Anyone use their D60 for weddings?

[gregarpp]

Anyone use the D60 for weddings?
How do you handle formal pictures that would require large prints.

Have a website?

[Inactive user 09]

you can see some shots I took with the D60 for a friends wedding. I was asked to capture the brides morning with her bridesmaids .... the exhibit is called "carolyn's day"

I'd appreciate your thoughts.

www.jaymz.ca

Cheers,

Jaymz!

[gregarpp]

They look great!!

Did you end up printing any of them?

[yavor73]

Remember that you will probably want to shoot in Raw mode if you really want stunning large prints. You have to develop a good workflow in extracting and correcting them. Of course, this means that you only get 15 shots per 128MB CF card. Also, you might shoot the set-ups in Raw mode- but do the candids in top-level Jpg. The time to write the Raws to the CF card would keep you from being able to shoot several candid's quickly. Also, it's critical that your White balance is right-on for the set-ups (daylight setting works well for strobes). I use two studio strobes in the first few pews- and fire them with the on-camera flash...which fills from the center. Just be sure that if you use strobes in light-slaved mode, that the sensors can "see" the camera's flash. You can also run a PC wire from the camera directly to one of the flashes. Many wedding photographers just use a big on-camera flash and 400ASA film. I find that using the studio strobes results in MUCH better images.
Side-notes: limit your use of diagonal composition in the candids. It's effective in moderation, but dizzying in over-use.
Shoot lots of prep shots of the bride. Focus on her. That's normally who is paying!

So, have fun!

Bob

[wcapald]

Not true.

I'm a professional wedding photographer using D60's and I have all my photographs printed on photographic papers on A2 size (16x22") double page spreads and they are stunning.......shooting on Fine JPEG. It means the workflow is easier and uses less card space. I typically shoot 800 images on a wedding....

[gregarpp]

I don't have a problem with RAW mode.
I have 512meg cards.

I also have strobes, but I use radio slaves.

I was thinking of doing candids with the digital.
And formal posed shots, that will end up as enlargments with my EOS-3 and film.

[DAVIDJAY]

I've just switched over this winter to shoot weddings with a d60 and have no regrets thus far. I've been using a 1gig microdrive but am planning to move into the CF game. Less worries about losing images with flash cards and I can still use the microdrive for anything beyond a gig that I need. jpeg set at fine is all you need unless someone wants a 20x30. So stick with the digital...don't bother fussing back and forth.

[Hawkeye12]

yavor73 wrote:
Remember that you will probably want to shoot in Raw mode if you really want stunning large prints. You have to develop a good workflow in extracting and correcting them. Of course, this means that you only get 15 shots per 128MB CF card. Also, you might shoot the set-ups in Raw mode- but do the candids in top-level Jpg. The time to write the Raws to the CF card would keep you from being able to shoot several candid's quickly. Also, it's critical that your White balance is right-on for the set-ups (daylight setting works well for strobes). I use two studio strobes in the first few pews- and fire them with the on-camera flash...which fills from the center. Just be sure that if you use strobes in light-slaved mode, that the sensors can "see" the camera's flash. You can also run a PC wire from the camera directly to one of the flashes. Many wedding photographers just use a big on-camera flash and 400ASA film. I find that using the studio strobes results in MUCH better images.
Side-notes: limit your use of diagonal composition in the candids. It's effective in moderation, but dizzying in over-use.
Shoot lots of prep shots of the bride. Focus on her. That's normally who is paying!

So, have fun!

Bob

do you even own a digital?
we're talking about a Canon D60 here, not a Minolta DiMage X.
128MB card in a D60 for a wedding?........LOL

[timbo]

I have shot weddings, commercial and children portraits for ten months with my D60 and made enlargements up to 16x20 and one 20x24! No complaints! Some thought I was shooting a larger format. Shoot RAW always! Over and under is corrected in Raw image converter software.

Good luck!

[Yavor74]

Yo Hawkeye-
This fellow is looking for help- unless you've caught the DVwarrier disease - don't waste bandwidth with making fun of others. You have no idea who you are talking to on the other end. Throwing mudballs only makes you look like an idiot.

Bob

[Canon-1Ds]

Quote gregarpp

"I'd appreciate your thoughts"

Very good, well exposed canded colourful shots but don't fall into the trap of too many canted arty farty shots these are easy to produce post production and gives you a greater choice for the couple to choose from.

wcapald shoots 800 images per wedding ! how do you have the time to go through so many pictures, overkill springs to mind, how do the medium format boys survive with the 16 rolls of film 192 shots. Digital has given us a new way to appreciate photography, 5 years ago no one would dream of shooting 300 shots at the best of weddings let alone 800.
Just because you can (take 800 shots) does not mean you have to, but you will soon sicken yourself as time goes on if you don't rein in your picture taking, let alone the drive space needed to store each wedding !
This has already happened to a wedding pro who could no longer stand the time he was taking in front of a computer, he has moved back to film and still winning Kodak gold awards.

[Hawkeye12]

Yavor74 wrote:
Yo Hawkeye-
This fellow is looking for help- unless you've caught the DVwarrier disease - don't waste bandwidth with making fun of others. You have no idea who you are talking to on the other end. Throwing mudballs only makes you look like an idiot.

Bob



hi Bob,
no i'm not throwing mudballs, i have just never heard of anyone suggesting the use of a 128MB CF card for shooting RAW.
my question to you in regards to what camera you are using is still of interest though.......

[Yavor74]

Hey Hawkeye-
I'm a D60 user... but I actually have not shot a wedding with it yet. I still don't trust it enough. I also saw that you have given constructive advice mostly on the other threads..so - nice going. I'm just a little gun shy after all the DVwarrier crap that was spewed.

I wasn't suggesting using a 128mb (512 is more like it), but was showing how few would fit on a card adequet for Jpg's.

I just did the grey card test to check if my 28-135 IS is actually 1 stop under- and it is. The 50mm, 100mm and 20mm are a half a stop under. I guess it's better than blowing the whites- but is going to mean batching a levels bump every time.

I'm working on a linear workflow chart for newbies...just had Roger critique it. I think we should keep a thread going for suggested workflows. Everyone has their method..and I'd love to see what others find best. Best I've found is Yarc+ with ARF2 to Pekka's LSbeta2- strong sharpening , add noise blur if High ISO.

so- take care-
Bob

[seanspeng]

Here is a wedding gallery by D30. The photographer is a real amateur. So I wouldn't doubt D60's capability.

http://pengs.us/gallery/list.php?exhibition=7

[photography By Evangelos]

Hi Gregarpp well to answer yor question I do for all of my wedding work. I do average 70 weddings a year so far the D60 works great. The only problem is on low light the A/F will not work all the time it keeps hunting and will not focus. So I use my Photogenic 1250 DR light to add some light to a room then it works ok. Do not use Microdrives you are taking a big risk and they have a high failure rate. Use only Solid State CF cards which can take the shock. I use Sand Disk Ultra 512MB cards I carry six of them at all times at my weddings. And in the past 9 months all is good in digital world. I have sold off all my film cameras bye bye film. Now the 1.6 X factor is driving me nuts and I would like a full 1:1 chip. Aslo a better A/F system and Better ISO at 400 and up would make this camera the best in class. I Shoot at the largest JEPG setting and I have made 16x20 and 11x14 all day long and they are tack sharp. I have made a few 20x30 prints and I use Photoshop 7.0 and sharpen it up and use some plug ins and no problems noted. I never made 20X30 with 35mm film now I can with digital. I think a new DIGITAL is on the way from canon. Which will fix the problems of the D60 I can't wait. The Price of the 1Ds is to much canon is crazy if they think the will sell many of them. With nikon users having 7 SLR bodys like the S2 and the KODAK Pro 14N canon users are at a disadvantage with only 3 SLR bodys. So I hope the new canon is as good as it needs to be. Three times are a charm so they say we will see. Good luck and have a great day. You can stop by my web sight all photos taken are with the D60.

[Hawkeye12]

Yavor74 wrote:
Hey Hawkeye-


I'm working on a linear workflow chart for newbies...just had Roger critique it. I think we should keep a thread going for suggested workflows. Everyone has their method..and I'd love to see what others find best. Best I've found is Yarc+ with ARF2 to Pekka's LSbeta2- strong sharpening , add noise blur if High ISO.

so- take care-
Bob


thanks for the understanding Bob. the workflow topic would be of great interest to all of us.

funny thing about the 28-135, some actually work better than others, but all the pics i've seen from this lens on a D60 have shown to be super sharp.
i'm looking for a 24-70L now to replace my 24-85.
i said i wouldn't, but the results from my 70-200L have gotten the best of me.
the wife wants me to shoot our nieces wedding so i'm a bit nervous about not having the right glass.

[carmeljo]

Thinking of going striclty digital---after shooting Weddings for over 25 years, on film. But looks like too much post work>>>to make enlargements on the PC>>deliver prints and CD~~~~~~

At present we do not offer reprints--we sell the negs/prints ----the bride & groom pay for the image and we charge by the hour. But would be nice to just hand them a CD of raw files and receive the same pay! No Processing... No Film!

But I think the consumers look at a CD as something "cheap"---a blank medium is pennies. So it may be difficult to charge for the latent image on a CD ==== equally to film/photograph theory at the same income..

CJOGO Crystal Studios

http://fp2k.redshift.com/cjogo/

http://fp2k.redshift.com/cjogo/c__joseph_gough.htm

[carmeljo]

"wcapald shoots 800 images per wedding ! how do you have the time to go through so many pictures, overkill springs to mind, how do the medium format boys survive with the 16 rolls of film 192 shots"

Still shooting 35mm--average 6-9 rolls of film for a 5 hour event.....but I "set-up" every shot, even my candids...we guarentee 33 images per roll---no wasting film--after 25 years ,,,we hope we know what the bride& groom are looking for.

cjogo


http://fp2k.redshift.com/cjogo/

[Rudi]

I use a D30 for weddings (and have shot a friend's wedding with his D60). I have had no complaints about the prints... :)

I have samples from the last wedding on my web page.

[Canon-1Ds]

[quote]carmeljo wrote:
Thinking of going striclty digital---after shooting Weddings for over 25 years, on film. But looks like too much post work>>>to make enlargements on the PC>>deliver prints and CD~~~~~~

At present we do not offer reprints--we sell the negs/prints ----the bride & groom pay for the image and we charge by the hour. But would be nice to just hand them a CD of raw files and receive the same pay! No Processing... No Film!

But I think the consumers look at a CD as something "cheap"---a blank medium is pennies. So it may be difficult to charge for the latent image on a CD ==== equally to film/photograph theory at the same income..

CJOGO Crystal Studios

The post work only becomes a problem if you go for overkill. ie. 800 shots per wedding..!!!
Most of the wedding pros in my neck of the woods use S2 or D60 with good results.

Don't go down the purist direction no one I know uses RAW for weddings in my books, picture wise,
the largest one off print (20*16) will easily stand 3072 * 2048 in fine JPEG mode...We all get bogged down by the technology and what the purists think, but you live in the real world and don't want to have to sit for hours converting all your shots from RAW mode.
OK the CD problem, you could ask your clients to view their prints at the studio on one of your monitors or present the CD in a DVD box as you would a wedding DVD and print their name, date etc. on the CD and on the DVD box...presentation goes a long way to disguise what may be relativly cheap to make. Remember they pay for your skill and time the rest is a bonus.

[henkbos]

I'm not that good in photography, but better in math: 800 pictures per wedding? One per minute is 60 per hour! Is the wedding night included? Do you guys eat when you're on assignment?
Most difficult is probably how do you choose the best ones for the happy couple (if they can still see after you have fired 800 flashes at them).

[Rudi]

Well, I'd have to agree that the most I've ever taken was about half that (400 or so), BUT...

... in parts, I tend to take a lot more than 1 photo per minute! :D

...and on some jobs I don't get to eat, either! :(

[Hawkeye12]

Rudi wrote:
Well, I'd have to agree that the most I've ever taken was about half that (400 or so), BUT...

... in parts, I tend to take a lot more than 1 photo per minute! :D

...and on some jobs I don't get to eat, either! :(

Rudi, what lens would you suggest for shooting a wedding?

[Rudi]

I used to use my "old" 28-135IS most of the time, but would now use my "new" (actually older than the 28-135, but new to me) 28-70 f/2.8 L, or the new 24-70L if I had one. :) I also used a borrowed 17-35L once instead of my EF 20mm f/2.8, which I use a lot of the time. I like to use the 70-200 f/2.8 L for candid portraits at the reception, but find that I don't use it as much as I thought I would... (not at weddings, anyway).

[Hawkeye12]

thanks a lot Rudi.........i am on 2 waiting lists for the 24-70L already. seems to be a shortage just like anything else Canon makes that is in demand.

[gregarpp]

Do you print your own?

Or do you send them out to be printed?

[wcapald]

Just so you know some of our american counterparts are shooting more than 800 images on weddings!

The one I shot 800 images at was a castle in Scotland.

I started at 9.30am with the groom. Then did a shoot with two soft top vintage bentleys. Next was the bride getting ready. Short rest before going on to the church to do the arrivals, with about 120 guests. Loads of candid stuff and no formals. The vicar also allowed any photography we wanted inside the old church.

Departures included a planned shoot of the two bentleys with confetti everywhere it was great.

Then on to the castle for a champagne garden party reception - wonderful light... covered the speeches then had a serious break for two hours before covering the 1st dance.

We finished at about 10pm for several malt whiskeys.

Everything was shot on fine JPEG and we use microdrives. There is no need for RAW if you know how to use the D60. Storage would be prohibitive, workflow too long, and quality is excellent for 16x22 prints from Fine JPEG.

Of the 800 we shot the B&G selected 400 7x5' s and then chose 100 photographs to go into a GraphiStudio Wedding Book. Double page spread in these books is 16 x 22" for those who are not familiar with GraphiStudio Books.

The quality of the D60 images is superb, pin sharp.

GraphiStudio also personally congratulated me for one of the best wedding books in 2002, both in terms of my photography and location.

And what did I charge - just short of £3000 or $4800.

Not a bad days work.

And guess what I have almost 30 booked already for 2003.

So the message is - get on the bus and enjoy the ride and join the elite photographers who know how to use these new tools to shoot big weddings....

Wayne

[Rudi]

wcapald wrote:
So the message is - get on the bus and enjoy the ride and join the elite photographers who know how to use these new tools to shoot big weddings....

Wayne

Wayne,

I couldn't agree more! I feel I can do a better job for the client with digital than I could ever do with film. The fact that I have complete control over all the image manipulation before (and sometimes during) printing has a lot to do with that! :D

... and I have no hard and fast rule about how many shots I take per wedding, I just seem to average around 400... :)

[Canon-1Ds]

I have been in the Scottish wedding scene for over 15 years and know who produces what...the chaps who are the cream of the crop are still using Hblads, Bronicas or have moved back to film, you must be the exeption.
800 shots is OTT in my books, very few wedding photographers now bother with the guests they leave that to the video.
How much of your time after the wedding was spent sifting through 800 pictures, I calculate that 800 D60 pics is 2 GB of storage and being a true pro stored on 2 computers, just as well HD space is cheap and plentifull.

[wcapald]

If you really take a look at where the new ideas are coming from they aren't the hasselblad or bronica brigade. For a start they couldn't move fast enough.

If you look at two of Australia's leading Master Photographers in 2002 presenting at WPPI in Las Vegas next week they are totally digital, dropped film 12 months ago. And they charge £4000-£5000 for a wedding in the middle of Sydney.

The slide rule is dead, we use IPAQ's for calculators...

[Canon-1Ds]

Quote Wcapald

"If you really take a look at where the new ideas are coming from they aren't the hasselblad or bronica brigade. For a start they couldn't move fast enough.

If you look at two of Australia's leading Master Photographers in 2002 presenting at WPPI in Las Vegas next week they are totally digital, dropped film 12 months ago. And they charge £4000-£5000 for a wedding in the middle of Sydney.

The slide rule is dead, we use IPAQ's for calculators..."

Reply...

Funny how one of Scotlands most coveted wedding photographers went from S2s back to film after a year thinking Digital was the be all and end all... 600 shot weddings the lot...just like you.
Seems you are impressed with "How much you can get for a wedding" £4000-£5000 weddings are one offs and in my opinion fairy stories to impress the likes of you, very few customers in the UK will spend this on a photographer, they will split the cost between Photo-video. People are not stupid when they book a photographer above £1000 they want quality NOT QUANTITY.
£1400-£2500 for a top wedding photographer is the norm...THE AVERAGE WEDDING NO FRILLS WORKING CLASS WILL PAY £600. (These prices are less reprints).
I like yourself work in the top end of the market place and use digital, I don't have the same outlook as you fortunatly, there is a place for film and digital. It seems to me you like to hurry along and get as many shots in the can as possible, not the calibre I want to aspire to.
Mabe your destiney lies in video, 25 frames per second,
you could give them an 6 hour video !

[wcapald]

You are out of touch big time...

I charge £2500 for my wedding coverages and I have 30 booked this year already....

[wcapald]

And just in case you can't read...

GraphiStudio also personally congratulated me for one of the best wedding books in 2002, both in terms of my PHOTOGRAPHY and location.

I have clients moving their wedding dates in 2004 to book me as their photographer. Ask yourself why?

There are people that do £600 weddings and those that shoot £2500 weddings, because of the style of their photography not how much we charge. Seems you have a hang up about it. Every TV has an on/off button on it, everyone can choose what they want to watch or not..... if you don't like digital shoot on film but don't lecture people who are successful at what they do!

[Canon-1Ds]

Quote Wcapald

"don't lecture people who are successful at what they do! "

I only have your word for this...As usual you miss the whole point...Who mentioned I don't like digital...you assume far too much, I seem to have your attention, you come accross as a "knowitall", Mr Digital...As you have no idea who I am you are not in any position to lecture me or my professionalism.
Nor are you in a position to call into question the professionalism of top fellow wedding photographers...film or digital. Until the 1Ds there has not been an D-SLR camera produced to match medium format for quality...You seem to relish the fact that you can take 800 shots at a wedding...I think this says more about you as a wedding photographer than anything else you care to have mentioned...I was only making some general perceptions but you seem to have taken it personally.

QUOTE...

"GraphiStudio also personally congratulated me for one of the best wedding books in 2002, both in terms of my PHOTOGRAPHY and location. "

www.graphistudio.co.uk

Lets not get carried away here Graphi bind and sell wedding books to...........wedding photographers...they have good PR...don't see any of your pics in their gallery !

Just out of interest where do you work from (England, Scotland etc.)

[Rudi]

The point you made was that, and I quote:

"I have been in the Scottish wedding scene for over 15 years and know who produces what...the chaps who are the cream of the crop are still using Hblads, Bronicas or have moved back to film, you must be the exeption."

In fact, as far as wedding photography is concerned, the trend here (Australia), and in the US as well, is towards digital, and with good reason. There are more photographers moving into digital than back toward film. I am among them.

You assumed that just because a handful of Scots moved back to film (I have to take your word for that), that everyone else must be an exception. So what? They also wear skirts (and they get upset when someone calls it that! :) ), and it's damn cold in Scotland, so the Scots don't always do the logical thing... :D

[Canon-1Ds]

Rudi, unlike our American cousins the Scots ar'nt easily offended and can take the odd joke or too.

Perspective...

One top wedding photographer went from a year with digital back to film.

The majority of wedding photographers in Scotland during 2002 were using medium format or 35mm film.

Those who were using digital were taking far too many pictures and admitting to it.

Most wedding photographers using digital are unhappy at the amount of time spent post production ie. in front of the computer.

Main fear with all pro digital photographers is corrupt CF card letting them down.

Comment...

I am in no doubt when the technology gets better and lets not kid ourselves D-SLRs are in their infancy...when more full frame cameras hit the market and the reliability factors get better we will see a far greater uptake of Pro-Digital.
Certain people in this forum can't see past their nose and forget there is life beyond digital. Many people both amateur and pro are more than happy with film.
Digital so far has made certain photographers sloppy, instead of getting their head in gear and treating the subject matter the same as they would with 36 exposures, they seize the new oppertunity of 204 exposures per 512 CF card and reinvent the wheel calling it "Reportage". Don't get me wrong theres nothing wrong with shooting extra but extra with a genuine purpose in mind from what I have witnesed so far the digital-pro is becoming a glorified wedding guest.
Good photography requires basic rules, we all learned our skill thanks to film, we must never loose sight of that. Embrace the technology with the same skills learned from film don't snap for the sake of it.

[Rudi]

Canon-1Ds,

The only thing that I disagree with you on is the fact that most wedding photographers are sticking with, or going back to film. Towards the end of last year I saw a lot of wedding photographers seriously taking up digital. And it seems to be the progressive thinkers, the guys (or gals) who shoot a little differently, the ones on the cutting edge of the art.

I agree that digital should not replace basic photography skills. FWIW, I used to shoot around 10 rolls of film (around 360-400 frames) before taking up digital. Now... I average around 400 digital exposures (maybe a few more, if you take into account the handful that I delete immediately because I can see straight away that they are no good).

My keeper ratio is slightly higher, because of the fact that I delete the dozen or so which are no good. Other than that, my shooting habits haven't really changed at all. Just so you know where I'm coming from: I use a handheld incident meter for the really important shots, because I believe in getting the shot "right" the first time. Reviewing the LCD is a great backup, but there's nothing better than doing it right in the first place... :)

[Canon-1Ds]

Good to here Rudi...keep up the good work...!

[brian k]

Good photography is about quality...not quantity

Excellent point but also common sense if you care about your business and reputation goes along the lines of
"Never bolt a door with a boiled carrot"
I'll carry on working in Medium format but also adding some candids with my D60 until I can speed up the post production side then possibly, i'll consider doing all my Weddings on digital.