Outdoors and Fill Flash

[ocabj]

I recently got the 580 EX II and I'm trying to play around with outdoor fill flash. I always bring my camera with me to shooting matches, so I tried the 580 to see what could be done in daylight.

Here's one example from the other day:

http://photography.ocabj.com/img/v4/p643611951-5.jpg

Any comments about the use of fill flash? Is it done completely wrong?

I was about 2-3 yards away from the subject. Sun is at 9 o'clock (the shooter's 6 o'clock) at about 45 degrees.

I had a 28mm f/1.8 prime on the camera and used the high speed sync. I think the shutter was 1/1600 at f/4 and it might have been in Av mode when I took the photo.

[CatchingUp]

Did you have the flash head tilted or directly aimed? Also, what about a defuser, did you have one on?

I certainly don't claim to be an authority on the subject...as I still am toying around with using a fill flash. I normally don't use it unless I'm dealing with harsh shadows from like a baseball cap or other shade maker. Have you got a shot of this without the flash to compare?

What did You think of this shot?

[ocabj]

Direct flash. No diffuser.

I didn't take that photo without flash, but here's photo from another match, same location, at about the same time in the day (similar sun position), without flash.

http://photography.ocabj.com/img/v4/p495162793-5.jpg

[CatchingUp]

well, given the two to compare, the flash was a plus...a little hot for my own personal taste. I guess being as close as you were, I might have tried tilting the head or defusing it to avoid such a direct hit.

What kind of rifles are those?

[ocabj]

The first is an AR-15 (civilian version of the military M16). The second is an M1 Garand.

Both are "National Match" configured rifles. Basically, gunsmithed/modified to attain maximum accuracy for use in Service Rifle competitions.

[myckul]

very nice on the first shot, a diffuser would have given a less harsh light on his face, try to use the flash off of the camera and shooting in manual mode for better effects... in the second picture having the flash on your right side could have eliminated the shadows under his arm as he is shooting.

sweet rifles

[Patrick]

I use the flash during the day quite often. It fills in the shadows quite well.

[1downfall]

very nice on the first shot, a diffuser would have given a less harsh light on his face, try to use the flash off of the camera and shooting in manual mode for better effects... in the second picture having the flash on your right side could have eliminated the shadows under his arm as he is shooting.

sweet rifles
Not trying hi-jack...but i have similar thoughts. What setting would use on day such as he shot for the fill flash? -1/2 or more?

[myckul]

Downfall,

I would try -1 on a bright day to eliminate the hard shadows but still have some light shadows to keep the shot looking natural.

[1downfall]

Downfall,

I would try -1 on a bright day to eliminate the hard shadows but still have some light shadows to keep the shot looking natural.
ty much. I will.

[asysin2leads]

This really isn't fill flash. The flash was your main light. Trust me, I did the same thing. The harsh shadow under his right arm is a sign of that. You really don't need high speed sync for this. There really isn't that much motion to this. My advice would be to meter the shot for the available light and set the flash at -1 for fill. Trust me, someone will correct me if I'm wrong.

[Bob_A]

well, given the two to compare, the flash was a plus...a little hot for my own personal taste. I guess being as close as you were, I might have tried tilting the head or defusing it to avoid such a direct hit.

What kind of rifles are those?

Tilting the flashhead when there is nothing to bounce off of should do nothing except require more flash power. :)

Using a diffuser would help, and maybe dialing down the FEC a bit to balance ambient with flash a little bit better.

[M_ark]

HSS is fine if the OP was trying to blur the background by opening the apeture.(it was AV mode)
-1 or even -1.5 if you're just trying to subtly lift the shadows. (i assume TTL EV in use)

[ocabj]

Thanks for the feedback. Like I said, I'm still playing around with the flash, particularly when taking photos at the shooting matches I participate in.

I think the flash is needed in the shooting range environments I am in. Most High Power Rifle ranges shoot towards the north, either favoring North-East or North West, and the sun tends to cause shadowing forward of the firing direction (towards the targets).

[woodsie]

Try playing around with different settings.

I agree with others. Dropping the flash exposure down would be good in these shots, still creating stong shadows without blacking them out like with no flash. The stong shadows will give a harder more "masculine" look to the shot.

Another approach for some shots is to underexpose the background by 1-2 stops and leave the flash at normal exposure. You have to have the camera in manual mode for this, as in Av or Tv it will wind the flash down to match the ambient exposure correction. This makes the sky a much deeper blue and isolates the subject from the darker background nicely.

Both approaches give different effects appropriate to different situations.

[HammerCope]

Nothing to add on the flash. On the shooting position have them get that elbow down and in. They will be much more stable.

[asysin2leads]

Nothing to add on the flash. On the shooting position have them get that elbow down and in. They will be much more stable.

The "chicken wing" is an appropriate method of shooting. Perhaps his scores are higher with this method than the other, preferred, stance.

[ocabj]

Nothing to add on the flash. On the shooting position have them get that elbow down and in. They will be much more stable.

You don't force the trigger hand elbow down. Let it hang naturally. Holding it high on the AR isn't detrimental. If it allows you to get a high firing hand grip, then go with it.

As far as the M1 and M14, you need a high shooting elbow to get the appropriate trigger hand grip for a clean, straight to the rear pull.

If anything, the AR shooter in the first photo has his head farther back than I would prefer. My nose is right on the charging handle.

[HammerCope]

Not not It maters to each their own and how they learned it. My mother and I were trained in the newer non-military position.

[Gatorboy]

For fill, set your flash between -1 to -2 ETTL and it will look much better.

A diffuser would do NOTHING. What would you bounce off outdoors? The light source would be the same size (unless you used an umbrella or something). Softness is caused by the size of the light source in comparasion to the subject. A stofen would just scatter the light everywhere causing the flash to work harder.

[prime80]

For fill, set your flash between -1 to -2 ETTL and it will look much better.

A diffuser would do NOTHING. What would you bounce off outdoors? The light source would be the same size (unless you used an umbrella or something). Softness is caused by the size of the light source in comparasion to the subject. A stofen would just scatter the light everywhere causing the flash to work harder.

QFT. Use FEC outdoors to correct your flash exposure, not diffusers or tilting the head. When there's nothing to bounch off of, tilting does nothing for you, and diffusers just make your flash work much harder than it should.