Members Photoshopping other Members photos???

[Toogy]

Not sure where to post this, but I am noticing this alot more lately on here. Somebody posts a picture and before you know it, somebody has taken the image into photoshop and 'fixed' it or so they think.
I don't really have a problem with this, but it would be nice if people asked before just assuming that we are ok with them doing it.

Does anybody else feel this way?

[tommykjensen]

It often depends on how the original poster frases the post.

But I think it is common sense to ask first unless the poster specifically requests it. But now I should probably not say more because when I last voiced this opinion people that were doing this favor got offended.

[diving to cover....]

[etaf]

an interesting post - I feel the best way to show someone what you mean is by taking the picture and making the changes or crop etc - then the poster can ignore it,
If people are posting for advice help etc its much easier and more effective to show them rather than write about it.
I have never done this on this forum yet, but have on another forum although I have asked the poster - or stated that if they object i would delete my post.

IMO i feel that if you post a picture here for any advice, you should expect people to do that...
If you only want to show the image then maybe a not to say - please do not critique/comment on my picture, isnt taking the picture and making changes just a different way to make your comment in pictures rather than words :) :)

[tommykjensen]

IMO i feel that if you post a picture here for any advice, you should expect people to do that...


It depends on which forum it is posted in. In my opinion it is a big no-no if the photo has been posted in the share forums. Only in Critique forum would it be okay, but I would still expect users to ask first.

[mdm]

No.

[kawter2]

I.E.

This post, http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=74532 the member posted this along with a pic in the "PEOPLE" "SHARING" section

I don't really do portraits but I took this shot at a recent wedding & I really like the way it turned out. 2 of the bridesmaids came over to my table for a chat & I just picked up my camera which had my 2 day old 50mm f/1.4 on & took one rather quckly composed shot. I thought I'd share it here!
**IMAGE REMOVED**

Thanks for looking.


Next thing 2 people edited and posted...... 1 it is just a sharing forum and 2 they never asked for any help..


**note**
to the members that made the edit.. I am not intentionally pointing you two out, this happens ALL the time and is just a recient example, and thus why you are mentioned

[mrclark321]

I don't see a problem with it, If everyone had to ask permission most likely you would not get much help this way!!


Dan

[Jon]

If someone's asking for critique, cropping might be appropriate. If they're asking about lens performance, showing what a skilled PhotoShopper can do to the out-of-camera images is in order. Post-processing examples may be helpful. But if the picture's posted as a share, or to illustrate lighting or technique then editing it isn't in order.

[tommykjensen]

I don't see a problem with it, If everyone had to ask permission most likely you would not get much help this way!!


Again it depends where it was posted and how it was posted.

If the poster asks how a photo can be improved then yes. But if it has just been posted to share it, anybody that want to improve it should ask first.


I understand that it is done with best intentions in mind but it is common courtesy to for me to ask first.


And I simply can't get it into my mind that just because a photo has been posted on the internet it appears to be free game for anybody that want to "improve" the photo. What if the editor really did a poor job and made a worse photo?

[tommykjensen]

I.E.

This post, http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=74532 the member posted this along with a pic in the "PEOPLE" "SHARING" section




Next thing 2 people edited and posted...... 1 it is just a sharing forum and 2 they never asked for any help..


**note**
to the members that made the edit.. I am not intentionally pointing you two out, this happens ALL the time and is just a recient example, and thus why you are mentioned

Eric, I am so glad You share my opinion.

I have had this happen too with one of my photos. I don't pretend I am a master but I expect users to respect that unless I ask for edits then I don't want edits. The one time this happend to me I very kindly asked the editor to remove the photo. I then started a thread like this but the editor in question and a few others that also think it is ok to edit away got so offended that I had the nerve to ask him to remove his edit of my photo that I eventually asked a moderator to move the thread to a hidden forum where it probably stills sits. So this is really a touchy subject.

[CyberPet]

Why not start a forum with photo's that you don't know what's wrong with it, but you know something is wrong. Then people can help out and tell what they did and how they did it.

I personally don't mind at all that people will work in my photo's to make them better. It's till my picture and if I don't like what they do with it, I just ingore it. However those who done big improvements on a photo I've taken, I've learnt a lot from.

I myself would not hesitate to fix someone's photo if i see there's potential in the image, that's not taking advantage of... 1. because the person is a beginner with Photoshop (I'm not, and can give good advice) or 2. because the person imply they aren't happy with the picture and want input, or 3. others can learn a new technique, even if the poster doesn't appreciate it (or didn't ask for it). 4. I learn something new myself while I'm doing it.

If I post an image and people are offended and ask me to remove it from my server, fine. That's not a problem at all. But I do believe sometimes people are too sensitive and might not want to learn stuff and get offended when someone wants to have a go at your photo. If people want to have a go at one of my photo's I take it as people think it has potential to be better, so teach me something new and next time I'll post a better version of another subject with the new technique I was taught.

[tommykjensen]

Why not start a forum with photo's that you don't know what's wrong with it, but you know something is wrong. Then people can help out and tell what they did and how they did it.


I don't think a new forum is required for this. A simple rule could be if the photo is posted in "Photo sharing" then its a no-no to edit, but if You need to edit then ask first. If it is posted in "Critique corner" its free game.

[jukas]

I wouldn't modify someone elses photo without asking first unless it or they said something like "How do I fix this" or "Fix this please" or "Can anyone fix this?" in which case I would not only post the edited photo but what I did to get there. This would show them not only what I considered a "fix" but the steps I took to get there thus hopefully adding to their existing knowledge.

If I saw a photo I thought would look cool in a different way I would probably contact them and ask if it was ok. This does two things, it saves me time if they aren't ok with it and it respects their work and keeps me from overstepping what I feel is my boundaries.

Now if I saw an image I just *HAD* to see what a certain effect might look like on it and they didn't want me posting an edited version I might still edit it just to see what the end result looked like but would never post it.

[kawter2]

Eric, I am so glad You share my opinion.
.

Yea I am amazed sometimes,... i feel like the only one that thinks this is rude, not as much much when someone does it to me, but more so when i see someones hard worked blasted by someones half cocked idea that the photo needs to be "FIXED"

[tommykjensen]

I wouldn't modify someone elses photo without asking first unless it or they said something like "How do I fix this" or "Fix this please" or "Can anyone fix this?" in which case I would not only post the edited photo but what I did to get there. This would show them not only what I considered a "fix" but the steps I took to get there thus hopefully adding to their existing knowledge.

If I saw a photo I thought would look cool in a different way I would probably contact them and ask if it was ok. This does two things, it saves me time if they aren't ok with it and it respects their work and keeps me from overstepping what I feel is my boundaries.

Now if I saw an image I just *HAD* to see what a certain effect might look like on it and they didn't want me posting an edited version I might still edit it just to see what the end result looked like but would never post it.

And that is in my opinion the proper way to do it.

[jimsolt]

There are 2 ways of looking at this and I agree with both of them. One is that if you post a picture in any category in a forum devoted to photography you are inviting criticism and there's no sense denying that. If you rent a gallery to display your work, you will get people making criticisms. I think there's no way of avoiding others who do the same thing having an opinion and often expressing it. The fact that someone is interested in my work to the point where they venture opinions of what's good and what's bad is probably a compliment.
The other way of looking at it is it takes very little time to ask if someone would object if I took a crack at doing it "my way." If I'm willing to spend some time in Photoshop, I should be willing to take the time to see if you'd feel OK about my posting my version of your product.
A little consideration for feelings goes a long way.
Jim

[kawter2]

anyone care to vote, please do so here ... http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=74558

[BlueTit]

My first thoughts would be that I personally would be honoured if someone PS'd an image I posted and even it it was not an improvement I would be grateful of their effort. However after reading the other thread and a little more thought I think I will jump into the ask first camp. An editor can always do the PS edits while waiting for a reply which I am sure most of thetime would be yes, then post it, maybe after emailing it to the owner for approval first, if required. Personally I would not have the wit or the wisdom to edit someone else photos, have enough trouble with my own.

[tommykjensen]

It could be interesting to know what the pros that do photography for a living think about this?

How would RFMsports, KennyG and other of the pros feel if someone thought they could improve their photos, edited them and uploaded them without asking?

[Rob612]

I don't think a new forum is required for this. A simple rule could be if the photo is posted in "Photo sharing" then its a no-no to edit, but if You need to edit then ask first. If it is posted in "Critique corner" its free game.

I'll second this one. Photo sharing - if I am not getting it wrong - is a place where one wants to share with fellow members his own work. I assume that if this is the concept, they are satisfied with the result. Of course, critiques and comments are always welcome, but editing is a big no-no indeed.

Critique corner, its all the way around. One who posts there is asking for everything that can be useful to improve. And editing is just a different way of saying something. We can really name it "visual help". I have no problem at all, BTW. Everybody feeel free to edit everything I post. I may like the result or not, but in any case I will learn AT LEAST what I do not like :D

[Andy_T]

Yea I am amazed sometimes,... i feel like the only one that thinks this is rude, not as much much when someone does it to me, but more so when i see someones hard work blasted by someones half cocked idea that the photo needs to be "FIXED"

Then, by all means, say that to the editor :D

I think that it is important to try not to step on other peoples toes ... and I think that I will in the future ask for permission just to make sure.

On the other hand, I think that there are *some* people who have enormous toes that might be hard to avoid any way:wink:

If somebody edits my images without asking me before and without me requesting critique, then 3 things can happen
A) I truly learn something new I would not have thought about before ... that's why I did not know to ask for alternative ways to do it
B) I see an alternative view that I consider ok ... but not better than mine ... so I just leave it at this
C) I see a half cocked idea that can in no way relate to my hard work ... then I chuckle and assume that others will see it that way, as well.
(If they don't, then I question my perception again ... maybe it really is option A) and I did not realize :wink: )

How would RFMsports, KennyG and other of the pros feel if someone thought they could improve their photos, edited them and uploaded them without asking?

Impossible to tell for me ... so I don't even try.

But I have this little voice in the back of my head that keeps telling me that they might just say
'Smartass ... of course I know this can be improved that way if you spend a lot of time on editing, but I was on a deadline and the photo was good enough for the purpose my client wanted it for'

Best regards,
Andy

[jukas]

There are 2 ways of looking at this and I agree with both of them. One is that if you post a picture in any category in a forum devoted to photography you are inviting criticism and there's no sense denying that. If you rent a gallery to display your work, you will get people making criticisms. I think there's no way of avoiding others who do the same thing having an opinion and often expressing it. The fact that someone is interested in my work to the point where they venture opinions of what's good and what's bad is probably a compliment.
Jim

Just one quick distinction I'd like to make here. There is a huge difference between criticism and modification. If I had a gallery and someone said "Oh I love this photo but I would have like to see it with x, x and without y" that's entirely different than if they grabbed the photo, drew on it with a magic marker and then re-hung it

I know it's silly analogy but it's what I came up with while waiting for 5pm ;)

[Citizensmith]

It's quite often requested, and can also be a good way of demonstrating what you mean by your comments about a photo. Personally I haven't ever done it, but I'd have no problem if someone did it to one of my photos.

[RAitch]

I love it when people PS my images. Usually that only happens (or seems to happen) when images are uploaded and shown inline. Then they are a low-res copy and I don't really see an issue.

Even if it was a full-res copy, I learn so much from other people's edits that I wouldn't want psing to stop.

[jimsolt]

Just one quick distinction I'd like to make here. There is a huge difference between criticism and modification. If I had a gallery and someone said "Oh I love this photo but I would have like to see it with x, x and without y" that's entirely different than if they grabbed the photo, drew on it with a magic marker and then re-hung it

I know it's silly analogy but it's what I came up with while waiting for 5pm ;)

Maybe not so silly. I was going to use one about taking my car in for a paint job . . . but I took it out.

Your point is a good one, and I agree with you.

Jim

[Citizensmith]

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=73577 (nudity warning) is a great example of when someone has requested people to mess with their photo. Their are some great interpretations there. Of course the person was obvious that their intent was for people to revise the photo.

[PhotosGuy]

Why not start a forum with photo's that you don't know what's wrong with it, but you know something is wrong. Then people can help out and tell what they did and how they did it. Isn't that covered in the "critique" section?
How would RFMsports, KennyG and other of the pros feel if someone thought they could improve their photos, edited them and uploaded them without asking? :D:D Good luck on finding a way to improve their shots! Considering the conditions that they work under every day to get them, it would be measurebating to an extreme! ;)

[Wazza]

Depending on the situation, there are times when it is suitable. But most the time it is not.

If it's in photoshare, and they're asking how can I improve, or you can see they've reuploaded it three times, trying to get a better shot, then there shouldn't be any harm in giving it a go.

But when a poster clearly "shares" a pic, just for a bit of fun, and then gets ripped into with strong critique it's just not fair. Because of that, I don't want to ever share any below average shots, even if it contains a good subject, or something interesting happening.

So basically, my opinion is, if they're asking for help, go ahead, but if they've clearly just shared some pics, whether it be family shots, cars or whatever, what's the point in making an adjustment.

Wait, I think I found a flaw in KennyG's shot. Oh actually it was my dirty monitor. Good luck in getting a fault on their shots. :lol:

[Big_B]

It's quite often requested, and can also be a good way of demonstrating what you mean by your comments about a photo. Personally I haven't ever done it, but I'd have no problem if someone did it to one of my photos.

I'm with you on both points here. I can see that some people might sometimes be offended by this sort of thing, but there must be a balance between a forum that locks down every possible avenue of offence by implementing a stream of rules, and a forum that accepts that people will sometimes be offended but recognises that the members are generally capable of sorting it out between themselves. We are all adults here, so if I don't like what someone has done, I can simply ask them to remove it.

[IanD]

*If you do not get a written permission to edit that photo, you may not edit that photo and post the edited photo back. This applies ALL FORUMS. Giving the permission can be simply "post processing examples welcome."*

Folks,
Please note that the above is the new way that Pekka wishes folks to handle this issue. It has been posted in all photo forums under "Guidelines". This is a new rule that has been posted in the last 24 hours, but it might be worth while to take a look in the Guidelines section of the forum every once in a while just to see it there have been any changes.

[Rob612]

*If you do not get a written permission to edit that photo, you may not edit that photo and post the edited photo back. This applies ALL FORUMS. Giving the permission can be simply "post processing examples welcome."*

OK then, if this is a new guideline, I'll follow immediately the example of CyberPet and stick it in my sig.

Easy solution to a potential complex problem.

[Jemmind]

OK then, if this is a new guideline, I'll follow immediately the example of CyberPet and stick it in my sig.

Easy solution to a potential complex problem.

Same goes here too!
Julie