Help! Little League in low light

[Redfire_Cobra]

Last nights game was my 3rd attempt at this. The first 2 were at practice in better lighting and I was overall happy with the way those turned out. Last night however our game did not start until 7:15pm so the only source of light was the field lighting and I had very few keepers.... Motion was blurred pretty bad and I'm finding that the auto focus tends to drift to brighter objects. I am shooting with an XTi and EF-S 55-250 f 4-5.6. I was shooting in AV mode with the aperture set to let as much light in as possible and adjusting ISO to try and get the desired shutter speed, obviosly this did not work!

At this distance would a flash be of any use or is my only option to step up to better glass?

Sorry for the long post and any and all help is greatly appreciated!

The Exif info on the following example is:
ISO 1600
220mm
f/5.6
1/50 sec
I had AF set to Al Servo and Center Weighted metering.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3648/3403231408_4a564c5554_o.jpg

Thanks in advance,

Chris

[S.Horton]

You're ready for better glass -- You'll need f/2.8 or faster, and, sorry to say, higher ISO for those conditions, which means a new body as well.

Welcome to sports photography.

;}

[eigga]

Chris,
You seem to have a pretty good grasp on whats going on here... more glass or more light are the only options. I know flash is allowed in a lot of sports when done correctly but not sure about baseball...somebody will chime in on that.

Better glass is more than likley the best option. You are going to need at least f/2.8 for that kinda shot....and it will give you better DOF in the daytime.

Also, the focus is an issue in that post. Low Light focus ability will be somewhat limited for the Xti.

at f/2.8 you would only be getting 1/200 shutter so thats still an issue....bump up to ISO 3200 and your golden at 1/400 for young kids (if the XTi has 3200 that is)

[JeffreyG]

You missed that shot (the fence is nice and sharp though). Unfortunately, even if you had hit focus I think the kid would scarcely be sharper considering the 1/50 shutter speed.

If f/5.6 yields 1/50, then f/2.8 gets you 1/200 which is actually still not enough.

There are a few options.
1. Does the kid play some day games? Try putting the camera away for the night games and just watch the game. Shoot in the daytime.
2. Or get a faster lens. You could shoot f/2.8 and underexpose by 1 stop for 1/400. You will need to use noise reducing software on the result, and I suggest you shoot in RAW. 200/2.8 runs about $600 and the 70-200/2.8 is close to $1000.

Note that hands and bat will still be blurred at 1/400. I prefer 1/2000 to shoot batters, but the fielders (especially at this age) will be fine at 1/400.

[snyderman]

The folks behind the fence say that your exposure is good. The 1/50 isn't going to stop anything. See the other boy walking behind the fence? Same thing. He's blurred as well but not moving nearly as fast as the batter.

The advice on staying away from night games is good. It'll also save you a lot of money!

dave

[Redfire_Cobra]

Thanks for the quick an helpful comments/advice. Unfortunately I am limited to a maximum ISO of 1600 with the XTi and even at that they get pretty grainy. Another unfortunate thing is we only have two games this year starting earlier and they are at 6:00pm so the light should be better but still not great, I guess it's time to start saving for better equipment. In the meantime I guess I will settle for the few decent shots I manage to get during the first part of the game where the shutter speed stayed between 600 and 800.

Here are a few of the "better" ones from last night.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3448/3403434018_8f0918c212.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3615/3403435218_8a2e7b95c8.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3568/3402627611_89178e2b5c.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3664/3403438136_62ae7fc072.jpg

[S.Horton]

When you're stuck in light that is too low for AF, go manual focus.

You'll get blur, but about 1 in 25 shots might look pretty cool!

[BenJohnson]

I'm 99% sure you are not setting your AF point. Even in your "good" set of shots half of
them are obviously focused on the backstop. You need to set the AF to the center point
only or the camera will just pick up on whatever has the most contrast.

I have shot low light sports with the XTi and 55-250 IS combo. Far from ideal but you
can get decent shots. It sounds like you have the settings well understood (besides the
center AF point). I would think that even with the light available for the first shot you
can get some decent images. You won't stop motion, but you should have no problem
getting the subject in focus.

Is the first picture posted an aggressive crop? I don't get anywhere near that much noise
on an uncropped (resized) image. I am even fairly happy with shooting 1 stop
underexposed and then bringing it back up in post. That will double you shutter speed,
but still not enough to stop motion.

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?p=764145

[Redfire_Cobra]

I'm 99% sure you are not setting your AF point. Even in your "good" set of shots half of
them are obviously focused on the backstop. You need to set the AF to the center point
only or the camera will just pick up on whatever has the most contrast.

I have shot low light sports with the XTi and 55-250 IS combo. Far from ideal but you
can get decent shots. It sounds like you have the settings well understood (besides the
center AF point). I would think that even with the light available for the first shot you
can get some decent images. You won't stop motion, but you should have no problem
getting the subject in focus.

Is the first picture posted an aggressive crop? I don't get anywhere near that much noise
on an uncropped (resized) image. I am even fairly happy with shooting 1 stop
underexposed and then bringing it back up in post. That will double you shutter speed,
but still not enough to stop motion.

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?p=764145

Thanks for the reply, I forgot to mention that I am setting AF for center focus point and keeping that on the subject. I was thinking the fence looked so in focus due to a large depth of field and light reflecting off of it combined with it being a stationary object rather than in motion like the players. I have only had this lens for a little over a month and only shot vehicle / landscape type shots with it primarily in well lit situations and have not had any focus issues.

All of the shots were cropped fairly heavily.

[Redfire_Cobra]

When you're stuck in light that is too low for AF, go manual focus.

You'll get blur, but about 1 in 25 shots might look pretty cool!

Thanks I will give that a try!

[BenJohnson]

Thanks for the reply, I forgot to mention that I am setting AF for center focus point and keeping that on the subject. I was thinking the fence looked so in focus due to a large depth of field and light reflecting off of it combined with it being a stationary object rather than in motion like the players. I have only had this lens for a little over a month and only shot vehicle / landscape type shots with it primarily in well lit situations and have not had any focus issues.

All of the shots were cropped fairly heavily.
Looking at them again, it appears they are all strongly back focused. I would guess the camera is trying to focus on the backstop. Since the player is not actually moving towards or away from you during an at bat, maybe try One Shot AF and see if you can lock onto the player more successfully.

[Redfire_Cobra]

Another thought I just had. When shooting these I has IS on, is it possible that was in some way shifting focus to the fence?

[bobbyz]

Chris, I would try single shot mode for the batters. The small kids not going to move that much so you don't need AI servo which is useless in low light with slow glass on rebel series. If you have some glass with f2.8 or faster aperture, I would try that. If focal length is short, see if you can shoot from closer position on the field or from behind the fence.

[BenJohnson]

Another thought I just had. When shooting these I has IS on, is it possible that was in some way shifting focus to the fence?
IS should not have anything to do with where the focus is locking. If you keep the batter centered there should not be a problem.

Chris, I would try single shot mode for the batters. The small kids not going to move that much so you don't need AI servo which is useless in low light with slow glass on rebel series.
Agreed. Stick to one shot for this situation. You should be able to tell if it's locking on the batter or the backstop.

Do you have any uncropped images? If you are an extremely long ways away, and the batter is smaller than the AF area the camera is using (which is not that same size as the dot that lights up), then it could just be locking onto the more contrasting section of the image (back stop).

[Redfire_Cobra]

Thanks again for all the help guys! I will definitely try one shot focusing on the next ones. Here are the uncropped ones.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3641/3404993711_da1ca6a2fc_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3660/3404993195_615111204d_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3604/3405805914_c99e8a9017_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3568/3405806422_b600fa5104_o.jpg

[BenJohnson]

Yeah, I would guess that the AI Servo mode is probably going back and forth from player to backstop, and tends to favor the high contrast of the backstop. I'd go to 1 shot AF for batters, and make sure it locks onto the player before you shoot.

[Redfire_Cobra]

Yeah, I would guess that the AI Servo mode is probably going back and forth from player to backstop, and tends to favor the high contrast of the backstop. I'd go to 1 shot AF for batters, and make sure it locks onto the player before you shoot.


Thanks again, I will try that and hopefully have some better results to post next week.