspu36]

Thanks for the pointers. My kit is all stored in one Tamarac backpack. So I will definately be taking everything along. The trick for me will be learning to deal with the DOF for different types of shots. I haven't taken enough pictures to get a feel for the DOF vs f-stop/focal lenght yet.

The wedding will be at my church, so I can practice to my hearts content there. It has a high (30') domed ceiling. I took a christmas photo of my family there. I bounced the flash off the ceiling and used the white card on the flash to get some front lighting. It came out ok. The only bad part was that one of my kids and I were leaning too much.

Well, I think I'm drawing the thread way off topic. Thanks again!

[Citizensmith]

Hello from Sacramento!


I was going to say where abouts in Sac, but I should probably ask which one as well. If its the Sac of Kings and Rivercats fame then I hope your enjoying the weather as much as I am. :)

[Marvinspu36]

Yep. Home of the Kings. Enjoyed a great run this afternoon in the sun.

[WestFalcon]

Dphoto....the prints have your name on the back...Mine say Brunsvold Photography with a copyright sign...I don't know what kind of orinter they use.

[dphoto]

Hey there Marvinspu36, hello from Sactown! Wow, and Citizensmith too... I hadn't even noticed that before! Well, it's great to see two photographers from here in the same area! :D

Marvinspu36, it sounds like you are able to get the best of both worlds by shooting friends' weddings as the secondary photographer. Did you have any problems with the primary photographer? Hehe... yeah, that 20D should be nice. I just got one as well, so I'm very excited about using it. DOF is always fun to play with, but you do have to be careful. Shooting a head shot at f/1.8 with a 50mm lens gives you something like two inches of DOF. Yikes!

Well, seeing as how both cameras may be in use at the same time, in an even split that would be two 1gb cards each. That should be enough, but I think one more (per camera) would be nice and would serve well in case I had a card malfunction. Also, one of these cards is going to be borrowed, so I really should get my own! :D

Thanks again for all the great input!
-Deva

[Citizensmith]

Hey there Marvinspu36, hello from Sactown! Wow, and Citizensmith too... I hadn't even noticed that before! Well, it's great to see two photographers from here in the same area! :D


We should get together for some beers and plot the take over of this forum. :)

[4walls]

Go to your local electronics store a couple of days before the wedding and
pick up a couple of extra 1GB memory cards. Keep the receipt and don't
open the package unless you need them. If you don't use them, return them
to the store after the wedding. Cheap insurance.

[Citizensmith]

Go to your local electronics store a couple of days before the wedding and
pick up a couple of extra 1GB memory cards. Keep the receipt and don't
open the package unless you need them. If you don't use them, return them
to the store after the wedding. Cheap insurance.

Good plan, but watch the store. Some (CompUSA for instance) charge a restocking fee on some stuff.

[dphoto]

We should get together for some beers and plot the take over of this forum. :)LOL! No, I don't want to mess with the "natural order" of things around here... this place is way too helpful! :D As for beers, I don't really drink any more, but I do love to eat! :D

4walls, that's a great idea. Yeah, there's a store here that doesn't charge restocking (Fry's) so maybe I'll do that. A little insurance is always nice.

I just got the battery grip and an extra battery for my 20D in the mail today. Man, this camera sure does look nice. Sometimes when I'm not shooting I get compelled to pick it up and hold it. Am I losing it here?! :D

Talk to you guys later!
-Deva

[4walls]

I just got the battery grip and an extra battery for my 20D in the mail today. Man, this camera sure does look nice. Sometimes when I'm not shooting I get compelled to pick it up and hold it. Am I losing it here?! :D
LOL!