Avoiding the fanboys elsewhere I need some practical lens advice :-)

[neil_r]

I need (ok want) a longer lens. Currently I have a 100 - 400 and a 300 f/2.8. I am looking at either the Canon 500 or 600, this will primarily be for motorsport. I guess the easy answer is go for the reach but there are some real pros and cons to consider. I have used a friends 600 and it is a fabulous lens but it is really huge. But to really cut to the chase, is the additional 100mm worth the additional £2k ?

Would really appreciate some practical advice from real time users on this. Many thanks

[CyberDyneSystems]

As a fanboy myself,
I will say a few things that may be of use to you.
I can and do hand hold the 500mm, and love to use it on a monopod.
I can't hand hold the 600mm, and would be less comfortable using it on a monopod.
To me it' the weight that is the key, the 500mm comes with me all the time due to it's weight and comfort.
I had the "Sigmonster" for some time and it weighs in roughly = to the Canon 600mm. It was too cumbersome to me and thus stayed home too often and in the end was sold off in favor of the more portable and always with me 500mm.
The 500mm traveled well with me three weeks across Namibia and Botswana.
I would not have attempted that with the 600mm.

Most of my experience has to do with birders and nature photogs, but I know many other than myself that have owned the 600mm and ended up selling it and keeping the 500mm. (most of the few that own the 600mm can afford both)

IQ wise they are so close you'd never notice, though the 500mm measures better.

[neil_r]

Thanks CDS I read your Sigma / Canon comparison. it was very useful. If I went the Sigma route I know myself well enough to know that I would always regret not having the IS.

PS I was referring to the "Flaming Fanboys" of another place :-)

[Mike Hoyer]

I would go for the 500 myself. Having used both, it's much more manageable.

[Cadwell]

Mmm... OK. Thing is that I hate IS for motorsport, in fact I have it switched off on all the lenses I have which are equipped with it, the 600mm included. Actually I find it gets in the way by interpreting the deliberate movements I make to try and accurately track a race car as "camera shake" and trying to cancel them out. About the only time IS is even remotely useful is doing full pans and you don't really do that with a 500 or 600mm unless you're standing in the next county. Even the track at Silverstone isn't THAT far away.

That aside, I use both a 500mm and a 600mm prime. The 500mm is the Sigma unit which is significantly smaller and lighter than the Canon equivalent. The 600mm is the Canon. I did initially think that I'd sell the 500mm on when I bought the 600mm but I found I still needed it at many circuits. The 600mm is too tight at some venues and the 500mm is much easier to live with and handle particularly in cross-winds. The optical quality and focus speed / accuracy is pretty much the same across the two lenses so I find myself happily switching between them.

If I were forced to have just one of the two focal lengths it would be 500mm for circuit work in the UK. Why? Oh because I can crop the 500mm images if need be but I can't make the 600mm wider. Bear in mind, however, that I am talking about using a 1D series camera and not a 1Ds like I know you own.

[neil_r]

Thanks for that Glenn. I have pretty much made my mind up on 500. I have been offered a used Sigma for a really good price, so now I have to decide if I will regret not getting the Canon if I go for it.

[Simon Harrison]

Thanks for that Glenn. I have pretty much made my mind up on 500. I have been offered a used Sigma for a really good price, so now I have to decide if I will regret not getting the Canon if I go for it.

Neil,

I bought a second hand Sigma 500mm around 12 months ago from LCE and I have never looked back. I fail to see just what extra benefit in terms of focus speed, accuracy and image quality the Canon version could give me.

No doubt that will upset those who think L series lenses are the be all and end all, but it is simply a fact.

Simon.

[neil_r]

To be honest Simon, it was your pictures that started me looking at the Sigma 500.

Is yours the f/4.5 APO C/AF or the EX DG HSM ?

(does the Canon 1.4 tc work with the Sigma or do you need a proprietary one?)

[Cadwell]

Neither "works" with Sigma 500mm if by work you mean "will retain autofocus". The Sigma is f/4.5 and once you add the TC you end up with an effective f/6.3 solution which crosses the magic f/5.6 autofocus threshold. Now I know, a 1 Series SHOULD af with lenses up to f/8 but it won't. I have tried to get an explanation from Sigma without success. A tape-tricked or non-reporting TC works OK..

[Simon Harrison]

To be honest Simon, it was your pictures that started me looking at the Sigma 500.

Is yours the f/4.5 APO C/AF or the EX DG HSM ?

(does the Canon 1.4 tc work with the Sigma or do you need a proprietary one?)

Mine's the EX DG HSM version.

Glenn has answered your question about TC's. If I want any extra reach out of mine, I use it with a 40D, and it produces superb results. Most of the shots in my recent bike thread were taken with that combination. All of the images in the following gallery were taken with the 40D + Sigma 500

http://www.srh-motorsport-photography.co.uk/srhphoto/v/2009+Season/HCS/SBD/

Cheers,

Simon.

[GSH]

Thanks for that Glenn. I have pretty much made my mind up on 500. I have been offered a used Sigma for a really good price, so now I have to decide if I will regret not getting the Canon if I go for it.

I seriously looked at the Canon prior to buying my Sigma and was close to placing an order (prices were more realistic than they are now!) when i spotted a "used" Sigma 500f4.5 EX DG at a dealer's for a good price...less than 50% of the current retail price ;)

Do i regret not buying the Canon? Not at all. Do i miss IS?...well the only time i use it is at the NEC for the Autosport show and i only own 1 IS lens (24-105) after selling the 100-400 ages ago.

The choice is yours, but if the Sigma is a good deal you could always sell it if you find really want an IS lens. Given that the Canon currently retails at £5K+ it would seem to be the sensible thing to do.

If it's samples you're after...

On the 1DMK2N
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/geoff.hubbert/Pics/Images%202009/OPBGT/Oulton%20F3BGT994.jpg

On the 50D
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/geoff.hubbert/Pics/Images%202009/OPBGT/Oulton%20F3BGT061.jpg

[neil_r]

Geoff the whole price thing is crazy I could go to New York (on air miles) and buy a Canon 500 for the same price as a UK Sigma 500. But looking at your and Simon's results I am really seriously considering the Sigma (we all know it's the lens not the photographer that produces the results.... right :o )

Thanks for this great input.

[GSH]

Neil, if you want to see larger versions of those PM your e-mail address to me and i'll send some tonight as web-sized shots are no guarantee of quality...

Simon's seen a much larger version of the Ferrari shot and i'm sure he'll confirm what it looks like :)

[Simon Harrison]

Simon's seen a much larger version of the Ferrari shot and i'm sure he'll confirm what it looks like :)

Total cack :lol::lol:

That is of course using the lesser known meaning of the word 'cack' i.e. super sharp, spot on colours / contrast and all round top notch image quality.

Simon.

[neil_r]

Neil, if you want to see larger versions of those PM your e-mail address to me and i'll send some tonight as web-sized shots are no guarantee of quality...

Many thanks.... PM Sent

[Mike Hoyer]

Neither "works" with Sigma 500mm if by work you mean "will retain autofocus". The Sigma is f/4.5 and once you add the TC you end up with an effective f/6.3 solution which crosses the magic f/5.6 autofocus threshold. Now I know, a 1 Series SHOULD af with lenses up to f/8 but it won't. I have tried to get an explanation from Sigma without success. A tape-tricked or non-reporting TC works OK..

My Canon 500 4.5 will autofocus with a 1.4x TC on a 1-series. It's really good aswell, only disadvantage is you can only use the centre focus point.

[Cadwell]

My Canon 500 4.5 will autofocus with a 1.4x TC on a 1-series. It's really good aswell, only disadvantage is you can only use the centre focus point.

Indeed, and the Sigma "should", but it doesn't. Stick a non-reporting TC on it (like an old Tamron one) and it works just fine.

[CyberDyneSystems]

Thanks for that Glenn. I have pretty much made my mind up on 500. I have been offered a used Sigma for a really good price, so now I have to decide if I will regret not getting the Canon if I go for it.

Try it out!

All you lose with the Sigma is IS, and some T-Con functionality.
IMHO, with the Canon you get a 500mm and a 700mm with the 1.4x
Getting a 1.4x to AF on the Sigma is dodgy unfortunately sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't and YES I am talking about 1 Series AF too.

If you can confirm good AF with a 1.4x on your body, than the Sigma is a great option if the price is right.

[neil_r]

Guys, thanks for all the great advice I eventually went with the Canon 500 which I bought from B&H so I got the Canon for the equivalent UK price of the Sigma.

Will be taking out for a spin on Sunday.

Thanks again

[Simon Harrison]

Guys, thanks for all the great advice I eventually went with the Canon 500 which I bought from B&H so I got the Canon for the equivalent UK price of the Sigma.

Will be taking out for a spin on Sunday.

Thanks again

Great stuff Neil :D.

Look forward to seeing some shots from Sunday in the next day or so.

Simon.

[neil_r]

Have put some day one results here

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=684377