Question 'bout LIGHTING

[Rockrz]

OK, so I'm experimenting with my new Canon PowerShot SX1IS
and I'm finding out that I really need better lighting that the flash
that is built in to this camera

So, which is the best way to go...buy one of those big honkin
flashed that fits on top of your camera ($400 - $500)

Or, would it be better to get a couple of flashed that go on top
of a stand that automatically know when to flash right as you
are taking the shot.

BTW...how in the heck do these work anyway?

[gonzogolf]

I dont think you are ready for off camera flashes on a stand that go off automatically (its not that simple). Look for a canon 430ex, or 430exII. Learn how to bounce it and control it while its on your camera. Then work your way up. If you are serious about advanced lighting you might want to look at stepping up to one of the rebel dslrs too.

[Rockrz]

OK, so meanwhile...what am I supposed to do about getting better lighting?

The product I'm photographing is coming out a little dark on another angle
where it's not possible for the flash on my camer to illuminate because I can't
get light onto that angle unless I have another lighting source.

I mean, the pics I got look OK...but they would look much better if I could
get lighting (that's the same as my camera's flash) on to other angles other
than the angle of looking through my camera forward

And, "if I'm not ready"....when will I be?

I figure since I have the money and the desire
to learn...I just need tips on what to buy

[gonzogolf]

Get the 430exII ($250 or so), and off camera flash cord ($30 or so). With the off camera cord you can move the flash away from the camera and still retain auto exposure.

[Rockrz]

The off camera flash cord I found at http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=details_accessories&A=kitInfo&Q=&sku=498744&is=REG&friendly=Canon_1950B001_OC_E3_Off_Camera_Shoe.html
says it only works with Canon EOS cameras.

My Canon PowerShot SX1IS has the EOS processor, so does this count.

I actually have a shoe mount flash already, although it's not the highest
priced one that is available, but it's good for learning

So, all I would need right now is an off camera flash cord
that is compatible with my Canon PowerShot SX1IS

[gonzogolf]

what shoe mount flash do you have? You need one that allows you to use the ettl II system, plus some older flashes have the potential to harm your camera electrical system.


I'd recommend getting your cord here http://www.flashzebra.com/ttlcords/ettlcords/index.shtml The owner is a member of this forum and a stand up guy, great products at a great price.

[mufutau55]

You can get a longer one for much cheaper (look at link below), and then just buy a lightstand (about $19) to mount the flash, and an umbrella and of course a flash.

This is 16 feet cord:
http://www.flashzebra.com/products/0123/index.shtml

This is 24 feet cord:
http://www.flashzebra.com/products/0125/index.shtml

Impact Lightstand:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/359885-REG/Impact_2205_Light_Stand_Black_.html

Umbrella Adapter:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/298709-REG/Impact_3117_Umbrella_Bracket.html

An Umbrella:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/423625-REG/Impact_UBBW45_45_Convertible_Umbrella.html

With the above you will be ready for off camera lighting, also with Flash of course.

Mufutau

The off camera flash cord I found at http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/controller/home?O=details_accessories&A=kitInfo&Q=&sku=498744&is=REG&friendly=Canon_1950B001_OC_E3_Off_Camera_Shoe.html
says it only works with Canon EOS cameras.

My Canon PowerShot SX1IS has the EOS processor, so does this count.

I actually have a shoe mount flash already, although it's not the highest
priced one that is available, but it's good for learning

So, all I would need right now is an off camera flash cord
that is compatible with my Canon PowerShot SX1IS

[runninmann]

Does the OP's camera have E-TTL II? Are the Speedlights fully compatible with it as far as having all of the flash features available?

I thought that Speedlights were only compatible with the 'G' cameras and DSLRs.

[Titus213]

It would appear from DP Review (http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canonsx1is/) that your camera supports any EX hot shoe flash. I would recommend the 430EX as an excellent on camera flash unit, fully automatic with your camera, and the head tilts and rotates for bouncing.

You can add an off shoe cord later if you want to get the flash a bit off camera.

[runninmann]

If the OP is doing product shots, perhaps cheap constant lighting and a softbox are better options. OP, what kinds/sizes of products are you shooting?

[runninmann]

It would appear from DP Review (http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/canonsx1is/) that your camera supports any EX hot shoe flash. I would recommend the 430EX as an excellent on camera flash unit, fully automatic with your camera, and the head tilts and rotates for bouncing.

You can add an off shoe cord later if you want to get the flash a bit off camera.Thanks, Mr. Norwood.

[gonzogolf]

If the OP is doing product shots, perhaps cheap constant lighting and a softbox are better options. OP, what kinds/sizes of products are you shooting?


Tried to talk him through that in another thread without much succcess.

[Rockrz]

what shoe mount flash do you have? You need one that allows you to use the ettl II system, plus some older flashes have the potential to harm your camera electrical system
It's the Zeikos "Digital Professional Slave Flash" that "works with all Digital and SLR Cameras" that I picked up for the bargain price of only $29.99
I know, it's a cheapy but it may be good to learn with

I'd recommend getting your cord here http://www.flashzebra.com/ttlcords/ettlcords/index.shtml The owner is a member of this forum and a stand up guy, great products at a great price.
Now, all of those just say that they are for Canon cameras.
Do they work with my camera?

Umbrella Adapter:
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...a_Bracket.html
I already have a tri-pod, and this appears to enable you to
connect your flash to a tr-pod, right?

It would appear from DP Review that your camera supports any EX hot shoe flash. I would recommend the 430EX as an excellent on camera flash unit, fully automatic with your camera, and the head tilts and rotates for bouncing.
Thanks for the link...

If the OP is doing product shots, perhaps cheap constant lighting and a softbox are better options. OP, what kinds/sizes of products are you shooting?

Just small card payment terminals. I thought of that, but after experimenting
yesterday I am getting great pictures...I just need lighting from another
angle to illuminate the item a little more and I think it'll provide a good image
May look into that at some point in the future though

[runninmann]

Tried to talk him through that in another thread without much succcess.Do you happen to have a link to that thread?

EDIT: Posted before seeing OP's post above mine.

[Rockrz]

Another question...when running a second flash, does the flash on your
camera work also so you have two flashes going at once?

That's what I'm needing to do as that would create two lighting sources

[gonzogolf]

I dont know anything about that other flash. Its certainly not going to use the internal exposure system of your camera, you might be able to set your camera up to use it manually.

[Underscore]

Just curious if you have read the stickies first in this area of the forum. I highly recommend it. They will answer quite a few questions.

[Rockrz]

OK, so here's a sample pic that would be used on a webpage...
http://www.geocities.com/picserv_2000/pob_209x300_gif.gif

Doesn't this look like it needs more lighting from the
left side to brighten this up a little more?

[gonzogolf]

OK, so here's a sample pic that would be used on a webpage...
http://www.geocities.com/picserv_2000/pob_209x300_gif.gif

Doesn't this look like it needs more lighting from the
left side to brighten this up a little more?

No image

[Rockrz]

No image

You lost me...are you saying you cannot see the picture I posted?
I can see it just fine...

[gonzogolf]

I dont see any image or link to an image on the forum.

[mufutau55]

I can surely see the image. I am not sure if you need any other lighting on the side.
Also try and read this thread: http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=281524

Mufutau

You lost me...are you saying you cannot see the picture I posted?
I can see it just fine...

[Rockrz]

I am not sure if you need any other lighting on the side

Maybe it's just personal taste, but this eeems to be needing more
light to me. the terminal itself seems like it's too dark.

So, I guess I need to get my act together and buld a light box.

I'll read through that thread to see what kind of fabric is needed
and what kind of light bulbs are needed.

Building the frame itself shouldn't be a big problem at all.
Thanks for all the replies...

[gonzogolf]

Now that I can see the photo, I dont think the lighting needs to be changed. It just needs a little post processing in photoshop to adjust the levels, contrast, and sharpness.

[Rockrz]

Well, I seeing that I may need to break down and buy
some good software to processing images. I've never
used photoshop. I've been using Photo Impact (by Ulead)
but to be honest I don't know much about it other than
normal newbie functions.

If most folks here are using Adobe Photoshop Lightroom
then maybe that's what I oughtta get so I can at least
get help learning how to use it.

[gonzogolf]

Just google lightroom tutorial there will be tons of youtube videos showing you how to do various things.

[Underscore]

If you want to learn about how to light products, I suggest some DVDs from Dean Collins who was the paramount leader in understanding how to light subjects and control light.

When something is black, you have to bring out shape through reflective surfaces, not artificially increasing exposure since proper exposure of black is about 3-4 stops below 0 or 18% gray.

[Rockrz]

Excellent, thanx. Nothin like learning from someone who
has experience and the ability to teach

[Underscore]

Just google lightroom tutorial there will be tons of youtube videos showing you how to do various things.

This is nice, but learning why to do certain things vs. just doing them is much better. I suggest purchase books on color correction from Dan Margulis and read, read, read.

Knowing why you want to make a certain edit is more important than the photo editing itself, else you frankly never know when you are done, or how to get to where you think you are going.

[Rockrz]

....else you frankly never know when you are done, or how to get to where you think you are going.

I find most anything I do that is creative, I never seem to be happy with it.
Always feeling like some other tweak would make it better...but that's
probably just me not ever being satisfied. Sometimes when you aren't
sure of what to do next you just have to go with "decent" until to get
more experience and work under your belt in any endevor.

I do agree though that knowing why something is done is key to doing
things effectively to accomplish best results

[Underscore]

Yeah, it took me a while to learn how to do enough things to know when I had taken a photo where I wanted it.

After you learn more tools, both in the digital darkroom and lighting, then can make your vision reality; else, you simply have to learn more to get there.

[Rockrz]

After you learn more tools, both in the digital darkroom....

Is this like processing the photos on your computer after you've taken them?

I've been looking at Adobe Lightroom 2

Is this pretty much the thing to use these days?

[Underscore]

Is this like processing the photos on your computer after you've taken them?

I've been looking at Adobe Lightroom 2

Is this pretty much the thing to use these days?

LR 2 is what I use because frankly, I was using LR when it was a beta before its first version was sold; so I am comfortable with it.

You can get away with adobe bridge that accompanies PS, so it really is a matter of what you like in terms of organizing and editing. You just have to experiment.

Yeah, the digital darkroom is photo editing on the computer then sending off to print.

[Rockrz]

Yeah, the digital darkroom is photo editing on the computer then sending off to print.

"Digital Darkroom" sounds like a new punk rock club er something :cool:
I don't guess they have punk rock anymore...who knows.

I suppose I need to download the demo version of LR2 and see
if I can figure it out. Might have to break down and read the
Help Files :eek:

[Underscore]

"Digital Darkroom" sounds like a new punk rock club er something :cool:
I don't guess they have punk rock anymore...who knows.

I suppose I need to download the demo version of LR2 and see
if I can figure it out. Might have to break down and read the
Help Files :eek:

If you are not one that can read a tutorial book or help files and figure things out, you will either get frustrated and miss out on the benefits of what these programs have to offer, or spend a bunch of money on tutors.

A nice middle ground is to purchase DVD tutorials. Often, these guys tutoring provide how to setup the program before taking you through its practical application.

[Rockrz]

I know. I use many different software titles for business and I mostly jump right in
and start using the program to learn basic functions without needing to read
anything...and then, I'll start getting into the Read Me Help Files to learn more
advanced functions, that and seeing what questions I can get answered from
talkboards which is usually very helpful.

[drh681]

I know. I use many different software titles for business and I mostly jump right in
and start using the program to learn basic functions without needing to read
anything...and then, I'll start getting into the Read Me Help Files to learn more
advanced functions, that and seeing what questions I can get answered from
talkboards which is usually very helpful.

for learning photoshop or lightroom there are many ways to go...
free tutorials posted by fellow users, the previously mentioned DVDs ( which can be very expensive ) and dedicated tutorial sites such as: www.lynda.com (http://www.lynda.com)
I used this when I purchased Photoshop CS4 ( it was free for a month :) a pre-order special )
the regular price is something like 25$ a month for access to any tutorials they post. They have them for LR, CS4, and psElements, as well as many other programs.
( be advised, I think on-line tutorials have a "snooze ray" built into them.:D )

[Underscore]

I attest that Lynda.com is fantastic. Chris Orwig and Deke McClelland are excellent tutors.

[aidanblake]

Good info guys

[Titus213]

Lynda.com is great for photoshop. You can do a one month subscription to try it out. Cheap and effective education.

For that matter they have lots of free stuff to check out too.

[Rockrz]

So it's still up in the air...which is preferred the most???

Photoshop, or Lightroom?

[Underscore]

So it's still up in the air...which is preferred the most???

Photoshop, or Lightroom?

Lightroom is not designed to take the place of PS, and vice versa. LR is a combined photo organization, RAW converter, and presentation/printing software; while photoshop is a powerful manipulation tool to address a myriad of tasks that LR cannot.

If you need PS and don't want to fork out the dollars for LR, then get PS and use bridge as your organizer, viewer and RAW converter.