D30/D60 to 1D Experiences

[Terry]

I am considering selling my D30 and buying a 1D. The primary reason is because of shooting my son's baseball games. Last summer I had a fair amount of luck getting some decent images with my D30, using Auto Focus and single shot settings for both focus and drive mode.
For the most part I had to pre-focus on either home plate or second base, hold the shutter half way down and wait for some action to occur at that spot. When I tried to quickly capture action that was going on elsewhere, focusing in time to get the shot I wanted was very much hit and miss (mostly miss).

The other issue was that once I took a shot and let up on the shutter button (still had my eye to the viewfinder), and wanted to take a second or third shot, I couldn't because the camera was writing the prior image to the compact flash card.

My understanding is the Auto Focus on the 1D is much faster (not sure about accuracy), and the 1D will allow an image to be taken while it is in the middle of writing to the compact flash card, assuming the image buffer isn't full.

I only want one body, so I plan on selling my D30 if I get the 1D. The problem is I also shoot landscape and nature images, more than my son’s sporting events. I like the quality I get from the D30 and would not want to compromise that for speed.

I am interested in feedback from anyone who started with a D30 or D60, and then upgraded to a 1D. Can you compare the two in terms of what you like/dislike about each, image quality, handling and performance, workflow, etc.? If you still own both, under what conditions do you use one over the other? Any other comments, advice, or things to consider?

All comments will be greatly appreciated, as I'm currently undecided as to whether I should keep the D30 or sell it and get the 1D. Please don't suggest a 1Ds... too expensive for my blood... unless you have one that you want to sell for around $4,300 :)

Thanks.

(This inquiry has also been posted on the robgalbraith forum. My apologies to those of you who may have already read this or replied in the other forum).

[philw]

Well I don't completely qualify, but I just stopped using a D30 after two years, I played with a 1D, and I've shot about a hundred pictures with my 1Ds.

>For the most part I had to pre-focus [...]

I'm not convinced that doing the same thing won't be necessary with the 1D/1Ds autofocus. Certainly it seems faster, and there are more little squares to point at things. Today I was using my 100-400 in low light and allowing the camera to choose the focus points was a bad idea; better to select one so you can be sure. Probably wider lenses would work better; some of those clever sensors don't get a look in at f4.5.

If you want it to be really snappy you probably want a 1D/1Ds and an f2.8 lens or better.

>The other issue was that once I took a shot and let up on the shutter button (still had my eye to the viewfinder), and wanted to take a second or third shot, I couldn't because the camera was writing the prior image to the compact flash card.

That's lack of buffer management.... you just need to know when to take your finger off and when not to. The 1Ds has the same problem, as the files are huge. The 1D, from what I recall, can run at 8fps (which sounds really funny to listen to) all day long, so you won't have a problem with that one.

>I only want one body, so I plan on selling my D30 if I get the 1D. The problem is I also shoot landscape and nature images, more than my son’s sporting events. I like the quality I get from the D30 and would not want to compromise that for speed.

I didn't particularly like the CCD on the 1D. As fas as image quality is concerned, I guess that's sujective, but I wasn't incllined to "upgrade" from my D30 to a 1D. To me the 1D was a tank of a camera with a very fast frame rate and pretty much the same res as the D30. I thought it was a brain-damaged 1Ds. If I had to buy a 1D I'd have still dumped my D30; the images are a bit different but the "quality" is about the same to my eyes.

If you're going to shell out several thousand dollars for (a) autofocus; and (b) buffer management then I think you may want to at least rent a 1D first to be sure it gives you what you want. You may be able to get away with the buffer management thing if you're just more careful with taking your finger off at the wrong time [apologies if you know that stuff already]. You may find that better glass helps more with the autofocus than a new camera. It seems a shame to shift bodies without increasing resolution.

Phil

[robertwgross]

Terry, I don't believe that my D60 has the same problems as your D30. Buffer management is not a problem, except if I am trying to preview something that I just shot. It always gives priority to shooting the next shot, regardless of whether I just took one or two within the last few seconds. However, the buffer only holds eight. So, if I had just shot off seven in a burst, then it will let me shoot the eighth, but then it will freeze up for a number of seconds until the buffer is managed down and everything is saved to compact flash.

What some of us do for sports action is to set up framed between point A and point B. Let the action run from point A to point B without much panning. Get on the shutter button and let a burst of eight go within three seconds. Have AI auto focus set. Of the eight shots, some will be poor. Some will be good. At least one will be excellent. Some seconds later, preview those, purge the poor and good ones from memory, then continue.

---Bob Gross---

[Phil Hall]

Terry

I have had a D30 for about 18 months and have just moved up to a 1D. I have not had the kind of buffer problems you mention. I did not think the D60 was that much better than the D30. I could not get my hands ona 1Ds an did not want to wait several months for one. I also have concerns about 11 Mb files with current computers and software. I have not yet got into the 1D in detail. It is better built but I only shoot around 1000 frames per month , mostly on ranch and wildlife subjects. The pictures are better, just a little sharper but over all a lot better. I also bought a 100-400 lense which I do not like as much as the 70-200 L IS, even with a 2x extender.
You might want to wait to see what the D40 or D80 look like but it might be a while before they become available.

I hope to get my workflow set up this week and atart using it more. I will add more comments then.


Phil Hall

Santa Ynez CA

[redbutt]

Have you thought about upgrading your lens? You didn't mention what kind you are using. I am borrowing a friends Canon 70-200 f/2.8 L for my D30 and that thing is amazing. The USM autofocus motor is amazingly fast at finding focus. There are still issues in VERY low light, but that doesn't sound like it would be an issue for you shooting baseball games.

[Mr. Fogle]

Ya,
I use the 2.8 lens, shoot sport and have no probs. First you must use Al-servo to track the players movement. Then use multiple shot mode and click away. I have fired off 5,6,7, shots one right after the other and never got boggled. The trick is to not let the shutter button all the way up. If you do, it will have to right the entire buffer to get started again. If you only let it up half way, whitch you need to do to keep the focusing working, it will right one shot and you can take another right away. The fast lens makes all the diff' in focus lock. I point,,,, WHAM,,,,, lock,, and shoot.

[jpbeale]

I have used a D30 for just over a year, and this month got a D60. I shoot wildlife (birds) and dance performances, and in both cases I need to take many pictures rapidly and the timing is not always exactly predictable. With the D30, you either have to hold the button half-way down to enable shooting which prevents writing to CF so the buffer fills, or you release the button and must wait until the buffer is empty before any more shots.

I find the D60 is a tremendous improvement for me, since you can let the button go and write to memory, but still take another shot anytime the buffer is not completely full (8 frames). For me the D60 is worth the price just for the buffer handling; the added resolution is of less importance (in fact I am using the "medium" 2048x1360 resolution for faster writing to CF card.)

[Terry]

Thanks to all who have replied... after thinking about this some more and searching through web sites, I'm beginning to wonder if a D60 might be a better alternative to a 1D.

The D60 doesn't do much for focusing, but it does have buffer management that will probably solve 80% of the issues I have with the D30 (and besides it's 6MP). The more I thought about it, most of the shots I missed were due to not being able to get a second shot off because the camera was processing and writing the first shot to the CF card. I'm not sure about the "only let up the shutter button half way" approach. Maybe with practice I could get use to this, but I'm still nervous that I would let it up too much during the excitement of the play and miss more shots.

To answer a couple of questions: My gear consists of a D30, Canon 17-35 f/2.8 L, Canon 28-70 f/2.8 L, and a Canon 70-200 f/4 L. For the baseball games I use the 70-200 f/4 L, unless I need to change for a wider angle team photo.

I chose the 70-200 f/4 L primarily due to cost. The other advantage is the smaller size. I can fit the D30 and the 3 lenses in a Tamrac photo backpack for when I go 4-Wheeling, hiking, and general exploring. Yes, a 70-200 f/2.8 IS L would be nice to shoot with, but the size and weight would be a bummer. I'm hoping that someone doesn't suggest that the 70-200 f/4 is still too slow, because I'm considering purchasing the Canon 100-400 f/4.5-5.6 L IS zoom for the baseball games.

I don't think I want to wait for the "new" models to come out, even if the rumors are true. If past performance is any guide, the new cameras would not be shipping for several months after the announcement, and even then getting one would be difficult since they will be in high demand (put your name on a list and wait... wait... wait). Baseball season starts up in April.


I'm still undecided on the direction to go. I have a few more specific questions regarding the 1D, and would appreciate comments on the following:

1) Battery life
2) Dust on the CCD sensor (and if it is a problem, what technique do you use to clean the sensor)
3) Lack of magnified image review
4) Long exposures (1-30 second range)

Again, thanks to all who have helped with your comments and experiences. Maybe I'll figure this out, hopefully sooner than later :)

Terry

[danphoto1]

Terry I own two 1D's and a 1DMKII. I have owned a D30 and a D60 as well I still have a 10D. The !D is light years ahead of the other cameras. The 20D might be an option but if you can afford a 1D it's a nobrainer. The MKII has twice the battery like of the old 1D and foucs faster and shoots in forthframe bursts If you have any doubts go to my site. http://danphoto1.tripod.com and take a look then let me know what you think. I always had to anticapte the action with the D30 and D60 neither focus as fast nor traks as fast

Dan

[CyberDyneSystems]

D30 to 1D? This willbe a stratospheric upgrade!

I've been shooting with 1D bodies for just over a year now,. the upgrade from a 10D was huge...

But recently I picked up a D30,. and well,. it is simply pathetic next to the 1D.
Af speed is at least 5 times faster with the 1D,. maybe more. The first time I played with the D30 I ran into buffer issues. I've NEVER run out of buffer with a 1D. (used to run into trouble with the 10D every once in a while and even ran into the brick wal with the 20D recently,. but it comes back to life in mere seconds)

The upgrade will be HUGE!

Not to mention images! White balance, af tracking , etc etc etc..

[René Damkot]

1D is obviouosly better than a 30/60D. AF/speed is also a lot better than a 10D/20D. The high iso of the 20D is _a lot_ better than that of the 1D (even 10D is slightly better). If high motordrive speed and fast/large buffer is all you want, try the 1D. Otherwise a 20D might be a very real option. (much lower noise, better colours, same crop as 30D, much the same UI, fits EF-S lenses, reasonably fast (5fps) AF _much_ better than 30D/60D/10D). If you're looking at a used 1Ds, look at a new 1DMk2. should be about the same price....

[Andy_T]

Hahahaha ... I love that new forum feature that displays 'similar threads' below the thread you're reading at the moment... now the old threads are getting bumped again.

Maybe Terry didn't really wait for 2 years to have his question answered :lol:

Best regards,
Andy

[René Damkot]

LOL! Maybe he can share his experiences here ;)

[xdjoynerx]

ai servo

i used it at my sisters plays and it works great for little kids running around the stage. (this is with the d30)