Do I need 64 bit Vista?

[cueball]

I just recieved my laptop with 4G of RAM but Dell put 32 bit Vista on it instead of 64 bit. Can 32 bit utilize all 4G but not more or do I need to fight to get 64 bit from them to utilize all 4G? Thanks.

[Tsmith]

I'd send it back and have them send you (at their expense) what you ordered, if I'm understanding you correctly. Vista x32 will not take advantage of the additional RAM.

I went from WinXP x32 to Vista HP x64 and couldn't be happier. Its a lot more responsive in what I do being able to recognize all my RAM. The only drawback that I've run into is some software vendors haven't released x64 updates for my Photoshop plug-ins but they are suppose soon.

[neil_g]

what did you order it with? you cant assume that because it has 4gb theyll put 64bit o/s on.

32bit will use up to 3gb.

[cueball]

Yeah, I screwed up and assumed that it would have 64 bit because of the 4G of RAM. That part is totally my fault (even though it makes no sense to me to build and sell a system with 4G of RAM and then limit it to only using 3 by installing a 32 bit OS). I understand my prior ignorance in this matter though and after having sat at a computer for the last six hours or so doing research I see now that my best option is just to return it for a refund and order an M1330 with a T8300 (possibly T9300 but I don't know if it's really worth it), 4 or 6 gig of RAM, Vista Home Premium 64 bit, 320 gig 7200RPM HDD, and the GeForce 8400M GS.

As far as the T8300 vs T9300 goes, will the additional .1 GHz and 3MB cache of the 9300 make that big of a difference? I don't do a whole lot of gaming but convert AVCHD to MPEG2 video quite often along with regular photo PP.

I spoke with Dell about having 64 bit installed on the one I just received but my option's were either to have them send me an install disk and load it myself (which I was told will void my software warranty), or return the computer for a refund and order a new laptop.

This whole thing is just frustrating because I was really looking forward to getting this thing and now I'm going to have wait for another week or two to sort all this out and get a new one. The portability of the 13" XPS ahould be nice though as the Studio 15 I just got is larger than I thought it would be. Thanks for your replies.

[neil_g]

it is frustrating but (at least here in the UK) very few manufacturers offer 64 bit as standard despite being multi-core 4gb or more machines..

if you really dont want to wait anothe week.. did you get reload disks with yours? if so would it be cheaper to source a copy (OEM maybe) of vista 64 and create a ghost image of the machine. in the event of a problem use the reload disks to go back to 32 bit, when its fixed reload the 64bit image. bit fiddly but itll get you moving..

[cueball]

Cost wise it should be a pretty minimal difference between dealing with the turn around and re-order time/cost vs sourcing a 64 bit copy. The M1330 or M1530 build's I'm looking at are only about $100.00 to $150.00 price difference from the Studio and either will allow future memory expansion up to 8G which the Studio didn't allow for. Either build also has a 320GB 7200 RPM HDD vs the 250 of the Studio so that's a plus as well. In a way this situation has been a blessing because I feel way more informed and therefore confident this time around after having done a lot of research all night.

[John E]

I bought a new computer a year ago and steered away from Dell because they didn't make any 64-bit systems at the time (not sure if they do now). Bought an Hp and couldn't be happier. Overall, I think Dell's quality/value/service has decreased dramatically in recent years.

[jchargu3]

read this for instructions on how to set /pae into your bootup (physical address extension).

http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/cc721886.aspx

[neil_g]

I bought a new computer a year ago and steered away from Dell because they didn't make any 64-bit systems at the time (not sure if they do now). Bought an Hp and couldn't be happier. Overall, I think Dell's quality/value/service has decreased dramatically in recent years.

well they do, they jsut dont always include the 64bit o/s as standard and usually its an upgrade. in the UK it doesnt seem to be the case on the cheaper home user machines, on the XPS M1330 tho -
Genuine Windows Vista SP1™ Home Premium (64 BIT) - English add £0.00

disagree on the dell comments tho, certainly in the UK.

[MaxxuM]

Yeah, I screwed up and assumed that it would have 64 bit because of the 4G of RAM. That part is totally my fault (even though it makes no sense to me to build and sell a system with 4G of RAM and then limit it to only using 3 by installing a 32 bit OS). I understand my prior ignorance in this matter though and after having sat at a computer for the last six hours or so doing research I see now that my best option is just to return it for a refund and order an M1330 with a T8300 (possibly T9300 but I don't know if it's really worth it), 4 or 6 gig of RAM, Vista Home Premium 64 bit, 320 gig 7200RPM HDD, and the GeForce 8400M GS.

As far as the T8300 vs T9300 goes, will the additional .1 GHz and 3MB cache of the 9300 make that big of a difference? I don't do a whole lot of gaming but convert AVCHD to MPEG2 video quite often along with regular photo PP.

I spoke with Dell about having 64 bit installed on the one I just received but my option's were either to have them send me an install disk and load it myself (which I was told will void my software warranty), or return the computer for a refund and order a new laptop.

This whole thing is just frustrating because I was really looking forward to getting this thing and now I'm going to have wait for another week or two to sort all this out and get a new one. The portability of the 13" XPS ahould be nice though as the Studio 15 I just got is larger than I thought it would be. Thanks for your replies.

1. You'll likely never know the difference between 64 & 32 bit Vista unless you do some very big work in Photoshop CS4 which I doubt. 64 is more stable, but it is less supported by hardware/software manufacturers (though this has improved remarkably in the past year).

2. If you have your heart set on 64 bit - install it yourself or send it back for a new one. A week is nothing. Don't let impulse rule your decisions - you'll be sorry in the end if you do.

3. As far as CPU and the added .1 GHz and cache, yes it will make a difference for video work. It will shave off about 3-10 min per hour of video rendering depending on how much you use effects in your work. On my Mac I went from a 2.4 (work) to a 2.5GHz (personal) Macbook Pro and there was a marked improvment even in real time rendering.

[cueball]

Just got off the phone with Dell Customer Service. They are giving me a full refund and having UPS come pick up the Studio from my house tomorrow to ship back. I'm going to wait to order the XPS until the refund finalizes but hopefully that won't take more than a week. Thanks again to all of you for your input.

John E: Unfortunately my last two computer's have been HP's. I say unfortunately because the first one had a hard drive failure right after the warranty expiration and the second one (my current laptop) is unusable unless I have an external monitor to hook up to it. HP's are pretty much dead to me for a while. I understand that they make some really good machine's but I've just had two too many bad experiences with them. Besides, my wife get's a 16% discount with Dell cause she works for Boeing.:D Anyways, thanks again!

[John E]

Best of luck to you! I guess we all have different experiences with computers. You story with Hp sounds like my story with Dell. Anyway, hope you get a good one.

[RandyMN]

FYI, My wife bought an HP that has 8 GB RAM with Windows Vista 32 bit.

Maybe they have found ways to utilize that extra memory, or maybe they put it in just because it sounds better as a sales pitch. Not many are aware of the 3.5 GB Vista 32 bit restriction.

I remember reading about ways to make your computer access the extra emmeory, but I just gave in and installed the 64 bit version. I had to toss my slide scanner though as it was no longer supported. I think that's why not many computer manufacturers include 64 bit OS on new computers yet.

[MaxxuM]

FYI, My wife bought an HP that has 8 GB RAM with Windows Vista 32 bit.

Maybe they have found ways to utilize that extra memory, or maybe they put it in just because it sounds better as a sales pitch. Not many are aware of the 3.5 GB Vista 32 bit restriction.

I remember reading about ways to make your computer access the extra emmeory, but I just gave in and installed the 64 bit version. I had to toss my slide scanner though as it was no longer supported. I think that's why not many computer manufacturers include 64 bit OS on new computers yet.

It can be done, but the OS can only map 4GB at a time despite these tricks. Programs also have limitations built in. Many people forget to add (or remove actually) their video card's memory to the total Vista/XP can see. Meaning, if you have a 512MB video card you will have to subtract that from the total memory available to Vista. Switching to Vista 64 bit alleviates this problem but adds other problems like larger memory block sizes. Meaning, 64bit Vista will use up more memory than 32bit Vista for the same tasks. Most people do not need 64bit Vista, but it is an advancement that needs to progress. In truth, Microsoft has hindered themselves alot by not moving fully to the 64bit platform dispite most people not needing it. Apple will make the largest step toward this goal this year. It is unknown when Microsoft will do the same because to do so they will have to make large sacrifices to do so.

[Faolan]

FYI, My wife bought an HP that has 8 GB RAM with Windows Vista 32 bit.

Some companies will do this if they don't have or can't certify drivers to work with 64Bit. However most of the first tier manufacturers are starting to send out Vista 64 as standard now. At least most of the new gear coming through that I've seen from Dell and HP have been for business, home owners are still a mixed bag.

In any case the licence key for Vista is interchangeable between 32bit and 64bit.

[_aravena]

HP and Toshiba have some great deals out there. I've been looking and debating between the two of them. Both have great specs and cheaper than what I could have built on Dell. I love Dell. I have owned three computers from them but have been a bit disappointed lately. HP has been questionable personally lately. My extended family owns 3 and all have had customer service and technical problems. Although fixed, they've had problems.

My dad has had a couple of Toshibas for a long time and everything has been perfect. Honestly I never noticed much from3GB to 4GB using the 32 and 64 bit OS but I never used the 4GB full time so obviously I didn't really get to do much. I say send it back and keep looking. I can't go over 14" on my laptops, just too big.

[Tsmith]

John E: Unfortunately my last two computer's have been HP's. I say unfortunately because the first one had a hard drive failure right after the warranty expiration and the second one (my current laptop) is unusable unless I have an external monitor to hook up to it. HP's are pretty much dead to me for a while. I understand that they make some really good machine's but I've just had two too many bad experiences with them. Besides, my wife get's a 16% discount with Dell cause she works for Boeing.:D Anyways, thanks again!

That's a good reason to invest in a program like Acronis and make a Clone of your system and save to an alternative hard drive. That way if you have a HD failure, just install a new one and copy the Clone to the he main drive.

[Oakey22]

you can ask for a vista 64bit dvd from dell free of charge. There is a website somewhere with all the info.

http://forum.notebookreview.com/showthread.php?t=327851

[cueball]

Thanks again for everyone's replies and advice. After a lot of thought, research, and a bunch of hands on in a number of store's (Which I should have done more of in the first place) I have decided to forego the Dell route and am going to go for a Mac. The new Studio XPS laptops from Dell look amazing but after playing around with the MacBook's in the store I just find myself really drawn to them and loving how OS X works.

My big dilemma now is which particular MacBook to get. The MBP is out of my price range so my decision is down to the 2.0 and 2.4 unibody models. If I went for the 2.0 I would have enough cash to upgrade to 4G of RAM and a 250G HDD but I would still be missing out on the extra processing power as well as the backlit keyboard. The 2.4 sits right at the high end of my budget so I wouldn't be able to upgrade the RAM for a little while.

Either way I go I will be getting Aperture 2 right away for PP. I've read a lot of good things about it so hopefully it will fit my needs (Currently I use PSE). Final Cut Express will come later for video editing. I like the fact that I can buy the Apple Care warranty extension at any point during the first year of owning the computer. Anyways, thanks again for all the input.

[MaxxuM]

Thanks again for everyone's replies and advice. After a lot of thought, research, and a bunch of hands on in a number of store's (Which I should have done more of in the first place) I have decided to forego the Dell route and am going to go for a Mac. The new Studio XPS laptops from Dell look amazing but after playing around with the MacBook's in the store I just find myself really drawn to them and loving how OS X works.

My big dilemma now is which particular MacBook to get. The MBP is out of my price range so my decision is down to the 2.0 and 2.4 unibody models. If I went for the 2.0 I would have enough cash to upgrade to 4G of RAM and a 250G HDD but I would still be missing out on the extra processing power as well as the backlit keyboard. The 2.4 sits right at the high end of my budget so I wouldn't be able to upgrade the RAM for a little while.

Either way I go I will be getting Aperture 2 right away for PP. I've read a lot of good things about it so hopefully it will fit my needs (Currently I use PSE). Final Cut Express will come later for video editing. I like the fact that I can buy the Apple Care warranty extension at any point during the first year of owning the computer. Anyways, thanks again for all the input.

You could go with an early 08 model, they are a couple of hundred cheaper than current models but still have about 90% of the power. Don't buy direct from Apple - go with MacMall and save some $$$. Buy with minimum ammount of memory and buy upgrade memory from NewEgg then buy Aperture 2 (which is a very good program) from Amazon. Those things alone will save you anywhere from $200-$400 depending on model and memory quantity. You can also save some good cash by buying referbished which are just as good and warrantied just as long as regular Macs'. You could save even more if you have children in school ($100-$300 savings). All told, my Mac Pro should have cost me $4,850 but after all the savings, educatioin discounts and Apple points (credit card) it was $3,980. If you have any specific questions about where and what to buy just post away. There are many Mac users here :)

[cueball]

Well I got the Commander and Chief to sign off on it and pulled the trigger on my very own 2.4GHz MacBook yesterday. I really can't thank my wife enough for being so patient and understanding about my hobby (obsession) and the expenses involved.

Anyways, I definitely didn't get the best deal out there but I did manage to save a little bit of cash. My wife gets 6% off on MacBooks and iMAC's through her employment with Boeing (8% on MBP's and Mac Pro's, 17% on Apple software) so I went down to the Apple Store here in Omaha and had them hook me up with a quote. Price before tax was going to be $1503.00. About a hundred bucks off which made it comparable to average internet pricing.

Well after that I decided to hold off on making a purchase and instead went to Nebraska Furniture Mart as they are currently running 21 month's 0% financing. I asked them if they would price match the Apple Store and they did one better and beat the Student price instead. Their offer was $1,493.00. Like I said, not the best deal but it was something. After taxes it was still below Apple's regular pricing so I was happy.

I plan on bumping the memory using NewEgg and then I'll get the Apple Care extension in a few months. I'm pretty sure that I'll go with Aperture but I have a copy of Elements 4.0 that came with my Bamboo Fun that I'm going to try for a little bit. Anyways, thanks again and sorry for the long post.

[Moppie]

Enjoy the new computer, I guess that is plus 1 to Apple and 0 to Dell for scewing up :lol:

I wonder if the big companies, Dell, HP, Toshiba etc, will ever realise that Apple is now a very real and legitimate threat in the consumer market?

[cueball]

If I had to guess I would say that they won't truly get worried/scared until Apple releases something a bit more powerful in the sub $1,000 market (Desktop or Laptop). Don't get me wrong,the current white MacBook has had just enough tweaks to make it still remain appealing but it's not a blow you out of the water with it's aluminum shell, backlit keyboard, and cool touchpad like the unibody Mac's. It does still have OS X going for it though and after one day with my new Mac I can honestly say that I am very happy with my decision. I am also really impressed with Apple's attention to detail.

[neil_g]

Enjoy the new computer, I guess that is plus 1 to Apple and 0 to Dell for scewing up :lol:

I wonder if the big companies, Dell, HP, Toshiba etc, will ever realise that Apple is now a very real and legitimate threat in the consumer market?

until schools and businesses start leaning more towards apple i cant see them ever threatening PC to be honest. schools will teach what is concidered mainstream, businesses wont spend the money to swap and will stick with what is known to work (windows server and office apps).

[MaxxuM]

until schools and businesses start leaning more towards apple i cant see them ever threatening PC to be honest. schools will teach what is concidered mainstream, businesses wont spend the money to swap and will stick with what is known to work (windows server and office apps).

I think you're short-changing Apple. They are making inroads on many fronts, particularly with the the 20-somethings. Microsoft, Dell and HP have all sat up and noticed Apple as a threat to their bottom line - and rightly so.

[neil_g]

not really, while i know apples market share has increased, i dont think its competitors will be losing too much sleep by the slight margin difference

[MaxxuM]

not really, while i know apples market share has increased, i dont think its competitors will be losing too much sleep by the slight margin difference

So, what you are saying is that you would discount the number one computer manufacturer? Not a great marketing move ;) I guarantee you every single PC maker plus Microsoft is paying very close attention to Apple. If however you're right, I think Apple would be very happy with that news.

[neil_g]

thats not what i was getting at.. im sure dell etc are watching apple with a beady eye but what i was saying was that apple have a long way to go to eat into their competitors market share. but yes youre right apples share is increasing.