Southwestern USA - Early or late November best?

[Mike Bell]

I have a photography trip booked from 8th - 18th November. We go to Bryce and Zion National Parks and the tour begins and ends at Las Vegas airport.
As I'm flying all the way from the UK, I'm thinking of extending my holiday by arriving a week early or staying a week afterwards. Which would you recommend?

And where should I plan to go at that time of year? Grand Canyon? Death Valley? I know very little about that part of the world.

[bretedge]

I would arrive a week earlier rather than stay a week later. You'll catch fall colors in some parts of the desert and may even be able to make the trip to the N. Rim of the Grand Canyon, depending on whether the road is open or not. I live in Moab, UT and early November is prime time for photography in Arches and Canyonlands. If you head this way as opposed to going toward Death Valley you can also visit Capitol Reef NP and Grand Staircase-Escalante. More to see and do.

I offer guided photography excursions in the Moab area. Let me know if you plan to visit the area and are interested in maximizing your time while here. I'm also happy to answer any additional questions you may have.

[Win]

I'd recommend a week earlier, too. The North Rim of the GC will most likely still be open. We were there Nov 9th in 2008 and it was near perfect.

I would go more toward Moab, though, traveling through Page, Monument Valley and the Bluff/Blanding area. You could come back through Capitol Reef.

I'm in the Zion area, let me know if you need any info. I'd suggest these books:

Michael Kelsey: Hiking the Colorado Plateau, he has many others
Laurent Martre's: Photographing the SW Vol 1, 2nd Edition
Benchmark Road and Recreation Atlas - Utah

Win

[Mike Bell]

Thank you very much Bret and Win. There is nothing like local knowledge. If either of ever plan on coming to Scotland I'd be glad to reciprocate. :)

I've looked at those places on a map and it looks like a fair distance to drive. Roughly how many hours driving is it from Las Vegas to Moab via Page and Monument Valley? Would a regular hire car be OK at that time of year?

[FlyingPhotog]

You're looking at roughly eight hours of strictly driving time from LV to Moab via Page and MV...

[Win]

A regular front wheel drive would be fine, better would be a small SUV. Jeep Liberty for one.

FP hit the driving time right on the head. I would recommend designing a trip where you can visit the North Rim, Antelope Canyon (Page, AZ), Monument Valley and Moab area.

Another thought is to fly into Phoenix and do Sedona, South Rim, Page area and Monument Valley. Return thru Page and get permits for Coyote Buttes
and return the car in Vegas where you'll meet the tour.

You just need to avoid only driving.

Win

[Mike Bell]

Thanks guys! Lots of great location ideas. I will definitely hire a car. The idea of flying into another city and making my way to Vegas sounds good. It will depend on my finding flight deals that work and don't cost the earth.

Can I assume there will be plenty of motels with rooms available in November? I prefer not to book in advance to stay flexible. That's always worked for me in the UK and Europe.

[racketman]

Monument Valley definitely worth a visit. Motels no problem, miles of them in every town. Shame about the exchange rate! Make sure car has c/c.

[FlyingPhotog]

Thanks guys! Lots of great location ideas. I will definitely hire a car. The idea of flying into another city and making my way to Vegas sounds good. It will depend on my finding flight deals that work and don't cost the earth.

Can I assume there will be plenty of motels with rooms available in November? I prefer not to book in advance to stay flexible. That's always worked for me in the UK and Europe.

You should be ok in November. It's what we would call "shoulder season" on the back end of summer...

One thing advanced reservations would help you guard against are bus tours. When you see a three or four bus-sized group roll in, the hotel is probably going to be pretty full.

[Mike Bell]

I wish I lived in a country where November was the 'back end of summer'! :lol:

In Scotland summer lasts about 3 weeks .... but you can never predict which 3! :rolleyes:

[LarryD]

I don't think that I would be looking at the North Rim of the Grand Canyon in November... I would be going to the South Rim.... and it is open year around.

The sun is in the south so most shots of the canyon itself will be looking into the sun from the North Side, but at your back while on the South Rim.

These shots are in ~November from the South Rim and you can see if you were on the opposite side (which is to your right in the middle shot) of the canyon you would be looking into the shadows at that time of year..

As for Vegas, ....go early as October-November are historically the most moderate months.

http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa67/LD_album/Nature/Grand%20Canyon/GrandCanyon2003010.jpg

http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa67/LD_album/Nature/Grand%20Canyon/GrandCanyon2003032.jpg

http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa67/LD_album/Nature/Grand%20Canyon/condor2.jpg

[FlyingPhotog]

Yeah, good call on the North Rim that late in the fall.

FWIW...

The bulk of the facilities at the North Rim were scheduled to close on October 15, 2008 with scenic roadways, overlooks, permit office, book store and gift shop remaining open until December 1, 2008 when State Route 67 was scheduled to be closed for the winter.

This was all subject to change depending on when and how much snow might come earlier.
http://www.nps.gov/grca/parknews/upload/2008-11-26%20North%20Rim.pdf

[Mike Bell]

Good points! Thank you. I need to do a lot of research for this trip, especially as it will be my first time in the USA.

[sparker1]

Mike, I love Moab, where Arches and Canyonlands National Parks are located. However, I would spend the limited time available in Zion, Bryce, the area around Kanab, UT and Page, AZ, and possibly as far as Monument Valley. There is just so much to see and do within that region, why spend more time than necessary driving to other places? Once you see this area, you will undoubtedly return in the future, at which time you can visit Moab and that area. Just my thoughts. You will love it, whichever approach you take. The books recommended by Win are good. Martres has several photography guide books with many out of the way places and how to get to them.

[FlyingPhotog]

Mike, I love Moab, where Arches and Canyonlands National Parks are located. However, I would spend the limited time available in Zion, Bryce, the area around Kanab, UT and Page, AZ, and possibly as far as Monument Valley. There is just so much to see and do within that region, why spend more time than necessary driving to other places? Once you see this area, you will undoubtedly return in the future, at which time you can visit Moab and that area. Just my thoughts. You will love it, whichever approach you take. The books recommended by Win are good. Martres has several photography guide books with many out of the way places and how to get to them.

Another FWIW...

I spent three days at Page back in September of 2007 and had every intention of getting to Bryce, Zion, MV, North Rim, Horseshoe Bend, Antelope Canyon and around Lake Powell.

My ego ended up much bigger than my ability to drive as I never made it to Bryce, Zion or MV... The distances are very deceiving and are nowhere near "as the crow flies..."

Just an FYI ;)