Quantum Turbo 2x2 and Canon 580EX I

[StephenJames]

Anyone ever have any trouble connecting the Quantum power pack and a Canon 580 EX ?... Can't seem to get the flash to power on when its connected... just wondered if there were any tricks to this? Any help is much appreciated. Thanks.

[gromeo]

Do have the correct cable and do you have batteries installed in the flash

[StephenJames]

The cable is correct... and I'm not sure if there are batteries in the flash itself, this is a friend of mine who is using my 580 EX... she's asleep now so I can't ask her directly..but would having batteries in the flash be a bad thing?

[Titus213]

From what I've read you need batteries in the flash.

[gromeo]

The first time I connected my turbo 2x2 I forgot to put the batteries back into the flash, the 580 needs to have the bats installed in order for the turbo to work. Here is the steps to make sure the turbo is powering the flash.
1- turn cam on
2- turn flash on
3- turn turbo on
you will know the flash is powered by the turbo cause the status light will stay red

[StephenJames]

Awesome.. thank you both so much.. I'll let my friend know in the morning that she should follow these steps... thanks a million!

[jureis]

ive also heard from some pros that if you keep all 4 batteries in the flash it could overheat and burn out. that being said they recommend you use a plastic battery because without 4 batteries in the unit it wont work.

[PacAce]

ive also heard from some pros that if you keep all 4 batteries in the flash it could overheat and burn out. that being said they recommend you use a plastic battery because without 4 batteries in the unit it wont work.
Now, that's a load of crap! The purpose of the dummy battery is to decrease the total voltage of the internal batteries so that they are not used to charge the main flash capacitor. But the voltage is still high enough to run the electronics of the flash. They serve that function on the 550EX because there is no way to set the 550EX to either use or not use the internal batteries for charging the main capacitor.

The dummy battery is unnecessary and is, in fact, redundant when used with the 580EX because you can set the custom function on the 580EX to use or not use the internal batteries for charging the main capacitor (when an external power pack is being used). :)

[jureis]

alright just passing along what ive heard

[Blackey Cole]

If you are using the Turbo battery it only supplies power to the strobe element you still need batteries in the flash ot a QB1 connected powering the electronics so it will work. What you are supplying power to is the light element only and you are using the Quantum to do two things 1 speed up time between charges and save the in flash batteries to power the electronics long so you can get more flashes out them since they are not charging the strobe capacitor

[silvex]

You also need to let the flash know to use the external power source. You can choose: Internal, external or both. I have set mine to use both, but I use canon's powerpack. Not to hijack the tread, but. How does the turbopack compares to canon's powerpack /

[PacAce]

You also need to let the flash know to use the external power source. You can choose: Internal, external or both. I have set mine to use both, but I use canon's powerpack. Not to hijack the tread, but. How does the turbopack compares to canon's powerpack /

Other than the fact that the Turbo 2x2 (don't know about the other Turbo models, though) will outlast the batteries in the Canon battery pack, their performance in terms of recycling speed are the same. Weight-wise, the Turbo 2x2 is much heavier than the Canon battery pack, and bigger, too.

[Gentleman Villain]

The cable is correct... and I'm not sure if there are batteries in the flash itself, this is a friend of mine who is using my 580 EX... she's asleep now so I can't ask her directly..but would having batteries in the flash be a bad thing?

Yep...it needs batteries in the flash itself.

I just wanted to warn you to be sure and check the instructions and see if the canon can be run at full power with the turbo. I blew up a couple of canon lights using turbo batteries in the past because I never read directions :) (fortunately I was making enough money that it didn't hurt too much)

[silvex]

Other than the fact that the Turbo 2x2 (don't know about the other Turbo models, though) will outlast the batteries in the Canon battery pack, their performance in terms of recycling speed are the same. Weight-wise, the Turbo 2x2 is much heavier than the Canon battery pack, and bigger, too.

I just read their "ratings" and it is about ~700 full powerflashes. I get around that with four duracells 2650 NiMH in the 580EXII. I have yet try to see how many I get when the Canon power pack (CP-E4) with eight 2650. I took at least 250+ with it just recently, but I would really like to take a test. The batteries were almost fully charged after taken the 250+ shots.

[PacAce]

I just read their "ratings" and it is about ~700 full powerflashes. I get around that with four duracells 2650 NiMH in the 580EXII. I have yet try to see how many I get when the Canon power pack (CP-E4) with eight 2650. I took at least 250+ with it just recently, but I would really like to take a test. The batteries were almost fully charged after taken the 250+ shots.

And all these were all full power flash shots using the 2650 NiMH batteries? :shock:

I've never done any formal testing of the battery performance, but I don't think I've ever gotten close to 700 full power flashes with my 2500 NiMH batteries in the CP-E4. And definitely not with just the four batteries in the flash.

[silvex]

And all these were all full power flash shots using the 2650 NiMH batteries? :shock:

I've never done any formal testing of the battery performance, but I don't think I've ever gotten close to 700 full power flashes with my 2500 NiMH batteries in the CP-E4. And definitely not with just the four batteries in the flash.

SO how do I do this...plug the cp-e4 to the flash...wear my sunglasses...:) and fire away once the flash gives a green lite ? maybe do it with a pocke wizard and set the flash in the backyard...)

http://www.duracell.com/products/rechargeables_2650.asp

[Bubble]

I just read their "ratings" and it is about ~700 full powerflashes. I get around that with four duracells 2650 NiMH in the 580EXII. I have yet try to see how many I get when the Canon power pack (CP-E4) with eight 2650. I took at least 250+ with it just recently, but I would really like to take a test. The batteries were almost fully charged after taken the 250+ shots.

yes you can take as much flash as you can but are they all produce the same amount of juice on each flash? :)

[silvex]

yes you can take as much flash as you can but are they all produce the same amount of juice on each flash? :)

The 5808EXII *should* make the *same* amount light as long as it is fully charge. I think it takes about 2-7 seconds. with regular batteries.

[silvex]

And all these were all full power flash shots using the 2650 NiMH batteries? :shock:

I've never done any formal testing of the battery performance, but I don't think I've ever gotten close to 700 full power flashes with my 2500 NiMH batteries in the CP-E4. And definitely not with just the four batteries in the flash.

Well I finally got a chance to do this test. I plugged the 40D with 580EXII (with four 2650s), the CP-E4 (with eight 2650s). The settings were.

1) 580EXII in Manual mode 1/1 (full blast)
2) 40D in manual mode 1/250 f/2.8 ISO100 pre-focus on subject.
3) Room in total darkness...well lights off and taken last nite.
4) EOS Util set to 25 seconds interval for 1000 shots.
5) Flash to use BOTH external and internal batteries for recycling.

At first I was using 10 seconds interval, but after 100 shots the flash needed 18 seconds to re-charge! :confused:. So I changed the interval to 25 seconds and put another set of fully charged 2650s in the CP-E4. This time the recycling was under two seconds...:shock: :cool:

It took 300 shots, but this morning I flipped the camera on and took some shots shot and it flashed before it died -- three?. So I will repeat the test with all batteries fully charge the ones in the flash and the CP-E4. This time setting the flash with external power recycling only.

NOTE: Even if it only took 300 shots. The CP-E4 sells for about $200 dollars. The MAHA charger about $80 and eight 2650 for $30 (YES they are $$$). So that brings a total of about $330. If you add another set of eight 2650s. The total is $360 -- for 600 full power shots. Which is about 1/2 the price of a single Turbo 2x2. it is now $550 + $50 = ~$600USD at BH.

Stay tune...:) batteries are charging.

[Titus213]

And how much is the Black Box (http://www.aljacobs.com/THE%20BLACK%20BOX.htm)?

[René Damkot]

It took 300 shots,

Sounds like a very quick way to overheat and damage the flash....

[Wilt]

Yep...it needs batteries in the flash itself.

I just wanted to warn you to be sure and check the instructions and see if the canon can be run at full power with the turbo. I blew up a couple of canon lights using turbo batteries in the past because I never read directions :) (fortunately I was making enough money that it didn't hurt too much)

Perhaps the 'blow up' was the fact that you fired too many consecutive flashes without letting the flash cool off, per the directions in the Canon owner manual?! This thermal overload is possible even when the recycling of the standard AA batteries is made faster with the use of the Canon battery pack or a Quantum...so the fault is not the Quantum, per se.

[silvex]

It seems like a nice solid product at $180USD shipped. Will his black box withstand a rain drizzle ? Dust? What if it breaks in the middle of nowhere ? The thing I like about AA batteries is convenience. If the batteries die. I can get regular ones and keep shooting. You also need AA to power the flash, so you already have the charger for the flashes. In my case I can use the xxD battery tray to power them up in the event the xxD batteries die also.

Again, it looks like a great solid product. He is also close to retirement. What happens when he retires ? The product retires ?

[silvex]

Sounds like a very quick way to overheat and damage the flash....
They were about 25 seconds apart. The flashed lived...:)

[Gentleman Villain]

Perhaps the 'blow up' was the fact that you fired too many consecutive flashes without letting the flash cool off, per the directions in the Canon owner manual?! This thermal overload is possible even when the recycling of the standard AA batteries is made faster with the use of the Canon battery pack or a Quantum...so the fault is not the Quantum, per se.

Yep, that was the problem

The main reason most people choose to run a turbo battery is to get fast recycling and save time. SO it's kind of a bummer that it will blow up canon units unless taking the time to cool down :lol: The way I learned to deal with it was just to run the 430 at half power on manual. It would recycle quickly with the turbo and never overheat as long as it was on manual at half power

I don't know if the 580 is the same way, but the problem that the OP described sounds kinda similar to what my 430s were like when they were blown up by the turbo.

I'm just kinda mentioning this is for lurkers...just so they can be aware of the potential problem. Personally, I don't use that type of gear anymore...and be careful of those cables that connect the turbo to the canon...they can give ya a bit of a zap

[amironsi]

i am mixed up here,
someone said that the recycle time of the 2x2 is the same as the canon battery pack. that's my only concern for which i would by the qtm 2x2, so if it is not improving why would i get it. i am fine with changing batteries, my whole problem is the recycle time.
Can anyone help here?

[silvex]

i am mixed up here,
someone said that the recycle time of the 2x2 is the same as the canon battery pack. that's my only concern for which i would by the qtm 2x2, so if it is not improving why would i get it. i am fine with changing batteries, my whole problem is the recycle time.
Can anyone help here?

I have canon's battery pack. It recycles under 1-2 seconds from a full blast. It is almost no wait time for 1/2 power and under. You get about 300 full power flashes and 1000 with 1/4-1/2 flashes.

[PacAce]

i am mixed up here,
someone said that the recycle time of the 2x2 is the same as the canon battery pack. that's my only concern for which i would by the qtm 2x2, so if it is not improving why would i get it. i am fine with changing batteries, my whole problem is the recycle time.
Can anyone help here?

If you're going for the recycle time at the least possible cash outlay up front, then go with the CP-E4. The advantage of the Turbo 2x2 is that you can get more pops per charge compared to the CP-E4 and, over the long run, you will supposedly end up paying less money for the batteries (I haven't really done any financial analysis on this, i.e current value of money vs. future value and all that, so I'm not 100% sure about this, though).

[amironsi]

If you're going for the recycle time at the least possible cash outlay up front, then go with the CP-E4. The advantage of the Turbo 2x2 is that you can get more pops per charge compared to the CP-E4 and, over the long run, you will supposedly end up paying less money for the batteries (I haven't really done any financial analysis on this, i.e current value of money vs. future value and all that, so I'm not 100% sure about this, though).

I have the CP-E4 already and i need something faster, with the CP-E4 when the batteries go hot the recharge time is so bad...
so would the turbo 2x2 make it better on the short and long run?

[PacAce]

I have the CP-E4 already and i need something faster, with the CP-E4 when the batteries go hot the recharge time is so bad...
so would the turbo 2x2 make it better on the short and long run?
Yes, I'm pretty sure the Turbo 2x2 would be able to dissipate the heat much better than the CP-E4. However, the question is, would your flash survive the torture? :shock:

(Note: The 580EX II does have a termal cut-off circuit that'll prevent the flash from overheating and getting damaged).

[amironsi]

Yes, I'm pretty sure the Turbo 2x2 would be able to dissipate the heat much better than the CP-E4. However, the question is, would your flash survive the torture? :shock:

(Note: The 580EX II does have a termal cut-off circuit that'll prevent the flash from overheating and getting damaged).

I think the Nikon SB900 has one like this... but u can actually control this.. i mean u can notice when u did take ur flash far more then he should go.

[Wilt]

If you're going for the recycle time at the least possible cash outlay up front, then go with the CP-E4. The advantage of the Turbo 2x2 is that you can get more pops per charge compared to the CP-E4 and, over the long run, you will supposedly end up paying less money for the batteries (I haven't really done any financial analysis on this, i.e current value of money vs. future value and all that, so I'm not 100% sure about this, though).

I paid a mere $250 for a new Turbo back in the early 1990's. Finally this year, I purchased a new replacement cell for it, doing it myself rather than sending the unit to Quantum for $90. It cost me $25 including shipping, to buy the replacement cell. If I can go another 15 years before I buy a new cell once again, the replacement cell would cost me $0.14 per month to operate the unit.

To have equivalent shooting capacity as the Turbo, you would buy 2-3 sets of rechargeable AA batteries, at $10 per set. You would need to replace these every 3 years or so. $30 per full set of 12 batteries, 5 replacements needed in 15 years...$150 or $0.83 per month to operate.

Yes, the Quantum is more costly outlay for initial purchase...a new one today is closer to $450. But it is useful for most any brand of flash, not merely Canons.

OK Leo, you can do the net present value analysis using the raw data I provided.

[PacAce]

I paid a mere $250 for a new Turbo back in the early 1990's. Finally this year, I purchased a new replacement cell for it, doing it myself rather than sending the unit to Quantum for $90. It cost me $25 including shipping, to buy the replacement cell. If I can go another 15 years before I buy a new cell once again, the replacement cell would cost me $0.14 per month to operate the unit.

To have equivalent shooting capacity as the Turbo, you would buy 2-3 sets of rechargeable AA batteries, at $10 per set. You would need to replace these every 3 years or so. $30 per full set of 12 batteries, 5 replacements needed in 15 years...$150 or $0.83 per month to operate.

Yes, the Quantum is more costly outlay for initial purchase...a new one today is closer to $450. But it is useful for most any brand of flash, not merely Canons.

OK Leo, you can do the net present value analysis using the raw data I provided.
Thanks, Wilt, but no thanks. I already have both battery packs so I don't have to worry about it. ;) :lol: :D

[silvex]

I paid a mere $250 for a new Turbo back in the early 1990's. Finally this year, I purchased a new replacement cell for it, doing it myself rather than sending the unit to Quantum for $90. It cost me $25 including shipping, to buy the replacement cell. If I can go another 15 years before I buy a new cell once again, the replacement cell would cost me $0.14 per month to operate the unit.

To have equivalent shooting capacity as the Turbo, you would buy 2-3 sets of rechargeable AA batteries, at $10 per set. You would need to replace these every 3 years or so. $30 per full set of 12 batteries, 5 replacements needed in 15 years...$150 or $0.83 per month to operate.

Yes, the Quantum is more costly outlay for initial purchase...a new one today is closer to $450. But it is useful for most any brand of flash, not merely Canons.

OK Leo, you can do the net present value analysis using the raw data I provided.

Good point and nice analysis. I think two sets of AA ($40) = one TC pack. So I think the in the LONG run the TC is better financially. I mostly see photogs with canon's not TC.