BIF - Revisiting Custom Function-4

[Ken Nielsen]

I am posting this thread because, as a newbie, C.Fn-4 seems to be the most difficult for me to get a hold on. C.Fn-4 seems to be the major concern for bif photography. My book for the XTi says C.Fn-4 is for the Shutter/AE lock button - WHAT? Does that mean the * button? Why don't they just come out and say that? Or, does it mean something else?

The manual leaves a lot to be desired in its description of C.Fn-4. Maybe someone here can explain C.Fn-4 in complete straightforward descriptive English.

Right now, I have my C.Fn-4 set to 1, or, AE lock/AF where I'm supposing the item before the '/' means shutter button pressed half-way down, and the item after the '/' means the * button for AF (I have the center point selected.) I am guessing this is true because, before pressing the shutter button at all, I can press the * button and get a center point Auto Focus on the subject (I am in AF Servo mode but that adds another level of complexity to this subject.) After I have the focus set, when the bird starts flying, I can follow with continuous shooting and the exposure is set when the shutter button was first pressed halfway down at the start of the continuous shooting. From what I understand, the exposure will stay set the same unless I release the shutter button and press it again to allow a new reading to take hold. Also, the focus will follow the subject because I am in AF Servo mode. Is that true? I would like to confine this thread to focus on Custom Function-4, but it is impossible not to also mention what is happening once these settings are in place.

Please someone, it would be nice to have detailed explanations of what each of these means and how they work by actual experience:

0: AF/AE lock
1: AE lock/AF
2: AF/AF lock, no AE lock
3: AE/AF, no AE lock

Deepest Gratitude,

Ken

[silvrr]

Custom function 4 just switches the focusing from the half depressed shutter to the back button.

If in One Shot it will focus and lock until you press the button again when it will focus again.

In continous shooting it will refocus inbetween shots, you should see the red light go on over the selected focus squares between shots, I am not sure if it takes new metering readings between shots.
In AI servo once pressed it will track whater ever your selected focus point is over until you let go.

Edit: the * button is on the back of your camera. There are two small circular buttons side by side. The left of the two is marked with a *. With custom function 4 on setting 1 this will be used to stop/start your auto focus.

[canonloader]

Shutter Button / AE Lock Button
C.Fn-04 controls how the shutter button and the Exposure Lock button operate. In its default mode, the shutter button is used for autofocus and autofocus lock and the AEL (*) button is used for exposure lock. Switching this function from 0 to 1 reverses this operation. The * button is then used for AF, and the shutter button is used to hold exposure.
Option 2 puts normal autofocus on the shutter button and puts autofocus lock on the * button. No exposure lock function is available in this mode.
Option 3 puts auto exposure on the shutter button and autofocus on the * button. This is similar to Option 1, but in Option 3, autoexposure lock is not possible. Some photographers prefer to use Option 1 for action such as birds in flight. By doing this with option 1, they can meter the scene, lock the exposure with a half-press of the
shutter button and activate autofocus with the * key.

[Ken Nielsen]

You guys should write for the manual. That is very clear, for a subject that needs to be understood in the context of shooting.

Thank You,

Ken

[canonloader]

Ha, I got it here, (http://www.naturescapes.net/072004/ej0704.htm) saved the PDF file so I have it. There's one for the Personal Functions also. :)

[Ken Nielsen]

Well, You knew where to look. That's exactly the same thing as being an 'Expert' on the subject.

: )

[canonloader]

Well, maybe, but I got to admit, trying to use the * button to focus drives me absolutely nuts. I could never do it. :)

[silvrr]

Well, maybe, but I got to admit, trying to use the * button to focus drives me absolutely nuts. I could never do it. :)

I liked the * button on my XTi but love the AF-On button on my 40D. Can't use it with the grip on though. (set to be on the * so I can seperate the focus with the grip)

I started using it track focus in motorcycle racing and then set/lock exposure and found it worked pretty well. Never went back.

[canonloader]

I tried it a few times, but ended up losing one too many good shots by pressing the shutter button 5 times before realizing I should be pressing the * button instead. Finally gave up. :)

[Ken Nielsen]

For birds, many of which are in the leaves, I can pick out that moment when the bird's head and eye are clear and 'spot' that center point using the *. I never worry about it past that point when the bird starts to fly off, because AF Servo mode takes over and keeps that bird's eye in focus (in theory.)

[canonloader]

I can do the same thing with the shutter button. Half way to achieve focus, when I start shooting by pressing all the way, it keeps focus the whole time the shutter button is down. One button to worry about. Using my thumb for that and my finger just seems un-natural. :)

[BradM]

I can do the same thing with the shutter button. Half way to achieve focus, when I start shooting by pressing all the way, it keeps focus the whole time the shutter button is down. One button to worry about. Using my thumb for that and my finger just seems un-natural. :)


Of course you know that with just using the shutter button method you can't seperate metering from focus and as your subject moves from differing lighting you will have to release the shutter and will lose focus on the subject to re-meter the scene.

However using the AF or * button you won't lose focus on the subject and can pause on the shutter having the camera re-meter the scene. This technique in a varied light and moving subject enviornment or circumstance is one of the best to improve captures and exposures.

[canonloader]

Brad, not true in Av Mode. Cause I can shoot a long sequence of shots in Av Mode, and since shutter speed can change, I assumed it was metering continuously, like it was focusing continuously.

Give me a few minutes to process a series of 4 shots and I will put them up with the EXIF that shows changing shutter speeds.

[canonloader]

OK, here are four shots shot in slow speed burst mode. 4 shots within 2 seconds, numbered sequentially by the camera, and you can see by the EXIF time stamp and the visual evidence of the bird in flight across the frame that they are shot all at once. The shutter speeds go 3200, 3200, 2500, 3200. In Av mode, I can only assume it is metering at each shot while the shutter button is held down the whole time.

1/3200...
http://www.picturelacrosse.com/birds09/herons09/gbh-1d2n2677-061909.jpg

1/3200...
http://www.picturelacrosse.com/birds09/herons09/gbh-1d2n2678-061909.jpg

1/2500
http://www.picturelacrosse.com/birds09/herons09/gbh-1d2n2679-061909.jpg

1/3200...
http://www.picturelacrosse.com/birds09/herons09/gbh-1d2n2680-061909.jpg

[Ken Nielsen]

Of course you know that with just using the shutter button method you can't seperate metering from focus and as your subject moves from differing lighting you will have to release the shutter and will lose focus on the subject to re-meter the scene.

However using the AF or * button you won't lose focus on the subject and can pause on the shutter having the camera re-meter the scene. This technique in a varied light and moving subject enviornment or circumstance is one of the best to improve captures and exposures.

I think I have been missing something: Do you hold down the * button while you are continuous shooting? (I've got it set to AF and set to Servo mode)? I have just been using it before shooting to get the focus point locked on, but have not been pressing it while shooting. Some minute detail on the correct process would be appreciated here.

[silvrr]

In AI servo and continous shooting keep the * button held down. Otherwise it will not try to track your subject between shots.

Edit: and you need to keep it held until you take your shot (in single shot) or are done with the continous shooting.

[canonloader]

And that was my problem with it. I mean, I think the concept is great, I am just unable to use it, or, walk and chew gum at the same time. For those who can manage it, good for you, but the shutter button does the same job if you have the touch. :)

[In2Photos]

And that was my problem with it. I mean, I think the concept is great, I am just unable to use it, or, walk and chew gum at the same time. For those who can manage it, good for you, but the shutter button does the same job if you have the touch. :)
For me the shutter button is too sensitive for AF. The * button FTW!

What I also like about using the * button is that in AI Servo if my subject isn't moving I can hit the button, obtain focus and let off, not worrying about the camera changing focus to something else.

[canonloader]

For me the shutter button is too sensitive for AF
I have heard that, but never really had any trouble holding the half press on mine. I had heard the 1D's were ultra sensitive, but mine have all worked fine.

[In2Photos]

I have heard that, but never really had any trouble holding the half press on mine. I had heard the 1D's were ultra sensitive, but mine have all worked fine.
Mine is super sensitive in H continuous, not quite as bad in low continuous.

[Ken Nielsen]

In AI servo and continous shooting keep the * button held down. Otherwise it will not try to track your subject between shots.

Edit: and you need to keep it held until you take your shot (in single shot) or are done with the continous shooting.

This might be the most significant post on this subject, for me anyway. Let me be sure I understand:

Before I shoot, I push down the * button when the AF point is over the eye of the bird as it is sitting. From what I read above, I no longer should do that but should wait until I'm ready to shoot: I guess I can't effectively use the remote firing shutter release either because I need to have my hand on the camera in order to push the * button - Holding the camera still, on the tripod. When the bird is taking off, in that fraction of a second I should: 1.) push down the * button and hold continuously (it will determine the focus point from whatever it grabs of the fluttering bird as I no longer can take the time to focus on the eye) and then, 2.) press the shutter button, which will read exposure and begin continuous shooting.

A lot is happening in a split second. So I would like ALL of your comments on this scenario. This, I believe, is the most important expose of all on shooting bif IMHO.

Ken

[In2Photos]

This might be the most significant post on this subject, for me anyway. Let me be sure I understand:

Before I shoot, I push down the * button when the AF point is over the eye of the bird as it is sitting. From what I read above, I no longer should do that but should wait until I'm ready to shoot:

No, that is still fine. After all you want the subject in focus so the lens has less room to travel once the bird moves. So go ahead and press the * button to gain focus on the bird.


I guess I can't effectively use the remote firing shutter release either because I need to have my hand on the camera in order to push the
* button - Holding the camera still, on the tripod.
True. When you use the * button you can no longer rely on a shutter release to control AF.


When the bird is taking off, in that fraction of a second I should: 1.) push down the * button and hold continuously (it will determine the focus point from whatever it grabs of the fluttering bird as I no longer can take the time to focus on the eye) and then, 2.) press the shutter button, which will read exposure and begin continuous shooting.

If you have not been pressing the * button to this point since your subject was stationary then yes, press the * button, hold it and start clicking the shutter too. The camera will select the AF point you have chosen to start and then should pass it off to others as the object moves across the viewfinder. If using the ROF it will start with the center point and then transfer to other points as needed.

[Ken Nielsen]

The camera will select the AF point you have chosen to start and then should pass it off to others as the object moves across the viewfinder. If using the ROF it will start with the center point and then transfer to other points as needed.

Beautifully explained. This is valuable information and instruction. Now, putting it into practice and learning from the results is next on my plate.

So far, the learning curve on this stuff hasn't been too bad. It's mostly a matter of getting out there and doing it.

Thank You,

Ken

PS: one other point on the choice of using the * or the shutter button for AF in Servo mode is that using the shutter button would allow me to use the remote fire button and I wouldn't have to put my hand on the camera, only one hand which controls the camera movement handle on the tripod and which also holds the remote fire trigger at the same time. Pressing that remote fire button halfway down would get me the AF and at the same time be held down as needed while the continuous shooting was going on. That does seem like a better arrangement than having to put my other hand on the camera which could easily cause more shake. I must also mention here, that the shutter button on my camera is easy to use in its two stages, halfway down is easy to do and control.

What do you think of this?

[canonloader]

On the contrary, I think both hands on the camera reduces shake, not increases it. I have used the remote shutter release this way, but why bother? As you say, your button is not that tender. But, I do use a grip action ballhead, not the regular ballhead.

[Ken Nielsen]

Would you post a link to the particular grip action ballhead you recommend?

I'm using a viscous dampened video tripod which gives strength and is adjustable to smooth out panning motion.

[canonloader]

Here it is, set up for the right hand in this picture (http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=140&A=details&Q=&sku=303591&is=REG&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation), but it is easily converted to left hand use, which is what you want. Had mine for over two years and will never use anything else.

Once it is on your tripod, imagine a door gunner in a WWII B-17. That's how you use it. Makes you very stable on your feet when you have one eye closed and up to the camera. :)

[Ken Nielsen]

So it's really strong? (I'm renting the 600mm in a few weeks.) I'm going to imagine door gunner on the B-17.

: )

[In2Photos]

So it's really strong? (I'm renting the 600mm in a few weeks.) I'm going to imagine door gunner on the B-17.

: )
For something like the 600mm I would go with a full Wimberley setup. That won't be cheap though. With the right legs it would be around $2000 and up!

[Ken Nielsen]

So this is how those lottery winners wind up losing it all in a short amount of time: They go into bif photography?

When I rent the 600mm, they will also rent me a adequate tripod set-up at the same time. If I end up buying the lens, it will be in October, and I for sure will finance it complete with the Wimberley set up and proper tripod along with it. I hear that particular lens works quite well with the 1.4 TC which keeps AF in full working order on that particular lens. I'll make sure this is true as I get closer to that date.

That will be then, This is now, and practicing with what I am learning about custom function 4 in this thread will be my focus over the next weeks ahead.

[canonloader]

No, the Grip action ballhead I use is not recommended for anything like the 600. That thing weighs far too much. My grip is recommended for no more than 11 pounds, which my 1D MkIIn and 400/5.6 fits.

I used it for the Orion ED80 telescope I used for digiscoping also, and while that was a very light tube compared to any telephoto camera lens, it was long. No ballhead is any good for anything that is long, light or heavy, as everything is balanced on one small ball, grip or no grip, and that pin point balance is not enough to stop the wiggle. Definately need a full wimberly for a 600/4 Canon lens. However, with the Wimberly, you can play door gunner too. :)

By the way, what camera body are you using?

[Ken Nielsen]

you can play door gunner too. :)

By the way, what camera body are you using?

Door gunner is all I want to do now. That would be like me sitting in a Wimberly (B-17) and having the camera in front of me facing out through the opening in the side of the plane. Imagine the bird's surprise when we fly right up to it and start shooting traveling along side at the same speed. Now that's first class panning!

The camera body is the same one I bought two years ago that has brought me to this point -> the Canon XTi. I know, It's not even pro-sumer, but I'm only being careful to invest in glass first. I can't tell yet which camera body is preferred. I do hear good comments about a 1D MK III or something like that, but I'm not body shopping yet, nor will I be for another year. I did get a good look at a 5D MK II in Los Angeles a few months ago. It was very nice for sure.

I went out today and tried the * key and you know, those birds are moving around so fast I don't know how anyone gets a AF 'fix point' on the bird at all. Today was a miserable failure for shooting, I deleted all of the shots right in the camera after I got home.

Foo

[canonloader]

After three years, I can't get in flight shots of small birds either. Even the bigger birds, like Robin or blackbird size are all but impossible unless you can get them from a distance in a clear sky and have the time to track them. Big birds, like eagles, pelicans, great blue herons and egrets are much easier to focus on and track.

Also, if you want to shoot birds, I strongly suggest you not get a lens with IS. While some people are able to get some nice bird shots with lenses like the 100-400, the IS unit in that lens takes up .9 seconds to spin up and drop into place before you can even shoot. By then, the bird is gone. And, most IS lenses don't work when panning anyway. The premier lens for birding close in is the 400/5.6. The 500/4 is another top bird lens, but more for birds a little further out that are sitting on the branch or flying in the open.

[Scottes]

The premier lens for birding close in is the 400/5.6. The 500/4 is another top bird lens, but more for birds a little further out that are sitting on the branch or flying in the open.
I have to wonder about the 400mm DO - though I knew someone with one of the originals, and he wasn't pleased with image quality. I kinda hope they have improved IQ on that lens, since it's got IS, and is small enough to hand-hold and move quickly.

Next up, and 1.5 times as heavy, might be the 300mm f/2.8 with a 1.4x TC. Not so hand-holdable because of the weight - I think that extra 2 pounds will mean a lot after a while.

I never could get BIF with the 500mm f/4, and I never enjoyed carrying it, and the tripod, around. I like hand-holding and moving quickly. The 500mm on a full Wimberley is nice, but it's nowhere near as maneuverable as the 400 f/5.6 L.

Maybe, one of these days, we'll get that lens with a current version of IS. I constantly dream about the mythical 400mm f/5.6L IS...

[canonloader]

I have to wonder about the 400mm DO
Isn't that also a much heavier lens? I say the 400/5.6 is a premier birding lens, because it is lighter, a prime, and does not have IS, therefore easier to hand hold and aim quickly. Although, even it is at the limit for comfortable walk around weight. An even better lens though is the 300/4 non-IS. An old lens no longer made, but it was blister fast, light weight, and shorter than the 400. Canon made a huge mistake when they took those off the assembly line. I recently sold mine, and wish I could have kept it. :)

[Scottes]

Yes, the 400mm DO is heavy, at 4.3 pounds. Nowhere near as light as the 400mm f/5.6... Wait, the 400mm f/5.6 L weighs 2.8 pounds according to B&H. That's not a huge difference, especially when you get f/4 and IS for that extra weight. (And an extra $4,000!!)

Even on a 1.6 crop camera, I often - almost always - wish for more length. There's no way I'd go birding with a 300mm unless I had a couple TCs in my pocket.

[canonloader]

I almost always had the sigma 1.4x mounted with the 300, for 420mm and AF. Now of course, I am using a 1.3x crop body with the 400/5.6 and the Sig 1.4x, but I retain AF. The new gear only works out to 58mm more, but I was using the 10Mp sensor on the 40D then, so it worked out about even with the 8Mp MkIIn, although, in real world use, I can crop the MkIIn pics 100% easy without noise creeping in and I could not do that with the 40D. ;)

It is heavier though. But then, so what? It's a 1D. LOL

[Ken Nielsen]

I like this last set of posts. It sounds like we're all out there with our wits and whatever we have to work with. I've invested in a shoulder bag for binoculars which I've taken to a canvas sail sewing shop to have the strap modified with 'D' rings and a clip to make the bag interchangeable from right to left side. What I do with this is put it on first, then a light jacket if need be, but most important is the camera goes on with neck strap around my neck and then the camera is carried next to my side with the lens pointing backward and in the bag. The bag has a comfortable wide strap the goes over the opposite shoulder and carries the weight of the camera and lens, keeping it ready to whip out and shoot. This has worked out to be an excellent help when going out shooting without the tripod. I've found in many cases that the 400mm can be hand held in good light at higher shutter speeds. Otherwise, I simply lock down the camera and lens onto the tripod and carry that over my shoulder. Anything longer than 3 city blocks distance or so is when I wish I had some kind of shoulder pad to carry a protect from the tripod poking into my collar bone.

I'm beginning to see that capturing bif means studying the area and finding a good spot to hold still and wait for a while. I'm not a fisherman, but some of birding reminds me of what it must be like to be a good fly fisherman.

[BradM]

I have to wonder about the 400mm DO - though I knew someone with one of the originals, and he wasn't pleased with image quality. I kinda hope they have improved IQ on that lens, since it's got IS, and is small enough to hand-hold and move quickly.

Next up, and 1.5 times as heavy, might be the 300mm f/2.8 with a 1.4x TC. Not so hand-holdable because of the weight - I think that extra 2 pounds will mean a lot after a while.

I never could get BIF with the 500mm f/4, and I never enjoyed carrying it, and the tripod, around. I like hand-holding and moving quickly. The 500mm on a full Wimberley is nice, but it's nowhere near as maneuverable as the 400 f/5.6 L.

Maybe, one of these days, we'll get that lens with a current version of IS. I constantly dream about the mythical 400mm f/5.6L IS...

Yes, the 400mm DO is heavy, at 4.3 pounds. Nowhere near as light as the 400mm f/5.6... Wait, the 400mm f/5.6 L weighs 2.8 pounds according to B&H. That's not a huge difference, especially when you get f/4 and IS for that extra weight. (And an extra $4,000!!)

Even on a 1.6 crop camera, I often - almost always - wish for more length. There's no way I'd go birding with a 300mm unless I had a couple TCs in my pocket.

Got a 400mm f/4 DO a couple months ago, and have to say the IQ is everything I would hope it would be, literally with a touch of post as good as my 500mm f/4 (primarily in post touching contrast).

Shooting it most often with a Canon 1.4x behind it and on the 50D. AF is very quick even with the 1.4X and it is barely noticablely heavier than the 100-400mm. Very sharp wide open when I first got it and just got better with some micro AF adjust with the lens alone and with the 1.4x behind it.

My GF wanted a longer focal length but is to petite to handle a 500mm f/4 so we went with the DO. And she is very happy, she will carry mounted on a CF tripod and Jobu sidemount over her shoulder for miles following me doing almost the same with the 500mm, 1.4x and 1D3.

It is a very good piece of glass and when I am using it I consider it a hand held lens for all day. Very well balanced on the 1D3. One of my favorite pieces of glass, only wish she would let me shoot it more often. ;)

Just a couple shots from it.

http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y259/Bradklr/Marmot400DO.jpg


http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y259/Bradklr/BOwl400mmDO.jpg

[Scottes]

Thanks for the little review Brad.

Time to start saving...

[In2Photos]

Maybe, one of these days, we'll get that lens with a current version of IS. I constantly dream about the mythical 400mm f/5.6L IS...
Or a 500 f/5.6 L IS! <sigh>

[canonloader]

There is a huge difference between the cost of a 400/5/6 and the next one up, the 500/4. A gap of $4000 is too much for most people. They could sell a lot of glass if they made a 500 in between those prices.

[Ken Nielsen]

"Got a 400mm f/4 DO a couple months ago"

Thanks for the review and the linked images.

Beautiful quality.

[Ken Nielsen]

While I am not getting the sharpness yet, This shot is bif of the most difficult to capture 'swishing high-speed bird." I am encouraged to stay with it because somehow, sometime, I'm going to make the right combination of moves that will stop that bird in its tracks.

http://www.studio10webgraphics.com/InternetPosts/bif_sparrow.jpg