A10 thounderbolt

[GyRob]

This was taken at 1/3200 at f5.6 can anyone confirm that in the red circles they are rounds from the gun as i carn't think they are anything else .
thanks
Rob

[Longwatcher]

The picture is not of sufficient quality (at least on my screen/browser) for me to say. Although the spacing looks about right from what I remember. The plane however, doesn't look like it is firing, but again because of resolution can't tell. If it was firing then the odds improve dramatically that those are indeed the rounds from the GAU-8 gattling gun.

[lost]

Couple questions. Was the warthog traveling from right to left or left to right in the frame? and Was he firing when you snapped the picture?

[lost]

By rounds do you mean Spent Casings or actual 30mm projectile?

[crazyfoo88]

By the looks of it, it is just a condensation trail from the fast turn in humid air :).

[kawter2]

By the looks of it, it is just a condensation trail from the fast turn in humid air :).


yea i think so too

[lost]

Look close and there are black spots evenly spaced along the trail. Shell Casings possibly

[CyberDyneSystems]

Shell casings are not ejected from an A10...

The firing rate on the GUA 8A Avenger is so high that I would imagine the spacing between rounds could very well be seen in a photo if the shutter were fast enough. But I'd love to see a full res image.. (assuming this isn't a 100% crop...? )

[Marauder61]

The Thunderbolt II's 30mm GAU-8/A Gatling gun can fire 3,900 rounds a minute which is 65 rounds per sec. the shell casings would be falling away and behind the A-10 and not in front.
There is gray smoke coming from below the nose where the 30mm gun is. Is there a better photo? and How were you able to get almost in the line of fire of an A-10???

[GyRob]

Yes he was firing and going from left to right, it is a 100% crop .

[GyRob]

full frame he was at 4000ft so not the best shot.

[GyRob]

He was comeing over my head on some of his runs but the target is a mile away from me, they wont let me go any closer :(

[GyRob]

he shot rockets too they go with a loud crack.

[Steve Parr]

The Warthog uses a "chain gun", which doesn't normally eject casings and, if it did, it wouldn't space them out evenly...

Steve

[GyRob]

no they do not eject the casings any more they use to .
i will catch up with this post tomorrow .
Thanks for help
Rob.

[dlove]

If the shutter speed you took it at is correct, than they are rounds from the gun. The gattling gun it uses has been limited to 2100 round per minute, so the spacing is about right. The plane collects the shell casings back into the drum, so as to not drop them all over the ground, and onto friendly troops heads. They are actually collected and turned in as scrap metal. As an OT the gun was originally a two speed rig, 2100, or 4200 rounds per minute. They limited it to the lower speed, and a burst of no more than three seconds, because there was so much gas produced by the shells going off, it was oxygen starving the engines and stalling them out.

[CyberDyneSystems]

Steve,. it's not a chain gun,. it's a true Gatling gun,..

Chain guns have one barrel,. with multiple chambers in a revolving cylinder... the cylinder is chain driven.. Much of the confusion stems from "DOOM" where he game makers mislabeled there "minigun" a Cahin gun.

The Ammo and shells are under constant pressure in feed tubes linked to the huge ammo drium,.. the spent casings follow a second tube and are returned right back into the drum.

Thus all shells are collected,. none expelled. This is true of most any aircraft gun made in the last 40 years. A spent casing in a jet intake would be bad.

[CyberDyneSystems]

Oopps,. dlove was faster..

http://members.bellatlantic.net/~vze2hdzu/pics/welcome.gifto the forum! :)

[rbush83]

It just struck me as hilarious that you use a sad face to describe the feeling you get from not being able to get closer to the line of fire of a 2100rpm cannon.

[dlove]

Also here's an interesting fact. Each round from the gun weighs more than a pound and is traveling around 3600 feet per second. Talk about kenetic energy. No wonder they call it the Tank killer

[Citizensmith]

Chain guns have one barrel,. with multiple chambers in a revolving cylinder... the cylinder is chain driven.. Much of the confusion stems from "DOOM" where he game makers mislabeled there "minigun" a Chain gun.


So does the double barrel shotgun in Doom2 become more of a gatling then? :)

[jukas]

If I remember right it was the A10's the generated quite a bit of controvery during the first Gulf War. They were firing depleated uranium rounds generating concerns about half life of material left on the battlefield.

[CyberDyneSystems]

Indeed jukas,. the A10 ammo ususe a depleted uranium "core" as a penetrator,.. it goes through armor like butter. Originally Tungsten Carbide was used in this type of ammo,. (though I can't say if it was ever used oin the 30mm Avenger) but carbide is exceeedingly costly.. and hard to make. Where as cast off uranium.. well...

"Gulf War Syndrome" has been linked often to the rounds of the A10,. atomized on impact,. it seems the obvious culprit as the similarities between the "syndrome" and radiation poisoning are remarkably similar.

[Jon Foster]

Good shots!

Jon.

[Az2Africa]

I did some work for the DOD in the 70s involving corrosion on the fuselage caused by combution gases when firing the 50mm guns aboard the A-10. That gun was definately firing and most likely those are rounds in the photo. Those things are .5 in. in dia. and about 4 in long and one will blow a hole in a wing that you could drive a VW through.

[Citizensmith]

"Gulf War Syndrome" has been linked often to the rounds of the A10,. atomized on impact,. it seems the obvious culprit as the similarities between the "syndrome" and radiation poisoning are remarkably similar.

Depleted uranium is pretty safe, its less the 0.711% U235. You can hold it in your hand with no concerns. I actually have, having found the counterweight from the wing of an aircraft. Having said that you could hold 100% pure plutonium in your hand and it would be safe.

The problem is, as was mentioned, it gets powderized on impact, or will form an oxidation surface (green salt) if left outdoors. Sure there isn't much radiation left in DU, but even so breathing it in to your lungs would never be a good thing. It may only be a statistically small increase in illness, but with the number of people exposed at various times it will certainly show up.

[Movinfr8]

Also here's an interesting fact. Each round from the gun weighs more than a pound and is traveling around 3600 feet per second. Talk about kenetic energy. No wonder they call it the Tank killer

if there are any IPSC shooters in the room that makes major caliber 173 times over!:) (major cal.=average .45 auto load, or bullet weight in grainsXfeet per second=145,000or more) .
Norm

[dispatchermike21]

The rounds also explode on contact, it's very cool to hear and see. ( I am a retired Cavelry scout US Army ) I got to see this a few time in the desert at FT Erwin in CA. you can't hear these planes coming up behind you till they are over the top of you and if you were the enemy that's to damn late HU RA.

[Citizensmith]

I've an uncle who is a retired air force colonel. He actually got to play test pilot on these and so he loves them.

I also got to look over a very badly beaten up one at the former McClellan AFB several years back. It was used by the ground crew to practice combat repairs. They'd fix it up nice then take it out back, shoot it up and blow bits off it. Rince, repeat. The hangers where a load of these lived are still there at McClellan, even if a few of them are now used by a lawn and garden service. Its still interesting exploring them and looking at all the warthog paintings on the walls.

[Jackal]

It doesn't seem like those would be the actual rounds. Maybe somehow coincidentally you've got sensor dust all aligned in a row? haha!

Because the dots seem frozen perfectly and I really don't know if that shutter speed would even be able to freeze them as dots...

That smoke is from the canon firing of course. The canon on it can actually slow down the plane and cause it to stall if it's moving near stalling speeds.

P.S. I have a model of this plane that I made a while ago hanging in my room. I love this plane and it was my favorite in the flight sim called "Lock on"

[Roach711]

Great capture on the missle shot!

Da Roach

[lost]

Ok Time for a little math lesson.

If the bullet is traveling at 3600 feet per second and the shutter speed is 1/3200 of a second. At what point will the trains collide?

The bullet traveled 1.125 feet during the Shutter cycle. Formula that I used was x=3600*1/3200

I think my math is sound.

The has a diamater of 1.18 inches and is looks to be about 6 inches long.

Now lets figure out the spacing. Rate of fire is 3900 Rounds per minute. Thats 65 per second. Or 0.015384615 seconds between shots.

So 3600fps x 0.015384615 = ~55Feet between rounds in the air.

That does not account for the forward travel of the jet which will decrease the distance between shells.

Now we have some more info to base our opinions on.

[kawter2]

The has a diamater of 1.18 inches and is looks to be about 6 inches long.



I'm sorry, I blushed when i read it :O

[lost]

I was supposed to put a blank there for you to fill in. :)

[MrChevy]

Nice shots Rob and lots of information from everyone. Thanks for sharing these Rob!

[MazerRakhm]

If the bullet is traveling at 3600 feet per second and the shutter speed is 1/3200 of a second. At what point will the trains collide?

Can I get a ticket for the train that is not going to collide with the stream of rounds?

[GyRob]

the closer i get to line of fire the better as long as i get the shot and not get shot lol.
thanks guys im sure they are shells now and thats a first for me :)
Rob.

[dlove]

Lost

You're close with your math. The gun is hydraulically driven and has two speeds, 2100 or 4200 rounds per minute. It was limited to 2100 rounds per minute (35 per second) because of the amount of exhaust gas produced at the high rate. The gas was causing oxygen starvation in the engines, causing them to stall. The rounds are about four inches long, and will be about 60 feet apart. From where the shot was taken and the height of the aircraft, gyrob caught the proverbial golden bullet, cool

[lost]

I read in a couple places that it no longer has a selectable rate of fire. Now it is set at 3900 rounds per minute. But I could be wrong.

[tacos3]

Assume for a second that the shutter was 1/3200, the shells are traveling at 3200 fps. Doesn't that mean that the bullet image would appear to be 1ft long and not appear as a "dot" on an image. For a projectile traveling at 3200 fps to appear as a dot, you'd need a really fast shutter....

Or maybe i'm just looking at this wrong....

[lost]

Nope Your 100% correct tacos3. That is the only thing that makes this picture look doctored. My calculations figured the projectile would have traveled 1.125 feet. Add to that the actual size of the projectile it should appear to be 1.5 feet long and 1.18 inches tall.

I am not saying that it is doctored. But if it is not doctored then something must be going on that I cannot figure out.

[dewmuw]

If I remember right it was the A10's the generated quite a bit of controvery during the first Gulf War. They were firing depleated uranium rounds generating concerns about half life of material left on the battlefield.

I think the controversy was also due to the death of 9 British troops that were fired upon by an A10.

[Buttkicker]

The Fast jet Pilots make jokes about the A10 pilots saying they go so slow

"they worry about bird strikes from behind"

[VegasGeorge]

Nice pics! I love the "Hog," and fly mine all the time. (In LockOn, of course!) :lol: