Girls Soccer

[Hydro]

First sports posting, and up for critique or suggestions. This is my daughter's under 13 travelling soccer team. The second shot seems a little soft, and it would probably have been better if the ball was not blurred-----but I liked the composition.

[Skip Souza]

Good for your daughters. I am no judge on composition bu they look good to me in that respect. The first looks overexposed and both need a faster shutter. Keep posting.

[Hydro]

Thanks, Skip. I meant to post the settings. They are:

No. 1
1/1000
f2.8
ISO 100
Focal L. 170mm


No. 2

1/500
f2.8
ISO 100
146mm

Both shot in Manual/RAW. No 2 was a very overcast day, so I dropped the shutter speed down. Guess I should have raised the ISO instead.

I seem to be having trouble with the exposure. I am using CF4-1 and paying close attention to the exposure in the display, but many of my shots seem underexposed when I open them in RAW in PE3. They also show clipping in shadows and highlights, so I back the exposure off even more to stop the clipping, then brighten----but something is wrong. I am on the first rung of the ladder when it comes to post processing, but am challenging myself (maybe too much) by shooting full manual and RAW. Yesterday I felt like just going to the auto settings and JPEG after looking at some of the images. I'm sure I am overcorrecting in PE3 as well in sharpening and levels.

Do you have to depress the shutter half way in CF4-1 to lock the exposure the instant before you take the shot? Because it may be that I am mashing the * button for focus, then just releasing the shutter without pressing half way first.

Thanks for the input. I had better pictures the last couple of weeks, but wanted input on these---so thanks for that.

[Exit]

The second image looks fine to my. Just try some USM. I think it's the compression you had to use to get it under the size limit :)

Do this 2x
500% .2 0

Then once
20% 2 0

Steve

[Skip Souza]

I must have been tired last night.
What I found distracting in #2 was the ball. I had assumed that it was motion blur but 1/500 should be enough. That leaves DOF , smaller aperture & higher ISO.
On #1 it is really tough to get a decent balance between the white uniforms blaring away and the black ones sucking all the light out of the picture. They should consult the photographers before choosing colors. hehehehe
You captured the intensity of the competition quite well in both photos.

[RbrtPtikLeoSeny]

I don't have much experience at all, have had my 20D for about a week n a halfish, but I find that for shooting sports shutter speeds in the relm of 1/1600th to 1/2000th and an apeture of f/4 seem to work the best. I find f/2.8 to be far to shallow. f/5.6 is alright too. 1/2000th might be a little fast... but I like it because it freezes the flying ball in lacrosse. Probably would have helped with the soccer ball shot.

Also, first one seems over exposed.....

I'll post two pics that I took second day I had my 70-200 f/4.
First shot: 1/1600th, f/4, ISO 1600
Second Shot: Same thing.

[Hydro]

Thanks much for the input. Yeah, the first photo was taken on a very bright day, which I thought was a good thing. But even when I was careful with exposure, when I opened in ACR there was a lot of clipping alarms. Maybe that's just what happens with the white & back uni's----I hadn't considered that.

In regard to the sharpening tip, Exit, I will give it a shot. None of the books on PE3 I have mention doing USM three times, although I see it mentioned on the forum as a good technique. I don't understand why it is effective to do it three times in a row, rather than just one big one (I know I'll read this two months from now and cringe---but for now if a kind soul could let me in on it, I would appreciate it.)

Skip, thanks for your input as well. I see what you mean about the ball being distracting, but I also liked it because the image showed the player reacting to the ball coming toward her, which I thought illustrated some athletisim and balance. Or maybe it because it's my kid---LIS (laughing inside)

Thanks again. I have so much to learn, but the little I know so far came from this forum.

[Hydro]

Oh, and Rbrt, I have been trying to shoot wide open, or nearly wide open. I figured if I have the lens that can do it I should try to learn how to use it right. But I do have some DOF problems doing this. There is a guy (Gmen) on here that really has this type of shot wired, and that is his style. I figure if I keep on trying I'll either eventually figure it out or lose my mind. The clock is ticking.

[RbrtPtikLeoSeny]

Yea, I know what you mean. I've seen Gmen's work and it's incredible! Shoot f/2.8 if you like, no biggy. It's a preference I guess. :-) That and my lens doesn't go past an f/4 anyway! haha. I shot f/2.8 with my 50mm though and didn't like the DOF results. Maybe it's poor results from a poor sports lens. Wish I had me one of them 70-200 f/2.8 IS's! :-) How ya like it?

[Hydro]

Let's put it this way. I feel that I have eliminated equipment as a reason for image problems. The 85 f1.8 is also a great lens. Even I managed to squeeze out a couple of good basketball shots in dungeon gyms.

[Croasdail]

If you can avoid shooting the lens at 2.8 - I would. Even the canon is a little less sharp at 2.8 and if you don't have a really contrasty subject, you will loose some detail. You will get better contrast and color if you shoot stoped down a little and bump you ISO up a little - say to 400. I know it sounds counter intuitive to shoot a beautiful lens like that stoped down - but it is just a little like a performance car - the power curve is just short of redline - and at 2.8 - you are running at redline - if that make any sense. Redline it when needed - that's what it is there for. But at 1000 @ f2.8 @ ISO 100 - you didn't need it. And if you get your exposure down into the lenses sweet spot - with this lens you will not be needing any USM to have fantastically sharp shots.

[RbrtPtikLeoSeny]

Well put croasdail! Still up to you though Hydro. At least give f/4 a try. See what happens, if you don't like it, go back to f/2.8. Save the f/2.8 for indoor settings and incredibly cloudy days like it's meant for. :-) Oh well though, what ever you do it's up to you man. :-)

[gmen]

Good shots Hydro. I like 'em very much. A fine first post!

I can see that you've had some difficulty in the first shot controlling the contrast range in the image - due to the harsh side lighting. This is a tricky scenario. Ideally reposition yourself to shoot into the sun and expose for the shadow area - assuming that the sun is reasonably high. If you are restricted in your shooting position and have to deal with nasty sidelighting, try lowering the in-camera contrast by one notch - that might help a little. It can be very, very difficult to avoid clipping some highlights in these circumstances and still retain shadow detail - so don't be discouraged!

I'd also recommend shooting from a lower angle - it looks like you may have been sitting/kneeling (?) in the second shot and that gives the image more impact.

I shoot all my f/2.8 glass wide open most of the time and I certainly don't have any sharpness issues. Yep, the DOF is certainly small and you have to nail the focus. This raises the issue of focus point selection - set up your focus points depending on what you are shooting. I'm not sure if you can 'register' a focus point on the 20D - if you can, then this will enable you to easily switch from one focus point to another at the press of a button.

For football, I generally set myself up manually at 1/1000s at f/2.8 and then simply change the ISO to account for changes in lighting. Once I hit ISO1250 and the light is fading then I'll change the shutter speed down to 1/500s... before the light forces me to move the ISO up to ISO1600 or ISO3200. Hope that makes sense.

[Croasdail]

Gmen has spoken.... I guess the main reason I do stop down to f4 is because of DOF issues. I have found it much more forgiving of my lack in skill in getting the camera and I to agree on what exactly we are shooting. But I have also found with the 70-200 it be a tad more saturated too just off of 2.8 too - could be just my lens. Great insights on moving the ISO though - thanks for sharing.

[Hydro]

I really want to thank all of you for your input. This forum really shines with people willing to assist those in their pursuit for improvement.

Gavin, I really appreciate the time you have taken to get me pointed in the right direction. Your detailed and unselfish assistance helping me and other noobs get better is rather remarkable.

I will continue to experiment and shoot. With a couple of kids playing several sports I've got plenty of opportunities for practice. I was always a restless spectator anyway, and this photography bug gives me something to do other than anchor down a lawn chair.

[gmen]

Gavin, I really appreciate the time you have taken to get me pointed in the right direction. Your detailed and unselfish assistance helping me and other noobs get better is rather remarkable.
No problem. I think that all I really do is stick to the basics - there are many better photographers than me that see all kinds of possibilities in a shot and would make vastly different lens and exposure choices.

I try to be consistent and I suppose my 'style' is to get in amongst the action with longer glass. However, I'm pleased to be able to help a little and there's no harm in sharing techniques as that will ultimately make us all better snappers!