Concert Photography

[cargo123]

I recently purchased the Canon 20D, 70-200 IS USM - 2.8f Lens, 580EX Flash and the 17-85 mm Lens. I have got some time in the last 2 weekends practicing on some little league baseball games. I have been hired to do some concert photography at the end of the month for an "Old School Jam". I have never done any concert photography before. There will be a VIP diner where I am planning on using the 17-85 for pictures of the VIPs. I should be allowed to use a flash, and I am planning on using the 70-200 without a flash (and a higher ISO) for the actual concert. Any suggestions where I can go to get prepared for this event? Any recommendations on this type of photography?

[johneric8]

Yes, stay away from the bar! LOL....

[tim]

Practice, practice, practice. Try and shoot something else beforehand, if you get a chance. You'll probably have to use high ISO. You might even like to get the 50mm F1.8 lens, those two stops can make a big difference in really low light.

You might like to delete the other almost identical thread you started too.

[radar-eclipse]

Perhaps a 50mm 1.4 lens might be better. You will probably not be able to use a flash. The 85mm 1.8 lens would also work well, it depends on how close you are....if your in the pit or not.

[tacos3]

Cargo123,

I shoot a lot of these types of events for my church. I'm guessing that it will be stage lighting with gels. Light will be scarce. I upgraded to a 20d just for it's high ISO noise performance. I correct white balance in post processing.

I shoot ISO 1600 and you have to keep your shutter speeds above 1/125. I always shoot RAW. Most of the time I shoot Tv, set my shutter to 1/160 minimum and shoot. If the shots are underexposed, I correct in post processing. If my aperture goes above 2.8, I bump up the shutter speed or lower the ISO, depending on the shot. You get a bit more noise when you have to bump exposure up in post processing so I clean some of the images up with Noise Ninja.

My primary lenses are a 70-200 2.8L, a 17-40 4.0L and a 50 1.8. Here are some of my images...

http://baysidepictures.smugmug.com/gallery/422441/3/16960912

Good Luck,

Darren

[rubyscooby]

I usually tend to not use my flash and rely on the lights from the stage. I also have to go to pretty high ISO levels. I use the free noiseware community program to get rid of noise. It's free and works great. Here is a link to some shots I did with my 10D and the 28-135 lens.

http://www.rubyrieke.com/SilencersMilk/index.htm

and a better one that I took last week make sure you take lots of pictures as you will tend to get blur if they move. I use photoshop to comp in bandmembers if needed for an album cover so that each one is the best possible look they can get.

ruby

[cargo123]

Darren,
You took some nice shots. How far were you from the musicians (Guitar, Keyboards)? Any suggestions on photography etiquite? What would you recommend with the RAW. The only software that I have to look at RAW photos is the "Digital Photo Professional" software ver 1.5 that came with the camera. I shot some pictures in the RAW mode so I could play with it, and I could not get the pictures to look good. I took some under exposed shots to see what I could do to brighten them up, and I made a mess of the pictures. Thanks for you advice.

[rubyscooby]

Wow Darren those are really nice...
ruby

[cargo123]

Ruby,
I like the way the stage color lights up the subject. What ISO did you shoot at? Any suggestions on my questions to Darren. Thanks for your help.
Mike

[tacos3]

Cargo,

I'm on the video team for my church so I get access anywhere. Some of the close ups were from about 10-15 ft with my 70-200. It's a bit tight, a 50 1.8 would have been perfect but it was in my bag.....I think I need a harness.

Shooting RAW is fairly straight forward. DPP 1.5 is a good tool. There are other better ones out there. I use Capture 1 and it works for me. Post processing RAW files with DPP is fairly straight forward, just make sure that you copy a raw file so you have something to go back if you mess it up.

I usually adjust exposure, white balance and sometimes sharpness with C1 and it can make up for about 1-1.5 stops of under exposure in post processing.

My best advice is to practice, practice and practice. It took me a while before I had the right setup and technique. I'd recommend knee pads as I get close and get down on my knee so I don't block anyone's view.

Send me PM if you want more details.

Darren

[cargo123]

Darren,
I would like more details. I am new to this forum, so I don't konw what you mean by PM.

Thanks for your help.

Mike

[tacos3]

send me private email at tacos3@yahoo.com. I don't always check this forum but I always check email.

Darren

[DaveG]

I recently purchased the Canon 20D, 70-200 IS USM - 2.8f Lens, 580EX Flash and the 17-85 mm Lens. I have got some time in the last 2 weekends practicing on some little league baseball games. I have been hired to do some concert photography at the end of the month for an "Old School Jam". I have never done any concert photography before. There will be a VIP diner where I am planning on using the 17-85 for pictures of the VIPs. I should be allowed to use a flash, and I am planning on using the 70-200 without a flash (and a higher ISO) for the actual concert. Any suggestions where I can go to get prepared for this event? Any recommendations on this type of photography?

I shot stadium concerts for a number of years when I worked for daily newspapers in my area.

The first thing is to get very fast lenses. I'd be shooting from the pit so focal length wasn't a big problem. At that time I'd use either an 85mm f1.8 or a 180mm f2.8. Now I'd use the 50 f1.4 or my 70-200 f2.8.

I'd start with ISO 1600 and be prepared to bring it all the way to 3200 if I had too. My stuff was professionally lit (Paul Simon, Dire Straights, Metallica and so forth) so you venue may be darker. Although using the Tv setting makes sense on one level, I'd actually use Av. If the light is pulsating and changing as the performace goes on you'll never be able to "centre the needle" fast enough in Manual. The light changes are too quick. With the camera on Tv you'd determine the shutterpeed you wanted but could easily underexpose the shot if the light went below your "nailed down" 1/250 @ f2.8. On Av I'd select f2.8 and then let the camera find the shutterspeed. Yes there would be some shots where the camera fire at 1/30 and I got a blurry picture, but there'd be some where it got 1/500 too.

Although each group would kind of re-invent the wheel when it came to shooting their concerts we photojournalists were generally allowed to shoot the first three songs and then we had to go. Bryan Adams had us shoot songs three to five with us standing around in the pit for the first two. Go figure, eh? Anyway I found it dead easy to shoot one roll of film per song, so the number of slow shutterspeed shots was acceptable. Grain and colour don't mean much for performance photography, but sharpness still does so don't be afraid of high ISO's to get your shutterspeed as high as it can be.

[Mike Panic]

stay away from high iso if your using a flash... no need for it

shoot 100iso - set your camera and your flash to rear curtain sync - drag the piss out of your shutter and have fun... that is how i shot this: http://www.photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=60835

[tacos3]

Hey Dave,

I tried Av and found that I got too many shots at 1/60 that were too soft. I found that this way, I get more usable images. I could take a 1/160th shot that was 1 stop under exposed and correct in post processing. I'd get a bit more noise but it can be corrected with noise reduction SW.

Sounds like a fun job....any advice to someone trying to break in?

Darren

[René Damkot]

I seriously doubt flash will be appreciated... Only use it when you want the effect, or absolutely have to. When using flash, I'td still use Av and higher ISO, to get close to managable shuttertimes. (1/4s or so). Yust a matter of taste. I use 20/1.8; 35/2.0; 50/1.4 and 100/2.0 on my 1D2, and mostly no flash. Examples here (http://ftp.castel.nl/~damkr01/werk.html)

[tim]

Rene, you have some fantastic photos there, i'll be sure to follow your advice! Your website it's very easy to use though. I can click on one image and see it, and I can see smaller ones all around it, but i'd like to be able to see the smaller ones larger. Clicking on them doesn't enlarge them :( Is there a way to see them bigger?

[Incomplete Pete]

Whenever I shoot gigs I use my 70-200 as my main lens and a 17-40 as a backup, hardly ever use it though. Try not to use flashguns as they take away some of the athmosphere or a shot. Always shoot at ISO1600, couldn't get away with any less!

Here are some of my photos:
http://eclipse.smugmug.com/gallery/377966

[DaveG]

Hey Dave,

I tried Av and found that I got too many shots at 1/60 that were too soft. I found that this way, I get more usable images. I could take a 1/160th shot that was 1 stop under exposed and correct in post processing. I'd get a bit more noise but it can be corrected with noise reduction SW.

Sounds like a fun job....any advice to someone trying to break in?

Darren

You have to expect that some shots will be too soft and unusable. And this only works where the light level is dramatically changing through the show, but is basically bright enough.

Before I messed with trying to fix underexposed shots I'd use ISO 3200. It'd be grainy but since this is concert photography who cares? I'd also score the 1/1000 @ f2.8 exposure instead of 1/125 @ f8 during the shooting sequence, and then the sharp ones would be REALLY sharp.

Get a job at a newspaper in any largish city and you'll shoot a concert about once a month. And yes, it's better than working.

[tacos3]

Dave, Thanks for the feedback and advice. I have a contact at our local "large" paper and I''m going to have him review my portfolio for additional advice.

Rene and Pete, Very nice images. Sounds like I need a short fast prime for concerts, something like an 85mm 1.8 or 1.2 and that lens could double as a portrait lens.

Darren

[Mike Panic]

i still strongly disagree w/ shooting @` 1600iso - if the venue allows flashes and / or you have a media pass - use it - there is NO way ill sacrafice a shot for grain if i can get away w/ using a flash @ 100 or 200iso.

ive worked in the electronic music industry for 4 of the last 5 years or so covering clubs / raves / events - and in 98% of the case i use a flash - and generally drag the shutter and use rear curtain sync.

if you just shoot @ 1/60th or whatever you need to get buy, they tend to start looking like snapshots

[DaveG]

i still strongly disagree w/ shooting @` 1600iso - if the venue allows flashes and / or you have a media pass - use it - there is NO way ill sacrafice a shot for grain if i can get away w/ using a flash @ 100 or 200iso.

ive worked in the electronic music industry for 4 of the last 5 years or so covering clubs / raves / events - and in 98% of the case i use a flash - and generally drag the shutter and use rear curtain sync.

if you just shoot @ 1/60th or whatever you need to get buy, they tend to start looking like snapshots

I'd agree with that only if I could get the flash away from the shooting position. A camera mounted flash is going to produce an image that takes away the theatrical lighting, flattens the image and results in a shot that looks like it was shot in their basement.

If I understand your shooting style, you'd use ISO 100 and drag the shutter. I assume then that the shutterspeed would be down to very slow speeds - 1/8 - 1/15 and this would bring up the stage lighting. The flash would freeze the action.

But the flash would also colour correct their faces and there would be ghosting in almost every shot. I'd rather have shots that were created by the stage lighing alone and without ghosting. In any case using flash is usually forbidden.

[René Damkot]

Rene, you have some fantastic photos there, i'll be sure to follow your advice! Your website it's very easy to use though. I can click on one image and see it, and I can see smaller ones all around it, but i'd like to be able to see the smaller ones larger. Clicking on them doesn't enlarge them :( Is there a way to see them bigger?
Thanks!
No, there's no way to see them bigger. The presentation is made up as 'sheets'. They originally where for my portfolio @ 30x40cm. A (bit) bigger bandpictures (with horrible jpg compression) can be found here (www.atak.nl/pics.php) (Not all pics are mine, only when my name is stated :rolleyes: )