Any signs of a updated 100-400 L or a 400 5.6L IS ????

[Viky]

Hi,

I'm on the look out to get myself a budget telephoto for birding and wildlife...and the only real options are..

EF 100-400mm L - The Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 USM L IS was released way back in 1998. This lens with its long range zoom is perfectly suited for sports & wildlife. It has the old generation push-pull zoom mechanism instead of the current twist zoom. If I am correct, this is the ONLY surviving lens in the Canon linup wi the push -pull zoom mechanism! The Image Stabilization system is also the 1st generation variant which gives you the equivalent of two stops in hand holdability compared to the 4-stop hand holdability provided by the current generation IS on most newer cannons. This has already been around for more than 10yers now, and an updated version with the standard twist zoom and 4stop IS would do wonders for us armatures:)


EF 400m f/5.6 L- The Canon EF 400mm f/5.6 USM L was launched way back in 1993. It is one of the affordable super-tele primes in the Canon line-up and the last of the species that has not been replaced by an IS successor - it has survived without any changes for more than 15years now. People love it for its small size, light weight and excellent optics...just wish if they could update this one with a 4stop IS systems would make this lens just about unbeatable:)

So guys, any possibilities/news/rumors of an update on these lines in the near future??

Share your views...

Viky

[Grentz]

Why does everyone want a twist zoom for the 100-400? The Push-Pull is sooo much better IMO for long focal ranges like 100-400 as it is quick to zoom in and out. I have an old tamron minolta lens for 35mm that is push pull and it is great as well. It has also been shown over and over that is indeed not a dust pump.

I see no reason push-pull should be called old generation, it is just as good if not better than twist zoom for these long range lenses. Most that are against it have not used it much if at all first hand.

[mikekelley]

I would prefer the twist-type zoom if the zooming was all internal, and the length of the lens did not change. That is the one thing that I dislike about push-pull zooms. I have a 70-210f4 and that is my biggest peeve with it, compared to my 70-200f4L, where I much, much prefer the twist zoom as nothing changes!

[Grentz]

I would prefer the twist-type zoom if the zooming was all internal, and the length of the lens did not change. That is the one thing that I dislike about push-pull zooms. I have a 70-210f4 and that is my biggest peeve with it, compared to my 70-200f4L, where I much, much prefer the twist zoom as nothing changes!

I think with the larger range of lenses like the 100-400 (4x) it would be much harder to do a completely internal zoom like the 70-200s (2.8x) have.

[Potisdad]

So guys, any possibilities/news/rumors of an update on these lines in the near future??


Nope. I don't expect updates anytime soon. Here is why:


EF 100-400mm L - an updated version with the standard twist zoom and 4stop IS would do wonders for us armatures:)


The lens uses the push-pull system because it has to extend and retract so far. Using a twist zoom mechanism would be unwieldy. Making this lens an internal zoom design would make it much larger and less portable.

The 100-400 IS will get a newer IS system one day, but not before the flagship super teles (300, 400, 500 and 600) get it. When Canon release the 300/2.8L with 4 stop IS , then you can start looking out for an updated 100-400.


EF 400m f/5.6 L- if they could update this one with a 4stop IS systems would make this lens just about unbeatable


The 400 is Canon's bird-in-flight lens and this it does very well - light, easy to handle and sharp wide open. Adding IS would only make this lens heavier, reducing it's handling. IS has little benefit in this application and hence I doubt Canon are in a hurry to update it.

I may be wrong, but Canon make these decisions for marketing reasons, not to appease internet forum gear collectors!

[Larry Weinman]

I went to a Raptor release last Fall. There were a about a hundred photographers there and about 85% were using either a 100-400 or a 400 5.6. These have got to be two of Canon s biggest sellers. Why would they change anything?

[mr.jon]

To sell more of a better lens? God forbid canon improves a great product to the point that it is unbeatable....

[Sean]

I don't see them updating them at all. Maybe in the next 5 years, but both are still best sellers, and Canon doesn't see a need to replace them yet. Plus in their eyes there is no competition to these two lenses.

[MischiefK9s]

EF 400m f/5.6 L- The Canon EF 400mm f/5.6 USM L was launched way back in 1993. It is one of the affordable super-tele primes in the Canon line-up and the last of the species that has not been replaced by an IS successor - it has survived without any changes for more than 15years now. People love it for its small size, light weight and excellent optics...just wish if they could update this one with a 4stop IS systems would make this lens just about unbeatable:)

So guys, any possibilities/news/rumors of an update on these lines in the near future??

Boy I hope not. My new lens just arrived yesterday:D.

[RovinHoot]

Canon's priorities are aimed at professionals right now. I see lots of posts from amateur photographers claiming so-and-so lens would sell like hotcakes if it gets an update because lots of people want to shoot birds and kids' football.

Just remember your definition of hotcakes can be vastly different from Canon's. While the markup for L lenses is high, the actual profits from each lens model alone is not because they don't even come close to the sales volumes of cheap ef-s zooms for example.

Canon is trying to have good quality L lenses which are interesting for professionals, just to entice them into buying or staying with the Canon EOS system as a whole (think about $50k-$100k worth of EOS equipment per photographer here). Amateurs saving money for a year to afford a 100-400L, while very vocal, might not represent a category with high weight in this case.

Let's just say that the lens models mentioned in the topic of this thread are not particularly high on the upcoming design update list.

[sonofjesse]

Also how much RD costs would it need to make a new 100-400? I dont' know the canon PLC, but RD costs of the first 100-400 might have taken several years to pay off. So now canon is raking in more profit, using a cheaper older IS unit ETC. The only benefit I would say is that some of us here would be happy. But there running a bussiness. And keeping a lens like that is proably max out profit. The Econmey is bad, so they want to cut RD not make it more.

Ok lets say they make one. 100-400 F4 with 4 stops just super bad!! But the price is 2400 dollars. How many of us would be jumping up and down? The pro's would eventually get it, then all the 100-400MM would be hitting ebay etc. And we would buy them, but since its discontingued maybe canon would quit servicing them..so where buying affordale 1200 lenses with no warranty and canon don't want to service them.

There is just a lot of things thats has to be considered. Who knows in 20 years we all might be using 15-500mm 1.4 super zooms LOL

[cfibanez]

Rumors of a replacement to the 100-400 have abounded for years. And now rumors on the demise of the 70-200 2.8 IS have been surfacing (https://www.camerasdirect.com.au/index.php/camera-body-pricing/todays-news/end-of-the-line-for-canon-70-200mm-f2.8l-is-usm.html). Soon there won't be any Canon telezoom safe on the shelves...

[dolina]

I wouldn't bet on an update until at least 2012. Canon's current preoccupation are fast L primes.

[cbh76]

EF 100-400mm L - The Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 USM L IS was released way back in 1998. This lens with its long range zoom is perfectly suited for sports & wildlife. It has the old generation push-pull zoom mechanism instead of the current twist zoom. If I am correct, this is the ONLY surviving lens in the Canon linup wi the push -pull zoom mechanism! The Image Stabilization system is also the 1st generation variant which gives you the equivalent of two stops in hand holdability compared to the 4-stop hand holdability provided by the current generation IS on most newer cannons. This has already been around for more than 10yers now, and an updated version with the standard twist zoom and 4stop IS would do wonders for us armatures:)


Lenses of this size work much better with push-pull than twist zooming. Your left hand is supporting the weight of the lens as the center of gravity moves away from you.

Seriously, try it and you will see that it is better. Don't make it an issue of old generation vs. new generation. The design is old for a reason, it works.

If you want to see for yourself compare a 100-300 4.5-5.6 twist type zoom to a 100-300 5.6 with the push-pull. With the twist type, the lens barrel extends as you zoom to 300. Your hand hasn't moved, it is still holding the twist ring.

With the push-pull, your hand pulls the lens outward, holding it steady.

This is the reason the 35-350L and the 28-300L also use the push-pull zoom. The lenses are designed for press photographers who need speed and accuracy.

[KenjiS]

Lenses of this size work much better with push-pull than twist zooming. Your left hand is supporting the weight of the lens as the center of gravity moves away from you.

Seriously, try it and you will see that it is better. Don't make it an issue of old generation vs. new generation. The design is old for a reason, it works.

If you want to see for yourself compare a 100-300 4.5-5.6 twist type zoom to a 100-300 5.6 with the push-pull. With the twist type, the lens barrel extends as you zoom to 300. Your hand hasn't moved, it is still holding the twist ring.

With the push-pull, your hand pulls the lens outward, holding it steady.

This is the reason the 35-350L and the 28-300L also use the push-pull zoom. The lenses are designed for press photographers who need speed and accuracy.

And to chime in more

I had the Sigma 150-500 briefly, twist zoom just does NOT work on these big massive wide-range lenses, you had to be either holding the Sigma 150-500 in an uncomfortable way or make two movements to go from 150-500, and mine required a lot of force to move, it wore me out in 20 minutes...

The 100-400 is a simple lens, with a simple design, its quick when you want it to be and locked steady when you want it to be, its a lens that i feel -in control- of at all times because i never have to move my hand or adjust my grip when i shoot it..I can shoot this thing all day without feeling tired at all or getting a horrid pain in my shoulder

Try it for an hour, you'll love it

[05Xrunner]

The 400 is Canon's bird-in-flight lens and this it does very well - light, easy to handle and sharp wide open. Adding IS would only make this lens heavier, reducing it's handling. IS has little benefit in this application and hence I doubt Canon are in a hurry to update it.

I may be wrong, but Canon make these decisions for marketing reasons, not to appease internet forum gear collectors!
IS would not make it any heavier..maybe an extra oz or two but not anything anyone would notice at all..look at the weight of the 70-200's of their non IS vs IS it adds almost no extra weight..nothing that anyone would really be able to tell. I am sure IS would be very helpful. Shooting as bird sitting on a perch somewhere and lower light so IS would help there.

[KenjiS]

IS would not make it any heavier..maybe an extra oz or two but not anything anyone would notice at all..look at the weight of the 70-200's of their non IS vs IS it adds almost no extra weight..nothing that anyone would really be able to tell. I am sure IS would be very helpful. Shooting as bird sitting on a perch somewhere and lower light so IS would help there.

Not if the bird moves :)

[Geoffery]

An EF 100-400mm L II is most likely to materialize if the next hi-speed 1D-series is a full-frame type.

This is because the popular EF 70-200mm range of lenses (four of them) are great for the 1.3x crop factor but with FF, the 200mm end will have less "reach" with an FF camera.

Even then, Canon won't make an f/2.8 type for a version II of the EF 100-400L as it will be too expensive and heavy. We might be able to see a constant f/4 lens for version II.

[KenjiS]

Even then, Canon won't make an f/2.8 type for a version II of the EF 100-400L as it will be too expensive and heavy. We might be able to see a constant f/4 lens for version II.

That would defeat the purpose and turn off a lot of users of the 100-400

I could see them adding it as a second model, but not outright replacing the handholdable 100-400 with a tripod-only 100-400 f/4

Why tripod only? The Nikon 200-400 f/4G VR is over 7lbs iirc, this lens would be probubly 8 or 9, thats a tripod/monopod lens right there...

it'd also be $3000 at least...probubly closer to $4k...

The 100-400s appeal to me is that its a relatively light, easily handled, easily used 100-400 zoom that can be used all day long without breaking your wallet or your back....

[KayakPhotos]

That would defeat the purpose and turn off a lot of users of the 100-400

I could see them adding it as a second model, but not outright replacing the handholdable 100-400 with a tripod-only 100-400 f/4

Why tripod only? The Nikon 200-400 f/4G VR is over 7lbs iirc, this lens would be probubly 8 or 9, thats a tripod/monopod lens right there...

it'd also be $3000 at least...probubly closer to $4k...

The 100-400s appeal to me is that its a relatively light, easily handled, easily used 100-400 zoom that can be used all day long without breaking your wallet or your back....

Judging by the insane popularity of the 100-400, I think that it would be smart to update the original lens and add a 100 or 200-400 f/4 lens. They could keep the current lens the same and add better optics and the newest IS system (kind of like a longer version of the 70-200 f/4 IS). That would be an intriguing lens for sure. To be honest though, I would probably still buy the current offering. It's already at a reasonable price point for what it does IMO and would be even cheaper if an upgrade came out.

[KenjiS]

Judging by the insane popularity of the 100-400, I think that it would be smart to update the original lens and add a 100 or 200-400 f/4 lens. They could keep the current lens the same and add better optics and the newest IS system (kind of like a longer version of the 70-200 f/4 IS). That would be an intriguing lens for sure. To be honest though, I would probably still buy the current offering. It's already at a reasonable price point for what it does IMO and would be even cheaper if an upgrade came out.

Exactly

I could see improvements to the 100-400 design, a personal one would be some texturing on the tension control [My hands slip on it sometimes] similar to a focusing/zoom ring...but thats not major [i've considered modifying mine]

I could see better coatings being a good idea, that new coating Canon has that they've been putting on all the latest pro glass would be nice, and of course a 4-5 stop IS system with tripod detection would be marvelous [Hey, the 100-400 was one of the first IS lenses, wouldnt it be awesome if Canon gave it the first 5-stop IS system as well? Especially considering a lot of people shoot this lens in their hands and not on a tripod..]

a 200-400 f/4 IS would be awesome as well of course, but not for the same usage, I'd see it being a hit with sports photographers however...

[nuffi]

200-400 f/4.0 would be too expensive, I think. Everyone who'd been crying out for it would then just start bitching about how it was unfairly priced, which would turn into a PR nightmare (if you believe the ppl on this forum who're good at that sort of thing)

[KenjiS]

200-400 f/4.0 would be too expensive, I think. Everyone who'd been crying out for it would then just start bitching about how it was unfairly priced, which would turn into a PR nightmare (if you believe the ppl on this forum who're good at that sort of thing)

Only if it REPLACED the 100-400...

Nikon has a 200-400 f/4G VR and theres more than one Canon shooter who has admitted to wanting one, its a very good lens

But its also not a replacement for a 100-400 in my eyes...

[John_TX]

Only if it REPLACED the 100-400...

Nikon has a 200-400 f/4G VR and theres more than one Canon shooter who has admitted to wanting one, its a very good lens

But its also not a replacement for a 100-400 in my eyes...

Isn't the 200-400 F4 Nikon about 6 pounds & $4,000?
I'd hardly say that's in the same class as the 100-400, and no, I wouldn't want a 200-400 F4 lens if it had either of those features of the Nikon.

[JackLiu]

I use my Canon EF 100-400mm f/4.5-5.6 USM L IS infrequently and each time I have to reacquaint myself to the push-pull feature. Can't complain because the images are needle sharp!:lol:

[KenjiS]

Isn't the 200-400 F4 Nikon about 6 pounds & $4,000?
I'd hardly say that's in the same class as the 100-400, and no, I wouldn't want a 200-400 F4 lens if it had either of those features of the Nikon.

Almost 8lbs and $6,000 actually

Well you might not, but there are some sports photographers whod take one, as well as some birding/wildlife/airshow photographers who sit anchored on a tripod :)

[John_TX]

Almost 8lbs and $6,000 actually

Well you might not, but there are some sports photographers whod take one, as well as some birding/wildlife/airshow photographers who sit anchored on a tripod :)

Anchored is the operative word!!!

[KenjiS]

Anchored is the operative word!!!

Hey its lighter than the 400mm f/2.8...

But still if im anchoring myself like that, id have a 400mm f/2.8 over it anyways..