Don't know what to charge for this job!!

[int0xicatedxluv]

Hey guys,

I'm starting to pick up some bigger jobs...and I'm having a VERY hard time determining what pricing should be. I don't want to sell myself short of course, but I don't want to ask for something and have them turn around and think I'm being outrageous.

This job is shooting a flyer for a massive, massive promotional company in Los Angeles. They want me to re-create this look with this model so that they don't have to keep using this same stock photo I guess.

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a213/cronies/l_7cf89a352b44fc6b7b7c37e1384e7806.jpg

I don't really anticipate a FULL day of work. Maybe 3-4 hours. I'm currently working on getting together the wedding dress, tiara, a proper model, and location...I also need a makeup artist and hair stylist...

should I include all of this into costs??

any idea of what to charge would be fantastic because I have NO clue!

:oops:

[dreamcatcher23]

Are they hiring you as a photographyer or as an artistic director? Charge accordingly - makeup and hair will probably be a few hundred $, model could be similar - rental of wedding dress, tiara etc... it's going to be an expensive shoot, probably a few thousand dollars all in.

[sspellman]

Kristen-

Pricing for small commercial shoots can be complicated. I would first figure out your photography services cost-$150 an hour is a good start. Then you need to add expenses for model, styling, and location-perhaps $4-600. For that price and time, you should be able to execute a variety of outfits and looks-consult with your client to give them good value. Normally, commercial shoots would also charge for usage, but I would include that in your pricing.

-Scott

[int0xicatedxluv]

awesome thank you guys! that does help some.

i think up in the thousands would be a bit much... but.. i may ask for close to $1000 that sounds reasonable.

i am doing everything, directing, etc. Location we're probably shooting outdoors so no location fees assocaited there which is good :)

[egordon99]

I would hope so! :D


Hey guys,


I'm currently working on getting together the wedding dress, tiara, a proper model, and location...I also need a makeup artist and hair stylist...

should I include all of this into costs??

:oops:

[Box Brownie]

Firstly I wish I had some advice from experience however I am learning how others approach such matters should I ever get the chances.

But surely when it comes to these type of jobs are there not two prime ways of looking at the costs?

1) Knowing how many facets involved ~ model, dress, tiara etc hire charges and the number of hours you will allocate should give you a base cost. Then as appropriate add the margin to the fixed costs (model etc) but if you are allowing for half a day (4 hours) what about contingency ~ change of weather if outdoors, client rep on the shoot who insists on creative input disrupting the workflow.......makes me wonder if you should base the charges on an hourly rate rather a simply job rate???

2) Once you have your offer ready to give I have read many times hereabouts that these sort of clients will or should have allocated a budget and surely it is your right to ask what the budget figure is ??? You did say "This job is shooting a flyer for a massive, massive promotional company in Los Angeles" so whats the $$$$ they are setting aside for the job?

2a) If they tell you $xxx then based on your hourly rate how many hours does that cover? If in your opinion this is too low a budget then make sure your contract has a suitable clause(s) for you to be paid for over-run or a getout clause for you to cover the 'fact' the budget was inadequate for the job??? No good booking the model for half a day and she says 'right I am off to my afternoon booking..........' and if she stays you will be paying her extra hours not the client if you have not accounted for contingencies somehow?

Again I say I have no idea whether my 2p's worth is worth anything but my business head says these questions are logical, aren't they?

Edit - are they expecting you to do the PPing for the "look" you have shown??? If so just how manys hours on the PC/Mac will that likely take you. 1,2,3 .........10 hours ~ just how much is your time worth to make a living?

[bReed]

I would factor in your editing time after the shoot is done as well. I think $1000 is to cheap considering you are having to put it all together.

[PhotosGuy]

it is your right to ask what the budget figure is That's one of my first questions. makes me wonder if you should base the charges on an hourly rate rather a simply job rate Day rate for me.
How to price commercial work? (http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=677650)

Sticky: How much Do I Charge? One of the most often asked questions (http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=137162)

Editorial Photographers Price Estimator (http://www.editorialphoto.com/resources/estimator/estimator.asp)

[int0xicatedxluv]

It looks like I won't be doing any PP work. They are a massive graphic design firm and they will probably take the raw photos and do what they please with them into their flyers. I was told they would be doing major PP to the photos anyway as part of their flyer design this year.

So I'm figuring to ask him $1500... i'll see how this goes over haha

[int0xicatedxluv]

Welp here is the breakdown im about to send over to the client.

I hope it flies lol

Final Images: 300-600
Estimated Photo Shoot: 4 hours
Photography Fees: 6 hrs * $100=$600
Image Use Fees(unlimited): Included
Studio/Location Fees/Travel costs: $100
Talent Fees: 4 hours * $50 * 1 model = $200
Styling Fees: $350
Misc Fees: $250 (supplies / wedding dress etc)
TOTAL: $1500

* prep time.

[Box Brownie]

Welp here is the breakdown im about to send over to the client.

I hope it flies lol

Final Images: 300-600
Estimated Photo Shoot: 4 hours
Photography Fees: 6 hrs * $100=$600
Image Use Fees(unlimited): Included
Studio/Location Fees/Travel costs: $100
Talent Fees: 4 hours * $50 * 1 model = $200
Styling Fees: $350
Misc Fees: $250 (supplies / wedding dress etc)
TOTAL: $1500

* prep time.

Just my extra 2p's worth :D

So no PPing by you, OK your role to supply everything associated with the shot and make sure that the client gets what they want.

Now are you required to submit a breakdown like that ~ the reason I ask is firstly I hope you added your margin to those "other" costs and secondly by breaking it down you give them the chance to say for example "your costs are too high because we can get a model for $150 for that time period...."

IMO in business your overhead costs should be hidden from the client because as per my example "they" can then try to control those costs. Having said that is photography different from what I am used to ??? Afterall the image cannot be created without the model etc so your quote/charges (other feedback not withstanding) should reflect the your charge per hour and/or day with all those items factored in.

Best of luck and if you are allowed do post back with a portfolio shot of how you got on?

:)

[int0xicatedxluv]

Well... They've actually already chosen the model and she's already given me her pricing. They want HER, so its unlikely that they'll argue her cost...

I'm looking around online trying to find some type of contract that I can submit.

I feel like I "should" give them a breakdown of costs simply becuase if it were me, I'd ask where that $1500 was goin, but maybe they won't...


Sheesh all this business stuff is complicated! :p

[bReed]

So out of the 1500 how much would you actually be putting in your pocket?

[int0xicatedxluv]

About $1000 of that...

[PhotosGuy]

Forms, legal docs, contracts (http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=330529)

includes:Business Forms, © info, & Pricing Tables (http://www.d-65.com/photographers.html)

[tcphoto1]

I hope that you were more specific about the usage. If not, they will think that they can use the images in any/all advertising, fliers, website, their partners websites, advertising and resell in stock for an unlimited period of time.

[int0xicatedxluv]

^^ well isn't that the point? they're going to use them all over, I know that :)
and im okay with it.

(these people are also friends of mine which makes it a LITTLE tricky to slam the hammer down on them with usage rights...im cool with them using my images.)

[Floriantrojer.com]

I'm sorry to say so, but I feel like you undercharge them quite a bit.

And
massive, massive promotional company in Los Angeles
plus
these people are also friends of mine which makes it a LITTLE tricky to slam the hammer down on them

shows that you should maybe take some business classes... :oops:

Would you think Jerry Bruckheimer would produce you a movie for half the cost simply because he's a friend of yours? Don't think so.

Charge what it's worth it, I am sure most of your friends would do exactly the same.

[Ook]

Would you think Jerry Bruckheimer would produce you a movie for half the cost simply because he's a friend of yours? Don't think so.

Charge what it's worth it, I am sure most of your friends would do exactly the same.

Yes, becausewhile you're saying "They are my friends, so I'll let them use my stuff cheap", the other side of it is "He/She is our friend so we can use their stuff without paying them fairly", which doesn't sound very friendly to me.

[Alleh]

About $1000 of that...


So you are charging for a stylist and doing it yourself I take it? Probably not a good idea.

[DDCSD]

Does the promotional company know that they will more than likely be sued for copyright infringement by the author of the original image if they have you "re-create" it?

Be sure that you cover your bases to protect yourself from an infringement lawsuit if you choose to do this.