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Steve Parr
20th of February 2005 (Sun), 22:34
I'm interested in starting up a side gig taking photographs of local bands, here in San Diego. Every week, there are, maybe, 300 bands with gigs. For every one that gigs, there are two or three that don't. I'd imagine that half of these bands have websites. I'd imagine that, of these websites, a large number or them have photos taken by the drummer's girlfriend.

It's all in the planning stages right now. I've shot two bands thus far (gratis; both bands are friends), just to figure out all the little ins and outs of what I'm doing, time involved, etc., so I can arrive at a reasonable fee to charge.

So, I have some questions:

1) I'm not looking to pay the mortgage with this, but I don't want to undersell myself, either. Is there a "standard" to go by; say, a certain number of images for a certain price?

2) When a band buys the images from me (they would be burned onto CD), are they buying the rights to them, as well, or is that something that needs to be stipulated?

3) Is there a simple contract I should employ for doing something like this?

4) This is an equipment question: The flash on my Digital Rebel leaves, I think, a bit to be desired. A friend who does this type of thing for the company I work for rents a Quantum T2 with the power pack. I thought I'd "pick one up", until I found out that, new, these units, with the battery pak, are almost $800.00. Is there another, less expensive unit available which will yield acceptable results? Again, I'm not looking to turn this into a living, but I also want to make sure that my customers get good shots, as well.

Basically, I'm trying to get the benefits of a flash without the look of a flash; something with a diffuser, I think. I want to get the "effect" of stage lighting while not being subjected to always shooting without a flash to get it. Does that make sense?

I shot a friend's band last night, and I pushed the ISO up to 800. It worked fairly well without the flash, but not quite good enough for my liking. I didn't ppush it to 1600, although I guess I could've given that a shot.

Anything else that can be offered in terms of advice, recommendations, etc., are most welcome. I'm still pretty new to this and I'm still trying to figure it all out.

Thanks...

Steve

CyberDyneSystems
20th of February 2005 (Sun), 23:24
Just FYI there is a thread based on a similar question running in the EOS forum right now here;

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=58728

Maybe it can be of help.

Steve Parr
21st of February 2005 (Mon), 00:06
Just FYI there is a thread based on a similar question running in the EOS forum right now here;

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=58728

Maybe it can be of help.

Thanks! I'll check it out...

Steve

RockSlut
21st of February 2005 (Mon), 00:59
I have found that "Concert Photography: How to Shoot and Sell Music-Business Photographs" by Jon Sievert is an excellent resource for someone interested in getting into the business of rock'n'roll photography. http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0964700913/qid=1108966139/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/002-5037707-1304846?v=glance&s=books

1. Pricing - My personal experience from this type of work is that while there is money to be made, the smaller bands, which is where you need to start, don't have a lot to spend on photos. This however, may be a geographical anomaly (I'm in Brisbane Australia). I price from $150AUD minimum (below that it's not worth my time) and then vary based upon the required use. Photos for website use I quote approx $200AUD for 10-15 photos (I would normally provide images at 640x480, saved for web in photoshop). For print use, the same photos at whatever the highest resolution available from my camera I would provide for $300AUD, but include photos for web site use. I do it for love, but if someone wants to use the photos for a commercial use, I will charge them a commercial price (Thanks IndyJeff, RFMsports et al). IMO there is no point in putting the full time pros out of work and my gear is damned expensive. I can't justify buying more if I'm not making some money from it.

2. Usage - this would affect price (as noted above) and depends on what the client requires. I would advise against assigning all your rights in relation to the photos, particularly if you think that the band has real potential. I normally discuss with the client what they need them for and take it from there.

3. Contracts - I really wouldn't want to provide advice on that. Probably talk to a lawyer or check out books relevant to your jurisdiction. I have found that "Forms and Precedents" type books are handy. They provide sample contracts for various things from the sale of a business or a house to how to set up a trust. You should find sample photographic contracts in such a book.

4. As for gear, I have a 420ex flash,but I avoid it as much as possible. You can however get good usable results with practice, but they rarely will beat the ones with existing lighting.

As for general tips for shooting - your lens choice should be as fast at possible, f/1.8-2.8, and expect to shoot at higher ISO. On my G3 I would often be forced to shoot at 200 or 400 which were nearly unusuable at times. I'm expecting with my 20D to shoot between 800 for the rare well lit shows and as high as 1600 or even 3200 under normal live band circumstances. It's been my experience that most promoters/venues that I shoot at rarely provide good lighting.

I have a Canon 50mm f/1.8 and my next purchase will be a Tamron 28-75mm f/2.8.
I've read around these forums that the Canon 85mm f/1.8 and the 135mm f/2.0 are very good prime lenses for low light conditions.
When I use my G3 I tend to use the whole range over 28-140, so I'm of the view that a fast zoom is probably more suitable for the conditions.

I hope this infomation helps.

Steve Parr
21st of February 2005 (Mon), 11:00
I hope this infomation helps.

It definitely does; thank you!

Steve

Bruce Hamilton
21st of February 2005 (Mon), 13:03
And don't forget to obtain that all important release form from the band, as well... You can ask for it after you shoot the performance, but you can't do anything commercial with them without permission. Even posting them here for us to see could get you into a ticklish situation, if they or their agents happen to find them.

RockSlut
21st of February 2005 (Mon), 21:28
Bruce: You've posed an interesting question there for me. I would normally only obtain the artist's permission out of courtesy.

The reason being is that it is a public performance and unless the venue, or the artist imposes certain restrictions on photography the photos are yours at the end of the show. However, this is based on my understanding of my local law.

I would definately obtain a release if I intended on selling the photos for third party advertising or selling prints of the photos to fans. However, in my experience the bulk of the market is selling to the bands themselves or for editorial purposes.

As I've said before though, photographers should seek their own legal advice. Here's three great reasons why:
1. I'm not a lawyer.
2. I have only researched the law as it applies to me (in Australia).
3. A court is unlikley to react positively to a "...but some guy on an internet message board told me it was ok" defence.