Shooting motorcycles with a 20D

[Stymyx]

Here’s a question I hope to get some help with. I’ll be at the Honda AMA Superbike Classic this coming weekend in Birmingham, Alabama with my Canon 20D and Canon 75-300mm f/4-5.6 zoom lens. I hope to be sitting about 25 to 50 feet away from the track. I’m not a newbie with cameras, and I do like to manually set my own settings whenever possible. Most of my photography experience is with portraits and scenery photography, but I’ve never tried shooting motorcycles blazing by at over 150 miles-per-hour before! Anybody have any suggestions for 20D-specific settings, techniques, etc? Thanks in advance!



-Jeff

[Skip Souza]

I can't offer you any advice because I have no real experience either. I hope that you get some shots to post.
I am looking forward to taking my 20D to Laguna Seca for the first time (for the camera, not me) this July.
Have fun!!! I'll look for you on Speedvision ;-)

[Stymyx]

Thanks, Skip. I'll definitely post a photo or two here, good or bad, after the race!

Off-topic: Laguna Seca? Man, you're making me homesick. The last time I was there was back when Freddie Spencer and Kenny Roberts used to battle it out (there I go, showing my age!). Sittin' at the bottom of the Corkscrew. Man, that's a great track!

[R1 Kid]

I wish I could go to either AMA race. I haven't had the pleasure yet of shooting fast action. But I have read several posts here on this forum about photoing races in general. Do a search and read up. Several good reads in here on the subject.

[cactusclay]

Practice paning, maybe.

[Skip Souza]

Like Cactusclay said; "Practice panning". I have taken up standing beside a road with fairly quick traffic and practiced. Aint as easy as it looks! I have also collected some "hard stares" from some of the local gang bangers.
I also remember the great battles between Freddie & Kenny. This year MotoGP returns with the AMA nationals. First time for MotoGP in what, 12-15 years. Of course we lost World Super Bikes. WSBK has practically turned into a Ducati Cup except for Vermuelens Honda and a couple of others.
Practice, practice, practice. Film is cheap for the 20D :-)

[fortinaa]

I haven't done this yet either... But from the nicer pictures I have seen, there are two things you can try.

1) Definitely go anywhere you can to practice your panning technique and see what settings get you the best quality pics. Use AI Servo and a tripod with pan head where possible.

2) Pick a point on the track where you know you are likely to want the photos from. Set up a tripod and AF on the spot you plan to shoot the bikes. Flip the lens into MF so you don't lose your focus lock. Pan and shoot when the bikes approach the spot. Re-check your focus every few sets to make sure you haven't bumped the focus out of whack.

Good luck and post some shots!

[SkipD]

The advice I can give you is from a long time ago. Forget auto focus. Forget auto exposure. Set the camera up on full manual mode. Pre-focus and set exposure on a spot on the track where the action happens. Then, pan on the subject until it gets into position.

You will want to choose a good spot (or spots) on the track to take the photos based on observation. For example, it might be the place where the bikes land after a jump or it might be mid-jump. Your observation experience will tell you what places are best for the type of shots you want to make. You might want some straight-on shots, some under-the-bike shots while they are in the air, etc.

[ron chappel]

I tend to think along the same lins as skip-autofocus will probably be way too slow to be any good ,especially with that lens.
It depends alot on how hard the AF has to work-panning shots are reasonably easy because the distance to the bike is not changing too dramatically.Try something like a full head-on shot though and AF will probably fail everytime.
Auto exposure shouldn't be too bad.Try it and see-relying on manual exposure is hard work because you have to check for blow highlights all the time.Try both auto and resort to manual if you have to i think

Here are some motocross shots taken with that same lens.I got some good ones but had a whole lot of throwaways,mostly due to focus issues (bad AF or missfocussed MF).

http://members.dodo.net.au/~l8r_ron/

[dito]

Sorry to be the odd man out, but DON'T manual focus! Why would the better lenses and bodies all use AF if it wasn't better? I shoot motorcycles for a living. I used to do this with a D30, then a 10D, now 1DMKII so I know you can do it with a 20D. My suggestions are...
-use center focus point only
-use AI servo
-DON'T pre focus then "shoot when you think they reach that exact spot"
-use M if you are comfortable, otherwise use TV depending on panning expertise.
Yes, that lens isn't the best, (get yourself a 70-200 2.8 with a 1.4 TC, you WONT regret it!) but if you pan pretty decently you will get keepers.
-don't feel you have to be the closest possible to the track. I sometimes shoot farther distance and let the zoom work so I can keep a equal distance throughout my panning (helping the focusing problem). Honestly, I don't think that lens will be any good for "head on" shots if you want tight crops, that is unless the runoff isn't good and they're pointed at walls and ytou can stand behind one. take a look at my AMA testing from Infineon a couple weeks back here, http://gotbluemilk.com/web050317/. Any comments, questions (good and bad) welcome at dito@gotbluemilk.com...

-panning shots=70-200 w/wo 1.4TC, head on shots are with the 400, 600, or 600 with the 1.4.

[ScottE]

Last year I spent about an hour waiting for a Meadowlark to return to a perch so I could get some photos, only to have a couple of trail bikes come roaring up and frighten it away. They then tore up the side of a hill, off-trail, through a patch of wildflowers I was planning to photograph after I got the Meadowlark shots.

At the time I thought the best thing to shoot a motorcycle with would be a 12 gauge shotgun, if a 10 gauge wasn't available.

Scott

[jimmywires]

Practice paning

[Stymyx]

Man, lots of great advice here! I guess I'll do my experimenting by trying everything I've read here during qualifying on Friday and figure out which technique works best, then use that technique during the races on Saturday. I'll be camping at the track the whole weekend and I'll have my laptop computer with me, so I can see the results right there on the laptop (I know, I know, camping with a laptop. *geez!* :rolleyes: ) As far as the lens I'll be using, I know this lens isn't the best in the world, but it's what I have to make do with until I can afford something better.

Thanks, Ron & Dito, for the links to your example photos. Although they're ALL great pix, Dito's more closely resemble what I'll be shooting, i.e. superbikes vs. motocross bikes.

And thanks to everybody else for your suggestions. I'll post some examples next week and let everybody here know which technique worked best.

Cheers,
Jeff

[KennyG]

I am sorry to say, but Skip is totally wrong in his recommnedations and Ron, the lens is fast enough to cope with bikes at high speed. Whatever you do, don't bother with a tripod, total waste of time and even a monopod is overkill for such a light setup.

The 20D has a good AI Servo system and you should use the centre focus point only. In Tv mode start off a 1/400 or 1/320, pick up the bike as soon as you can, track it and take the shot when opposite you and follow through like a tennis shot. You can take head-on shots of bikes at 150mph a 1/500 at the highest, preferably 1/400 or 1/320. Too high a speed and you will 'park' them on track, so don't go for too fast a shutter speed.

Look at some of my bike shots in the Sports forum, the Exif info is intact if you want to check the settings. Look at the shots from Simon Harrison, he uses a 20D and AI servo, or shots from Ian H. The latest posts were from the PowerBike series here in the UK with bikes/riders that appear in the SuperBike series. These boys do not hang about.

Keep it simple and practice. Get at the entrance or exit of a corner where they will not only shed some speed, but shots of a leaning bike have more appeal.

[dito]

[QUOTE=KennyG] don't bother with a tripod, total waste of time and even a monopod is overkill for such a light setup.
The 20D has a good AI Servo system and you should use the centre focus point only. In Tv mode start off a 1/400 or 1/320, pick up the bike as soon as you can, track it and take the shot when opposite you and follow through like a tennis shot. You can take head-on shots of bikes at 150mph a 1/500 at the highest, preferably 1/400 or 1/320. Too high a speed and you will 'park' them on track, so don't go for too fast a shutter speed.
QUOTE]
Those are great pointers I forgot. Definately follow the follow through tip!

[SkipD]

I am sorry to say, but Skip is totally wrong in his recommnedationsI had been thinking of close-in motocross, not road racing. Big difference, of course. Oh well.....

[Bosscat]

Make sure you use a shutter speed in the 1/250 range or slightly slower. And start at a slower corner in order to get the hang of it. Make sure that you follow through with your subject after clicking the shutter, and don't press too hard to keep from jarring a smooth flowing panning movement is what you need.

[davefaulk]

All the recommendations were good, in my opinion. I am an amateur and have taken shots at Laguna Seca and Sears Point. The speed of the bikes is tough to deal with if you are too close. I was at the top of the corkscrew and they were coming through too fast for me to catch them. I had better luck on Turn 1, etc where I could see them coming in and then zoom in on what I wanted.

I got some great shots of the World Superbike race crash in turn 1 a few years ago--right place right time. Luckily no one was seriously hurt.

Take lots of shots and you'll be sure to get some keepers.

Dave

[SeanH]

Just go with the Sports mode, and hope you don't get any like this...........it's bad when it's a friend

[Skippy29]

Damn, that looks like it hurt!!

Oh wait...it did :(

[dito]

here's another one that hurts... was using d30 at the time...
click here for more motorcycle crashes...http://gotbluemilk.com/crash.html

[Skip Souza]

Green, blue, green, blue.................Medic!

[Stymyx]

Well, it took a couple of days, but I finally posted a few shots from the race. They're over at http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?p=517699#post517699.

I did try using manual focus, but I ultimately ended up using the AI Servo autofocus mode.

Thanks again for everybody who posted advice. It really worked!

Cheers, -Jeff

[Adam Hicks]

Hey I just saw this post, but I shot the AMA / THQ Superbike series when it was in Dallas a few weeks ago. Had full press credentials and the whole bit. I used the 50mm 1.8 because I didn't have the 1.4 yet (wish I had) but if you're going to be on the dirt, the 50mm is PERFECT. You'll want the light gathering ability of it or the 85mm 1.8.

I'll say that all photographers on the dirt were using either the 70-200 2.8 or the 50mm 1.4 (or one camera with each.) Not much else out there.

Here's a few quick samples... since this shoot was just for fun I haven't gone through all of the shots yet. Had Nascar the next weekend!

We spent some time with Stewart that night after the races and he was a super nice guy. Let me know if there's anything I can help with!

Adam

http://www.golilm.com/motox/stewart_air_1.jpg

http://www.golilm.com/motox/top_three.jpg

[m3elmo]

here's another one that hurts... was using d30 at the time...
click here for more motorcycle crashes...http://gotbluemilk.com/crash.html

Dito, good to see you on this forum. I'm a new SLR owner myself. If yo don't remember i'm R6Elmo from BARF. Hopefully I'll see you at the track again

And yes, you do take pictures of motorcycles on track for a living...among other things ;)