Candid Weddings

[Big_B]

All,



Two very dear friends of mine are getting married in July. He is a newly qualified teacher and she is training to be a vicar so, needless to say, they don’t have much money. They have hired a professional photographer to provide the formal wedding shots but can’t afford to have a second shooter doing candids etc. You can see where I’m going with this.



I have agreed to provide the candids for them, but would like some advice on the finer points.


I’m going to clarify with them exactly what the wedding photographer has agreed to provide. However I want some help with the terminology. When a photographer agrees to do the ‘formal’ shots does this usually mean that they will only be doing the formal posed shots i.e. outside the church etc. or does it in practice tend to include classic candids such as the bride getting ready?


As I say, I’m going to be confirming this with the photographer anyway, but it is helpful for me to know what the usual practice is.




Lenses:


Bearing in mind that I have a good external flash, what lens would you recommend?



I currently own a 24-80mm f4 and a 24mm f1.8. I have considered purchasing/hiring an 80mm f1.8. Is this a good idea or can you think of a better one?




Other tips:


I’m going to purchase a book on wedding photography to help me with some of the technical aspects, but would welcome any other tips you can give me.



Thanks in advance!

[tim]

I'm about to shoot my first wedding in 6 weeks, so take my advice for what it's worth.

I just ordered 3 wedding photography books, I can't recommend any, but I read amazon reviews and there are what I decided on. The first one may be of particular interest to you.
- The Best of Wedding Photojournalism: Techniques and Images from the Pros (Bambi Cantrell)
- The Art of Wedding Photography: Professional Techniques with Style (Bill Hurter)
- Digital Wedding Photography (Paul Gero)

Those books will recommend gear. I'm in a similar situation to you, and i'm going to stick with my Tamron 28-75 as my main lens, and maybe my only lens. If I were rich i'd get the 70-200 F2.8 IS, but what i've read is it's handy for a few shots, not essential, but it depends on your style. The 80mm F1.8 (though I thought it was 85mm) would be a good candid lens, with a nice narrow DOF to isolate your candid subjects.

AFAIK, the pro will take whatever photos you want them to, formal, candid, so long as you can afford it. I would guess their value is for groups and set shots, though i'm sure if you find someone good they'd do everything well.

Good luck! :)

[robertwgross]

Have a three-way meeting with the pro photographer and the B&G and you.

Have the B&G tell the pro this:

"Mister Pro, we want you to do your best work on the most important shots. As a result, we want Big_B here to work on the less-important candid shots. So, you won't mind if he works behind your back, will you?" The B&G have a business relationship with the pro, and you do not.

The pro will probably state what he allows and what he does not allow. For example, some use an optical slave triggering system that will go crazy if anybody else in the room is shooting flash shots. So, some pros have a rule like "Uncle Fred can shoot whatever he wants, as long as he stays behind the main camera and he doesn't use any flash."

Some will have a rule like "Uncle Fred can shoot whatever he wants, outside the room of the ceremony. Nothing inside."

We used to have a rule that Uncle Fred can shoot whatever he wants, but he has to wait until after the main camera has flashed its flash.

---Bob Gross---

[idofotos]

As a full time Wedding photographer I can relate an experience from a wedding 2 weeks ago, when I did the engagement photos the B&G were extremly picky and I ended up reshooting the eng, they thought i rushed them even though we did an indoor & outdoor setting and spent 30-50 minutes viewing them, anyway on the reshoot I was a little nervous but all went well. On the wedding day the bride had an extra shooter at wedding , she had asked me when we were singning contracts and I had said no I dont mind, She works at our local newspaper and he was a newspaper photog, I had met him at an earlier event this year so I knew who he was, anyway I spent the whole day second guessing my shots and what he was doing he wasnt very social as I tried a few times to chat when we were in the same area, he didnt interfear but was a little distracting during the ceremony with his motordrive, why you need 7-10 shots of the B&G at the alter is beyond me, but anyhow my pics turned out fine I havent met with them yet to see if they are satisfied or not, but I figure that they hired me to do the formal and him to shoot the candid which Im sure he is better at them. my candids seem to always have mouths open or eyes closed, any way try to speak to the photog and assure him you are not trying to upstage him but just want to help the B&G
and if he isnt a jerk he should enjoy the company
hope this helps
I just purchased my first canon digital camera should get it tomorrow
bought a used 1ds with a 17-35 2.8 and will be adding more glass soon

[vcutag]

I'm doing something very similar to the OP for my sister-in-law's wedding this summer. My partner (who's sister is the bride) and I are putting together an album of candid & family shots for her as a wedding present. It's pretty informal anyway, the wedding party will be in Hawaiian shirts and leis, but I want to make damn sure I don't get in the pro's way. I plan on talking to the pro (who's a photographer for a magazine up there as a day job) beforehand to find out what's cool with her and what she'd like me to avoid. As an aside, my sister-in-law and future brother-in-law are getting the negs as part of the package, which struck me as weird, but fortunate for my sister-in-law.

Another situation is two friends of mine who are getting married in May. They're both broke college students who couldn't come close to affording even a cheap pro, so I offered to do their photos as a wedding present. This one, however, includes the formals. They're going to pay the cost of prints, I'm basically just giving them my time for free, since they're some of our best friends and I kinda owe them a favor. I plan on shooting the formals on film and the candids digitally.

[Maureen Souza]

I have shot several weddings this year and have 2 more in the near future. I recommend a wide angle lens ....(I find my Tamron 28-75/2.8 does fine) and a good portrait lens... I use the 50mm/1.4. I try not to have too many choices because I don't want to spend all my time changing lenses. Take lot's of pictures and you will have plenty of good choices to offer. Tim, I think you will do fine with your Tamron, it really does a nice job!!!

[Moments]

My wife is from the West Midlands in England. What she has told me about Wedding photography is that it is much more along the lines of just the formals with no candids. They usually leave after an hour or so after the church service from what I've been told. You being in London might be more like here in the states. I do the formals and journalistic shots and stay the entire day. I do not let someone else do photography at my weddings. Let me clarify that, if a family member or guest whishes to take a shot here and there while I'm working, I'm OK with that.
About 6 years ago I had a Bride that worked at a NYC magazine also. Her friend from the magazine, a Fashion photographer started to shoot alongside me. I was told about him upon his arival which was 15 min after mine. I have my own ideas and style and he has his own. The Bride thought it would be great to have both of us to shoot, but she tired of it quickly. As I would shoot a formal group, he would shoot candids and then redirect the group once I was done. He was so annyoing, I asked him if he would like to shoot the rest of the job and I would leave. He thought I was joking and I did almost quit and walk out. Since then I only allow a few shots from family of friends if they do not get in the way while i"m shooting.
I would check with the photographer first and see if you can also shoot at the wedding. If you can I would try to ask whats his or her style and how they work.
I use a Canon 16-35 2.8L for reception candids and specialty shots
Tamron 24 - 75 2.8 and a Canon 70-200 2.8L is the rest of the time for other candids

Your lens and choices seen ok to me, F1.8 lens for natural light and DOF. I used ok go and spend time at bookstores to get some ideas for shots. Now it's even easyer to check out websites for ideas.

[tim]

Good tips there moments, i'll make sure to put "no other shooters without prior discussion please" in the contract for my first wedding.

Tim, I think you will do fine with your Tamron, it really does a nice job!!!

Thanks Maureen :) What do you use the 1.4 for? Candids in natural light?

I'd love a 70-200 IS but i've bought too much stuff this month already...

[Maureen Souza]

Thanks Maureen :) What do you use the 1.4 for? Candids in natural light?

I'd love a 70-200 IS but i've bought too much stuff this month already...

Tim: Use the 50mm for portraits of the B&G alone or separately. It does such a nice job as a prime lens getting the bride & groom clear and razor sharp. It also takes care of low light situations very nicely for indoor shots and outdoor shade.

I too am looking at the 70-200/2.8 as well as the 16-35/2.8. Those two lenses should cover about all I will need in the lens dept along with what I already own.

Good luck at your wedding shoot..look forward to seeing the outcome!

[tim]

Thanks Maureen. I'll not fail due to lack of preparation, that's for sure. I have those 3 books above on the way from amazon, plus i'm reading a lot and looking at a lot of pictures.

I'm a little careful with the 1.8 because the DOF is just so narrow. It's actually with Canon right now, being calibrated, as some theatre shots I did turn out out of focus and I tracked it down to a bad lens. In a crowded environment the 1.8 would be great, but I suspect i'll use my Tamron more.

I bet i'll get drunk one night and order a 70-200 IS ;) It probably won't be any time soon, it seems like a "nice to have" rather than a "necessary" lens for weddings. I still have to order a flash bracket or two, another 2GB of memory, and maybe a spare 50mm F1.8.

[Maureen Souza]

I bet i'll get drunk one night and order a 70-200 IS ;)

Hey, get good and drunk and order two, would ya!?!:lol: :lol: :lol: I want mine to be the 2.8IS USM, please:D

[tim]

Hey, get good and drunk and order two, would ya!?!:lol: :lol: :lol: I want mine to be the 2.8IS USM, please:D

I'm drunk right now :p :D

It's on my list... I have terrible willpower and a good job, so it can't be too far away ;)

[Maureen Souza]

It's on my list... I have terrible willpower and a good job, so it can't be too far away ;)

I'm at work right now, but same here. A good job and bad willpower, what a combination!!!!

[tim]

I'm at work right now, but same here. A good job and bad willpower, what a combination!!!!

Isn't it nice to be able to afford to buy nice equipment without having to worry about it paying for itself :)

[Big_B]

Thanks for the advice everyone. Some really good stuff.

Bob - have asked the B&G to contact the photographer along the lines you suggested

everyone else. Reading your comments i'm starting to wonder whether I might be better off buying the 50mm 1.8 rather then the 85mm. Any thoughts?

[Big_B]

oh and tim, thanks for the book advice. I'll look them up.

[tim]

If the price was the same i'd definitely have the 85mm 1.8, but it costs about 4 times more, and the 50mm's pretty good.

You're welcome to my recommendations, they're just what read on amazon. If you PM me in a week i'll probably have received them and at least skimmed them all, if you want to know which I think is best.

[Big_B]

Yeah, if the price was about the same I think I'd go for the 85. However the difference is making me think....