Your take on 'Escorts' on a shoot with models.

[inthedeck]

I'd just like to know how 'you' feel about a model bringing an escort. The good, the bad, plusses, minuses, etc. I've had some models bring one, and others not. Again, I'm not shooting nudes, or implied nudes, so it may be a bit different when shooting that type of scene.

1) I won't let another one in a studio type setting, especially when there's another photog. in house. I've seen too many of the shots where the model is looking away from the camera, even when I tell her to make contact with the camera, because her friend/other model is trying to change, or talking with the other photog. etc. So, no more!

2) On location...first time meeting me...yeah, I'll allow it. Second time, if I work with the same model...and I felt that the escort wasn't a bother, I 'might' let her bring the same person.

3) Boyfriends...no. That is just too big of a hassle...and can get out of hand 'way' too fast...and I assume moreso with nude/implied nude types of shoots. I had one guy walking around the area...and kept getting in the shot, despite my asking him to sit still in one farkin' place. But no...he just had to get up, walk around, stretch...bah. Done with that.

[tfiorda]

I don't mind an escort. I want the model to be at ease and comfortable in front of my camera. Note I said MY CAMERA. I will not refuse an escort but I let the model know the rules of the shoot prior to coming in and then let the escort know when they show up. Only MY camera in the studio, no other shots to be taken and if the escort becomes a bother the shoot is over immediately.

Sometimes i do put the escort to work, holding reflectors getting some prop or helping in general. If they don't want to do this, they can sit quietly or go someplace else while the shoot is on.

If it's a boyfriend, significant other, or I've even had husbands and fathers, I always let them know what we will be shooting and then ask if they have a problem with any of it. If there is a problem, we don't shoot. I don't want the drama or hassles that could ensue.

But, with that said, being professional with the model and civil with everyone else, I've never had a problem with an escort. But I always meet the model for a consult prior to scheduling a shoot.

Tony...

[Mark_Cohran]

Escorts are fine with me as long as there are clear rule up-front about who they are and why they are there. I have a Model Information page that I send new models to read before a shoot, and I always meet with the model before the shoot to make clear my expectations about the shoot. Sometimes I put the escorts to work, and other times they are simply allowed to watch the session. If at any time they begin to interfere with the shoot, they're asked to step back and find somewhere else to be.

More aggravating for me than escorts, are models that refuse to turn off their cell phones and constantly feel the need to asnwer every call and to chat between sequences.

[Mark1]

I have never had a problem with an escort. In fact the shoot I had on Monday( see my wonder failure thread) She actually got the model to relax faster than I could have. She also had some great ideas when we talked during breaks.

I let the models know I don't mind. And that alone I think had a few come without an escort. I guess they thought "If he is so welcoming about it, maybe I don't need one." If the shot involves any "exposure" I try to gently insist they bring a girl friend rather than a boyfriend/parent. I have found that when something gets shown, say a boob gets exposed, Girl friends tend to be on the "thats hot" side and make her feel good. But boyfriends start to get a bit protective. The escort from Monday is another good example. Maybe she wanted to see the models boobs, I don't know. But as we moved along and removed articles of clothing the more encouraging the escort became. It was great, I had to do nothing but direct the shoot.

As far as other cameras I dont care here either. They are not connected to the lights, and most end up with my equipment covering half their shots. They and up as "look what she did" shots. Not as competition.

[chrisvl]

I only allow girlfriends. never males and only if I feel it will help the shoot, like give here someone to interact with so I get more spontaneous/candid feel to the shots.
Typically my stand is if you feel unsafe shooting with me alone then don't shoot with me. Don't need the hassle. I tend to exchange a number of emails and send my pre-shoot checklist, and release ahead of time so the day of the shoot there are no surprises.

[M Powered]

I used to request the model bring someone to help i.e carrying my equipment gear, hold reflectors, etc, etc... That is the only exception I will allow the model bringing someone.

Unless I specifically state I want them to bring someone to help out, I usually assume they are coming alone, and I'm 99% right. Models I shoot are mostly industry professionals who take modeling seriously. Like any other job, you don't take your friends/ BF/ Significant other to your job/ workplace do you? Course not; modeling is no different.

I think I only shot with 4 models in my entire time shooting fashion/ glamor where a Model actually brought a BF/ Husband, etc, etc. None of the time the shoot turned out well.

Right now I'm thankful that I can simply turn down a model because they feel they need to bring an escort; but for the new photographers its a little more difficult, so each case will be different and you have to play it by ear.

[hawk911]

Half of my Mayhem shoots have brought escorts, and usually becuase they had a bad experience with another photog or shoot. If it's a location shoot, then I tell them to plan on the escort being used to hold reflector, lightstand, etc. If nothing else, they carry the models crap she dragged along.
so far, if the model is comfortable, the shoot is 1000 times better than her being aprehensive.

[M Powered]

Half of my Mayhem shoots have brought escorts, and usually becuase they had a bad experience with another photog or shoot. If it's a location shoot, then I tell them to plan on the escort being used to hold reflector, lightstand, etc. If nothing else, they carry the models crap she dragged along.
so far, if the model is comfortable, the shoot is 1000 times better than her being aprehensive.

#1 Rule. Model will say ANYTHING to justify bringing an escort.

I've heard everything from medical excuse, to "my bf is a make up artist." He helps me carry my stuff, he drives me, he spoon feeds me, wipes my ass, etc, etc... 100% BS. Don't fall for that.

[Nevilleblack]

Interesting. Ive wondered about that and especially MM since its pretty much a classifieds site. I will be shooting nudes such as rim lighting and body shots. But, I've always wondered, "I bet Ill get the BF who is over protective, ruin shots and then yell at me or tell her 'dont do that' - 'shes not doing that dude' - 'lets go baby'." lol
...ride off in their beat up bronze '79 Firebird.

[shannyD]

is it different for women photogs VS male photogs?

do models sometimes feel more comfortable with females shooting them ( even if they have an escort) or not? or would it boil down to the escort getting moody if she starts stripping infrontf a female.

i have done a few shots with a couple of minors, and they were always looking at their mom/ dad.

that made it strange for me ( becaue im just starting out in this aspect of photography)

the one that was actually a great shot just had her make up artist there, and she was a loose person to work with for the couple of hours she was therem and very relaxed, and confident in what she wanted.

blah i ramble, but im glad to read about peoples expectations, and experiences with models, and their escorts.

sorry inthedeck for a thread jack.

[BillMarks]

I've never had a problem with an escort. Most of the models I work with have never brought one. When a model does bring one, I usually put them to work. I also talk to them the importance of the communication between photog and model, and how they should be sure not to disrupt it--the model will get the most for her money if you don't distract her.

[charlesu]

I welcome escorts. They can come in, meet me, see the set, dressing room, etc. They can use the restroom, stash something in the fridge (we have a kitchen in the studio), etc. However, when the model and I go to work, they need to move to the reception area. Close by and they can still hear the model if there is any need (there never is) but they are out of the line of sight of the model. This way we can all focus on what we need to.

I have not had a problem with this scenario.

I hear about models who want their escort on the set but this is not professional. Can you think of any other business in which someone works and their boyfriend sits next to them and watches?

[KyleB]

I see nothing wrong with a model bringing an escort.

If I had a daughter going to take some partially nude pictures, I'd want her to have an escort with her.

[cdifoto]

If I had a daughter going to take some partially nude pictures, I'd want her to have an escort with her.
Why?

[Karl Johnston]

Why?
So she doesn't get raped by some nikon user.

[KyleB]

I'd want to know she was safe?

[mrgtturbo]

So she doesn't get raped by some nikon user.


:lol: :lol: :lol:

[Nevilleblack]

Why?
Bizarre question...

[KyleB]

Bizarre question...

He's just trying to stir the ****.

[Nevilleblack]

He's just trying to stir the ****.
It worked, "put up yer dukes!!!"

[inthedeck]

And back to the original topic please.

[cdifoto]

I just don't get why you'd be ok with your daughter doing nudes with a photographer you don't trust in the first place.

[KyleB]

Once my daughter is 18, its her choice. If she feels that she wants to take nude pictures, thats fine. I'd just feel better knowing she had someone else there (protect her, comfort her, give her advice, ETC).

[M Powered]

I see nothing wrong with a model bringing an escort.

If I had a daughter going to take some partially nude pictures, I'd want her to have an escort with her.

Ever worked with models bringing an escort?

Keep in mind, if your daughter books a shoot with a photographer who has the intent of making your daughter a victim, most likely if she brings an escort there will be not one.. but TWO victims.

Teach your daughter common sense, check references and most importantly if the photographer has good work or not. If she is doing it just for the money there are other fields she can get into that involves nudity that are well known ;)

[joedlh]

An experienced model can be expected to know the routine and to be able to scope out an unscrupulous person masquerading as a photographer. On the other hand, I understand somebody new to it questioning her ability to assess the level of professionalism in somebody who wants to shoot her. It's not uncommon in predatory circles for a man to pass himself off as a photographer in order to get a lady to shed her clothes.

I don't do glamour photography. However, if somebody asked me to shoot them, I would ask them to bring along their own MUA and/or hair person. It would make me feel safer.

A case in point: I once read a question by a guy posing as a photographer on an Internet forum. He wanted to know what he could ask a model to wear that would get him aroused. Does anybody doubt that a model new to the field would get a little paranoid with attitudes like this out there?

[chrisvl]

I think it would be foolish of any model not to exchange a number of emails, check out portfolio quality, email models reference in the port before going on a shoot with a photographer she's never met before.
You have to build a connection before the shoot so you know what each other expects from the shoot.
My advice to any model is if don't feel comfortable then don't do it.

[M Powered]

From my experience, models who typically bring escorts shoot nudes/ glamor. Fashion models never bring anyone ;)

[KyleB]

I do not photograph nude/glamor.

But like I said, I'd have nothing to hide, if he/she wanted to bring an escort along, I'd be fine with it.

Maybe my opinion would change if I shot nude/glamor, but I doubt it.

[KyleB]

Especially if it made the model comfortable.

Isn't that the point, trying to make the model comfortable, so you get the best shots?

Please, if I'm wrong, let me know. It just seems logical, comfortable model = better shots.

[Ledrak]

I think maybe twice out of all the shoots I've done I've had a model want to bring an escort, and both times I put them to work (I can always use an extra hand on my shoots :D). As long as they don't get in the way everything's cool.

[M Powered]

Especially if it made the model comfortable.

Isn't that the point, trying to make the model comfortable, so you get the best shots?

Please, if I'm wrong, let me know. It just seems logical, comfortable model = better shots.

Models who need escorts to be comfortable = Non professional models.

I prefer to work with professional models, pix turn out MUCH better. Look at my port on ModelMayhem, 100% of the pix were taken with Non escorted models.

Models comfort is important, but you have to understand what is it that makes them feel uncomfortable. Why do they feel uncomfortable? YOU, yes thats right, YOUR the reason they are uncomfortable so therefore they need to bring someone to feel comfortable, F* That.

I feel INSULTED if a model told me she wants to bring an escort. I literally told a model off last week because she wanted to bring an escort, then she replied. "You seem legit, so I won't bring an escort." My reply, "Thanks, but no thanks.. I'm no longer interested."

[FLphotoguy]

I always allow escorts, but I have had some problems. One escort insisted on staying in the studio and having a conversation with the model while I was trying to work. That didn't work. On a recent shoot, the boyfriend insisted on staying outside of my home in his car while the model worked inside. That looked suspicious to my neighbors, and I didn't like that. The best escort I ever had was the model's husband who didn't interfere and was happy to assist when needed for wardrobe and makeup adjustments.

[KyleB]

You have some great shots there, M Powered!

I understand its the photographers job to make the model comfortable. But I still don't see a problem with her/him wanting to bring an escort..

I'm sure Tyra Banks or Hedi Klum both bring escorts to their shoots. I really doubt they go solo.

I've worked for a handful of top D.P.'s on various shoots, not a single professional model has come solo. I've never seen a D.P. give a rats ass about models bringing escorts..

[cdifoto]

I'd just like to know how 'you' feel about a model bringing an escort.
I don't care what she drives.

[M Powered]

You have some great shots there, M Powered!

I understand its the photographers job to make the model comfortable. But I still don't see a problem with her/him wanting to bring an escort..

I'm sure Tyra Banks or Hedi Klum both bring escorts to their shoots. I really doubt they go solo.

I've worked for a handful of top D.P.'s on various shoots, not a single professional model has come solo. I've never seen a D.P. give a rats ass about models bringing escorts..

Whats D.P? Everytime I hear the term "DP" I think of something else ;)

[inthedeck]

I don't care what she drives.

:lol: Good to know. Dork! :p

One of the last models that I worked with said she'd bring her sister...and I said as long as she stays out of sight/mind, that'll be fine. She showed up, and was by herself...so, didn't matter for me. Just one less person to deal with, while I was working. Pictures, from my perspective, came out just fine. :)

[Ledrak]

Whats D.P? Everytime I hear the term "DP" I think of something else ;)
DP = Director of photography (in photographic lingo).

[KyleB]

LOL! I like you, M.

DP, Director of Photography.

I'm a Set Lighting Tech.

[M Powered]

LOL! I like you, M.

DP, Director of Photography.

I'm a Set Lighting Tech.

Oh okay,

Well, I guess, YMMV. All the agency models I've shot and know, none bring escorts. Kinda like your job, do you take your BF/GF to your work place too? A photoshoot is no different.

Oh to answer your original question Tyra and Heidi doesn't bring an escort :)

[KyleB]

They have escorts.. I've worked on several jobs with Tyra Banks, and she most certainly does. I've never worked with Heidi.

And yes, I bring my Fiance with me to work (when its a neat job, like the latest Pussycat Dolls shoot).

[M Powered]

They have escorts.. I've worked on several jobs with Tyra Banks, and she most certainly does. I've never worked with Heidi.

And yes, I bring my Fiance with me to work (when its a neat job, like the latest Pussycat Dolls shoot).

I guess for supermodels celebrities it makes sense. Or any celebrity for that matter. For the rest of us lemmings escorts are frowned upon. I'm sure the "body guards" tyra or any of the supermodels bring to a shoot will not interfere.

I for one won't tolerate it. For big productions they can bring who ever they want, as long as they stay off the set.

[KyleB]

You wouldn't like it if the escort lent you a hand?

I'm not trying to argue, I'm just curious.

[cdifoto]

I personally could care less who is there, as long as no one interferes.

[Mark_Cohran]

I personally could care less who is there, as long as no one interferes.

My sentiments exactly.

[Karl Johnston]

I find if it makes them more comfortable (now I'm no high end model photographer like Kyle up there) then it'll show in your photos, if the girl or guy is rigid or nervous (pet peeves) it'll show. .
Though if it were me going to get my picture taken, and I wasn't allowed my friends to come to the location or anyone I knew i'd find that a bit weird (what if it was a set up and I got raped/robbed/kidnapped/sold to mcdonalds/bought by a slave trader/thrown to sharks/flung in the air/pampered with a princely treatment and flown around the world in a private jet)?

I'd want people I knew to be around just in case one or more of the above happened (to either join in or stop it):p. I dunno, you have different exp. than I do, though, so whatever works for you.

[KyleB]

I find if it makes them more comfortable (now I'm no high end model photographer like Kyle up there) then it'll show in your photos, if the girl or guy is rigid or nervous (pet peeves) it'll show. .
Though if it were me going to get my picture taken, and I wasn't allowed my friends to come to the location or anyone I knew i'd find that a bit weird (what if it was a set up and I got raped/robbed/kidnapped/sold to mcdonalds/bought by a slave trader/thrown to sharks/flung in the air/pampered with a princely treatment and flown around the world in a private jet)?

I'd want people I knew to be around just in case one or more of the above happened (to either join in or stop it):p. I dunno, you have different exp. than I do, though, so whatever works for you.

High end photographer like Kyle? I said I haven't' even photograph Glam/Nude.. I'm not sure why you'd be sarcastic.

Sold to MCD's. I'm lovin' it.

[Karl Johnston]

I'm not sure why everyone on this forum is so pissy..half the time I'm insulting someone by accident around here.

I thought I read you worked with tyra banks ?

Oi I was right, I did read that;
They have escorts.. I've worked on several jobs with Tyra Banks, and she most certainly does. I've never worked with Heidi.
And yes, I bring my Fiance with me to work (when its a neat job, like the latest Pussycat Dolls shoot).

[KyleB]

LOL! I like you, M.

DP, Director of Photography.

I'm a Set Lighting Tech.

Yes, I've worked on some very high end projects. But like I said, I'm not a professional photographer, I do not work in the camera department. I work in the Electrical (Lighting) department.

[Karl Johnston]

Ah okay, whatever then. Same thing, you were there ;) you're bound to pick up something

[Toblerone]

No Escorts (I used to be OK with it in the past, btw. I was a fool lol).

I've had a bf ,a dad and a buncha girlfriends come with the model as escorts...
whatever the scenario, it always sucks/ Plain and simple.

there's another person in the room, it makes a difference and disturbs the flow of the process. period. :)

[M Powered]

You wouldn't like it if the escort lent you a hand?

I'm not trying to argue, I'm just curious.

No, thats what assistants are for.

I used to be cool with models bringing someone because I thought it was funny to turn their "escort" into a pack mule by having them carry 40+ lbs of gear, but that stuff gets old, not to mention the added liability risk of that "escort" getting hurt, or worst... dropping your gear :shock:

I've had "cool" BF come along being SUPER helpful, again that falls back on you as well. How professional does it look on YOU to have the models escort as your assistant?

Being a lighting tech, I don't expect you to fully understand by reading other peopels testimonies... this is something you would have to experience first hand.

All I know is that in this industry, (unless you are a major celebrity who travels with a body guard regardless); its highly frowned upon. I never worked with any agency represented models who brings an "escort" or anyone for that matter. Hell, this past summer I shot with a model who was from france in LA doing photoshoots for a few weeks, and I drove her to the location.

Like I mentioned before, if a model needs an escort to be comfortable, then I have no right or desire to shoot that model. End of story.

[hawk911]

Let's define the level of model then. Some beginner models and photogs need the additional security until there is a comfort level that both parties are legit. I think as the skills progress, the escorts drop off.

[Nevilleblack]

Its hard for me to decide because one one hand Id like the model to feel comfortable as possible. If she is younger and her father comes with, thats ok by me. As a father myself I can understand that. But for anybody else, I would just tell them, "Come back in an hour or 2 or whatever. Theres a mall a few blocks up, go have some fun."
I WOULD NOT want to be liable for anything they might do while in my place of business nor would I want them to loiter and possibly bust any of my equipment up etc.

[taxsux]

I was dating a girl a while back and she said there are plenty of freaks nowadays using photography as an excuse to perve. To those people, they know who they are.

Better with escorts I say, covers their ass and yours as well.

[M Powered]

I was dating a girl a while back and she said there are plenty of freaks nowadays using photography as an excuse to perve. To those people, they know who they are.

Better with escorts I say, covers their ass and yours as well.

Yea, what your girlfriend doesn't know is statistically they are more likely to get drugged and rapped by their "boy friend" than a photographer :D

So maybe she should take an escort when going out with her boyfriend LOL

[hawk911]

The BF is easier to track down, I would think than a pervy GWC. I don't care, as long as they don't interfere.

[taxsux]

Yea, what your girlfriend doesn't know is statistically they are more likely to get drugged and rapped by their "boy friend" than a photographer :D

So maybe she should take an escort when going out with her boyfriend LOL

Or in that case a photographer. :lol:

[Gentleman Villain]

Escorts usually suck because their mere presence often competes with the authority of the photographer. They can also get in the way of chemistry between the photographer and subject.

Here's a few tricks I've learned when dealing with escorts.

#1 - Reverse Psychology
Do NOT make a rule against escorts because that immediately draws suspicion from talent. SO instead....go "Yeah, escorts are great! I love escorts because there are so many creeps in the industry and a girl should always be careful...so yeah, I'm totally cool with escorts and I'm really glad that you are concerned about safety." Be really sincere when you say this...and half of the time...the model will leave her escort at home just because you didn't sound creepy when asked.... Try it...reverse psychology works :p

#2 - Bore them to death
Photo shoots are boring as hell for everybody that is not directly involved in the shoot. It only takes 20-30 minutes of sitting around watching the set until escorts get really bored. This is a good time to give them an escape-hatch, ejector-seat or basically an excuse to do something else. Make certain to have something for them to do that is away from the photo set. A couch and a TV set in another room is perfect. I had a big screen tv, dvd player, tons of movies, big fat red leather couch in my previous studio that was a perfect place for escorts to take a 2-4 hour nap and leave me the F alone. Other things work too....be creative...cigarette runs...alcohol runs....pizza runs etc

#3 - Put them to work
Ask the escort to hold reflectors, move lights, hold flags and other monkey work. This can have one of two effects. First, it can actually help you! Wow, what a concept! Some escorts make excellent assistants. This also submits them a little bit to your authority so that the photographer becomes dominant and stays in charge of the photo shoot. Second, some people hate to work and will immediately make excuses to get out of it. The best excuse is when they want to go home and then come back and pick the talent up later. "um, I forgot that I've gotta run some errands....can ya give me a call on the cell when the shoot is done and I'll pick ya up later?" PERFECT...escort just dismissed himself

damn...this post is making me seriously think what a devious bastard I have become over the years. But anyway, just a few ideas that may help somebody out...maybe

[Zonieart]

If the model is over 18, I don't care whether they bring an escort or not. If the model is under 18, they must bring an escort who is either their parent or guardian. The only thing I don't like is if an escort leaves the studio and starts walking around the house. I won't allow that. Also, one time I had the escort sitting at my computer table while I shot. It never dawned on me until after he left that I had several passwords written down that he could have copied.

[flipstyle72]

i've never ran into this problem yet...I've had 1 model long ago who wanted to bring her mom. It was tfp, i was new...so what. Her mom turned out to be a great deal of help. The girl sucked at modeling and her mom was more outspoken and not at risk of sounding rude than if I would have said what I kept thinking. lol!

Other than that, only twice has a model brought another person and it was usually a good lookin friend who I snapped a couple shots of too!! One paid shoot actually wound up being a double paid shoot for same amount of time.

[M Powered]

i've never ran into this problem yet...I've had 1 model long ago who wanted to bring her mom. It was tfp, i was new...so what. Her mom turned out to be a great deal of help. The girl sucked at modeling and her mom was more outspoken and not at risk of sounding rude than if I would have said what I kept thinking. lol!

Other than that, only twice has a model brought another person and it was usually a good lookin friend who I snapped a couple shots of too!! One paid shoot actually wound up being a double paid shoot for same amount of time.

I had a few cases where the model brought the mom, both were bad experiences. 1st one I had her ask me questions like,... "Why does my daughter need to be in a swim suit?" "What are these photos going to be used for" I was so pissed I was about to tell them to go home.

2nd time model brought the mom un-announced, everyone was pissed and the model was treated like an outcast. That ought to teach her to pull **** like that again.

[flipstyle72]

2nd time model brought the mom un-announced, everyone was pissed and the model was treated like an outcast. That ought to teach her to pull **** like that again.

haha...that's why I like you Kes...lol

[chrisvl]

I had a few cases where the model brought the mom, both were bad experiences. 1st one I had her ask me questions like,... "Why does my daughter need to be in a swim suit?" "What are these photos going to be used for" I was so pissed I was about to tell them to go home.

2nd time model brought the mom un-announced, everyone was pissed and the model was treated like an outcast. That ought to teach her to pull **** like that again.

Tell her to leave. I had a model bring her BF. He brought her stuff in and then I had a chat with them outside indicating that he would not be able to stay and why. He was upset that he didn't know in advance but all was good.