Infra Red - Monos

[simplymono]

Taken with a IR converted Canon Rebel \ 300D

http://www.davidjameswilliams.com/wp-content/gallery/infrared/autumn-infrared-2.jpg

http://www.davidjameswilliams.com/wp-content/gallery/rememberance-sunday/081109-cheltenham-remembrance-sunday-227-edit.jpg

[AlphaChicken]

Second one is real cool. I like it a lot. Does not look like a infra-red though (who cares?).

First one is blown to hell in the highlights. Otherwise would be a cool composition, but that detail-lacking, over-bright foreground is very distracting.

[cgatto]

Second one is real cool. I like it a lot. Does not look like a infra-red though (who cares?).

First one is blown to hell in the highlights. Otherwise would be a cool composition, but that detail-lacking, over-bright foreground is very distracting.

+1

The second picture is killer though, well done

[Picture North Carolina]

The second is an excellent job of composition, but without flora does not showcase the abstractness that is the essence of infrared. If you did not tell anybody it was IR, they probably would think it was a standard BW.

I prefer the first because it does highlight the IR effect. As to "blown to hell in the highlights", I see detail in the foreground. That's the way IR looks. Yes, it looks like it's pressing against the histogram right edge, and maybe even clipping a hair, but I do not see "blown to hell." (Perhaps a new monitor will help. ;) )

Have you considered cloning out that fence and post to the left? Good pics.

[Zoso23]

the blown out highlights in the first one dont bother me as much as that wire fence or whatever it is on the left.

i still really like the shot tho, i think the highlights make for some really nice contrast.

[AlphaChicken]

No thanks...as you know nothing about my monitor...lets just say its calibrated and perfectly fine. Don't make assumptions about my gear please.

Regardless of how IR is "supposed to look"...the first shot technically is not good at all cause of the distracting foreground. I could care less if it shows off what IR does...that does not make the shot good.

The second is great due to composition and the very nice use of the silhouette effect. Big deal he labeled the thread IR, and the pic does not showcase IR's effects...similar to before, just cause it doe not showcase IR, does not make it a bad shot.

[Picture North Carolina]

No thanks...as you know nothing about my monitor...lets just say its calibrated and perfectly fine. Don't make assumptions about my gear please.

Regardless of how IR is "supposed to look"...the first shot technically is not good at all cause of the distracting foreground. I could care less if it shows off what IR does...that does not make the shot good.

The second is great due to composition and the very nice use of the silhouette effect. Big deal he labeled the thread IR, and the pic does not showcase IR's effects...similar to before, just cause it doe not showcase IR, does not make it a bad shot.

And because you don't like something doesn't mean it's a bad shot either, does it?

[Picture North Carolina]

First one is blown to hell in the highlights.

Question: here is a histogram of the first shot. In your judgment would you classify this as a histogram of an image that has highlights "blown to hell?"

[AlphaChicken]

Well I see a huge chunk in the very brights and then a line going all the way up to the top of the graph on the far left side. That indicates blown highlights to me...yes. And there is no arguing that the huge, almost completely white, in your face foreground creates a not so aesthetic image.

[Picture North Carolina]

Well I see a huge chunk in the very brights and then a line going all the way up to the top of the graph on the far left side. That indicates blown highlights to me...yes. And there is no arguing that the huge, almost completely white, in your face foreground creates a not so aesthetic image.

The huge chunk to the right is before the edge which indicates the highlights are not clipped. The left is shadows, not highlights.

I have always thought this (http://www.luminous-landscape.com/tutorials/understanding-series/understanding-histograms.shtml)was a good tutorial on how to read histograms.

[bjordan]

It's not blown. I would bring out the detail myself, but if it was clipped there would be nothing to bring out. There is VERY little clipping:

[bjordan]

Well I see a huge chunk in the very brights and then a line going all the way up to the top of the graph on the far (right)side. That indicates blown highlights to me...yes.

You do realize that line to the far right is the border, right?

[Picture North Carolina]

It's not blown. I would bring out the detail myself, but if it was clipped there would be nothing to bring out. There is VERY little clipping:

How are you doing that!! Not the graphic, but I saw the first post you put up completely disappear. I know that posts can be edited, but did not know they could be totally removed.

[bjordan]

How are you doing that!! Not the graphic, but I saw the first post you put up completely disappear. I know that posts can be edited, but did not know they could be totally removed.

Yeah, I wasn't sure I wanted to get involved so I deleted it, reconsidered, and re-posted what's up now lol. I think you can delete within a certain timeframe if there are no responses.

[Picture North Carolina]

Yeah, I wasn't sure I wanted to get involved so I deleted it, reconsidered, and re-posted what's up now lol. I think you can delete within a certain timeframe if there are no responses.

Yes, understand and agree - usually best to let other people step into stink piles by themselves. ;)

I guess that delete window is the same time window that allows you to edit a post without the "edited..." label being put on it. I just didn't know that the entire post could be scratched. Too bad. Would have saved me a lot of "sticking my foot in my mouth" grief over the last few years. ;)

But I don't want to hijack away from the OP. I know he loves that converted camera like I love mine.

[bjordan]

Yeah, I thought I'd try to "just state the facts, ma'am!"

[AlphaChicken]

The line on the far right is not the border. You can see the border on the left side and it is not the same. You can see on the left there is a partial line on the far end as well.

Sorry I called them blown highlights...my mistake *rolls eyes*...how about... "over-bright and distracting foreground"? The point is, whether I was right about blown highlights or not, the fact that there is a very large, over-bright area in the immediate foreground of the shot makes it extremely distracting.

My post got deleted CannedHeat...so I just want to re-iterate real nicely this time. I really, really don't like it when people assume things and patronize me. This is what it seemed like to me when you assumed my monitor was bad and then posted a tut on histogram reading when you assumed I could not read those. Please don't do that. It pisses me off.

[bjordan]

The line on the far right is not the border. You can see the border on the left side and it is not the same. You can see on the left there is a partial line on the far end as well.

Are you assuming that *I* can't read a histogram? ;) The line on the right is the big white border which the OP added to his image.

The masters I've seen in any field are extremely patient when amateurs carry on about something, even if it's pedantic. Masters don't get pissed off, because their pride isn't involved. They have nothing to prove. We're not masters, but I think we should be as humble.

[L.Morey]

No two is great

[AlphaChicken]

No as you will see I am right....black line = clipping...gray line = border...

This has nothing to do with your picture anymore, but I am 100% correct about the black line...your picture does have clipping in it to some extent which is why in your black clipping-display picture you see some white on the black. That is why there is a line there on the side of the histo.

Picture proves my point:

[AlphaChicken]

As you will see here, I took a picture of my own, intentionally clipped the highlights and then showed the image in clipping-display mode with the histo, then I way under-clipped the highlights just to move the histo way to the left and showed it in clipping-display mode with the histo.

So I will say it again real da*mned slow...

Black
Line
=
Clipping

[Picture North Carolina]

My post got deleted CannedHeat... It pisses me off.

This may come as a shock to you, but I couldn't care less. I did not intentionally try to piss you off. I posted a tutorial with the intent of helping a user who made a statement that was incorrect. It was well-intentioned.

However, all became a moot point and irrelevant after your profanity-laden temper tantrum (the post that got deleted) in which, at least IMHO, you displayed obvious immaturity in this forum.

Sometimes people say and do things, even well-intentioned things, that irritate us. It's called life. Learn to deal with it maturely, suck it up and move on.

If somebody disagrees with you about histograms, cameras, or the types of shoes a model should wear, it's not personal. They are simply expressing their opinion. No offense is intended.

I am not a moderator here, so I can only express my personal opinion. But my opinion is that your hostile attitude (which I see you have now transferred to another member) is not befitting the potn community. People have disagreements here, sometime big disagreements, but they try to work them out maturely and without personal hostility.

POTN is about people helping people. Drop the hostile attitude and make friends, not enemies. It will be much more beneficial to you in the long run.

[bjordan]

I am 100% correct about the black line...your picture does have clipping in it to some extent.

Yes, there is clipping to a small extent, which is what I stated... but that's not enough to make that line go all the way to the top.

Your histos are very nice and clear. How about doing one for the image in question? I think that would settle it. I guarantee that the rightmost bar won't go all the way to the top if you crop the white border/matte out of the picture first. When you admit you were wrong, make sure to say it "real da*mned slow" so I can understand, OK?

Back on topic... I agree with AlphaChicken. IR or not, I also think the foreground is overly bright and distracting. If the OP will allow an edit, I'll show how I'd try to improve it.

[AlphaChicken]

The white border did cause the majority of the height of the line on the right. Correct on that. I'm glad you see what I was really getting at bjordan...that the foreground was overly bright. They are almost so bright (this is the huge left-located chunk in the orig histo) that they appear to have no detail and also distract from other detail in the image. IMHO, that is as good as being blown.

So I mis-speak one bit and I have people (or what seemed like it) jumping on MY OPINION, trashing it, and intentionally or not treating me like an idiot. Immature, maybe; idiot, definitely not. Only in very small cases do I ever get pissed...check all my other 2k or so posts. I guarantee I do most of everything I can to be helpful and never go off like I did here.

And CannedHeat...stop talking down to me like I am your kid. I am a young adult (19) and I am definitely not YOUR Y.A. I don't need life lessons. Already got enough useful ones from my parents...which you aren't.

This thread may have blown it, but for the most part I have made a lot of friends and have been here a long time helping people. Not as long as most, but long enough that I know how things work. This was a mistake. It was not a misunderstanding of the way things work. So stop giving me lessons like I'm an un-educated person. *Spitting sarcasm* Not everyone is as privileged to have supreme enlightenment like you.

And you better start caring about peoples opinions and how you affect others. If you don't, regardless of whether you are "intentionally" causing arguments or confrontations or even physical fights in your life, you are still intentionally causing them. You wonder how you still might be doing it intentionally? Through the choice of ignorance.

[Picture North Carolina]

The white border did cause the majority of the height of the line on the right. Correct on that. I'm glad you see what I was really getting at bjordan...that the foreground was overly bright. They are almost so bright (this is the huge left-located chunk in the orig histo) that they appear to have no detail and also distract from other detail in the image. IMHO, that is as good as being blown.

So I mis-speak one bit and I have people (or what seemed like it) jumping on MY OPINION, trashing it, and intentionally or not treating me like an idiot. Immature, maybe; idiot, definitely not. Only in very small cases do I ever get pissed...check all my other 2k or so posts. I guarantee I do most of everything I can to be helpful and never go off like I did here.

And CannedHeat...stop talking down to me like I am your kid. I am a young adult (19) and I am definitely not YOUR Y.A. I don't need life lessons. Already got enough useful ones from my parents...which you aren't.

This thread may have blown it, but for the most part I have made a lot of friends and have been here a long time helping people. Not as long as most, but long enough that I know how things work. This was a mistake. It was not a misunderstanding of the way things work. So stop giving me lessons like I'm an un-educated person. *Spitting sarcasm* Not everyone is as privileged to have supreme enlightenment like you.

And you better start caring about peoples opinions and how you affect others. If you don't, regardless of whether you are "intentionally" causing arguments or confrontations or even physical fights in your life, you are still intentionally causing them. You wonder how you still might be doing it intentionally? Through the choice of ignorance.

Good enough. We all make mistakes. But to put things in perspective, the relevant part of what you object to and say "pissed you off" and in which I "called you stupid" was removed from the thread.

And what I said was this: in response to you saying that the black line all he way to the left of the histogram showed there were blown highlights, I replied with simply "The left side of the histogram is shadows." Didn't say you were right or wrong, didn't call you stupid. I simply provided a link to a tutorial on reading histograms. That's all.

Now be fair and stand away and look at it from outside your shoes. If a member of potn said in a post that the left of the histogram indicated blown highlights, would you not agree that the average person would assume that person did not fully understand histograms? And even offer help? This is not looking down on a person, calling them stupid or causing battles. This is simply extending a hand of help. Sorry you were offended.

With apologies to the OP for the rather poor performance of all of us who participated in the negative aspects of this thread, in hopes of directing attention back to some nice photographs I will bow out.

Have a good one.

[Smad728]

Number 2 is nice. Just a little grey though.

[Karl Johnston]

Love the 2nd shot the best