I'm a pro, I'm not a pro, I'm a pro, I'm not a pro...

[carseasoncity]

I'm sure this has been discussed somewhere on here before, but I can't find it in my searching, so...

I consider myself a professional photographer. I make money doing what I do, I have a website, a blog, repeat customers, and an honest to god studio.

But...

I shoot with a Rebel Xti and the kit lens (note* I rent the 17-55 2.8 for all my weddings but still use the xti body).

I'm saving for the 17-55 2.8 and the 50D but times are tough for us right now so trying to get by with what I've got.

So my question is this:

Is this normal? Am I the only freak that's trying to make a living using consumer grade equipment?

It's a little disconcerting when my clients say, "I've got that same camera!".

Should I be freaking out that I don't have better equipment? I want to create better images but feel limited by my lens. Is it the equipment or my knowledge of said equipment? Is there only so much you can do...so far you can go...with the body and lens I have?

I currently use Alien Bees in the studio but would love to use more natural light (especially for my newborns) but I can't seem to make that work with the kit lens. Is it something I'm doing wrong or just the fact that the lens can't work that well in low light.

Are there any other "pros" out there that are using the XTI and the kit lens?

Feel free to check out my site or my blog (the blog is more current) so you can comment on what you think of my abilities as a "pro", just be gentle. I'm a delicate flower.

I'm really just interested in hearing other's thoughts on this concern I have.
Thanks!
B

[butugly]

if you get the customers and they are happy with the photos good luck to you,you do really need better glass,and more imagination with the light setup.use more bounced light for the newborn shots.
shouldnt really comment as i am still setting up my studio,i will only be using a couple of portaflash units for the time being but as cash becomes available improve equipment.

[natalieegbert]

I think your site and blog looks good, I love the picture of the little one and the gold fish such a cute idea I think ill try (thanks for the idea). Other then that Im in the same boat as you I have a xsi and Im saving up for a better camera but until then I got to work with what I got. It sure looks like you are making your camera and kit lens work well for you.

[stathunter]

As someone who makes my living with my camera - I think you are extremely limited with a kit lens and consumer grade camera -- sounds like you put the cart before the horse in your business.
It is pretty obvious, to me, that you do not have much time in the business. You would have "collected" more equipment with just a bit more time in the photography world, number 1. Number2, why pay for building out a studio before you had a few essentials required for doing the job, lenses etc. Dunno - maybe you took a few photos and love them jumped into building out a studio but missed a few basics.....like lenses and backup equipment.
Also - why do you mention the fact that you have the same camera as your clients on your blog? What?
Also if you are delicate like a "flower" you need to get out of business - you might not have what it takes to start and run a business.

[joedlh]

It's a little disconcerting when my clients say, "I've got that same camera!".


If so, then why are they hiring you? Your response should be, "Isn't it a great camera? I am frequently amazed at the high quality images I get out of it."

How many yo-yos have you seen sporting a 1D something or other or a xxD or 5D with a grip (so that it looks like a 1D) and (1) obviously don't know how to use their equipment and/or (2) have yet to create an image that draws appreciative comments?

The camera and accessories are tools. The photograph is taken by the photographer, not his or her gear. Entry level DSLRs can produce professional shots, as you well know. An experienced photographer with a good eye will get better results with a 3mp phone camera than one of those aforementioned yo-yos with a $5000 1D something or other.

[Todd Lambert]

I'm not a pro.

I'd get rid of the personal stuff off your blog. There is no room for mixing comments like "I have no idea what I am doing" on a professional's website. Period.

You are killing yourself on this, get rid of it, keep it professional and on target. If you want to blog about this kind of stuff, do it somewhere else.

Just my opinion.

[carseasoncity]

As someone who makes my living with my camera - I think you are extremely limited with a kit lens and consumer grade camera -- sounds like you put the cart before the horse in your business.
It is pretty obvious, to me, that you do not have much time in the business. You would have "collected" more equipment with just a bit more time in the photography world, number 1. Number2, why pay for building out a studio before you had a few essentials required for doing the job, lenses etc. Dunno - maybe you took a few photos and love them jumped into building out a studio but missed a few basics.....like lenses and backup equipment.
Also - why do you mention the fact that you have the same camera as your clients on your blog? What?
Also if you are delicate like a "flower" you need to get out of business - you might not have what it takes to start and run a business.

Wow.

I guess I should clear up a few things.

I've been shooting for pay for about 3 years. Slowly, very slowly working my way into it one client at a time so that I now have 2-3 jobs a week.

I haven't "collected" more equipment because I can't afford it. I'm struggling to make ends meet at this point. A $1200 camera and $1100 lens are not even an option until things straighten out a little. Hopefully in the next month or so.

I have a studio because my husband is a carpenter and my father-in-law needed a shop for his business so he added a space for my studio as well. No cost to me.

I mention that I have the same equipment as my client on my blog because I am who I am. I'm open. I'm honest. I tell it like I feel it/see it/ hear it. I think they appreciate me for that. Actually, I KNOW they appreciate me for that because that very client already booked me for her new arrival's pictures next month and thanked me for the kind words and honesty on my blog. Maybe it seems crazy to mention it, but at least my prospective clients can know who I am going into it. If they don't like my work they won't hire me regardless of my equipment.

And the delicate flower thing was just a little joke. I guess I should have put a smily face after that statement. I'm a VERY strong woman. Or strong willed anyway. :) I'm not a quitter and I definitely have what it takes to run this business...minus the cash flow for new equipment. :)

Thanks for the input.
B

[carseasoncity]

If so, then why are they hiring you? Your response should be, "Isn't it a great camera? I am frequently amazed at the high quality images I get out of it."

How many yo-yos have you seen sporting a 1D something or other or a xxD or 5D with a grip (so that it looks like a 1D) and (1) obviously don't know how to use their equipment and/or (2) have yet to create an image that draws appreciative comments?

The camera and accessories are tools. The photograph is taken by the photographer, not his or her gear. Entry level DSLRs can produce professional shots, as you well know. An experienced photographer with a good eye will get better results with a 3mp phone camera than one of those aforementioned yo-yos with a $5000 1D something or other.

I do usually mention how great the camera is and also mention how it's really not about the equipment, but how you use it.

And I agree about the camera being a tool...but I guess my concern is that I'm outgrowing my tool. You can only get so good with a 3mp phone camera, right?

I'm just itching to get better and feel I can't do that with what I've got.

I'm not a pro.

I'd get rid of the personal stuff off your blog. There is no room for mixing comments like "I have no idea what I am doing" on a professional's website. Period.

You are killing yourself on this, get rid of it, keep it professional and on target. If you want to blog about this kind of stuff, do it somewhere else.

Just my opinion.

I'm sorry that this seems to be the concensus on my blogging. But I won't change it. I am who I am. I write what's on my mind. If prospective clients don't like it then they won't like me. Period. I have good relationships with my clients...I'm very much a people person. I think they come to me as much for my attitude/personality as they do for my work.

In fact I've been told that from several clients. They love that I entertain them while I work, that I'm honest and open, and that I'm not stiff and unpersonal. I want my blog to reflect that.

Thanks for the advice though...I know it's hard to reflect with the written word, but I'm being sincere...I really appreciate the advice on here.
B

[PhotosGuy]

Ten years ago, the Rebel Xti would have had ecstatic buyers at a price of $10,000? It looks as if you're getting pretty good work out of it. But for something one-time-only like a wedding, you should either rent a back-up body or put shooting them on hold until you can.

[Evil_Edge]

Like I've said 1000 times. I've seen shots from people with $5000 camera that can't shoot worth a damn. You've made due with what you have and after a quick scan of the photos on your blog, you have some serious talent. Keep on doing what you are doing. After all it's about the skill and creativity of the photographer rather than all the fancy stuff listed in your signature. Keep on shooting!

[Nightstalker]

I worked for the 1st 3 years with a silver 300D with a EFs 17-85 IS lens - when that died due to overuse I upgraded to a 30D still with the EF 17-85 IS.

This equipment was perfect for 95% of the work I was doing but as I started to do more critical work I became more and more aware of the limitations of the kit - so much so that for my 1st wedding (a friends) I used the 30D and rented a EF 24-70 F2.8L.

The lens was great but not being used to a F2.8 lens I lost a few shots due to the narrowness of the focus. It was quite dark and I wouldn't trust the 30D at much beyond ISO 1250 - 1600 at max, the images were just too noisy for my liking.

After procrastinating for what seemed to be a year I managed to kill the 30D through overuse (it lasted about 2.5 years in total) and upgraded to the 5DMk2 and EF 24-105F4ISL - boy what an improvement.

So I guess the moral of my story is this - great kit does not make a good photographer BUT cheap kit does have its limitations.

You can get away with the limitations with many customers as they either don't know what to look for or are comparing your output with P&S or even camera phones. Once you decide to make the step up and go for more demanding / better paying clients or take a really critical and honest look at your images you may decide that an upgrade is worthwhile.

[carseasoncity]

Ten years ago, the Rebel Xti would have had ecstatic buyers at a price of $10,000? It looks as if you're getting pretty good work out of it. But for something one-time-only like a wedding, you should either rent a back-up body or put shooting them on hold until you can.

Thanks and I agree. I guess I'm just coming to the realization (in somewhat of a panic) that I should never have been shooting a wedding with the XTI even if I DID have the 17-55 2.8 to go with it. I do have the Rebel XT as a backup but now I'm seeing how deficient that is.

Like I've said 1000 times. I've seen shots from people with $5000 camera that can't shoot worth a damn. You've made due with what you have and after a quick scan of the photos on your blog, you have some serious talent. Keep on doing what you are doing. After all it's about the skill and creativity of the photographer rather than all the fancy stuff listed in your signature. Keep on shooting!

Thanks for the pep talk! I do feel it's the skill of the photographer, but it has to be a little bit about the equipment too. Right? I think so. Maybe.

I worked for the 1st 3 years with a silver 300D with a EFs 17-85 IS lens - when that died due to overuse I upgraded to a 30D still with the EF 17-85 IS.

This equipment was perfect for 95% of the work I was doing but as I started to do more critical work I became more and more aware of the limitations of the kit - so much so that for my 1st wedding (a friends) I used the 30D and rented a EF 24-70 F2.8L.

The lens was great but not being used to a F2.8 lens I lost a few shots due to the narrowness of the focus. It was quite dark and I wouldn't trust the 30D at much beyond ISO 1250 - 1600 at max, the images were just too noisy for my liking.

After procrastinating for what seemed to be a year I managed to kill the 30D through overuse and upgraded to the 5DMk2 and EF 24-105F4ISL - boy what an improvement.

So I guess the moral of my story is this - great kit does not make a good photographer BUT cheap kit does have its limitations.

You can get away with the limitations with many customers as they either don't know what to look for or are comparing your output with P&S or even camera phones. Once you decide to make the step up and go for more demanding / better paying clients or take a really critical and honest look at your images you may decide that an upgrade is worthwhile.

Thanks for the background info. It's good to know that I'm not the only one with this experience.

And I guess I HAVE gotten to the point where I'm seeing the limitations of my equipment (again, in a panic). And I'm definitely seeing that it would be very worthwhile to upgrade but it's very frustrating since I can't afford to upgrade right now. I guess I'll just keep pushing the kit as far as it can go for another few months.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts on the matter.
B

[SMP_Homer]

The equipment is only part of the equation...
what you have will take pictures just like anything else, and as long as you know the strengths and limitations of your gear, you'll do fine...
better and more expensive stuff will make it easier to do some shots, quality will show in those shots, and you might spend a little less time going over them afterwards...

but I'm worried you didn't mention anything about a backup....

[chopperdave]

results matter. that's all really.

If you deliver what is expected, then awesome.

[NickJushchyshyn]

1) You appear to be a very good photographer, and yet another example of how a good photographer can do excellent work without top-of-the line gear. Bravo.

2) If money is tight, you should be working as hard as you can to increase/grow your business with as little cost impact as possible. One area would be self-deriding comments about yourself on your blog. By simply omitting these things, you could very well gain an additional client or two or more.
There's no impact to how much fun you are to speak to in person, and how comfortable you can make clients feel by making fun of yourself while face to face .... you say yourself that it's "hard to reflect with written word", so why put anything on your site that could be misinterpreted, or will do anything but help you increase client traffic to your studio.
What you're risking here is that you could be loosing prospects that would be perfectly happy working with your honest and fun style in person, but they never get that far because something they read on your blog makes them nervous about selecting you.
Again ... your site/blog should drive traffic TO your studio, not deflect it away. If they come in for a visit and decide they don't fit your style ... fine, no biggie, but there's really no reason to push them away before they even get there.

You are who your are, and it's your site to do with as you please ... but consider that, while you continually mention that things are tight, the level of professionalism you present on your site/blog can have a direct impact on the growth rate of your venture.

3) Given how good you are with consumer-grade gear ... pro lenses and camera can make your work even more spectacular (once you get comfortable with the new tools of course ... it's not an open-box-it's-magically-better sort of thing). The improved quality helps open the doors to new clients, better paying ones too. I think you're doing the right thing by working with what you have ... but ideally, as the business grows, you are helping yourself if you can re-invest some of the new profits into purchases or rentals of better gear.

One thing to consider is that to rent a 5D with L lens costs around $300-ish for one week, including shipping. Rent that kit for week when you have 3 clients scheduled to shoot to spread the investment out over multiple jobs and you will now have an even better set of examples to use to sell more work down the road, plus you will start to have a direct understanding of how this gear can improve your work.

Hope this helps. Good luck.

[usukshooter]

I do think it's a bit unusual but I don't think there's anything wrong with it - I'm a professional sports photographer but I'm still shooting with a 20D. Although it's from the mid range or semi pro line, it's hugely outdated.

Everyone takes their own path and you should do whatever works for you. I'm still shooting with the 20D partly because I priorized getting the lens I needed for sports first. I was talking to a staff member at Calumet about equipment and I mentioned I'm in serious need of a camera update - he asked what I shot with, I told him and he said "Hey, if it gets the job done, that's all that matters". And he's right - although some equipment might be limiting, if it's getting the job done, that's the most important thing.

[SMP_Homer]

the lady that shot my wedding did so with a 10D and no L glass
had a flash on a bracket, and some big brick hanging by her side for flash power (it hit me in the knee a few times)
I don't recall her changing lenses at any point, but I do recall her saying she wished for her wide angle when doing the group shots
pics turned out very well

[Sunapollo]

You did very well with the equipments you have. I love your pictures. Just slowly build up your lens/camera collection so you can take even better pictures with them.

[carseasoncity]

The equipment is only part of the equation...
what you have will take pictures just like anything else, and as long as you know the strengths and limitations of your gear, you'll do fine...
better and more expensive stuff will make it easier to do some shots, quality will show in those shots, and you might spend a little less time going over them afterwards...

but I'm worried you didn't mention anything about a backup....

I did mention a backup, but it's only the Rebel XT. And I could see how new equipment would makes some shots easier, and save me time.


results matter. that's all really.

If you deliver what is expected, then awesome.

True. True. I think now it's more about me than my clients. It's about what I'm expecting of myself not really what they're expecting because as was mentioned earlier most clients are impressed if you present them with an image that's in focus.

1) You appear to be a very good photographer, and yet another example of how a good photographer can do excellent work without top-of-the line gear. Bravo.

2) If money is tight, you should be working as hard as you can to increase/grow your business with as little cost impact as possible. One area would be self-deriding comments about yourself on your blog. By simply omitting these things, you could very well gain an additional client or two or more.
There's no impact to how much fun you are to speak to in person, and how comfortable you can make clients feel by making fun of yourself while face to face .... you say yourself that it's "hard to reflect with written word", so why put anything on your site that could be misinterpreted, or will do anything but help you increase client traffic to your studio.
What you're risking here is that you could be loosing prospects that would be perfectly happy working with your honest and fun style in person, but they never get that far because something they read on your blog makes them nervous about selecting you.
Again ... your site/blog should drive traffic TO your studio, not deflect it away. If they come in for a visit and decide they don't fit your style ... fine, no biggie, but there's really no reason to push them away before they even get there.

You are who your are, and it's your site to do with as you please ... but consider that, while you continually mention that things are tight, the level of professionalism you present on your site/blog can have a direct impact on the growth rate of your venture.

3) Given how good you are with consumer-grade gear ... pro lenses and camera can make your work even more spectacular (once you get comfortable with the new tools of course ... it's not an open-box-it's-magically-better sort of thing). The improved quality helps open the doors to new clients, better paying ones too. I think you're doing the right thing by working with what you have ... but ideally, as the business grows, you are helping yourself if you can re-invest some of the new profits into purchases or rentals of better gear.

One thing to consider is that to rent a 5D with L lens costs around $300-ish for one week, including shipping. Rent that kit for week when you have 3 clients scheduled to shoot to spread the investment out over multiple jobs and you will now have an even better set of examples to use to sell more work down the road, plus you will start to have a direct understanding of how this gear can improve your work.

Hope this helps. Good luck.


Thanks so much for taking the time to comment so thoroughly. I really appreciate the advice and unbiased viewpoint.

I don't think my comments on my blog are "self-deriding", they're honest. I make no grandiose claims about my photography or myself. Maybe it's bad marketing. But this is who I am.

And if I was going to worry about things on my site (my professional site or my blog) being misinterpreted then I wouldn't have a site. Because even tiny things can be misinterpreted...and they are.

Things are tight, but I'm not willing to portray myself as something I'm not just to get a few new clients. I don't like sugar-coating and I feel fake if I try to make myself sound all "professional" and sophisticated, though I do consider myself to be dignified, handling my clients professionally, and I'd even call myself a classy lady. :)

If my prospective clients get scared off because of one or two comments on my blog about how I'm scared that I'm not good enough or that I wish I was better, then they can go to one of the other two photographers in town that claim to know it all.

The kind of clients I want are the ones that see how hard I work, how determined I am to get a good image of them or their family that's not cookie cutter and appreciate that I don't claim to be anything I'm not.

I do think I'm going to rent the 50D for a wedding I have coming up in October and hope to have the 17-55 2.8 by then. Maybe that will make me more comfortable with plopping down $1200 for it in the near future.

Thanks again for all the thought you put into your comment.
B

[Muuraija]

You're doing just fine with what you have for now (a lot better than me). You might be able to glean some inspiration from this thread:

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=654283

[Tom Reichner]

I think part of being a professional is having an obsession for taking the very best images that you possibly can. If you think you are doing that with your current equipment, then great! If you think you would be able to make slightly better images with updated equipment, then that's what you should do. The bottom line is image quality (at least that should be the bottom line). For some photogs, the bottom line is profit. And it frequently shows in their images.

[Nick_b]

I make a few bucks of photography but I wouldn't call myself a pro. I relate to your view on being honest with clients about yourself. I'd rather people hire me because of my work and my personality then because of a persona I've created to get them in the door.

[brennasg]

I find this an interesting thread. It seems like recently a ton of people have been complaining on here about how the 'GWC'(girl with camera) down the road is taking business away from them and they just have some cheaper consumer dslr. Of course we could never get proof of the 'GWC' work. Still though, they felt like they were losing out because cameras were so accessible to the general population.

Anyway, it has really been irritating me. Maybe the 'GWC' takes better pictures than you even if you have top of the line camera and lenses and they dont. I have actually received A LOT of flack on here cause I was doing some jobs for people with my P&S..EEK. Most of the time they were free, sometimes at a discounted rate. In my situation I just recently made the switch from 35SLR to digital. Getting the 50D by January and thats when I am actually starting up my business. Still however, does that mean people still dont like my work? Should I not practice? Not hardly, I have people asking me all the time to do shoots for them. I have a week coming up where I am renting some equipment, and I am BOOKED.

So basically the point is... you do a good job, you have a good eye. You can take pictures with your camera that others with the same camera can't. You are a professional. There is no reason to go into debt over new gear(why I have just toughed out the P&S for the year). Of course I max out the ability of my P&S and I have finally quit using it and renting until I get my camera. So you seem to have outgrown your camera. There is nothing wrong with that. You will get your next camera and be able to do even better. Keep on keepin on sista!


*Oh I also want to address the blog thing.. I mean you dont necessarily want to devalue yourself, but I dont think you do on there. I also thin that the point of blogs is to kinda get to know the photographer. Therefore humor and sarcasm is a plus..and who wants to be so snide to think that they can do no wrong..if you cant pick on yourself then what does that say about you?

[fly my pretties]

The only people who care about what body you're using are people on internet forums. Well done on making your business work on a budget, you deserve credit for that.

Also, I agree on the personal aspect to your blog. I talk an ungodly amount of crap on mine, and while I will never know if it hurts or helps me, people tell me they love reading my stuff as much as they enjoy my photos, so that's all that matters really..

[brennasg]

The only people who care about what body you're using are people on internet forums. Well done on making your business work on a budget, you deserve credit for that.

Also, I agree ont he person aspect to your blog. I talk an ungodly amount of crap on mine, and while I will never know if it hurs or helps me, people tell me they love reading my stuff as much as they enjoy my photos, so that's all that matters really..

John.. I REALLY enjoyed reading your blog..thats what Im talking about! Show some personality! You have some great shots on there too:)

[stathunter]

I'm sure this has been discussed somewhere on here before, but I can't find it in my searching, so...

I consider myself a professional photographer. I make money doing what I do, I have a website, a blog, repeat customers, and an honest to god studio.

But...

I shoot with a Rebel Xti and the kit lens (note* I rent the 17-55 2.8 for all my weddings but still use the xti body).

I'm saving for the 17-55 2.8 and the 50D but times are tough for us right now so trying to get by with what I've got.

So my question is this:

Is this normal? Am I the only freak that's trying to make a living using consumer grade equipment?

It's a little disconcerting when my clients say, "I've got that same camera!".

Should I be freaking out that I don't have better equipment? I want to create better images but feel limited by my lens. Is it the equipment or my knowledge of said equipment? Is there only so much you can do...so far you can go...with the body and lens I have?

I currently use Alien Bees in the studio but would love to use more natural light (especially for my newborns) but I can't seem to make that work with the kit lens. Is it something I'm doing wrong or just the fact that the lens can't work that well in low light.

Are there any other "pros" out there that are using the XTI and the kit lens?

Feel free to check out my site or my blog (the blog is more current) so you can comment on what you think of my abilities as a "pro", just be gentle. I'm a delicate flower.

I'm really just interested in hearing other's thoughts on this concern I have.
Thanks!
B

Holy moly....... the advice that has been given here has not, in my lame opinion, been the best.
First your statement is that you are a professional "because you make money, have website, studio etc"
You may consider yourself a professional but honestly I do not - your comment on your blog is not what I would consider professional. You mentioned that your "studio" is some space that someone let you use - something like that - space does not make a professional studio. So far you have a website, great big deal - it is not what you have but how you use it (no joke here) --- and how you present yourself. But the key here is running a successful (money making) business - which pays for updated equipment etc- and acting professional - not sure you are there with either counts.

You can run a very professional photography studio with an xti --- but in my opinion you need at least two - what happens if one breaks? Not very professional is it? In all counts you can run a professional studio with a Holga camera - truth - but you would need at least two - and you would probably have to develop your own film to meet time demands from clients - and in turn act professional and market yourself professional. It has nothing to do with the price of your equipment - that just can make things easier but the results and for a business the profit/return.

[Todd Lambert]

Also, I agree on the personal aspect to your blog. I talk an ungodly amount of crap on mine, and while I will never know if it hurts or helps me, people tell me they love reading my stuff as much as they enjoy my photos, so that's all that matters really..


Yes, but that's just it.. you probably only hear the good things, not the bad. The people that are okay with your personal stuff on your blogs, are okay and maybe even like that and tell you.

There can be just as many, if not more people who are turned off by your writings and will never tell you or let you know. You just lose out on business.

I equate writing politics, religion, personal beliefs that are more than basic industry stuff, etc... with selling a car to a relative. It's just a bad idea and should be avoided.

[brennasg]

I did mention a backup, but it's only the Rebel XT. And I could see how new equipment would makes some shots easier, and save me time.
B.


You can run a very professional photography studio with an xti --- but in my opinion you need at least two - what happens if one breaks? Not very professional is it? In all counts you can run a professional studio with a Holga camera - truth - but you would need at least two - and you would probably have to develop your own film to meet time demands from clients - and in turn act professional and market yourself professional.


see the quote above.

[carseasoncity]

Holy moly....... the advice that has been given here has not, in my lame opinion, been the best.
First your statement is that you are a professional "because you make money, have website, studio etc"
You may consider yourself a professional but honestly I do not - your comment on your blog is not what I would consider professional. You mentioned that your "studio" is some space that someone let you use - something like that - space does not make a professional studio. So far you have a website, great big deal - it is not what you have but how you use it (no joke here) --- and how you present yourself. But the key here is running a successful (money making) business - which pays for updated equipment etc- and acting professional - not sure you are there with either counts.

You can run a very professional photography studio with an xti --- but in my opinion you need at least two - what happens if one breaks? Not very professional is it? In all counts you can run a professional studio with a Holga camera - truth - but you would need at least two - and you would probably have to develop your own film to meet time demands from clients - and in turn act professional and market yourself professional. It has nothing to do with the price of your equipment - that just can make things easier but the results and for a business the profit/return.

I mentioned that my studio is a space that cost me nothing. It is not merely space. I have a dressing room, backdrops, 4 AB's, props, a counter, sitting area, windows...and even a radio. wink, wink.

So I guess this proves the point that someone can be affected by one comment on my blog, because you were. You're point is proven...you wouldn't hire me because you don't think I'm professional based on that comment. Which is a plus, because if you are someone who doesn't want to hire me based on my honest evaluation of myself, then I wouldn't want to shoot you. I don't need to be someone I'm not for you or anyone else.

I think I have far more than a website. I have clients. A lot of them. Enough that I can pay my bills with my work. Isn't that considered a "successful money making" business?

I'm sorry you feel I'm not professional but I have a lot of testimonials from many clients that feel otherwise.

And as I've already stated I have two bodies in case one breaks.

Am I really considered unproffesional because I say what's on my mind and don't worry about whether or not I may lose a few clients because of it?

Wow.

I thought artists had more integrity than that. And isn't that what photography is? Art?

I think so.
B

[stathunter]

I mentioned that my studio is a space that cost me nothing. It is not merely space. I have a dressing room, backdrops, 4 AB's, props, a counter, sitting area, windows...and even a radio. wink, wink.

So I guess this proves the point that someone can be affected by one comment on my blog, because you were. You're point is proven...you wouldn't hire me because you don't think I'm professional based on that comment. Which is a plus, because if you are someone who doesn't want to hire me based on my honest evaluation of myself, then I wouldn't want to shoot you. I don't need to be someone I'm not for you or anyone else.

I think I have far more than a website. I have clients. A lot of them. Enough that I can pay my bills with my work. Isn't that considered a "successful money making" business?

I'm sorry you feel I'm not professional but I have a lot of testimonials from many clients that feel otherwise.

And as I've already stated I have two bodies in case one breaks.

Am I really considered unproffesional because I say what's on my mind and don't worry about whether or not I may lose a few clients because of it?

Wow.

I thought artists had more integrity than that. And isn't that what photography is? Art?

I think so.
B

B - everyone has their own opinion -- you posted here because you wanted to hear opinions - this is not about creating art-- you posted in the business section. In my opinion most photographers/artists are missing key components that make them good business people. Business and art are two different things - paying your bills and having a financially successful business are not close - again my opinion.

[carseasoncity]

B - everyone has their own opinion -- you posted here because you wanted to hear opinions - this is not about creating art-- you posted in the business section. In my opinion most photographers/artists are missing key components that make them good business people. Business and art are two different things - paying your bills and having a financially successful business are not close - again my opinion.

If you're photography business is not about creating art then I feel sorry for you.

I did post to hear opinions which I'm reading, loving, mulling over, and considering. It's amazing to be able to hear so many opinions and thoughts in such a short amount of time.

This is the business section. My business is creating art. That does not mean that all I think about is making money.

I'm not sure what your definition of "successful business" is. I can't afford everything my little heart desires for my budding photography business or the newest and best gadgets (who can in this economy) but I'm able to be home with my children while helping to support my family by putting food on the table and a house over our head. We're happy, healthy and get to spend most of our time together.

I think that's pretty successful.

My opinion.
B

[AxxisPhoto]

It's not the equipment that creates a great image.;)

[cdifoto]

If you're in the studio all the time, you don't need anything more than a Rebel and a kit lens. The body will be at ISO400 at the highest and the kit lens will be stopped down. No challenge to the gear there.

[S.Horton]

My clients could care less what kind of PC I have -- They pay for results.

;}

[artona]

HI B

You stick with it, your photographs will sell well. On the subject of equipment I bought a Canon eos 1d the other day for £300. I only bought it to shoot passport photographs at one of our outlets and yet the quality from it is as good as the eos 1ds mk2 I normally use.

stew

[martial76]

I do usually mention how great the camera is and also mention how it's really not about the equipment, but how you use it.

And I agree about the camera being a tool...but I guess my concern is that I'm outgrowing my tool. You can only get so good with a 3mp phone camera, right?

I'm just itching to get better and feel I can't do that with what I've got.



I'm sorry that this seems to be the concensus on my blogging. But I won't change it. I am who I am. I write what's on my mind. If prospective clients don't like it then they won't like me. Period. I have good relationships with my clients...I'm very much a people person. I think they come to me as much for my attitude/personality as they do for my work.

In fact I've been told that from several clients. They love that I entertain them while I work, that I'm honest and open, and that I'm not stiff and unpersonal. I want my blog to reflect that.


Thanks for the advice though...I know it's hard to reflect with the written word, but I'm being sincere...I really appreciate the advice on here.
B

hey... I for one applaud u! I am or was in the same boat. I just opened my own buis. Photography has always been an intrest of mine do to my hiking and climbing and all the great places I've seen and wanted to remember. All I had was a point and shoot. A little over a year ago I bought an xsi with the kit lens. I got a few photos out of it that I liked, though most of them weren't very good at all... Which led me to start learning not only more about photography but also Photoshop! I read every book and watched every video I could get my hands on... Don't get me wrong between learning more and learning some pp skills the pics got better. However, I still wasn't happy with them. So I bought a tamron 17-50 f2.8 lens (was a little over 300) the image quality of my shots increased considerably soon as I made the switch!

Still though, images weren't all that great... But much better! Then a horrible thing happened... A buddy of mine let me play with his 40d and a 24-70 2.8 L... I was blown away!!! The sharpness, the contrast, color... Incredible! I made my mind right there. The first thing I did was bought a 50d, then the next thing was to by a fast 50mm prime for portraits (on a 1.6 crop it is 80mm and almost a perfect portrait lens... ) (the cannon 1.4 50mm is like 300)

I promise u, if u shot with that u would love your portraits! Anyway, then I picked up the 24-70l... Shortly after, I got the ability to get off cam with two strobes (speedlights) there is no comparison to shooting with a xsi and kit vs a 50d with a L series lens and off cam lighting! Now I don't want to start any arguments here I have a ton to learn still, and there are people here that know miles more than me! BUT, saying equipment isn't important???? I can't imagine me shooting with my gear and someone shooting the same thing with a xsi and a kit getting the same results. Yes a camera is just a tool... But if u had to cut down a forest would u want a 6" hand saw or a high powered chain saw? All I can tell u is once I got the gear dialed in, what used to take a lot of editing in Photoshop now comes right out of cam.

I know the gear is expensive! I put myself in debt up to my eyes to get it! But... I made the desicion to go for it... So, I did.

I wish u all the best... My only advice would be to go to a local camera shop... Ask them to let u shoot with a really nice lens on ur cam. Shoot the same thing with the kit vs an L right in store... See the diff for yourself... Then put the L on a 50 and shoot the same thing again. I noticed a huge difference, I'm sure you will too!

Best of luck,
Jason

[Nick_b]

Yes, but that's just it.. you probably only hear the good things, not the bad. The people that are okay with your personal stuff on your blogs, are okay and maybe even like that and tell you.

There can be just as many, if not more people who are turned off by your writings and will never tell you or let you know. You just lose out on business.

I equate writing politics, religion, personal beliefs that are more than basic industry stuff, etc... with selling a car to a relative. It's just a bad idea and should be avoided.


It could go the other way as well. Maybe a photographer loses business because they seem too uppity? I'm sure there is a happy medium but I think there is something to be said about people in a creative arts business putting themselves out there especially considering how uncomfortable it is to be photographed.

But I guess there is always the robotic approach barking orders at your model.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-xObB-itSU I know I wouldn't want to work with that "pro".

[YankeeMom]

Well, I skipped the blog and went over to your professional site and I have to say that I am very impressed with the quality of the images you take! Like someone else said, 10 years ago the XTi would be considered high-end and professional. Ultimately, it's about what's going on behind the camera and you've got it. If you can afford to upgrade, that's great -- improvements are always a good thing -- but I wouldn't sweat it when you are already successful. (Personally, I would look into better lenses before upgrading the body.) Again, great job -- go to her business site for better examples!

[rammy]

Like others have stated, it is the person behind the camera that counts. Keep doing what you are doing with what you have. My first camera was the 300D with kit lens and I sold images and was also published in a national UK magazine with images from that camera and lens.

IMHO, no need to upgrade unless your kit breaks or you can't accomplish a shot due to the technical limitations.

[wayovrpar]

I mentioned that my studio is a space that cost me nothing. It is not merely space. I have a dressing room, backdrops, 4 AB's, props, a counter, sitting area, windows...and even a radio. wink, wink.

So I guess this proves the point that someone can be affected by one comment on my blog, because you were. You're point is proven...you wouldn't hire me because you don't think I'm professional based on that comment. Which is a plus, because if you are someone who doesn't want to hire me based on my honest evaluation of myself, then I wouldn't want to shoot you. I don't need to be someone I'm not for you or anyone else.

I think I have far more than a website. I have clients. A lot of them. Enough that I can pay my bills with my work. Isn't that considered a "successful money making" business?

I'm sorry you feel I'm not professional but I have a lot of testimonials from many clients that feel otherwise.

And as I've already stated I have two bodies in case one breaks.

Am I really considered unproffesional because I say what's on my mind and don't worry about whether or not I may lose a few clients because of it?

Wow.

I thought artists had more integrity than that. And isn't that what photography is? Art?

I think so.
B

Yes, that is unprofessional. I want to say that your work is very good, and I enjoyed looking at your site. Just because you are not bothered by what others say does not mean that everyone is going to be fine with what you say. Remember Puck on Real World?? He said whatever he wanted because that was what was on his mind...most agree he was an ***hole. Let your camera continue to speak for you...it is doing a great job. Remember, word of mouth is the most powerful form of advertising. If you piss too many people off because you're just "speaking your mind" you will be an artist with nobody to shoot. Again, your work is very good.

This is a non-pro opinion...take it for what it's worth.
Cheers,
Corey

[Todd Lambert]

Well, I'm not talking about the way you actually talk to or interact with your customers... more about the subject matter.

I am a web developer by occupation. If I put on my blog, that "I don't really know what I am talking about", or "I don't know what I am doing" - would people really take that as being honest and that I'm "a good guy" and want to hire me more because of that?

I don't think so. I'm not saying to be a robot and only post press releases on your site, but just be mindful of what you are posting on your site for your CUSTOMERS to read, that's all. You don't want to write about things that make customers doubt your skills or your prices, or your experience with other customers, etc.. These don't do anything to increase your "likability" at all and can do quite a bit to damage your reputation instead.

Keep your politics, religion and other "touchy" opinions to yourself or put them somewhere else. Don't mix your blog and professional website unless you are prepared to be mindful of these things.

I'm not preaching, just giving my opinion... remember, whatever you put on your website is there FOREVER. Once it's on the Internet, it's on the Internet. You can't go back and UNDO it. It's also doesn't have the same intricacies that speech does. People can make assumptions, mistaken context, etc.. you never know.

[carseasoncity]

You're doing just fine with what you have for now (a lot better than me). You might be able to glean some inspiration from this thread:

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=654283

Thanks so much! I'll take a look at the thread you posted.

I make a few bucks of photography but I wouldn't call myself a pro. I relate to your view on being honest with clients about yourself. I'd rather people hire me because of my work and my personality then because of a persona I've created to get them in the door.

Completely agree! I don't want to be fake with people...they can sense that and it makes them uncomfortable.

I want them to come to me because of me and my art, not because I tricked them by my fancy description of myself or my accomplishments.

I find this an interesting thread. It seems like recently a ton of people have been complaining on here about how the 'GWC'(girl with camera) down the road is taking business away from them and they just have some cheaper consumer dslr. Of course we could never get proof of the 'GWC' work. Still though, they felt like they were losing out because cameras were so accessible to the general population.

Anyway, it has really been irritating me. Maybe the 'GWC' takes better pictures than you even if you have top of the line camera and lenses and they dont. I have actually received A LOT of flack on here cause I was doing some jobs for people with my P&S..EEK. Most of the time they were free, sometimes at a discounted rate. In my situation I just recently made the switch from 35SLR to digital. Getting the 50D by January and thats when I am actually starting up my business. Still however, does that mean people still dont like my work? Should I not practice? Not hardly, I have people asking me all the time to do shoots for them. I have a week coming up where I am renting some equipment, and I am BOOKED.

So basically the point is... you do a good job, you have a good eye. You can take pictures with your camera that others with the same camera can't. You are a professional. There is no reason to go into debt over new gear(why I have just toughed out the P&S for the year). Of course I max out the ability of my P&S and I have finally quit using it and renting until I get my camera. So you seem to have outgrown your camera. There is nothing wrong with that. You will get your next camera and be able to do even better. Keep on keepin on sista!


*Oh I also want to address the blog thing.. I mean you dont necessarily want to devalue yourself, but I dont think you do on there. I also thin that the point of blogs is to kinda get to know the photographer. Therefore humor and sarcasm is a plus..and who wants to be so snide to think that they can do no wrong..if you cant pick on yourself then what does that say about you?

Am I really just a GWC? :( That's okay. I don't mind. But I guess the "pros" don't take kindly to it. :)

I agree with your thought that the blog is a place to get to know the photographer. In fact most of my first time clients have never even been to the blog. They only go there after their session and then they seem to keep coming back to check up on what I've done recently.

hey... I for one applaud u! I am or was in the same boat. I just opened my own buis. Photography has always been an intrest of mine do to my hiking and climbing and all the great places I've seen and wanted to remember. All I had was a point and shoot. A little over a year ago I bought an xsi with the kit lens. I got a few photos out of it that I liked, though most of them weren't very good at all... Which led me to start learning not only more about photography but also Photoshop! I read every book and watched every video I could get my hands on... Don't get me wrong between learning more and learning some pp skills the pics got better. However, I still wasn't happy with them. So I bought a tamron 17-50 f2.8 lens (was a little over 300) the image quality of my shots increased considerably soon as I made the switch!

Still though, images weren't all that great... But much better! Then a horrible thing happened... A buddy of mine let me play with his 40d and a 24-70 2.8 L... I was blown away!!! The sharpness, the contrast, color... Incredible! I made my mind right there. The first thing I did was bought a 50d, then the next thing was to by a fast 50mm prime for portraits (on a 1.6 crop it is 80mm and almost a perfect portrait lens... ) (the cannon 1.4 50mm is like 300)

I promise u, if u shot with that u would love your portraits! Anyway, then I picked up the 24-70l... Shortly after, I got the ability to get off cam with two strobes (speedlights) there is no comparison to shooting with a xsi and kit vs a 50d with a L series lens and off cam lighting! Now I don't want to start any arguments here I have a ton to learn still, and there are people here that know miles more than me! BUT, saying equipment isn't important???? I can't imagine me shooting with my gear and someone shooting the same thing with a xsi and a kit getting the same results. Yes a camera is just a tool... But if u had to cut down a forest would u want a 6" hand saw or a high powered chain saw? All I can tell u is once I got the gear dialed in, what used to take a lot of editing in Photoshop now comes right out of cam.

I know the gear is expensive! I put myself in debt up to my eyes to get it! But... I made the desicion to go for it... So, I did.

I wish u all the best... My only advice would be to go to a local camera shop... Ask them to let u shoot with a really nice lens on ur cam. Shoot the same thing with the kit vs an L right in store... See the diff for yourself... Then put the L on a 50 and shoot the same thing again. I noticed a huge difference, I'm sure you will too!

Best of luck,
Jason

Thank you so much for the personal experience and the well wishes! I am fully aware of the greatness of the better lenses. I always rent either the 17-55 2.8 or the 24-70 2.8 for my weddings. The difference is amazing. I can't imagine how much better it would be with the 50d instead of the XTI.

It could go the other way as well. Maybe a photographer loses business because they seem too uppity? I'm sure there is a happy medium but I think there is something to be said about people in a creative arts business putting themselves out there especially considering how uncomfortable it is to be photographed.

But I guess there is always the robotic approach barking orders at your model.... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-xObB-itSU I know I wouldn't want to work with that "pro".

Love the link! Hilarious!

And you're right...I know for a fact that people avoid "uppity" photographers because I did. I have also had two different clients tell me that they avoided a photographer in our area because she was too cold and unpersonal (is that a word?).

I don't want people to think I'm an unprofessional clown, but I also don't want to come of as haughty or severe. I'm trying to be balanced.

Well, I skipped the blog and went over to your professional site and I have to say that I am very impressed with the quality of the images you take! Like someone else said, 10 years ago the XTi would be considered high-end and professional. Ultimately, it's about what's going on behind the camera and you've got it. If you can afford to upgrade, that's great -- improvements are always a good thing -- but I wouldn't sweat it when you are already successful. (Personally, I would look into better lenses before upgrading the body.) Again, great job -- go to her business site for better examples!

Thank you so much! It means a lot to know a fellow photographer is impressed by your work. Truly.

And I'm hoping to have the 17-55 2.8 by October. Wish me luck!
B

[Nightstalker]

results matter. that's all really.

If you deliver what is expected, then awesome.


I agree with you 100% - the fact is though I felt that that the equipment I had was not to the highest standard and this made me reluctant to pursue the higher-end / more technically demanding, better paying jobs as I was not sure I would get results that I was happy with.

As with everyone we all see problems with our own work that clients would not recognise - having the better quality gear does impart the confidence that I won't fail due to equipment limitations. I may fail due to my own limitations but not those of my kit.

[brennasg]

Am I really just a GWC? :( That's okay. I don't mind. But I guess the "pros" don't take kindly to it. :)

B

No you are not... that is just what people have been throwing around on here, while complaing of local competition. They assume that just because someone doesnt have all the money to throw around that they do, that they arent any good. It pisses me off. People have to start from the ground up, so what the problem? I just dont get it.

oh and I often wonder if the G can stand for guy as well as girl..cause I always see it used for girl..which I find interesting considering the majority of this forum is male.

[Tom Reichner]

. . . just be mindful of what you are posting on your site for your CUSTOMERS to read, that's all. You don't want to write about things that make customers doubt your skills or your prices, or your experience with other customers, etc.. These don't do anything to increase your "likability" at all and can do quite a bit to damage your reputation instead.


Actually, it is for potential customers. If someone is already a customer, meaning that they have already paid you for services or signed a binding contract with you, then you don't have to work at making a first impression. They've already decided on you.

What the website is really for is to bring in new customers.

What will a total stranger think of you if all they know about you is what they read on your blog? Will what you say on your blog give potential customers absolute confidence in your ability and professionalism? If not, then why would you even have a blog?

Just like your camera and lens, your blog is a tool that helps you get a job done. It is your marketing tool.

[carseasoncity]

Yes, that is unprofessional. I want to say that your work is very good, and I enjoyed looking at your site. Just because you are not bothered by what others say does not mean that everyone is going to be fine with what you say. Remember Puck on Real World?? He said whatever he wanted because that was what was on his mind...most agree he was an ***hole. Let your camera continue to speak for you...it is doing a great job. Remember, word of mouth is the most powerful form of advertising. If you piss too many people off because you're just "speaking your mind" you will be an artist with nobody to shoot. Again, your work is very good.

This is a non-pro opinion...take it for what it's worth.
Cheers,
Corey

Thanks again for the opinions...I love hearing what everyone has to say...though we've gotten a little off topic.

I really don't think I'm being unprofessional. At all. I'm not sure what's sparked this huge debate. I'm not talking about major controversial things on my little happy blog. I'm talking about beautiful babies, rambunctious toddlers, hectic weddings, my family, and my concerns as a photographer. Sometimes that's about my worries that I don't have enough book knowledge about shooting and sometimes it's about my awesome-ness because I got a shot that I was hoping for.

It's really who I am.

Are you seriously comparing me to Puck? :) Have you even LOOKED at my blog? I'm very mild. I don't even use profanity and I never discuss anything even mildly offensive.

Well, I'm not talking about the way you actually talk to or interact with your customers... more about the subject matter.

I am a web developer by occupation. If I put on my blog, that "I don't really know what I am talking about", or "I don't know what I am doing" - would people really take that as being honest and that I'm "a good guy" and want to hire me more because of that?

I don't think so. I'm not saying to be a robot and only post press releases on your site, but just be mindful of what you are posting on your site for your CUSTOMERS to read, that's all. You don't want to write about things that make customers doubt your skills or your prices, or your experience with other customers, etc.. These don't do anything to increase your "likability" at all and can do quite a bit to damage your reputation instead.

Keep your politics, religion and other "touchy" opinions to yourself or put them somewhere else. Don't mix your blog and professional website unless you are prepared to be mindful of these things.

I'm not preaching, just giving my opinion... remember, whatever you put on your website is there FOREVER. Once it's on the Internet, it's on the Internet. You can't go back and UNDO it. It's also doesn't have the same intricacies that speech does. People can make assumptions, mistaken context, etc.. you never know.

Again...thanks for the advice and opinions...I really do appreciate it.

But I'm NOT discussing anything controversial on my blog. I'm very mindful of being unoffensive to people.

I agree that people can make assumptions and mistake context, but I'm willing to accept a lost client in order to be able to express my thoughts on my blog. Because if I've lost them because of a thought I had, then I didn't want them anyway.

And as far as things being on the web being on there forever...

If I don't post on my blog for fear that it could come back and haunt me I would NEVER post images anywhere. Ever.

I've posted total crap imags on here when I was first starting out that anyone could see as well as other sites.

I just hope my prospective clients base their decision to hire me on my current work and my personality...not my past work. :)
B

[carseasoncity]

Actually, it is for potential customers. If someone is already a customer, meaning that they have already paid you for services or signed a binding contract with you, then you don't have to work at making a first impression. They've already decided on you.

What the website is really for is to bring in new customers.

What will a total stranger think of you if all they know about you is what they read on your blog? Will what you say on your blog give potential customers absolute confidence in your ability and professionalism? If not, then why would you even have a blog?

Just like your camera and lens, your blog is a tool that helps you get a job done. It is your marketing tool.

I agree that my website is for potential customers. My blog is not. As I've already stated, my blog is usually only viewed by clients...not prospective clients. I ask all of my new clients if they've been on the blog and so far none of them have unless they were referred there by one of my current clients.

If someone stumbles upon my blog before they do my website and they hate my attitude, my images or are turned off by my apparent lack of confidence on some days then so be it. I lost a client...maybe.

But I may also gain a client who's sick of hearing the same old, "I have this award" and "I'm so wonderful that I'm in this magazine" bit. Maybe there are some people out there that just want a little honesty. A little truth from someone who can admit that they're a little nervous about a new business venture or doubts their abilities from time to time. Don't we all?

I know I do. It makes me want to give them a chance to show me what they can do. I'm always for the underdog.

I feel I'm using my blog as a marketing tool...just maybe not in the same way that every Tom, Dick and Harry are using theirs. I blog because I like to write, to express...the same reason I shoot...to express myself via art.

The clients I have like that. They love the blog and tell me so.

I guess if I have no work in the next year I can blame it on my big mouth on the blog. :)

Thanks again for the insight!
B

[Tom Reichner]

I blog because I like to write, to express...

Hey - that's what I use this forum for!

[cdifoto]

I don't think my comments on my blog are "self-deriding", they're honest. I make no grandiose claims about my photography or myself. Maybe it's bad marketing. But this is who I am.

And if I was going to worry about things on my site (my professional site or my blog) being misinterpreted then I wouldn't have a site. Because even tiny things can be misinterpreted...and they are.

Things are tight, but I'm not willing to portray myself as something I'm not just to get a few new clients. I don't like sugar-coating and I feel fake if I try to make myself sound all "professional" and sophisticated, though I do consider myself to be dignified, handling my clients professionally, and I'd even call myself a classy lady. :)

If my prospective clients get scared off because of one or two comments on my blog about how I'm scared that I'm not good enough or that I wish I was better, then they can go to one of the other two photographers in town that claim to know it all.

The kind of clients I want are the ones that see how hard I work, how determined I am to get a good image of them or their family that's not cookie cutter and appreciate that I don't claim to be anything I'm not.
I understand how you feel about not putting on, and it's my approach too. HOWEVER, there's a line between self-deprecating and know-it-all-uppity. You want to ride the line. You don't want to be negative. You can admit when you're experimenting but you don't want to say you're clueless about what you're doing.

You can be approachable without being a moron, and you can be confident without being pretentious.

[carseasoncity]

Hey - that's what I use this forum for!

I know a lot of people do. And they do so without restraint sometimes. It's interesting to note that if I do a search for Tom Reichner photography the third link to show up is to a post on here under "slightly rude street photography".

What would a potential client think if they see that? I guess it's about the same as putting my thoughts down on my blog. If they come across it and form an impression of me based on one comment I make about feeling like I have no idea what I'm doing then so be it. They could come to the same conclusion by seeing some of my posts on this very forum.

I understand how you feel about not putting on, and it's my approach too. HOWEVER, there's a line between self-deprecating and know-it-all-uppity. You want to ride the line. You don't want to be negative. You can admit when you're experimenting but you don't want to say you're clueless about what you're doing.

You can be approachable without being a moron, and you can be confident without being pretentious.

Perfect!

Well said.

I would never call myself "self-deprecating". I feel very confident in my abilities as a photographer...most days. The comment that is being referred to (I'm assuming) is being taken way out of context. I was merely telling a client that if she wanted to take up photography then she should do it because I did and I still struggle with the "technical" side of it but can get great images.

I do feel confident and I have NEVER been called negative (quite the opposite), so I think I'm striking a happy balance.

Thanks for the thought.
B

[Mhappy]

carseasoncity,
I enjoyed looking at your pictures!! They're wonderful! (btw, what did you use on the floor to make it shiny?? :)
I agree with what some others have said in this thread... They are paying for the finished product! If you know how to use the correct exposures, apertures and shutters with the light you have access to, and you're getting steady *paid* work, then I don't know how that's not shooting professionally. (unless you are always shooting in Auto... then I'd suggest learn the ins and outs before calling yourself a pro!... But I don't think that's the case here!)
I think better glass definitely makes a big difference!

[int2str]

First off, you have some very nice images on your site. You definitely have a lot of talent and your using your equipment well. That said...

Your blog is definitely somewhat unprofessional. You cannot argue that point away. Your point that non of your new clients have seen your blog does not hold up to the corollary by which you can't tell who DIDN'T become a client BECAUSE they saw your blog.

Of course you can be honest on your blog and express yourself. Just filter some of the more personal/negative comments and make sure you are showing yourself in a positive light.

Content aside, your blog is also not exhibiting professionalism because it has Google Ads on it. I would never put ads on a professional website - especially when you can't control the ad content. Heck, when I go to your blog I get ads for other photographers...

Purely esthetically, black text on gray is hard to read.

On the commercial side, you also received some advice here that a successful business should pay for upgraded equipment. You countered (argued?) that you feel you are successful. I do congratulate you for creating beautiful art and having found a great work/life balance. However, I would not consider my BUSINESS successful if it doesn't pay for the gear needed.

Many businesses start (or should) with leveraged capital (read: business loans) to buy the equipment needed. Then the business income is used to cover the initial outlay and to pay for new gear etc. Since you're already well past "step 1" with your business, it seems like the solution should be very easy. You can either take a small business loan to buy the gear that would allow you to expand the business. Or, set aside a couple hundred $$$ a month to save up for expansion.

Of course you should budget any "expansion". If a 2nd body and a few new lenses allows you to shoot more/higher paying weddings and portraits, then go for it and the outlay will amortize itself. If you don't think you can turn additional lenses/gear into more $$$, than new gear is completely in the "would be nice" category - which in business simply means "NO".

Bottom line is, you don't seem very open to the suggestions that were provided here. If you really are a "pro" (I have no opinion on this), then you'll approach that part as a business and take the advice you've been given without feeling personally attacked and make your own decision based on what works/doesn't work for your business.

[carseasoncity]

First off, you have some very nice images on your site. You definitely have a lot of talent and your using your equipment well. That said...

Your blog is definitely somewhat unprofessional. You cannot argue that point away. Your point that non of your new clients have seen your blog does not hold up to the corollary by which you can't tell who DIDN'T become a client BECAUSE they saw your blog.

Of course you can be honest on your blog and express yourself. Just filter some of the more personal/negative comments and make sure you are showing yourself in a positive light.

Content aside, your blog is also not exhibiting professionalism because it has Google Ads on it. I would never put ads on a professional website - especially when you can't control the ad content. Heck, when I go to your blog I get ads for other photographers...

Purely esthetically, black text on gray is hard to read.

On the commercial side, you also received some advice here that a successful business should pay for upgraded equipment. You countered (argued?) that you feel you are successful. I do congratulate you for creating beautiful art and having found a great work/life balance. However, I would not consider my BUSINESS successful if it doesn't pay for the gear needed.

Many businesses start (or should) with leveraged capital (read: business loans) to buy the equipment needed. Then the business income is used to cover the initial outlay and to pay for new gear etc. Since you're already well past "step 1" with your business, it seems like the solution should be very easy. You can either take a small business loan to buy the gear that would allow you to expand the business. Or, set aside a couple hundred $$$ a month to save up for expansion.

Of course you should budget any "expansion". If a 2nd body and a few new lenses allows you to shoot more/higher paying weddings and portraits, then go for it and the outlay will amortize itself. If you don't think you can turn additional lenses/gear into more $$$, than new gear is completely in the "would be nice" category - which in business simply means "NO".

Bottom line is, you don't seem very open to the suggestions that were provided here. If you really are a "pro" (I have no opinion on this), then you'll approach that part as a business and take the advice you've been given without feeling personally attacked and make your own decision based on what works/doesn't work for your business.

I, in no way, feel personally attacked. I love that I can get all of this input and advice on here in a matter of hours.

But just because someone gives you advice doesn't mean you have to take it, right?

And your right...I can't argue away the fact that some people may feel that my site is "somewhat unprofessional"...they have the right to that opinion.

My point about my clients not being put off by my blog DOES hold up...because I may have lost 100 clients because of my apparent "unprofessionalism" but I'm okay with that. If they don't like me for me and my art can't stand on its own then we won't work together well anyway.

I am being positive on my blog. The idea that I'm a negative person who's down on myself is NOT what my blog is reflecting. I'm not sure how one comment from my blog has started this whole debate(?) on how I'm a self-deprecating negative person. I am so not. I'm exactly the opposite of negative.

The ads are a test. They won't be there long and haven't been there long.

I won't even go into the black/white/grey text thing. It's pointless, but I see what you're saying.

As for me arguing (countering) about my "successful" business...I really don't mean to sound argumentative. I'm just expressing my viewpoint on the matter. That doesn't mean that I'm not ingesting some of the advice and input. It also doesn't mean that I'm going to rush out and do everything that everyone suggests. I would be running in circles.

My business COULD pay for more equipment but my husband has recently changed jobs and so my pay is making up for his lost pay instead of going back into my business to make it more acceptable.

When that changes then hopefully I'll be able to get my business further off the ground.

I am VERY open to suggestions...and appreciate all that I have received thus far.
B

[cdifoto]

Hmm. This is starting to look like one of those "I want your opinion but only if it reinforces mine" threads.

[YankeeMom]

Hmm. This is starting to look like one of those "I want your opinion but only if it reinforces mine" threads.

I don't see it like that at all. She didn't ask for opinions about her blog -- she was inquiring if others use basic equipment, as pros, like she does. Well, DO THEY? Anyone??

I think it is nice that people are trying to give her advice about the blog, but she doesn't have to take it and people shouldn't get offended if she doesn't.

It seems to me that she is more successful than most people who post or read here and maybe it bugs people that it's not all about the equipment. Personally, equipment worship is overkill here; she defys the conventional wisdom and I think it's great. :D Does this mean she shouldn't upgrade? Of course not! But she is smart to get out there and get things going long before breaking the bank on equipment.

She reinforces the facts that it is more about who is behind the camera than the cameras themselves. And before someone tells me what "junk" the Xti/kit lens is, I'm not going to listen. 10 years ago everyone on this board (including pros) would have jumped for joy to have one. Years ago, the image quality and features would have been considered top of the line. :)

[cdifoto]

I don't see it like that at all. She didn't ask for opinions about her blog
.....

Feel free to check out my site or my blog (the blog is more current) so you can comment on what you think of my abilities as a "pro"

[kja]

Very interesting thread. I have a different take on one thing...if you are booking 2-3 clients a week and still can't afford a $1000 lens, you may need to take a look at your business plan and costings. Kinda sounds like you're working too hard for too little.

Changing what you offer can often bring in clients you never considered as well as making those you currently cater for more profitable. Business is an evolution and if it's not paying the bills, you need to rethink, recharge and rework it 'til it does.

I don't shoot nearly that volume and I'm not a super high end photographer, but my photography does just fine in making sure that I have all the tools I need to do the job, to grow in my skills and techniques and to make my business work.

[_aravena]

I'll keep this as to the point as I can.

Are you unprofessional. A bit. Unlike some I'm sure, I really read through your blog...a lot. It's great and refreshing to see something so personal. Catch that? It's not bad and the fact that it's more for past clients than new ones is great. As a business owner and someone "running" a business, it's a horrible idea for new customers. We do not always fit the ideal business plan though. Captialism is about fitting your own business plan and if everything fits, life is fine, and you're not the "struggling artist" ;) then who cares?

I have a blog like yours, kinda. More bloggish with shoots thrown in. It's HIGHLY unprofessional so I keep it away from my site but it does have it's own set of followers, which is another area I work in. Professional blogging? Yes, kinda. I may get there if I care to. Never the less, your work is great and what else matters? I consider myself a pro as I'm like you. I make money, doing stuff outside a studio. I would love to have one and even may, but it's not a priority as it's fun but I like being out. That's me.

Here's the thing, if you're so proud, stop defending herself about being unprofessional, or your blog being as such. It is and be proud because it's you. I'm also sure that you're a bit different in person meeting some for the first time. I know I am. I let my guard down after awhile but it all becomes gravy then. I actually, apparently like you, keep up with former clients and even have become close friends with some. It's great.

I am confused by your money intake unless business just started booming. While your husband is out of work, why couldn't you have gotten more earlier? Sure the space is free but the equipment was not. You could have easily left out studio work and got lenses and built the studio over time. The space would have been there. Either way, it's in the past and you need glass, just for some diversity.

If I were you, I'd skip the 17-55. Seriously, it's nice but think what you could get for $1000+. Tamron or Sigma equiv, 70-200F4, flash, prime, who knows. Money a lot better spent and if you don't like...sell. If you find the IS useful on the 17-85, then maybe get the 17-55 but as you may see, plenty do well without IS on the wide angle lenses so something to ponder. Plus, it's always more fun getting many toys than just one! :D

Continue the good work and be yourself. Don't worry about Stat. he cracks me up. Words can go to ones head but so does exposure. Just clicking on his site, like the first 4 photos on the slideshow, if I recall, I thought were horrible and reminded me of my first wedding. I don't say that 'cause he's a douche, but because I honestly wanted to see what he offered as he comments often and then I realized, Martha Stewart did go to jail. :lol:

[Todd Lambert]

Ha.. Nathan, you crack me up.

Good post!

[cdifoto]

Plus, it's always more fun getting many toys than just one! :D
I dunno. I think it's more fun to have a few toys that are awesome than a lot of toys that are just so-so. My nephew literally has a tractor-trailer full of toys but he only has maybe 10 that get played with.

I currently have 4 lenses (one is a prosumer standard zoom for backup) and they do everything I need. They each have their job and they do it well.

[_aravena]

^Very true but like you said, some can do the same job as something more expensive. While I really want the 70-200 F2.8 IS, the non does the job. I was more saying the 17-55 is not needed as much as she could diversify with some nice glass and still get the job done as shown with the 17-85.

Thanks Todd. I try to be lately. Life has just been too serious...ew, bad joke from TDK.

[carseasoncity]

Hmm. This is starting to look like one of those "I want your opinion but only if it reinforces mine" threads.

Nope. As I mentioned before I am taking this all in. Mulling it around...letting it tickle my brain.

I'm very open to opinions...but I'm not going to start deleting posts, changing my blog colors, and try to be a different, more "professional" person all because a few people who I don't even know think I sound negative or unprofessional.

I don't see it like that at all. She didn't ask for opinions about her blog -- she was inquiring if others use basic equipment, as pros, like she does. Well, DO THEY? Anyone??

I think it is nice that people are trying to give her advice about the blog, but she doesn't have to take it and people shouldn't get offended if she doesn't.

It seems to me that she is more successful than most people who post or read here and maybe it bugs people that it's not all about the equipment. Personally, equipment worship is overkill here; she defys the conventional wisdom and I think it's great. :D Does this mean she shouldn't upgrade? Of course not! But she is smart to get out there and get things going long before breaking the bank on equipment.

She reinforces the facts that it is more about who is behind the camera than the cameras themselves. And before someone tells me what "junk" the Xti/kit lens is, I'm not going to listen. 10 years ago everyone on this board (including pros) would have jumped for joy to have one. Years ago, the image quality and features would have been considered top of the line. :)

Thank you, thank you, thank you!

I really WAS just asking for input on whether or not other people have experienced working as a professional with a consumer grade camera.

How we ended up discussing my merit as a pro and how my blog is sucky I have no idea.

The only reason I suggested that people go to my blog to judge my work on it's professionalism (meaning the quality of my PICTURES not my blog) was because that's where my most current work is. My website is my professional site... www.priesterphotography.com (http://www.priesterphotography.com) ..the blog is for current clients and they've already decided that they like me and my work. They don't think I'm unprofessional because I talk about things that concern me.

I'll keep this as to the point as I can.

Are you unprofessional. A bit. Unlike some I'm sure, I really read through your blog...a lot. It's great and refreshing to see something so personal. Catch that? It's not bad and the fact that it's more for past clients than new ones is great. As a business owner and someone "running" a business, it's a horrible idea for new customers. We do not always fit the ideal business plan though. Captialism is about fitting your own business plan and if everything fits, life is fine, and you're not the "struggling artist" ;) then who cares?

I have a blog like yours, kinda. More bloggish with shoots thrown in. It's HIGHLY unprofessional so I keep it away from my site but it does have it's own set of followers, which is another area I work in. Professional blogging? Yes, kinda. I may get there if I care to. Never the less, your work is great and what else matters? I consider myself a pro as I'm like you. I make money, doing stuff outside a studio. I would love to have one and even may, but it's not a priority as it's fun but I like being out. That's me.

Here's the thing, if you're so proud, stop defending herself about being unprofessional, or your blog being as such. It is and be proud because it's you. I'm also sure that you're a bit different in person meeting some for the first time. I know I am. I let my guard down after awhile but it all becomes gravy then. I actually, apparently like you, keep up with former clients and even have become close friends with some. It's great.

I am confused by your money intake unless business just started booming. While your husband is out of work, why couldn't you have gotten more earlier? Sure the space is free but the equipment was not. You could have easily left out studio work and got lenses and built the studio over time. The space would have been there. Either way, it's in the past and you need glass, just for some diversity.

If I were you, I'd skip the 17-55. Seriously, it's nice but think what you could get for $1000+. Tamron or Sigma equiv, 70-200F4, flash, prime, who knows. Money a lot better spent and if you don't like...sell. If you find the IS useful on the 17-85, then maybe get the 17-55 but as you may see, plenty do well without IS on the wide angle lenses so something to ponder. Plus, it's always more fun getting many toys than just one! :D

Continue the good work and be yourself. Don't worry about Stat. he cracks me up. Words can go to ones head but so does exposure. Just clicking on his site, like the first 4 photos on the slideshow, if I recall, I thought were horrible and reminded me of my first wedding. I don't say that 'cause he's a douche, but because I honestly wanted to see what he offered as he comments often and then I realized, Martha Stewart did go to jail. :lol:

I am proud of my blog and being a bit unconventional. I don't think I ever questioned that. Someone else did in the beginning of this post. I don't feel like I'm defending myself though...just stating facts. Others are free to think what they wish about my site and my professionalism. I think I'm on the right track and I'm too stubborn for it not to work at this point.

About the money intake...

My business DID just start booming. About 3 months ago. That's why the sudden panic about shooting with the XTI and not having the money to rush out and buy big.

And I have lights because my parents bought them for me as a gift (they felt guilty for sending my sister to college and not myself). :) So...free studio space, lights as a gift and I'm stuck with the XT and the kit lens, so I've tried to make the best out of it until now. When business is booming and I'm feeling like I've outgrown my equipment.

Thank you so much for the advice and the kind words of encouragement. I'm keepin' on keepin' on and waiting for the financial break I need to kick it in high gear.

And thanks for taking the time to read my blog...I've gotta go check out yours. because you sound hilarious.
B

[_aravena]

Yeah...it's not. :lol:

Occasionally it can be. I need to keep writing in it and try posting more photos. But awesome parents, con them into more with guilt! :D

[cdifoto]

Nope. As I mentioned before I am taking this all in. Mulling it around...letting it tickle my brain.

I'm very open to opinions...but I'm not going to start deleting posts, changing my blog colors, and try to be a different, more "professional" person all because a few people who I don't even know think I sound negative or unprofessional.
Sounds good to me. I admit I didn't actually read your blog (no offense but I don't care to) so I was just bouncing off what others said.

Just walk the line and do what works. I'm sure that some things I've said along the way have turned some people off of me as a person and a photographer but that's just life. I won't lose sleep over it since I'm just being me and I'm unaware of it anyway. I've also been called an a$$hole to my face more than once, and yet there are other people who absolutely love me. Sometimes the ones that love me are the ones calling me an a$$hole! :lol:

Just try to keep the TMI to a minimum. I've failed on that front quite a few times. :rolleyes: :)

[mritchy]

I'm not a quitter and I definitely have what it takes to run this business...minus the cash flow for new equipment. :)

Thanks for the input.
B

When I first opened this thread and started reading, I was almost sure that I was going to agree with the OP's situation on the "we have all been there" standpoint. We have. I have to say, that if you have been shooting for 3 years and you are still XT'ing with a kit lens, there might be something wrong. NOW. Don't take what I have said and turn it into one of those "well, it's not about the equipment" wars. I understand that. I shot with an XS for a few months and got spectacular results without any L support. But 3 years is too long to be shooting like that, honestly. The first time I picked up a DSLR was in January of this year and now look what I use. I am a college student at the most expensive private school in Texas (more than Yale now, apparently) and I pay my own housing, car insurance, gas, food, etc and tuition is paid on scholarship. Basically, all of my income to live is based on photography now. All of my equipment from the very beginning has been funded by my photography work as well. I have shot over 2 dozen weddings since I started them in April, have a running product photography base, and shoot engagements and portraits on a weekly basis. I'm sorry, but if you are not generating a cash flow after 3 years of business, you do not have what it takes to run it. PLEASE GET A BACKUP CAMERA. If you gain nothing else from this, whether it is a used $250 XT or a 5D MKII, get another camera. Do your clients a favor if not yourself.

[cdifoto]

When I first opened this thread and started reading, I was almost sure that I was going to agree with the OP's situation on the "we have all been there" standpoint. We have. I have to say, that if you have been shooting for 3 years and you are still XT'ing with a kit lens, there might be something wrong. NOW. Don't take what I have said and turn it into one of those "well, it's not about the equipment" wars. I understand that. I shot with an XS for a few months and got spectacular results without any L support. But 3 years is too long to be shooting like that, honestly. The first time I picked up a DSLR was in January of this year and now look what I use. I am a college student at the most expensive private school in Texas (more than Yale now, apparently) and I pay my own housing, car insurance, gas, food, etc and tuition is paid on scholarship. Basically, all of my income to live is based on photography now. All of my equipment from the very beginning has been funded by my photography work as well. I have shot over 2 dozen weddings since I started them in April, have a running product photography base, and shoot engagements and portraits on a weekly basis. I'm sorry, but if you are not generating a cash flow after 3 years of business, you do not have what it takes to run it. PLEASE GET A BACKUP CAMERA. If you gain nothing else from this, whether it is a used $250 XT or a 5D MKII, get another camera. Do your clients a favor if not yourself.
1. OP already has a backup camera.
2. 24 weddings in 5 months? Impressive. That's more than one every weekend. WoM spreads like wildfire where you live. That doesn't happen everywhere. Consider yourself lucky.

[mritchy]

1. OP already has a backup camera.
2. Not everyone lives in heavily populated areas where networking spreads like wildfire.

1. Then I take back the comment on the camera. From what I read, all she has is an XT or XTi and a kit lens, occasionally renting the 17-55 2.8

2. Well, if you don't live in a market for something, then don't start a business doing it. Keep it a hobby. That's just basic economics. Supply and demand. Depending on how much the OP charges for her services, it may be a price elasticity issue, but I'll assume that she keeps her prices at equillibrium and also assume that where she is it would be a perfctly competative market.

[mritchy]

1. OP already has a backup camera.
2. 24 weddings in 5 months? Impressive. That's more than one every weekend. WoM spreads like wildfire where you live. That doesn't happen everywhere. Consider yourself lucky.

And yes, most of my summer weekends were spent shooting 2-3 weddings.

[cdifoto]

2. Well, if you don't live in a market for something, then don't start a business doing it. Keep it a hobby. That's just basic economics. Supply and demand. Depending on how much the OP charges for her services, it may be a price elasticity issue, but I'll assume that she keeps her prices at equillibrium and also assume that where she is it would be a perfctly competative market.
Small market doesn't equal no market. Small market just means word takes longer to travel. Not every business is profitable right out of the gate. Last time I checked, Facebook still isn't profitable. ;)

You started out fast, good for you. That doesn't mean no one else should do it. Of course at 2-3 weddings a weekend, that's not the kind of start I'd want. I don't like the whole wham-bam-thank-you-ma'am type of wedding photography. I'm more of a take-time-with-each-client kind of photographer. :)

EDIT: Do you have a gallery mritchy?

[mritchy]

Small market doesn't equal no market. Small market just means word takes longer to travel. Not every business is profitable right out of the gate. Last time I checked, Facebook still isn't profitable. ;)

You started out fast, good for you. That doesn't mean no one else should do it. Of course at 2-3 weddings a weekend, that's not the kind of start I'd want. I don't like the whole wham-bam-thank-you-ma'am type of wedding photography. I'm more of a take-time-with-each-client kind of photographer. :)

EDIT: Do you have a gallery mritchy?

I was very much able to have relationships wih my clients on that schedule.

Here is one of my portfolios: http://www.flickr.com/photos/mritchy/

[cdifoto]

I just did a quick skim but it looks like you have some good selections in there. :)

[mritchy]

I just did a quick skim but it looks like you have some good selections in there. :)

Thanks. I looked at yours too. I like your candids.

[cdifoto]

Thanks. :) I'm trying to do less flash on my candids so I don't have to wait for it to recycle. Even with a battery pack I can only do at most one exposure per second. Sometimes that means I miss something great because I was anticipating one thing but another great thing happened instead or right after.

[mritchy]

Thanks. :) I'm trying to do less flash on my candids so I don't have to wait for it to recycle. Even with a battery pack I can only do at most one exposure per second. Sometimes that means I miss something great because I was anticipating one thing but another great thing happened instead or right after.

Amen. I was having tha issue with my 1D during the bouquet toss.. the flash wouldn't fire quick enough to get the sequence. Then I picked up some primes and problem solved!

[cdifoto]

Hah same here. I'll jack the ISO way high just for those then go back to business as usual with the flashes. :lol:

[harroz]

it seems to me to be more of a business issue, if there is work there, then why are you not making enough, are your prices too low? how's the structure of your business? is it designed in a way for you to actually make money? I'd be interestd to know, with 3 shoots a week you should really be doing fine.

[alabama1980]

I'm sorry, but if you are not generating a cash flow after 3 years of business, you do not have what it takes to run it.

That's a very general assumption. The average small business operates at a loss for the first three years. That's loss....it can take another year or even two for a small business to become profitable. If you have, in eight months, began making enough to fund all the things you fund, then you got very very lucky. Your work is good, don't get me wrong, but basic economic facts don't support that kind of success with a small business in that time frame. I DEFINITELY congratulate you!

As far as the OP...you are kicking tail with what you have. Don't sweat it. Don't let that anxiety over your camera throw you off your game. I've seen a lot worse images with more expensive gear. Chill out...enjoy your work. You seem to be overcoming the limitations of a "consumer" grade camera quite well. I do think you should kick it up a bit when you can, but for now...your rockin with what you have...

[carseasoncity]

When I first opened this thread and started reading, I was almost sure that I was going to agree with the OP's situation on the "we have all been there" standpoint. We have. I have to say, that if you have been shooting for 3 years and you are still XT'ing with a kit lens, there might be something wrong. NOW. Don't take what I have said and turn it into one of those "well, it's not about the equipment" wars. I understand that. I shot with an XS for a few months and got spectacular results without any L support. But 3 years is too long to be shooting like that, honestly. The first time I picked up a DSLR was in January of this year and now look what I use. I am a college student at the most expensive private school in Texas (more than Yale now, apparently) and I pay my own housing, car insurance, gas, food, etc and tuition is paid on scholarship. Basically, all of my income to live is based on photography now. All of my equipment from the very beginning has been funded by my photography work as well. I have shot over 2 dozen weddings since I started them in April, have a running product photography base, and shoot engagements and portraits on a weekly basis. I'm sorry, but if you are not generating a cash flow after 3 years of business, you do not have what it takes to run it. PLEASE GET A BACKUP CAMERA. If you gain nothing else from this, whether it is a used $250 XT or a 5D MKII, get another camera. Do your clients a favor if not yourself.

As has already been stated...Congratulations to you to be able to pick up a camera in January and be living off your work in a matter of less than a year.

I would imagine that's not the normal course a photography business takes for people.

I won't get into all the financial issues, but though I'm not in college I have three small children and live in a very small town in southern Missouri. People around here are scraping by, like me. We don't have big businesses here, or the economy to support one.

And I am generating cash flow...though I haven't been in serious business for 3 years. As I mentioned earlier, business just started booming about three months ago. My kit lens and XT where never an issue to me before when I was shooting an occasional wedding and portraits here and there. NOW it is. I'm busy and it's time to upgrade.

it seems to me to be more of a business issue, if there is work there, then why are you not making enough, are your prices too low? how's the structure of your business? is it designed in a way for you to actually make money? I'd be interestd to know, with 3 shoots a week you should really be doing fine.

See above comment...I am doing fine. But only since the last three months and I'm now playing catch up.

That's a very general assumption. The average small business operates at a loss for the first three years. That's loss....it can take another year or even two for a small business to become profitable. If you have, in eight months, began making enough to fund all the things you fund, then you got very very lucky. Your work is good, don't get me wrong, but basic economic facts don't support that kind of success with a small business in that time frame. I DEFINITELY congratulate you!

As far as the OP...you are kicking tail with what you have. Don't sweat it. Don't let that anxiety over your camera throw you off your game. I've seen a lot worse images with more expensive gear. Chill out...enjoy your work. You seem to be overcoming the limitations of a "consumer" grade camera quite well. I do think you should kick it up a bit when you can, but for now...your rockin with what you have...

Thank you so much for the encouragement. I really appreciate the kind words.
B

[YankeeMom]

Thank you, thank you, thank you!

I really WAS just asking for input on whether or not other people have experienced working as a professional with a consumer grade camera.

How we ended up discussing my merit as a pro and how my blog is sucky I have no idea.

The only reason I suggested that people go to my blog to judge my work on it's professionalism (meaning the quality of my PICTURES not my blog) was because that's where my most current work is. My website is my professional site... www.priesterphotography.com (http://www.priesterphotography.com) ..the blog is for current clients and they've already decided that they like me and my work. They don't think I'm unprofessional because I talk about things that concern me.


That's how I read it, too. I didn't read much of your blog and these guys may have some sound advice on it, but I definitely thought this thread was supposed to be about pros using entry-level/basic equipment. I guess you are the only one! :lol:

A thought about your blog: you could just make it private and give a password to clients and friends. Just a thought if it might be an issue (though I'm sure you've considered it already.)

[YankeeMom]

That's a very general assumption. The average small business operates at a loss for the first three years. That's loss....it can take another year or even two for a small business to become profitable. If you have, in eight months, began making enough to fund all the things you fund, then you got very very lucky. Your work is good, don't get me wrong, but basic economic facts don't support that kind of success with a small business in that time frame. I DEFINITELY congratulate you!

As far as the OP...you are kicking tail with what you have. Don't sweat it. Don't let that anxiety over your camera throw you off your game. I've seen a lot worse images with more expensive gear. Chill out...enjoy your work. You seem to be overcoming the limitations of a "consumer" grade camera quite well. I do think you should kick it up a bit when you can, but for now...your rockin with what you have...

She also said that her business makes enough for equipment, but right now she is using her profits to supplement her DH's loss of income.

[Saxi]

As someone who makes my living with my camera - I think you are extremely limited with a kit lens and consumer grade camera -- sounds like you put the cart before the horse in your business.
It is pretty obvious, to me, that you do not have much time in the business. You would have "collected" more equipment with just a bit more time in the photography world, number 1. Number2, why pay for building out a studio before you had a few essentials required for doing the job, lenses etc. Dunno - maybe you took a few photos and love them jumped into building out a studio but missed a few basics.....like lenses and backup equipment.
Also - why do you mention the fact that you have the same camera as your clients on your blog? What?
Also if you are delicate like a "flower" you need to get out of business - you might not have what it takes to start and run a business.

wow, +1.

That blog post will stay with your business for your life. You should have responded privately if there was an issue. I am a father, never made a dime off photography, and I have a lot more gear than you do. The Rebel does have a certain "amateur" stigma to it and if I went to a professional and I saw they were using entry level consumer grade gear I would be a little put off myself.

[Saxi]

I did mention a backup, but it's only the Rebel XT. And I could see how new equipment would makes some shots easier, and save me time.




True. True. I think now it's more about me than my clients. It's about what I'm expecting of myself not really what they're expecting because as was mentioned earlier most clients are impressed if you present them with an image that's in focus.




Thanks so much for taking the time to comment so thoroughly. I really appreciate the advice and unbiased viewpoint.

I don't think my comments on my blog are "self-deriding", they're honest. I make no grandiose claims about my photography or myself. Maybe it's bad marketing. But this is who I am.

And if I was going to worry about things on my site (my professional site or my blog) being misinterpreted then I wouldn't have a site. Because even tiny things can be misinterpreted...and they are.

Things are tight, but I'm not willing to portray myself as something I'm not just to get a few new clients. I don't like sugar-coating and I feel fake if I try to make myself sound all "professional" and sophisticated, though I do consider myself to be dignified, handling my clients professionally, and I'd even call myself a classy lady. :)

If my prospective clients get scared off because of one or two comments on my blog about how I'm scared that I'm not good enough or that I wish I was better, then they can go to one of the other two photographers in town that claim to know it all.

The kind of clients I want are the ones that see how hard I work, how determined I am to get a good image of them or their family that's not cookie cutter and appreciate that I don't claim to be anything I'm not.

I do think I'm going to rent the 50D for a wedding I have coming up in October and hope to have the 17-55 2.8 by then. Maybe that will make me more comfortable with plopping down $1200 for it in the near future.

Thanks again for all the thought you put into your comment.
B

I'll be selling my 50D w/ grip and 3 batteries in about a week or so if your looking at upgrading. Just PM if you are interested.

I have a 7D on its way and have two Rebel backups (my father has two rebels).

If you have a way to buy one, I never was into the renting myself, it just throwing money out the window.

On another note, I would seriously consider a lens like the 85mm f/1.8. You will take your photography to an entirely different level because of the amazing quality of the lens but it is a very small investment since it is a prime. In an studio, the real limitations of prime lenses are almost non-existent. I just picked up a 85mm f/1.8 for $380 shipped to replace my 50mm f/1.4 I was not happy with. Even the 50mm f/1.8 for less than $100 would probably give you way better results than the kit lens.

Your images are excellent for the gear you use, and I always tell people who talk to me about photography that even a Rebel can take amazing pictures, as a candid shooter I upgraded my body because I want more keepers and I like the features and using manual modes with a rebel is a real pain. As a business owner, image is everything and your camera is your tool. I bet your husband spent a good amount of money on his hammer, more so any home owner would. Even if the camera didn't effect image quality at all, it would likely increase your client retention rate.

[jen19806]

I checked out your website (and not just the blog) and was impressed by your pictures. I know this doesn't really respond to your original questions, but comparing your prices to your quality- I think you definitely need to work on raising prices. Your work is really nice. Secondly, I couldn't find any contact info on your website. I had to go to your blog, or to the smug mug site to get your email, then I tried to send you an email b/c I was going to forward you a thread from another forum on pricing that I thought might be helpful, but the email got bounced back as undeliverable due to a server error. Maybe it was just me, but you may want to double check your email is functioning correctly, and maybe add contact info to your website? (or make it easier to find if I just gave up to quickly)

[carseasoncity]

I checked out your website (and not just the blog) and was impressed by your pictures. I know this doesn't really respond to your original questions, but comparing your prices to your quality- I think you definitely need to work on raising prices. Your work is really nice. Secondly, I couldn't find any contact info on your website. I had to go to your blog, or to the smug mug site to get your email, then I tried to send you an email b/c I was going to forward you a thread from another forum on pricing that I thought might be helpful, but the email got bounced back as undeliverable due to a server error. Maybe it was just me, but you may want to double check your email is functioning correctly, and maybe add contact info to your website? (or make it easier to find if I just gave up to quickly)

Thanks for taking the time to check out my site and my blog. I would LOVE to raise my prices. :) But the area I live in isn't conducive to it. One thing my clients keep commenting on is that they like my work and appreciate that they can get quality images without dipping into their children's college fund. I think that's an important part of who I am, so though I may raise my prices a little bit in the future, it won't be a drastic change. Anyway, our economy in this area dictates that I can't charge what someone in some of the bigger cities can charge. Well, I could charge it but I wouldn't get any work. :)

Thanks for the input on the contact info. I'm in the process of redesigning my site, blog and smugmug so I haven't given it much attention. I didn't realize that my email wasn't on the site (it was at one time, I must have accidentally deleted it in one of my midnight website development tirades). I'll work on that when time allows.

I'll also have to look into why the email on my smugmug bounced. ??
Thanks for the heads up.
B

[Saxi]

Thanks for taking the time to check out my site and my blog. I would LOVE to raise my prices. :) But the area I live in isn't conducive to it. One thing my clients keep commenting on is that they like my work and appreciate that they can get quality images without dipping into their children's college fund. I think that's an important part of who I am, so though I may raise my prices a little bit in the future, it won't be a drastic change. Anyway, our economy in this area dictates that I can't charge what someone in some of the bigger cities can charge. Well, I could charge it but I wouldn't get any work. :)

Thanks for the input on the contact info. I'm in the process of redesigning my site, blog and smugmug so I haven't given it much attention. I didn't realize that my email wasn't on the site (it was at one time, I must have accidentally deleted it in one of my midnight website development tirades). I'll work on that when time allows.

I'll also have to look into why the email on my smugmug bounced. ??
Thanks for the heads up.
B

Because of cost of goods sold and cost of doing business, sometimes just increasing your prices 5-10% can yield a 30% increase in profit. Customers will not noticed or be bothered by that amount of a change. In fact in some industries raising prices actually increases sales and conversions.

If you are not making enough money in your business (where you got a full studio for free) to afford even a 50D (which is about $900-1300) then your prices are too low or your business isn't working. Your camera is your main tool of your trade, your business needs to be able to supply you with the tools you need to do your job and enough money left over to supply your lifestyle.

It sounds like you have a good amount of clients, that is really the most difficult part of the business, so it sounds like something is broken because you didn't put all the profits into gear.

You can also adjust your target client as well to increase your profit and prices. Being a cost leader is not a sustainable business model. Not unless your walmart, price should never be your USP.

[moogyboobles]

I too have 3 young children, and husband on low wages, and I'm frustrated by being limited by my camera (I have a 450D, it's mainly low light noise I feel let down by).
I've not made a penny yet (although just recently I have had offers, got my first paid job in a couple of weeks) but then I've only had my camera a year this weekend.
I'd love to make a career of this as it's ideal to fit in around the children and I love it.
What I am doing (I don't know if you have this in the US) is applying for financial help. There are various charities here that help people set up businesses with a grant or loan. I'm working on my business plan at the moment.

[carseasoncity]

Because of cost of goods sold and cost of doing business, sometimes just increasing your prices 5-10% can yield a 30% increase in profit. Customers will not noticed or be bothered by that amount of a change. In fact in some industries raising prices actually increases sales and conversions.

If you are not making enough money in your business (where you got a full studio for free) to afford even a 50D (which is about $900-1300) then your prices are too low or your business isn't working. Your camera is your main tool of your trade, your business needs to be able to supply you with the tools you need to do your job and enough money left over to supply your lifestyle.

It sounds like you have a good amount of clients, that is really the most difficult part of the business, so it sounds like something is broken because you didn't put all the profits into gear.

You can also adjust your target client as well to increase your profit and prices. Being a cost leader is not a sustainable business model. Not unless your walmart, price should never be your USP.

I've already mentioned that my business IS making enough to afford the equipment I need but my income is now making up for the loss of my husband's income. Once that situation is rectified then I'll be a-okay.

I don't think I'm striving to be Wal-Mart or that my USP is my price. But my price is definitely one of the things that creates more clients for me. As I've also already mentioned we live in a very small town...I can't charge the same for my services as someone in a large city. Well, I could but I wouldn't get work.

And really this has nothing to with my original post which was simply asking if anyone else has gotten this far into a business with consumer grade equipment and wondering if the quality of my images was proof that I was using cheap equipment.

I agree with you on the small increase in price and I've already mentioned that I hope to do that in the near future.

Thanks for the advice and input.


I too have 3 young children, and husband on low wages, and I'm frustrated by being limited by my camera (I have a 450D, it's mainly low light noise I feel let down by).
I've not made a penny yet (although just recently I have had offers, got my first paid job in a couple of weeks) but then I've only had my camera a year this weekend.
I'd love to make a career of this as it's ideal to fit in around the children and I love it.
What I am doing (I don't know if you have this in the US) is applying for financial help. There are various charities here that help people set up businesses with a grant or loan. I'm working on my business plan at the moment.

Awesome! Thanks for the comment! The low light noise is exactly the issue I'm having right now. I'd love to do more natural light shots (particularly of newborns) in the studio but I don't think it's possible unless I want that grainy look.

I have thought about financial aid and may look into it further. Thanks for the advice.
B