Do APS-size cameras need different size lens hoods?

[DavidEB]

Seems to me that if the view angle for an APS camera is smaller than for the full-frame, then the lens hood should be deeper. Yet the lenses are sold with only a single hood size.

Does it make much difference?

Is there a list anywhere of lens hood substitutions (ie, if you have the 85 f/1.8 and an APS camera, get lens hood model # so-and-so)?


thanks,


David

[Todd Jacobsen]

Lens hood is LENS dependent not camera dependent.

[jbradc]

The only difference is that you may not need a wide angle hood on a wide lens (like a 28 or 35) because with the 1.6 crop factor you are not using the entire lens area.

[Jon]

The proper lens hood deopends on both. It has to match the effective angle of view of the lens, which is determined by the sensor size of the camera.

I don't think there is a general list - part of the problem is that the lenses aren't all the same diameter, so that, say, the lens hood for the 16-35 matched to 20D sensor would be about that for a 26-50 full-frame zoom. And I don't think that Canon makes any in the right diameter. Or matching a lens hood for the 100-400/20D to the hood for the mythical 160-640. There are probably some cases (maybe one of the 50 mm lenses with the hood for an 85) that would work, but not a lot. Check out the real angle of coverage for a lens, match it to something in Canon's list and see if that would fit.

[DavidEB]

Jon - thanks.

does anybody know if it makes a difference - has anyone taken flare test pics with the "correct" hood and with a deeper hood and compared? I don't have any deeper hoods that fit so I can't tell.

[Phil V]

Ther is a site somewhere that lists some alternative hoods, I considered buying the alternative hood for the 17-40, I think it's the old 28-70L hood that goes IIRC. Do a google, you might hit lucky.

I would imagine it makes some difference, remember that a hood for a zoom is made not to vignette at the widest setting, so at the narrowest setting the shade is a long way from the image edge.

[Todd Jacobsen]

Wasn't the original question" How does an "APS" camera (cause) effect hood size?

"APS", which is essentially a 1.4 camera, should have no effect on lens hood size.

[RichardtheSane]

Lens hood is LENS dependent not camera dependent.

I'm not sure that is not entirely accurate.

Because a lens hood is designed to eliminate flare to the best of it's ability without causing vignetting, yes?

So suddenly the ideal (note Ideal not correct) hood for a lens does become camera dependant as it is possible to provide better shade in order to eliminate flare using a deeper hood than the one that is designed for the lens.

For example I know that the EW-83E hood that came with my 17-40L is the correct one, but if I use the hood from the 24mm F1.4L lens then I will have the ideal hood as it is deeper but will not vignette.

[Quinn Porter]

You can use the 1.6x factor when considering which hood to purchase. For instance, I use the hood designed for the 24mm f/1.4L on my 16-35L. It works perfectly well. However, Canon's hood designs vary from lens to lens and I did have to modify the hood a bit to get a proper fit. I tried using the hood from the 85mm f/1.8 on the 50mm f/1.4, but the hood mounts were different and I wasn't able to get a good fit.

[Todd Jacobsen]

I'm not sure that is not entirely accurate.

Because a lens hood is designed to eliminate flare to the best of it's ability without causing vignetting, yes?

I agree that an APS camera COULD use a deeper lens hood than, say, a 35mm camera, since the hood is sized for a 35mm "view".

But that isn't to say that the APS camera would have GREATER flare problems caused by using the hood that is typically used for the lens.

A larger hood would have a better chance at stopping center point flare. But, if the APS were to have flare there, so would the 35mm camera...

[RDKirk]

Seems to me that if the view angle for an APS camera is smaller than for the full-frame, then the lens hood should be deeper. Yet the lenses are sold with only a single hood size.

Does it make much difference?

Is there a list anywhere of lens hood substitutions (ie, if you have the 85 f/1.8 and an APS camera, get lens hood model # so-and-so)?


Good hoods can make a difference. A "good" hood is the deepest that cuts out every ray of light that isn't required to build the image. That's why you see many studio photographers using "compendium" or "bellows" hoods that they can extend to match the angle of view of the lens. They extend the hood until they just see the edges in the viewfinder, then they pull it back slightly.

I have a Tamron 17-35mm XR Di that's a very good lens, but as expected, in bright cross-light or backlight situations, it does suffer from some flare--interestingly, it suffers significantly more in cross light than backlight. The hood that comes with the Tamron is designed for 24x36mm. But I discovered that the Tokina hood for the Tokina 28-80mm ATX Pro serendipitously bayonets perfectly onto the Tamron. The Tokina hood is designed for the same angle of view as the Tamron when the Tamron is used on an APS-C camera. And, yes, it makes a BIG difference in the ability of the lens to resist crosslighting flare--nearly night and day.

[RDKirk]

A larger hood would have a better chance at stopping center point flare. But, if the APS were to have flare there, so would the 35mm camera...

Not necessarily (actually, not likely). The best hood would closely follow the angle of view of the lens and would mirror the shape of the format. It would cut out all light that is not destined to create the image (or rather, it would replace the bright image of exterior sources such as the sky with the much dimmer image of the inside of the hood). This excess light bounces in the lens and the mirror box, and much strikes the sensor as flare. The better the hood stops this light outside the lens, the less chance of flare.

A lens on an APS-C format would present a narrower angle of view to the sensor than it would to a 35x36mm sensor, and thus must be deeper and shorter to fulfill that role of being as deep as possible without cutting off any of the image.

[Tom W]

Not necessarily (actually, not likely). The best hood would closely follow the angle of view of the lens and would mirror the shape of the format. It would cut out all light that is not destined to create the image (or rather, it would replace the bright image of exterior sources such as the sky with the much dimmer image of the inside of the hood). This excess light bounces in the lens and the mirror box, and much strikes the sensor as flare. The better the hood stops this light outside the lens, the less chance of flare.

A lens on an APS-C format would present a narrower angle of view to the sensor than it would to a 35x36mm sensor, and thus must be deeper and shorter to fulfill that role of being as deep as possible without cutting off any of the image.

That is correct, and is one of the reasons that people use the hood designed for the 24 mm f/1.4 on their 17-40 zooms, despite the fact that this very hood would vignette at 40 mm on full-frame. You simply block more of the light that isn't part of the image, but can be part of the internal lens reflections.

[CyberDyneSystems]

Check the "10,000 posts on the Crop Factor" thread in the -=READ FIRST=- sticky..
There are two posts that go into the Crop factors effect on lens hoods in detail,. some with illustrations ;)

The short answer is yes,. the crop factor definitely has an effect on what the best lens hood would be.

The 17-40mm for example,. has a lens hood designed for 35mm full frame (like all Canon lenses) but in this case the resulting hood is woefully inadequate for a 1.6X sensor.

And yes,. I'm a geek,. and therefore I have custom made "APS" lens hoods for some of my wide angle lenses... ;)

[CyberDyneSystems]

Wasn't the original question" How does an "APS" camera (cause) effect hood size?

"APS", which is essentially a 1.4 camera, should have no effect on lens hood size.

"APS" though not the exact same size as the 10D, 20D, 300D sensor's 1.6X,. has become the modern generic term for all 'Crop Factor" sensors excluding only the 2X crop factor sensor on the Olympus.

Therefore "APS" sensors include all of Canon's 1.6X, Minolta's SLR, Pentax's SLR and every Nikon Sensor made.. (all 1.5X)

No there not the same size as the APS film was,. but it is now the only real relevent use remaining for the term "APS" as there are no APS film SLR cameras left in production.

[DavidEB]

Cyberdyne - thanks. I had scanned the "10,000 posts...." but overlooked the lens hood ones. my mistake.

[CyberDyneSystems]

It seems the "visual aids" in my thead are no longer online.. I may have to fix that soon ;)

[Andy_T]

In addition, a lens hood on a zoom lens would have to change its length as you zoom in or out in order to be as effective as possible at any focal length.

Best regards,
Andy

[Tom W]

In addition, a lens hood on a zoom lens would have to change its length as you zoom in or out in order to be as effective as possible at any focal length.

Best regards,
Andy

Which is why the 24-70 zoom changes its length in a fashion that seems reversed - its designed to move the lens deeper into the hood for telephoto shots, while moving the lens our towards the front of the hood for wide angle.

[CyberDyneSystems]

Yep,. the 24-70mm and the older 28-70mm are the only lenses I know of that do this... quite a feat of engineering I imagine,. other wise you might see this more often.