Another pricing question sorry

[rg-tom]

Hi

I've been approached by the basketball club for whom I shoot the senior team's games, asking if I will do the team photos for the summer camp. It goes like this:

There are 180 kids on the summer camp, split into 18 teams. What they want is a picture for each kid of their entire team, that they can sell to the kid (not sure on price, but I know the camp costs around £200 for 5 days per kid.) They want 10x8, and they want them done by the day after the shoot. Local print place will happily do this for £0.99p per 10x8 once you go over a 100 (luckily im shooting 180, so £180 :)) I will be shooting with my 20D and 18-55 (not the best lens but stopped down to F8 ish its not bad, definitely good enough for this), and will probably use this as an opportunity to buy a much needed flash gun or 2. I will shoot 2 shots of each team with an old Canon EOS-1000F as a backup in case anything goes wrong with the digital.

Basically I've been told by the person who used to do the photos but has now retired that it takes about an hour ish to get all the pictures taken. I'd take a few of each team (say 10 or so) and then just select the best of each team when i got home, touch them up in photoshop, shove them on a CD and head to the print place, pick them up in the morning and go back to hand them out.

Any ideas on what kind of price I should be lookin at for this? Would be nice to be able to cover the cost of a couple of flashguns (lookin at the sigma Super 550's, meant to be a lot of flash for the money at half the price of a 580ex)

I've also thought of perhaps buying some cheap cardboard frames to put the pictures in which adds not much to my cost, but they could perhaps be sold for a decent bit more as they are far more presentable?

Any thoughts on this would be appreciated,

Thanks

Tom

[IndyJeff]

Why not ask the person who used to do these photos? That would be a good place to start.

[robertwgross]

I assume that all of the subjects are minors. Then you will need to get parents to sign a minor model release. Since you do not want to have to chase down all the parents for this, you get the camp/team management to do it for you. Parents will probably have to sign some permission/registration for the minors. Get the camp/team management to slip in the proper model release terminology into the permission/registration that parents sign.

That just makes it easier for everybody.

---Bob Gross---

[charlesu]

180 kids in 1 hour? That's 3 kids per minute or one every 20 seconds. That's moving pretty fast even if your workflow is perfect. Good luck!

[rg-tom]

charlesu it will be of their teams, so 10 kids per photo ;) 18 teams in an hour shouldnt be too bad, 3 minutes ish per team and they'll al be lined up ready to just move in front of the camera :)

Also about the minors thing, from everything i've read so far the UK is not as strict at all about model releases, I know when I used to go on these camps my parents never signed anything :) Will look into it more though, good few months before the event.

Jeff I will ask him next time I see him, just wondering what kind of price you guys would be thinkin :)

[Jon]

charlesu it will be of their teams, so 10 kids per photo ;) 18 teams in an hour shouldnt be too bad, 3 minutes ish per team and they'll al be lined up ready to just move in front of the camera :)

You wish! It'll take more than that to make sure noone's got their head hidden by someone in front.

[rg-tom]

True jon true :) I will have a lot of assistants though in the form of coaches tellin them to move their arses :D

[Moments]

Good luck!! Remember that the photographer who retired and say's it's an approx an hour, sounds like he has done it many times before. Expect that if this is your first time, it mostlikley will take a little longer. If you wish to retain the job again for next year, take your time and do it right. I would say that each team if they listen, will take 5 - 10 mins if they all listen and move quickly. I've done baseball leagues before, and an hour is tight for 18 groups of 10 kids. Don't just fire off a bunch of shots and figure you will fix things in Photoshop. The worst thing that digital photography has brought to the buisness is that too many people just say "I'll fix it later in Photoshop". I say, do it right, as if it was on film or it would cost you big bucks to fix. It will only help your photography in the end. Get ready for a fun action packed shoot.

[mooseel]

I do similar work at Karate Tournaments and at Karate Schools. I don't charge for the event, but I sell to the parents. I have considered this option for other events or jobs, I have set my event prices to consider the number of people at the event, on average. >100 people is a flat $200, 100-200= $300, 300- 400= $400, etc. You can see where this is going. This is a flat fee and would be in addition to the cost of prints, which you should whole sale to the league for at least a 30% markup. Thus covering your time to get the prints, and costs, such as Taxes! I'm sure the league is going to sell them for a mark-up, too! This of course it's just my Idea and you have to sell it with your service.
I would say that you may want a better flash, than the on camera one on your 20D, not to mention a flash bracket, so that you can change from portrait to landscape, without having your flash shooting from the side on the portrait shots. As you are looking to shoot around f8, you will need a tripod and a cable release to handle the long exposures. Another flash issue to consider, is that when shooting team shots you will have to watch out for shadows on your subjects, created by your flash. You may be able to solve this by shooting outside, then again, this may not be an option. I solve this by using strobes, flash and reviewing each shot on a 15 inch LCD TV. You will have to be creative, to get everyones attention when you ckick the shutter. Even then, it may take a few trys to get the best shot.
When you go to shoot the individuals and teams, take into account that you will have to shoot a little wide to leave room for the 8x10 crops that you should do in photoshop prior to printing. For Team prints I highly recommend that you sell 8x12 prints to the league. This will allow you to shoot much closer on the team shots without loosing people when the image is printed.
Sorry for the book, now the wife is rushing me.
MOST OF ALL SELL THE JOB, DO THE JOB RIGHT NO MATTER HOW LONG IT TAKES, it will save you from making mistakes!