Tell me what you think about this light set up....

[cae3]

Let me start that I am new to studio lighting. I will be shooting in a 12'x12' with 10' ceiling room. My main subjects will be mainly newborn/babies/toddlers. I will only be shooting in this studio, so no need to take it down after each session. Here is what I am thinking about purchasing from Alien bees:


2- B800
1-Medium octobox
1-48 inch shoot thru umbrella
2-10ft stand (not Alien bees)
A few sandbags
1-carrying bag

I already have a reflector (a foamcore white board)

So here are some questions:

1) Is this lighting overkill for a studio of this size and to be shooting newborn and toddlers? Even if I put the B800 at the lowest setting if needed?

3) I really want to get a third light, for the classic 3 light portrait set up. I will use one B800 as my main(key) light. Can I use my reflector as a fill light? Then use my other B800 as a backlight or hair light?

4) OR..... should I just use one B800 as the main light. The other B800 as a fill light? Now I wont have a backlight, or do I need one?

5) OR..... should I just buy a third light for the backlight? If I need a third light, then what is a good light for a backlight or hairlight?

6) What is a grid and what can I use it for? Do I attach it to one of my lights?

Anyone else have any other suggestions? Thank you for your time!

[pprice]

I am no expert, but the 800s are very bright at full power! For what it sounds like you will be doing I would say 2 400s would be just as good and save you a little money. I have a friend that shoot newborns and only uses 1 400 and gets some great pictures.

Just my thought :) .

[bobbyz]

I would go for atleast 3 AB400s. This way all lights are same and you can use the 3rd one for bg or hair light if you need to. Also you can use 2 as bg lights for wite bg and one as main and use reflector as a fill. Gives you a spare in case something happens.

With AB400 in place of AB800 you save $50 per light. Also buying 3 lights you get 15% off your accessories like octobox.


Here is a link to AB grid page

http://alienbees.com/hg4x.html

You can use it as a hair light to control the spread of the light. I prefer small softbox or stripbox if doing more than 1 person.

If you don't have any way to trigger these, get CyberSync, atleast 1 Tx and 1Rx.

[Rellik]

I just picked up 3 AB800s. I will have different applications, but if you can afford it, get the AB800 instead of the 400. Yes these things are bright, but they can be dialed down. Having more powerful lights means you can use them at lower power and have faster recycle times. Also modifers do eat up lights as well.

[bobbyz]

I disagree with Derek above. With AB800 you will be shooting at much lower power and AB have been know to have color and output power incosistencies at those power levels. My living room is 14x22 and I have 2 AB800 and even with 5' octobox and medium SB, I am rarely above 1/2 power on AB800s. And I get f8, ISO100, no problem (subject around 4-5 feet away). On my AB400, I only have to go near full power when trying to blow out white seemless using SB.

For smaller subjects, newborn babies in particular, you want to shoot at lower power and may even go ISO 200 or 400, so that flash doesn't disturb them (in case you feel so). AB400 are much better in that regard.

[Benji]

Faster recycling is always good with small children as the expressions are fleeting. If you are going for a mort permanant set up why not attach the fill light to the wall behind you, that way there will be one less stand to trip over/knock over.

Benji

[Milamu'g]

Let me start that I am new to studio lighting. I will be shooting in a 12'x12' with 10' ceiling room. My main subjects will be mainly newborn/babies/toddlers. I will only be shooting in this studio, so no need to take it down after each session. Here is what I am thinking about purchasing from Alien bees:


2- B800
1-Medium octobox
1-48 inch shoot thru umbrella
2-10ft stand (not Alien bees)
A few sandbags
1-carrying bag

I already have a reflector (a foamcore white board)

Be careful with the stands, you'll want some rugged ones for this setup. I've got some 10' Adorama stands and they work perfect with my flashes and modifiers. But with an AB800 and a medium octabox I'm pretty sure they start creeping down.

So here are some questions:

1) Is this lighting overkill for a studio of this size and to be shooting newborn and toddlers? Even if I put the B800 at the lowest setting if needed?Like mentioned AB's will lose consistency at lower power settings. In your 12'X12' studio AB400 will do, unless you've got some bad ass ambient and the only way to get rid of it is to overpower it.

3) I really want to get a third light, for the classic 3 light portrait set up. I will use one B800 as my main(key) light. Can I use my reflector as a fill light? Then use my other B800 as a backlight or hair light?Yes, assuming your walls are white you can use one of those as fill.

4) OR..... should I just use one B800 as the main light. The other B800 as a fill light? Now I wont have a backlight, or do I need one?A back light, rim light, hair light are used to separate the subject from the background. A necessity? No, but highly recommended!

5) OR..... should I just buy a third light for the backlight? If I need a third light, then what is a good light for a backlight or hairlight?IMO, yes. A fill light gives you more control then a reflector. Any cheap speedlight will do as 3th light. But you might want consistency in your setup and go for another AB

6) What is a grid and what can I use it for? Do I attach it to one of my lights?A grid can be used with some modifiers to prevent spill and aim the beam of light more directly. Imagine an AB aimed at wall with a 7" reflector, depending on how far from the wall you set it up you'll get say a 4' circle of light with nice graduated fall off . now the same setup with a grid will give a 3' circle with hard edges.

Anyone else have any other suggestions? Thank you for your time!How will you be triggering your strobes?

[cae3]

Thanks Milamu!

So I will check out adoroma's stands and B&H. Yes I need some very sturdy stands. So what size is a good size? 10' or 13' or once of each?

So do you really think that 2 b800 are overkill for a room this size. Also the walls are painted white. There isnt much of a big price difference betweem the 400 and 800, so that why i figure go with 800. What if I just turn them down? Will that work?


I will use a big white foam board for a reflector. Now can I get a stand for this? What type of stand for a foam board reflector. I know they make stand refectors but will they work for what I have?

If I were to use one of the b800 as a backlight, what degree grid to I get? They come in different sizes right?

As far as what I am going to trigger them with, I will probably use a cord of some sort. I want a Pocket wizzard, but Im going to have to save up for that.

Anything else you can suggest?

Thanks again.

[Milamu'g]

Thanks Milamu!
NP:D

So I will check out adoroma's stands and B&H. Yes I need some very sturdy stands. So what size is a good size? 10' or 13' or once of each?Like I said Adorama's stand won't work, just not rugged enough. 13' would be overkill for 10' ceilings and since you're shooting kids mostly even 7' would do.

So do you really think that 2 b800 are overkill for a room this size. Also the walls are painted white. There isnt much of a big price difference betweem the 400 and 800, so that why i figure go with 800. What if I just turn them down? Will that work? Not necessarily overkill but I wouldn't expect shooting at F2.8. If you turn AB's down the color of the light will slightly change. And eventhough the price difference isn't that much, you'll want a way to tricker your strobes and maybe even loose the umbrella and get a softbox.

I will use a big white foam board for a reflector. Now can I get a stand for this? What type of stand for a foam board reflector. I know they make stand refectors but will they work for what I have? I would keep this as simple and cheap as possible, just get 1 or 2 cheap light stands and some clamps from the dollar store.

If I were to use one of the b800 as a backlight, what degree grid to I get? They come in different sizes right?The bigger the more contained the light will be, so it just depends on the use and look you're going for. If to be used as hairlight on kids I would even suggest getting a snoot for the smallest light beam possible.

As far as what I am going to trigger them with, I will probably use a cord of some sort. I want a Pocket wizzard, but Im going to have to save up for that. Since your ordering at AB anyways get their cybersyncs, good stuff and a hell of a lot more affordable then PW's

Anything else you can suggest? Any props? What will your subject be sitting , lying, leaning on. What'll be your background, Toys for the kids to play with etc etc

Thanks again.Np again:D

[bobbyz]

I agree about Cybersyncs. If money is tight for PWs, CyberSync will work fine.

Regarding recycle times of AB400 vs AB800 we talking about quite small differences too even matter on home studio environment.

Regarding stands, I have good luck with Impact 9.5' air cushioned heavy dyty stands. They go for $39 at B&H. Last night I had my photoflex 5' octobox with AB800 and lighstand extended all the way and no issue with the stand. Sure the knobs are plastic but that's what you get for $40.

[bobbyz]

I would also get AB lightmod frame and set of gels. That way you can easiiy change color of your bg if you need to. Can come in handy for kid portraits.

[cae3]

Thanks everyone again! Ok...so a cheap light stand. Do you mean a light stand that is not made for photography? Where do I get one from? Home depot..etc?

Im getting a medium octobox, (I hope its not to big for my area 12x12 with 10' ceiling) and an umbrella. What type of umbrella is good? One you shoot thru or the one you reflect from?

If i get everything I listed above....do I have everything to start shooting? I mean once my package arrives, I have everthing to start practing that day? Is there any other cords, adapters, etc you can think of that I need to purchase that is not obvious to a newbie?

Ok...now about backdrops. I plan to get seamless paper in white. Im thinking of using muslin for a black backdrop. Is there a stand that I can hang both the seamless paper and the muslin? Is there one with 2 bars? When I buy the backdrop stand, will it come with everything I need to hang the paper and muslin or do i need to buy some adapters, etc?

Oh...back to the grid. Let me see if i got this right. A 10 degree shines less light than a 40 degree grid right? So you think since Im shooting newborn/babies the smallest light possible is needed for the backgroud right? So if the 10 degree light shines the least light, get the 10 degree one?

Sorry bear with me...i know some of these sound a little stupid to an advance strobist.

I know one day, I look back and laugh at myself for asking these questions...lol

Thanks everyone...I really appreciate it!!

[Milamu'g]

Thanks everyone again! Ok...so a cheap light stand. Do you mean a light stand that is not made for photography? Where do I get one from? Home depot..etc?
Hi again :D
I would just get a couple of extra light stands that are meant for photography. the cheaper ones are about $20 and you can get a cross bar for them so you can put back drops over it. Cheapest you can get is an empty paint can filled with concrete and a wooden stick coming out it.

Im getting a medium octobox, (I hope its not to big for my area 12x12 with 10' ceiling) and an umbrella. What type of umbrella is good? One you shoot thru or the one you reflect from? IMO a softbox would be a better solution here. An umbrella (esp shoot through) has a lot of spill and it'll give you the same shape of catch lights in the eyes as the octabox

If i get everything I listed above....do I have everything to start shooting? I mean once my package arrives, I have everthing to start practing that day? Is there any other cords, adapters, etc you can think of that I need to purchase that is not obvious to a newbie? Already decided on a way to tricker them? ;)
Extension cords?

Ok...now about backdrops. I plan to get seamless paper in white. Im thinking of using muslin for a black backdrop. Is there a stand that I can hang both the seamless paper and the muslin? Is there one with 2 bars? When I buy the backdrop stand, will it come with everything I need to hang the paper and muslin or do i need to buy some adapters, etc?See above. ;)And with kids you want something different then black/white, more colourful, playful :lol:

Oh...back to the grid. Let me see if i got this right. A 10 degree shines less light than a 40 degree grid right? So you think since Im shooting newborn/babies the smallest light possible is needed for the backgroud right? So if the 10 degree light shines the least light, get the 10 degree one?As far as I can tell from the diagram on AB's website a 10 degree grid spot sill has a beam of 6" at a distance of 1 foot. A baby is about that size! Just as a hair light this is too much. Either get a snoot or you just tape part of the grid.

Sorry bear with me...i know some of these sound a little stupid to an advance strobist.

I know one day, I look back and laugh at myself for asking these questions...lol

Thanks everyone...I really appreciate it!!NP :)

[pprice]

On the light stands I would get the air cushioned for sure! Just in case you have your hands full with the kid, you are trying to adjust you lights, you turn the wrong knob....bam, you light comes crashing down. (maybe a poor example, but you never know).

I got my stands from my local camera shop for around 50$ each and they are heavy duty and air cushioned. Worth it to me :) .

[bobbyz]

Thanks everyone again! Ok...so a cheap light stand. Do you mean a light stand that is not made for photography? Where do I get one from? Home depot..etc?

Get the impact one that I mention. Very nice for the money.


Im getting a medium octobox, (I hope its not to big for my area 12x12 with 10' ceiling) and an umbrella.

I have 10' ceilings and no problems with 5' octobox. Problem will come from spill control if you don't have fabric grids for it. Since you buying from AB, get the fabric grids.


What type of umbrella is good? One you shoot thru or the one you reflect from?

Get convertible one, so you can do shoot through or bounce. Actually photogenic had nice eclipse umbrellas.


If i get everything I listed above....do I have everything to start shooting? I mean once my package arrives, I have everthing to start practing that day? Is there any other cords, adapters, etc you can think of that I need to purchase that is not obvious to a newbie?



Ok...now about backdrops. I plan to get seamless paper in white. Im thinking of using muslin for a black backdrop. Is there a stand that I can hang both the seamless paper and the muslin? Is there one with 2 bars? When I buy the backdrop stand, will it come with everything I need to hang the paper and muslin or do i need to buy some adapters, etc?


You can buy some stands which have 2 rods. Now with stands you will loose precious floor space. If you can mount to the wall itself, it will be better. Bogen has a wall mounting system for multiple seemless rolls. For cheap muslin you can hang it from anywhere. Hain pianted ones are heavy though.

I bought Savage Port-A-Stand from B&H. It was $129 and came with one 53" roll of white seemless. There are others which are cheap. Nice ones with multiple rods are more money. I wouldn't worry too much about 2 rods, you can stick the musin even when paper roll is installed by using some A clamps.


Oh...back to the grid. Let me see if i got this right. A 10 degree shines less light than a 40 degree grid right? So you think since Im shooting newborn/babies the smallest light possible is needed for the backgroud right? So if the 10 degree light shines the least light, get the 10 degree one?


Instead of $30 for 1 grid, get the set for $100. but then having a small SB would be better for that kind of money. To use SB as hair light you may need a boom.

Other things, some foam core boards in back and white. Two sided ones are better.

I hope you planning to buy light meter like L358.

Little lighstand for background.

I am not sure how good shovel reflector from AB works

http://www.alienbees.com/ubr.html

THis might be good for white bg as you might not have the space to put umbrellas on each side to light the bg. I am thinking about it but haven't seen much information on the web.

[cae3]

Thank you Milamu'g and pprice! That helped me a bunch!! Im starting to visualize my studio now :))) I cant wait.

Thanks again!!!!!!!!