Will this radio trigger allow E-TTL

[canonfaithfulforever]

i found this trigger on ebay:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/wireless-flashgun-trigger-V2-TM-Canon-420EX-580EX-430EX_W0QQitemZ120396607235QQcmdZViewItemQQptZUK_P hotography_StudioEquipment_RL?hash=item12039660723 5&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1683|66%3A2|65%3A12|39%3A1|240%3A13 18

i was just wandering if this would allow E-TTL while in manual mode, if not how would i set the correct flash power

if you have any other budget triggers you would like to recommend it would be much appreciated

[msowsun]

No, that ebay trigger will not give you ETTL. There are no "budget Triggers" that do ETTL.

The only ones that will are the expensive Radio Poppers, but only if you have a Canon master/slave compatible flash or ST-E2 on the camera and a Canon master/slave compatible flash off camera. In effect you need two flashes or an ST-E2 and a Canon flash.

Not sure about the new Pocket Wizards. They seem to be having problems.

[canonfaithfulforever]

thanks msowsun, so how would i get a correct exposure and flash power

thanks

[Superficialodds]

You need to manually set the flash power with help from a light meter. Or you can do it by trial and error.

[msowsun]

Every time I see a question about off camera triggers, I always wonder if the poster really understands that off camera usually means no ETTL.....

I just spent a few minutes looking through all the stickies trying to find one that would be useful in explaining how to use a flash off camera in manual mode.

I can't seem to find one. Does anyone know if there is one?

[Tareq]

To be honest, I want to use the flashes off camera without ETTL because i know what power i need, now the only thing i am looking for on the net is a good modifier[softbox] and some triggers.

[Brett]

thanks msowsun, so how would i get a correct exposure and flash power

thanks

It's basically a seat-of-the-pants thing. You shoot Manual and use several variables to get a good exposure:

1) Shutter speed only controls ambient exposure, not flash. Most the time you'll want to shoot at you camera's flash sync speed (1/200th or 1/250th) to kill ambient and allow you more control over the light, but you can slow the shutter and let some ambient in depending on conditions.

2) Aperture controls flash exposure. Wider lets in more light, obviously. If DoF is important, that's a consideration as well, but I just adjust flash power to achieve f/8 as a good exposure, and open up from there if shallower DoF is desired.

3) Flash power. You'll learn where to start after shooting for a while, then adjust aperture/flash power for a good exposure.

4) ISO. Try to keep it at 100 for the cleanest file, but if your flash is at full power and you have the aperture where you want it for a desired DoF, you can increase ISO to increase flash exposure.

5) Flash-to-subject distance. You can read up on the inverse-square law, but basically as you move a light away from a subject, you lose power rapidly. Doubling the distance gives you 1/4 of the light.

You determine that you have a good exposure using the histogram. That has pitfalls of its own, and requires reading up on how to properly read a histogram, exposure-to-the-right, etc.

I think that covers it in a basic way. I've just started learning this, and that's what I know so far. :o ;)

[Titus213]

It's basically a seat-of-the-pants thing. You shoot Manual and use several variables to get a good exposure:

1) Shutter speed only controls ambient exposure, not flash. Most the time you'll want to shoot at you camera's flash sync speed (1/200th or 1/250th) to kill ambient and allow you more control over the light, but you can slow the shutter and let some ambient in depending on conditions.

2) Aperture controls flash exposure. Wider lets in more light, obviously. If DoF is important, that's a consideration as well, but I just adjust flash power to achieve f/8 as a good exposure, and open up from there if shallower DoF is desired.

3) Flash power. You'll learn where to start after shooting for a while, then adjust aperture/flash power for a good exposure.

4) ISO. Try to keep it at 100 for the cleanest file, but if your flash is at full power and you have the aperture where you want it for a desired DoF, you can increase ISO to increase flash exposure.

5) Flash-to-subject distance. You can read up on the inverse-square law, but basically as you move a light away from a subject, you lose power rapidly. Doubling the distance gives you 1/4 of the light.

You determine that you have a good exposure using the histogram. That has pitfalls of its own, and requires reading up on how to properly read a histogram, exposure-to-the-right, etc.

I think that covers it in a basic way. I've just started learning this, and that's what I know so far. :o ;)

...or you could buy a flash meter.

[SkipD]

You determine that you have a good exposure using the histogram. That has pitfalls of its own, and requires reading up on how to properly read a histogram, exposure-to-the-right, etc.The histogram is not a good replacement for a light meter. It knows nothing about the subject's reflectivity or coloring.

By far, the best way to deal with off-camera flash lighting exposure control is to use a handheld meter that can measure light from flash sources and, preferably, can read light in the incident mode (opposite of reflected light measurement - this reads the light falling on the subject).

[bobbyz]

Side question - What is typical flash vs ambient ratio (using L358) for pleasing mix of flash with ambient?

[Brett]

...or you could buy a flash meter.

Absolutely. As I said, I'm learning. If I could find a decent flash meter that doesn't cost $235 I would love to have one. For now, the variables I mentioned are what I've learned a great many people whose work I respect use to achieve nice (IMO) exposures. That said, I'm a fan of your work as well. :)

The histogram is not a good replacement for a light meter. It knows nothing about the subject's reflectivity or coloring.

By far, the best way to deal with off-camera flash lighting exposure control is to use a handheld meter that can measure light from flash sources and, preferably, can read light in the incident mode (opposite of reflected light measurement - this reads the light falling on the subject).

I know, and I've read many of your explanations concerning use of a light meter. I don't have one, though, and honestly, it doesn't take me long to lock in an exposure that I'm pretty happy with. In fact, I've learned about ETTR from your posts, read up on it, and I'm even happier with the results after. But yes, I'd love to have a light meter.

[Tareq]

Absolutely. As I said, I'm learning. If I could find a decent flash meter that doesn't cost $235 I would love to have one. For now, the variables I mentioned are what I've learned a great many people whose work I respect use to achieve nice (IMO) exposures. That said, I'm a fan of your work as well. :)



I know, and I've read many of your explanations concerning use of a light meter. I don't have one, though, and honestly, it doesn't take me long to lock in an exposure that I'm pretty happy with. In fact, I've learned about ETTR from your posts, read up on it, and I'm even happier with the results after. But yes, I'd love to have a light meter.

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/368226-REG/Sekonic_401_309_L_308S_Flashmate_Light_Meter.html

L-358 costs about $260, believe me, it is worthy.

[D Thompson]

Absolutely. As I said, I'm learning. If I could find a decent flash meter that doesn't cost $235 I would love to have one.

But yes, I'd love to have a light meter.
More than capable for $189. Sekonic L308S (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/368226-REG/Sekonic_401_309_L_308S_Flashmate_Light_Meter.html)

[Tareq]

More than capable for $189. Sekonic L308S (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/368226-REG/Sekonic_401_309_L_308S_Flashmate_Light_Meter.html)

Yes, this is the link that i posted above ;)

[D Thompson]

Yes, this is the link that i posted above ;)
Didn't click your link as I figured it pointed to the L358 since it is the one you referenced in your post.;)

[Tareq]

Didn't click your link as I figured it pointed to the L358 since it is the one you referenced in your post.;)

I posted the cheaper one and i stated that the other is better and worthy.

[Brett]

Thanks for the suggestions, but it's still $190. :p

If I set up a studio in the upstairs space at my shop, I'll definitely get a light meter. Right now, I'm in the process of moving my residence (just bought my first house at 41 years old :D ), so my money is very tight at the moment.

[agedbriar]

It's basically a seat-of-the-pants thing. You shoot Manual and use several variables to get a good exposure:

1) Shutter speed only controls ambient exposure, not flash. Most the time you'll want to shoot at you camera's flash sync speed (1/200th or 1/250th) to kill ambient and allow you more control over the light, but you can slow the shutter and let some ambient in depending on conditions.

2) Aperture controls flash exposure. Wider lets in more light, obviously. If DoF is important, that's a consideration as well, but I just adjust flash power to achieve f/8 as a good exposure, and open up from there if shallower DoF is desired.

3) Flash power. You'll learn where to start after shooting for a while, then adjust aperture/flash power for a good exposure.

4) ISO. Try to keep it at 100 for the cleanest file, but if your flash is at full power and you have the aperture where you want it for a desired DoF, you can increase ISO to increase flash exposure.

5) Flash-to-subject distance. You can read up on the inverse-square law, but basically as you move a light away from a subject, you lose power rapidly. Doubling the distance gives you 1/4 of the light.

You determine that you have a good exposure using the histogram. That has pitfalls of its own, and requires reading up on how to properly read a histogram, exposure-to-the-right, etc.

I think that covers it in a basic way. I've just started learning this, and that's what I know so far. :o ;)

Aperture controls both: ambient exposure and flash exposure.

It's true, though, that the impact aperture has on ambient exposure can be compensated with shutter speed, which can't be done in relation to flash exposure as the latter is not controlled by shutter speed.

[Brett]

Aperture controls both: ambient exposure and flash exposure.

It's true, though, that the impact aperture has on ambient exposure can be compensated with shutter speed, which can't be done in relation to flash exposure as the latter is not controlled by shutter speed.

Agreed, but for all practical purposes, at f/8 and 1/200th indoors, the frame is black without the flash. From a strobist perspective, aperture is used to control flash exposure, not ambient...although you're right, it does to an extent. :)

[brecklundin]

Absolutely. As I said, I'm learning. If I could find a decent flash meter that doesn't cost $235 I would love to have one. For now, the variables I mentioned are what I've learned a great many people whose work I respect use to achieve nice (IMO) exposures. That said, I'm a fan of your work as well. :)


I am in the same situation...right this micro second no funds for photography goodies beyond the simple stuff. And as much as I would love a decent light meter I am holding off. ;)

So, what I am doing is using a two flash setup. I have my 430EX II and a CHEAP Vivitar 273 I grabbed at an area thrift shot for $5, well, $4.95...I bought a set of PT-04 III (or GY whatever version that is not the CN version or the V2's you pointed toward.). That way I can position the flashes who I want, get a fairly reliable wireless off camera trigger setup. I set the flashes to manual adjusting using the "by golly or by gosh" method...otherwise known as a lot of WAGing. ;)

It actually has gotten pretty easy as it's all indoor and I keep relatively the same setup of white foam core boards and such. I can dial the flashes up or down to get pretty close to the light effect I am hunting on the first or 2nd try and then refine from there by positioning the boards.

Speaking of the foam core boards. I bought a bunch of them, around 10-12 I forget, when Michaels had them on sale for just $2/ea. I added a few blue and spray painted a couple flat black on one side then cut one up to various sizes. It really have me a lot of help learning the concepts in the books I have on lighting. And I get it done using just the two flashes and a few CFL white balanced trumpet bulbs. I have a LOOOOONG way to go in understanding this all but it's getting better.

I also did two things that were not all that expensive. First I made a DIY beauty dish kinda thing out of a shop light dish, painted the interior white and covered it with micro foam protective sheets. Cut a hole in the back for the flash head...it works well. But I did splurge on a Lumiquest Softbox III. Both work out well, and I found a fair deal on the Softbox III on eBay.

With all of that I have the eBay triggers, which as many will tell ya, are not perfect at all. But they work well enough for me at this point in time. If I get more interested I will probably invest in whichever set of RF triggers support ETTL the best and are the most reliable. But, if you have a lot of lights, that gets expensive FAST. I would rather buy a good new lens over a trigger that can be fired from 500' with ETTL...I never plan on being more than 15' from my flash anytime soon. ;)

Here are the triggers I bought:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&item=220388338247

The seller shipped fast and they arrived to me here on the west cost in California in under 7-days. As you see the set has four receivers (Rx). I opted for a 4 Rx set in case one or more of the Rx units were flaky. And sure enough two of them are funky and the other two are perfect w/o any issues at all. Work perfectly every time. The flaky two are weird in that if the battery door is bumped at all it will trigger the flash. But once in place they also just work in my small home studio setup. I will drop a not to the seller and ask for suggestions...if there is not one I'll prolly live with it unless the seller offers a swap of the units. A few bucks shipping is not a big deal.

Another option I found is the idea of building my own multi-flash ETTL cable. There is an interesting thread about doing just that here:

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=123662

If you are handy with building cables, it is REALLY easy to create a nice modular set of cables using some CAT5 cables and some cheaper hot shoe cables made for Canon. You could easily make a set for both flashes off camera with a 50' range for under $75 and if you can find the hot shoe mounts cheap somewhere then under $50 should be no issue. You really would not even need a "slaughtering iron" if you use self crimping connectors and adapters.

Sorry for rambling but I just went through this whole thing myself...and it was fun! ;)

I do really recommend the two books in my sig as well as reading all the strobist stuff you can, ignoring for the most part the product specific suggestions as from my reading the whole Strobist thing is getting an obvious commercial bent compared to it's realy days. Both the Light: Magic & Science and Strobist have Flickr groups. I learn a lot from both and here.

Again, very sorry for the LONG post...

EDIT: BTW, here is another option that WILL preserve your ETTL if you do not want to build your own off camera cables:

http://photography.shop.ebay.com/items/_W0QQ_dmptZCameraQ5fFlashQ5fAccessories?_nkw=off+s hoe+%2B%2810m%2C+3m%2C+10%27%2C+10ft%29+canon&_sacat=64353&_trksid=p3286.m270.l1313&_odkw=off+shoe+%2B%2810m%2C+10%27%2C+10ft%29+canon&_osacat=64353

ANd this one is a multi-flash rig:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=270356435887