Err 99 on 20D because of flash?????

[johneric8]

I have just come to an understanding and I wanted to see if anyone sees any correlation here? I just sent back my 20D because I was getting err 99 messages with my sunpak flash. I was shooting with the flash in M mode and the camera as well. Anyway, I just got my new 20D today and hooked it back up with the same flash and same setting and started getting the same err 99 after a shot or two. Please keep in mind this is a brand new 20D. Here is the kicker, I switched the mode on the external flash to A mode and it quit giving me the error message. I have heard different stories on which mode to put the flash in so does this make any sense to anyone? Could it be that the flash has a problem or something? It used to work fine with my 300D. Or, does the flash need to be in A mode? I'm a little confused so if anyone has any ideas please share with me. Keep in mind it did this with both 20D's so I doubt it's a problem with the camera.

[robertwgross]

Correct, it does not sound like a fault of the camera. Nowhere does Canon tell you that you can use a Sunpak flash. Nowhere.

Now, we know that Canon likes to sell Canon flashes. So, if you have a Canon camera and a Canon flash, then Canon can take some responsibility for making them compatible and working. If you get a Canon camera and a Brand X flash, then Canon no longer has any responsibility for making them compatible and working.

There are a very few non-Canon flashes out there that seem to be fairly compatible, but it escapes me why some people think they can throw together one item from Column A and one item from Column B and they are going to automatically work compatibly.

"Could it be that the flash has a problem or something?"

Duh!

---Bob Gross---

[johneric8]

I never assumed that the flash should work. It was something my father gave me that he had in his camera bag so I thought I would give it a try. I am fully aware of the incompatibility issues between the sunpak (made for film camera flash) and digital cameras. I just didnt know if anyone had any insight to err 99 and external flashes with the 20D. The some people that you are talking about Bob doesnt include me that I can assure you.

[robertwgross]

Well, we know that there is a complex dialog that can occur between a Canon camera and its external Canon flash when in E-TTL mode. We also know that there is probably little compatible intelligence in a really old non-Canon flash. We know that Err 99 is the catch-all message that your camera will show when something weird happened. Often, that is some lens issue, but it could be just about anything unexpected that the processor detects.

If a camera started the flash dialog and then did not get a suitable response, then I would kind of expect it to show an Err 99, or something similar.

---Bob Gross---

[johneric8]

that sounds very logical to me.. I didnt have any problems with my rebel using the subpak but the 20D just doesnt like it... I figured out last night that it really doesnt matter mode mode the flash is in it can show err 99 in both A and M modes on the flash.. Oh well, I'm going to get a canon flash soon that is for certain..

[robertwgross]

Oh well, I'm going to get a canon flash soon that is for certain..

A debate might happen as to whether you should get a 580EX, 550EX, or 420EX. Whatever.

I have a 550EX and a 420EX, plus also the STE2 transmitter, so I can set up some nifty wireless master-slave stuff if I need to. I don't need wireless that often. But, as they say, "In for a penny, in for a pound."

---Bob Gross---

[johneric8]

I was hoping I could at least use the sunpak as a slave to the canon when I get it. I just want to get the best flash for the 20D. Which ever that one is that is one I want. I know they are all a bit different. It will be nice to have one that works with my camera for a change. What a whip it is using the sunpak. The other day I used the subpak as a slave and it did a good job. What benefits does the transmitter give you Bob? I really dont know that much about em..

[robertwgross]

What benefits does the transmitter give you Bob? I really dont know that much about em..

If you want to play in the Canon wireless flash system, then you need at least one wireless master and at least one wireless slave.

Now, the 580EX can be a wireless master, or a wireless slave or wireless OFF. Of course it is a flash unit.

The 550EX is exactly the same.

The 420EX can be a wireless slave, or wireless OFF. Of course it is a flash unit.

The STE2 transmitter is a wireless master. Period. No slavery, and it is NOT a flash unit. If it is on the hotshoe, it will "talk" to the wireless slaves within a distance, using its near infrared pulses.

So, if I choose, I can put my 550EX on the hotshoe and stop there. Or, I can put my 420EX on the hotshoe and stop there. Or, I can put the 550EX on the hotshoe, and put the 420EX ten feet away to the left, and that works also. Or, I can put the STE2 on the hotshoe, put the 420EX ten feet to the left, and put the 550EX ten feet to the right. That works too. Most people do not need to spread out their light that much. However, if you have ever tried to shoot a three-row family shot at a wedding (maybe 30-40 people), you have to have a wide lens and a wider set of flashes.

---Bob Gross---

[johneric8]

very well put! thanks for the info..... I understand very well. so if you have the transmitter on the hot shoe of your camera it can tell your slave flash to go off that may be 10 feet away? Is this assumption correct?

[robertwgross]

very well put! thanks for the info..... I understand very well. so if you have the transmitter on the hot shoe of your camera it can tell your slave flash to go off that may be 10 feet away? Is this assumption correct?

If you have a wireless master connected to the hotshoe, then it "talks" to the wireless slave flashes that are within 10 meters outdoors or 15 meters indoors (at least that is the spec). You can set right-left lighting ratios and all that good stuff, right from the wireless master, and it "tells" the wireless slaves what to do.

Note that the Canon wireless flash system is completely different from the old method of optically slaving flashes, and the two ways are mutually incompatible.

---Bob Gross---

[Mark_48]

I have yet to try out a Master/Slave flash setup with my newly aquired 580EX and older 420EX. Do they have to be some what line of sight between the two for the infrared to communicate? Or can the infrared be sort of "bounced" around corners?

[Todd Jacobsen]

I have yet to try out a Master/Slave flash setup with my newly aquired 580EX and older 420EX. Do they have to be some what line of sight between the two for the infrared to communicate? Or can the infrared be sort of "bounced" around corners?

Indoors, it has been reported that the wireless IR can easily be bounced around and there does not need to be a direct line-of-sight between the IR receivers. Of course, one has to be within reason. Sticking a flash behind a couch, with no chance of seeing the IR signal (ie bounce angle bad) will probably not work.

Outdoors, I've been told one has to point the IR receiver back at the Master. I have just ordered 3x580Ex's to go along with my current 580 and will be able to verify that. I have so far, chosen not to purchase the STE-2 since is only does two group setups (vs 3). The STE-2 supposedly can "fire" group C but goup C flashes have to be manually adjusted (vs at the Master). I'm lazy and willing to pay $160 extra for that laziness ($160 is difference between STE-2 and 580EX).