Alien Bee lighting

[xxmxaxrxyxx]

I was on the website and was looking at the packages deals they have and had a few questions about the different lighting options....how do you know which size you need between the 400, 800, or 1600? Also the color options:

star white
deep space black
mellow yellow
alien green
martian pink

What can be achieved with the different size and color options I guess would be my question. Being a newbie to all this all inputs are welcome!

I would like to purchase a lighting kit to start out with but not sure where to start. I don't want to overdo it and spend more than i have to. But do want enough to get a better understanding off lighting techniques.

[tim]

If you want to fight the sun get 1600s, they might be enough. If you want to do narrow DOF portraits get the 400s. I have the 800s and they're good general purpose lights, though I rarely use them.

The colors are just colors, make no difference, I got black to go for a more professional look.

See also this faq (http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=113639) :)

[xxmxaxrxyxx]

wow thanks the FAQ thread was very educational! i still have tons to learn but would like to start somewhere!

so from my understanding it is best to start out with 1 light to get a better understanding but the different size is where it gets me. When you say 1600 to fight the sun does that mean these lights are better to be used outdoors when the sun is out? Lets say i want to make one of the spare bedrooms in my house a small studio. What size lighting would work best?

And as for the color they are just color that doesn't play any important factors into a photograph? I too would choose black for the more professional look. lol thank you!

[OneStrobe]

The 1600 has enough power to overpower the sun. If you brought a 400 or 800 into broad daylight, they'd be as good as fill lights for the shadows. A 1600 would have enough power to achieve that "strobist look" (lit foreground, darker background).

Of course, this is if you want to shoot in broad daylight. If you normally shoot indoors or afternoon/evenings outdoors then an 800 would suffice. I suggest checking out the Alien Bees group on Flickr to see what people have done with their AB's.

[xxmxaxrxyxx]

The 1600 has enough power to overpower the sun. If you brought a 400 or 800 into broad daylight, they'd be as good as fill lights for the shadows. A 1600 would have enough power to achieve that "strobist look" (lit foreground, darker background).

Of course, this is if you want to shoot in broad daylight. If you normally shoot indoors or afternoon/evenings outdoors then an 800 would suffice. I suggest checking out the Alien Bees group on Flickr to see what people have done with their AB's.
thank you i will check out the Alien Bees group...

[tim]

The 1600 has enough power to overpower the sun. If you brought a 400 or 800 into broad daylight, they'd be as good as fill lights for the shadows. A 1600 would have enough power to achieve that "strobist look" (lit foreground, darker background).

Of course, this is if you want to shoot in broad daylight. If you normally shoot indoors or afternoon/evenings outdoors then an 800 would suffice. I suggest checking out the Alien Bees group on Flickr to see what people have done with their AB's.

I'm not sure the 1600 has the power to overpower the sun if you use a soft box, but even the 800 can without a diffuser. Remember 400 -> 800 is only one stop, the same as going from 1/100th to 1/200th (if you can sync at that speed).

[xxmxaxrxyxx]

wow there is so much for me to learn....thank you

[sleibrand]

In a small studio, too much light can be more of a problem than not enough IMO. For an indoor studio, I would get AB800's or AB400's.

I have AB800's and have never had an instance where I needed more power in the studio. In fact 90% of the time I'm at 1/2 power or less with them when shooting ISO 100, f8-f11.

[Motofreak429]

i would say if you have the Cash. get the 1600, its always better to have the power there if needed. but 800's will work to

[gonzogolf]

i would say if you have the Cash. get the 1600, its always better to have the power there if needed. but 800's will work to
Not true. If you are working indoors in a small studio, the 1600 can be overpowering and you run the risk of color shifts if you go to the lowest end of the power scale. Decide where you are going to use it most, if its indoors the 800 is probably right for you.

[bobbyz]

Unless you going to be shooting outdoors at mid day or large groups, having more power can be bigger problem than having less power.

I would suggest AB800 for balance, AB400 if you like to shoot at wider apertures and AB1600 only if you shoot mostly outdoors in sun.

[Zivnuska]

What do you want to use the Bees for?

[Player9]

My $.02 (strictly an amateur here). If you're only going to be shooting portraits in a small bedroom studio, you need to forget about the B1600. I use B400s in the large AB softbox (double diffused) and can easily shoot at f/11, ISO 100, for typical portrait shots (e.g., headshots, half-body). You might find, however, that the B400 will leave you lacking in power when you have to move the lights back away from the subject to get the depth of light needed to shoot rows of people, and also when you want to use small grids (smaller than 30 degree), especially when you use the grids with gel sheets. For example, with a group of four or five people arranged in a way that has some depth, you will need to move the lights back for depth of light, while still keeping the aperture small for depth of field. In some instances, this will cause you to need to raise the ISO to ISO 200 with the B400 if the main light is in a big softbox. If you know that you will be shooting groups bigger than four or five, or that you will shoot groups regularly, you will want to go with the B800. The good thing about the B400s is that, if desired, you can shoot at wide apertures easily, and without having to take the power all the way down to 1/32.

[sleibrand]

i would say if you have the Cash. get the 1600, its always better to have the power there if needed. but 800's will work to

If you have an 800 and find you're lacking light, you can increase the ISO from 100 to 200.

Once you're at the bottom of the power range and still have too much power, then things get ugly in a small studio.

[xxmxaxrxyxx]

In a small studio, too much light can be more of a problem than not enough IMO. For an indoor studio, I would get AB800's or AB400's.

I have AB800's and have never had an instance where I needed more power in the studio. In fact 90% of the time I'm at 1/2 power or less with them when shooting ISO 100, f8-f11.
wow thanks!

[xxmxaxrxyxx]

i would say if you have the Cash. get the 1600, its always better to have the power there if needed. but 800's will work to
ok i will see what my budget and go from there

[xxmxaxrxyxx]

Not true. If you are working indoors in a small studio, the 1600 can be overpowering and you run the risk of color shifts if you go to the lowest end of the power scale. Decide where you are going to use it most, if its indoors the 800 is probably right for you.
well it looks like majority states 800 so this is be the one i will invest in for the time being thank you

[xxmxaxrxyxx]

What do you want to use the Bees for?
i want to have me a little studio room...where i can shoot portraits, pets and family!

[xxmxaxrxyxx]

My $.02 (strictly an amateur here). If you're only going to be shooting portraits in a small bedroom studio, you need to forget about the B1600. I use B400s in the large AB softbox (double diffused) and can easily shoot at f/11, ISO 100, for typical portrait shots (e.g., headshots, half-body). You might find, however, that the B400 will leave you lacking in power when you have to move the lights back away from the subject to get the depth of light needed to shoot rows of people, and also when you want to use small grids (smaller than 30 degree), especially when you use the grids with gel sheets. For example, with a group of four or five people arranged in a way that has some depth, you will need to move the lights back for depth of light, while still keeping the aperture small for depth of field. In some instances, this will cause you to need to raise the ISO to ISO 200 with the B400 if the main light is in a big softbox. If you know that you will be shooting groups bigger than four or five, or that you will shoot groups regularly, you will want to go with the B800. The good thing about the B400s is that, if desired, you can shoot at wide apertures easily, and without having to take the power all the way down to 1/32.
wow thanks for the info!

[xxmxaxrxyxx]

If you have an 800 and find you're lacking light, you can increase the ISO from 100 to 200.

Once you're at the bottom of the power range and still have too much power, then things get ugly in a small studio.
looks like i will be going with the 800 thanks!

[tim]

People worry too much about color shifts when using strobes at low power. The difference can't be more than a few hundred K, I deal with everything from 3000K to 8000K on the typical wedding day, RAW/ACR deals with it fine.

[buurin]

I always hear that you can have too much power with the 1600s... Why don't people use Neutral Density gels? Whats the con to using these?

http://www.alienbees.com/filters.html

[gonzogolf]

I always hear that you can have too much power with the 1600s... Why don't people use Neutral Density gels? Whats the con to using these?

http://www.alienbees.com/filters.html

I guess the answer for me would be, why spend an extra hundred bucks on the flash and then purchase gels (which get hot and don't always play well with modifiers )just to power down a flash?

[buurin]

I guess the answer for me would be, why spend an extra hundred bucks on the flash and then purchase gels (which get hot and don't always play well with modifiers )just to power down a flash?

Then you'd have the best of both worlds -- overpower the sun when necessary and be able to shoot shallow depth indoors.

Whats the conflict with modifiers?

[gonzogolf]

Then you'd have the best of both worlds -- overpower the sun when nescesary and be able to shoot shallow depth indoors.

Whats the conflict with modifiers?

I dont always use the reflector, which is where the gels clip on the ab lights.

[buurin]

I see.. Hmm they should make a gel holder then :)

[sleibrand]

Then you'd have the best of both worlds -- overpower the sun when necessary and be able to shoot shallow depth indoors.

Whats the conflict with modifiers?

As stated, these don't work well with softboxes, beauty dishes, octoboxes, etc. It's possible to buy larger sheets but it'd be a real pain to have to go that route.

Another thing that may or may not be a concern is flash duration. Comparing t.1 durations, AB400 at full power = 1/6000 sec, AB1600 at 1/4 power (same light output as AB400 at full) = 1/450 sec. These get longer as the power is lowered and at 1/32, the AB1600's t.1 is 1/300. Not much of an issue for posed portraits but may cause blurring if there is much subject movement. See Paul Buff's comments on page 8 of this thread for a discussion of flash duration - it's counter-intuitive but full power is much faster than low power for the AB's (and many other strobes): http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/805037

If you're willing to spend the money and think you need the power then you should look at the White Lightning X1600 and X3200. These are made by the same parent company as the AB's and accept all the same modifiers. The WL X1600 and X33200 have 1/4 power switch (be careful, the x800 does not). An x1600 can act like either an AB400 or an AB1600, best of both worlds. Best of all, it switches out the capacitor banks so you still get the shooting characteristics of an AB400 when in 1/4 power mode.

The new AB Max's were to have similar feature. Hopefully they still will when (if?) they're released.

[bobbyz]

Yup, if you need AB1600 for outdoor but need to shoot indoors in small space, get X1600.

I wouldn't buy AB1600 alone to use in small space. My AB800 at lowest power with double diffsued softbox gives me close to f4 at 3-4 feet, ISo100. And at that power setting there is 7/10 of a stop variation in pop to pop. Now if you go to any power setting higher than 1/16, pop to pop consistency is 2/10 of a stop.

[Village_Idiot]

In a small studio, too much light can be more of a problem than not enough IMO. For an indoor studio, I would get AB800's or AB400's.

I have AB800's and have never had an instance where I needed more power in the studio. In fact 90% of the time I'm at 1/2 power or less with them when shooting ISO 100, f8-f11.

Not true. If you are working indoors in a small studio, the 1600 can be overpowering and you run the risk of color shifts if you go to the lowest end of the power scale. Decide where you are going to use it most, if its indoors the 800 is probably right for you.

Unless you going to be shooting outdoors at mid day or large groups, having more power can be bigger problem than having less power.

I would suggest AB800 for balance, AB400 if you like to shoot at wider apertures and AB1600 only if you shoot mostly outdoors in sun.

Hai guys. ND filter. You must use.

[Motofreak429]

yes i now have people that agree with me!

[eviljunglenoodle]

I went for the 1600 since it wasn't that much more money, but I shoot mostly outdoors currently- the ND filter would work, not sure if the OP wants to spend additional money on that though. The good thing is lots of people use the AB's so if you find out what you bought doesn't work, selling it shouldn't be too hard :D

[sleibrand]

Hai guys. ND filter. You must use.

1. ND filters are going to run $50-$150, I have several filter sizes I'd need.
2. Focusing in dim light through an ND is not fun.

I'd much rather go from ISO 100 to ISO 200 outdoors than have to jump through a lot of hoops indoors.

YMMV.

[buurin]

1. ND filters are going to run $50-$150, I have several filter sizes I'd need.
2. Focusing in dim light through an ND is not fun.

I'd much rather go from ISO 100 to ISO 200 outdoors than have to jump through a lot of hoops indoors.

YMMV.

What would going to ISO 200 outdoors do for you? Its not going to help you overpower the sun.

[bobbyz]

What would going to ISO 200 outdoors do for you? Its not going to help you overpower the sun.

Agree. Using higher ISO is good indoors when you have less power. Outdoors you want to use the lowest ISO like ISO50 to better fight the full sun.

[xxmxaxrxyxx]

i don't know if i will be doing a lot of outdoor shooting at the moment....so i think i will get the 800 for now...to see if that works for my little indoor studio....right now i am in the learning stage so i don't want to spend more than i need to...but i am sure after i find out what and where i would like to go with photography then i will have reevaluated my current setup to add more too.. thank you for everyone's input. i am assuming that buying the beginner bee package is a start?

[gonzogolf]

i don't know if i will be doing a lot of outdoor shooting at the moment....so i think i will get the 800 for now...to see if that works for my little indoor studio....right now i am in the learning stage so i don't want to spend more than i need to...but i am sure after i find out what and where i would like to go with photography then i will have reevaluated my current setup to add more too.. thank you for everyone's input. i am assuming that buying the beginner bee package is a start?


Add it up and see if there is any savings involved by buying the package. I dont remember there being much difference than ordering ala carte.

[xxmxaxrxyxx]

Add it up and see if there is any savings involved by buying the package. I dont remember there being much difference than ordering ala carte.
ok i will do that. thanks

[xxmxaxrxyxx]

just added it up and there is only a saving of $4.14....

now I have another question...does the color of the umbrella matter?

[gonzogolf]

just added it up and there is only a saving of $4.14....

now I have another question...does the color of the umbrella matter?

Silver umbrellas reflect a little more light and are more prone to specular highlights. The whites are nice and soft. I'd look around at other vendors too. I like the convertible umbrellas, you take the black cover off and use it as a shoot through, or leave it on and use it as a white reflective. Best of both worlds.

[xxmxaxrxyxx]

Silver umbrellas reflect a little more light and are more prone to specular highlights. The whites are nice and soft. I'd look around at other vendors too. I like the convertible umbrellas, you take the black cover off and use it as a shoot through, or leave it on and use it as a white reflective. Best of both worlds.
wow thanks...i think the one that is in the kit is a shoot through umbrella and i didn't understand what that meant..but now i do thanks..

[FJ LOVE]

i use the 800's with the medium and large softboxes in my small basement studio. another option to the umbrella is the beauty dish with sock. it works really well with only one light and reflector. if price is a problem a small shoot through umbrella is good as the light reflected back can add fill to the room

[xxmxaxrxyxx]

i use the 800's with the medium and large softboxes in my small basement studio. another option to the umbrella is the beauty dish with sock. it works really well with only one light and reflector. if price is a problem a small shoot through umbrella is good as the light reflected back can add fill to the room
wow thanks...right now money is an issue so i will start out with just the beginner package to see how that works out for me...hehe

[FJ LOVE]

there is also a (white shovel background reflector) cheap $29.00 i would like to try,next time i order stuff i will include it. the reason i mention it is i use my 580's to light my background sometimes. so if you have a flash, you might think about combining it with your AB to save on shipping

[xxmxaxrxyxx]

there is also a (white shovel background reflector) cheap $29.00 i would like to try,next time i order stuff i will include it. the reason i mention it is i use my 580's to light my background sometimes. so if you have a flash, you might think about combining it with your AB to save on shipping
yes i have the 580ex II. what does this shovel background reflector do? i still haven't decided if i want to use a cloth or paper backdrop

[FJ LOVE]

it mounts to you AB and you position it behind your model,lighting up the backdrop so you can use your 580 as front fill flash.but it adds separation
from the model giving a more 3D effect or depth, and also controlling spill onto the model. btw your flash can trigger your AB so you don't need a cord.

[xxmxaxrxyxx]

it mounts to you AB and you position it behind your model,lighting up the backdrop so you can use your 580 as front fill flash.but it adds separation
from the model giving a more 3D effect or depth, and also controlling spill onto the model. btw your flash can trigger your AB so you don't need a cord.
wow i really appreciated your help and all the info you have provided me! i still have lots to learn! hehe

[klynam]

In a small studio, too much light can be more of a problem than not enough IMO. For an indoor studio, I would get AB800's or AB400's.

I have AB800's and have never had an instance where I needed more power in the studio. In fact 90% of the time I'm at 1/2 power or less with them when shooting ISO 100, f8-f11.

Agreed 100%.

I have 800's and 1600's and they have WAY too much power indoors - IMO. That, combined with AB's color-shifting at low power, make the AB400's much better for studio work. You can work in the higher power range of the unit and avoid the color shift issue. Plus, modern dSLR cameras have SO much low-noise, hi-ISO headroom, you just don't need THAT much power indoors - especially for any sort of shallow dof photos.

This has probably been covered already, just giving my "+1" and why on the quoted post above...

[george m w]

I have 800's and 1600's and they have WAY too much power indoors - IMO
Well....I dunno if I totally agree with that. Attached pix from last sunday. On this side was a B800 with a 30"x60" softbox, about 2 feet from the bike, it was was maxed out on power to give me f/10.

[Player9]

Sometimes the amount of power that folks assume is necessary is based upon the traditional wisdom that goes back to the days of 35mm film cameras, and even medium format cameras which are used in a lot of studio work. With the DSLR, you not only have the benefit of being able to change the ISO from 100 to 200, if necessary, but, with a 1.6x format camera, you also have the benefit of more DOF at larger apertures. For indoor shooting, this makes the B400 more attractive for a lot of people. For outdoor and groups, get the B800 or 1600.

[DerekW]

Well....I dunno if I totally agree with that. Attached pix from last sunday. On this side was a B800 with a 30"x60" softbox, about 2 feet from the bike, it was was maxed out on power to give me f/10.

Wow, I don't know If I've ever had my 800's much above 1/4 power for inside with a softbox, I usually shoot f/8-f/11. Are you sure it's working properly?

[Marloon]

you might want to wait for the ab max...

they have 8 stops of light so a 1600 can be a 400 at the same time.

I was on the website and was looking at the packages deals they have and had a few questions about the different lighting options....how do you know which size you need between the 400, 800, or 1600? Also the color options:

star white
deep space black
mellow yellow
alien green
martian pink

What can be achieved with the different size and color options I guess would be my question. Being a newbie to all this all inputs are welcome!

I would like to purchase a lighting kit to start out with but not sure where to start. I don't want to overdo it and spend more than i have to. But do want enough to get a better understanding off lighting techniques.

[xxmxaxrxyxx]

you might want to wait for the ab max...

they have 8 stops of light so a 1600 can be a 400 at the same time.
wow thanks!

[DerekW]

The key word there is "wait".

[gonzogolf]

Dont look for the AB Max, its been rechristened the Einstein..

[BCRose]

Dont look for the AB Max, its been rechristened the Einstein..

You mean the AB Max project has been scrapped? Einstein is another design altogether is it not?

They are really scrambling over there at PCB, I sent them a message in August asking about the CyberCommander and they told me they would be shipping in a couple weeks....

They are not given their clients a lot of confidence going forward with their shenanigan's on other forums and continuous delays.

[kenyee]

you might want to wait for the ab max...

Only if you want to wait until early next year. I wouldn't hold my breath until the units are in someone's hands. The entire power supply got redesigned, so it pretty much has to go through the entire engineering cycle, then testing, then certification, etc.
It's also been renamed the Einstein640...though the main reason people wanted the Einstein was it could run directly off 12V supplies. And people wanted the ABMax because it could use stepped sine wave inverters to save weight (but the new analog power supply will not need pure sine wave inverters)...

[george m w]

Quote:
Originally Posted by george m w
Well....I dunno if I totally agree with that. Attached pix from last sunday. On this side was a B800 with a 30"x60" softbox, about 2 feet from the bike, it was was maxed out on power to give me f/10.

....Derek replied:

Wow, I don't know If I've ever had my 800's much above 1/4 power for inside with a softbox, I usually shoot f/8-f/11. Are you sure it's working properly?


Derek,
Well, I can't say for sure that I know it's working properly....now you have me wondering, so I'll check it out. However, the shot above of Kurt by his bike, that was a 30x60 softbox with both the inner and outer diffusion panels and a grid on it. So....I'm thinking it was probably working correctly....but I'll check it against the other three lights and see if they are all the same, and report back.

[MT Stringer]

You asked about the color of the AB's. I read an explanation one guy posted. He has different powered Bees - like 800 and 1600 and maybe more so he picks a different color for each one. That way he can quickly identify what the power is for each one and make adjustments. Hmm, sounds good to me.

A pair of 800's are on my wishlist. If I buy new, they will be black because I will be using them in high school gyms for indoor sports and the less obvious, the better.

Good luck. A lot of folks have chipped in their 2 cents worth of good info. You should be up to about $1.98 by now! :-)
Mike

[gonzogolf]

You mean the AB Max project has been scrapped? Einstein is another design altogether is it not?



The way I read the press release most of the elements of the ABmax are there, except they will still need the pure sine wave power but they are calling them the Einstein now. Perhaps to avoid people being angry when the product doesnt match the previous descriptions of what the max was supposed to be.

[badgerW]

The way I read the press release most of the elements of the ABmax are there, except they will still need the pure sine wave power but they are calling them the Einstein now. Perhaps to avoid people being angry when the product doesnt match the previous descriptions of what the max was supposed to be.

Where is this press release? Einstein was announced well before ABMax, IIRC.

[SkipD]

A pair of 800's are on my wishlist. If I buy new, they will be black because I will be using them in high school gyms for indoor sports and the less obvious, the better.I would definitely recommend the B1600 over the B800 for that purpose. Even they may not be powerful enough, depending on where you mount them. The norm is to mount strobes high above the gym floor aiming down, as that keeps the flash from blinding the players.

[DerekW]

Paul Buff was talking about the name change on fredmiranda

[umphotography]

my studio is 11ft wide,,36ft long with 8ft ceilings ( my basement). i have 4 ab400 lights,soft boxes and umbrellas. i agree with the others , the 400's work fine and i have plenty of light getting up to f/11

first is a set up with an umbrella,softbox and 2 reflectors and a back light,,,,3 lights total. the 2nd shot was in my garage,2 umbrellas and 2 ab 400's......only issue i ever had was on a white background tring to get it to f/11 . wanted it evenly lit so i bounced with umbrellas and could only get the background to f/8...that was with 12 ft ceilings,,,i think i shot her at f/5.0. third shot was the only time i felt i would like more power than i had for the background.

http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z19/karenbaby12/2009-09-28-001-1.jpg

http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z19/karenbaby12/2009-08-18-0141-323-Edit-1-3.jpg

http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z19/karenbaby12/2009-08-18-0141-118-Edit-1.jpg

[george m w]

Mike, Those are really nice ! One thing I have found that is cool with using my rice paper screen is to shoot a gelled light from behind it ( see attached ). Shooting the gelled light towards the BG results in a nice even color to the rice screen, and shooting it toward the screen gives some cool gradients, depending on the angle, distance and power level of it. That third one is really nice use of the tileboard.

[badgerW]

Paul Buff was talking about the name change on fredmiranda

Ok, I found it:

http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/814756/2

C Buff][/color]I'm crossing my fingers that V21 of the Cyber Commander firmware may make it shippable in a week or so. We have 500 built and ready to update the firmware (easy to do via CC's Micro SD card.) Good progress on what was AB Max and big surprises . . . it will be re-branded Einstein 640 - because that's basically what it's become. We have prototyped my power supply and all the IGBT circuitry in house and it works fine. But it will still take about two months to bring it together.

[umphotography]

Mike, Those are really nice ! One thing I have found that is cool with using my rice paper screen is to shoot a gelled light from behind it ( see attached ). Shooting the gelled light towards the BG results in a nice even color to the rice screen, and shooting it toward the screen gives some cool gradients, depending on the angle, distance and power level of it. That third one is really nice use of the tileboard.


i like that a lot. thanks for the tip:cool:

[Fabian9931]

Im thinking about getting some alien bees myself =) I was wondering how is the power of a ab400 compared to the 430ex. I know its hard to compare. I believe the 400 would fill a large softbox better then the 430ex would right? Just trying to get a better picture compared to my 430ex that i play with. Also i know this is off topic, but would 2 430ex or 2 vivitars 285hv be enough to light evenly a bg of 9 ft wide to blow it out. I really thinking about going with the ab400 for now. I also have a basement studio 7.5 h x 16 w x 18 L.

[badgerW]

Im thinking about getting some alien bees myself =) I was wondering how is the power of a ab400 compared to the 430ex. I know its hard to compare. I believe the 400 would fill a large softbox better then the 430ex would right? Just trying to get a better picture compared to my 430ex that i play with. Also i know this is off topic, but would 2 430ex or 2 vivitars 285hv be enough to light evenly a bg of 9 ft wide to blow it out. I really thinking about going with the ab400 for now. I also have a basement studio 7.5 h x 16 w x 18 L.

(I originally wrote something here about guide numbers, but it appears Canon and AB might do their guide numbers differently. Blarg. It's hard to get solid numbers for a comparison. Here's a test by one POTN member:

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showpost.php?p=1010590&postcount=14

)

In general, studio strobes are much better at lighting anything than hotshoe flashes. This is because the studio strobes have a bare bulb capability when all modifiers are removed. In contrast, hotshoe flashes are built into a housing with a certain reflector that cannot be modified or gotten rid of. Thus the light of a studio strobe can be shaped from the very beginning, while the light from a hotshoe flash is going to have some initial shaping to it, and you will be working uphill to "undo" that initial shaping. So while you would probably be able to light a white background with 2 285HV's, you are going to have to do some work with placement and modifiers to get it to be evenly lit.

Lastly, pretty much any light is capable of blowing out a white background. It depends on your parameters. A desk lamp will blow out a white background if I am at ISO 800 and f/1.4. Most studio photographers shoot at ISO 100 and f/8 or so, but that doesn't mean you have to do so. The AB400 is capable of most studio work at ISO 100. Bumping up to ISO 400 in your camera will make a hotshoe flash seem just as powerful as studio strobes, but again you will be working with the shaping limitations I talked about above.

[george m w]

....I wrote:

Derek,
Well, I can't say for sure that I know it's working properly....now you have me wondering, so I'll check it out. However, the shot above of Kurt by his bike, that was a 30x60 softbox with both the inner and outer diffusion panels and a grid on it. So....I'm thinking it was probably working correctly....but I'll check it against the other three lights and see if they are all the same, and report back.

....okay....finally got the time to go downstairs and check it out. The three AB800's that I have right now ( the fourth one is on it's way back to the mothership getting a new cooling fan ) all put out the same amount of light. So I'm confident about my statement above regarding being maxed out at full power for the shot of Kurt next to his bike.

[DerekW]

Did you plug them in?
Just kidding.

I'm going to have to try that...... So, with a large softbox 2-3 feet from subject.... What was your iso and shutter speed?

[badgerW]

....I wrote:



....okay....finally got the time to go downstairs and check it out. The three AB800's that I have right now ( the fourth one is on it's way back to the mothership getting a new cooling fan ) all put out the same amount of light. So I'm confident about my statement above regarding being maxed out at full power for the shot of Kurt next to his bike.

I think the key here is that you were using the grid for that shot. A softbox has a very wide pattern (150 degrees or so from the face of the softbox?), and the grid cuts that down to 40 degrees. So the grid effectively stops 2/3 of the light coming out of the softbox (about 1 to 1.5 stops).

[george m w]

Did you plug them in?
Just kidding.

I'm going to have to try that...... So, with a large softbox 2-3 feet from subject.... What was your iso and shutter speed?

....yeah, I could tell they were plugged in 'cuz I got that nice satifying 'pop' when the caps dumped !
The shot above of the bike and rider were at f/10, ISO100. Shutter speed would not matter in this case as to exposure, but it was probably 1/160...I'd have to look at the exif tag. Again, it does not effect the exposure in this case. And I think our man 'badger' has probably nailed it there: the grid in this case soaked a bunch of the light up, as well as the fact that I had both the inner and outer diffusers in place.

Just as an FYI, when I tested the three lights this morning, I used the beauty dish and metered about 3 feet in front of it in all cases, and the sekonic read f/11.6, over multiple pops, with all three lights. So at least in the case of these three units, I have total consistancy. When I get number four back from Tennessee next week with it's new cooling fan in it, I'll re-do the test just for kicks to make sure it's the same as it's three siblings.

[klynam]

my studio is 11ft wide,,36ft long with 8ft ceilings ( my basement). i have 4 ab400 lights,soft boxes and umbrellas. i agree with the others , the 400's work fine and i have plenty of light getting up to f/11

first is a set up with an umbrella,softbox and 2 reflectors and a back light,,,,3 lights total. the 2nd shot was in my garage,2 umbrellas and 2 ab 400's......only issue i ever had was on a white background tring to get it to f/11 . wanted it evenly lit so i bounced with umbrellas and could only get the background to f/8...that was with 12 ft ceilings,,,i think i shot her at f/5.0. third shot was the only time i felt i would like more power than i had for the background.

http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z19/karenbaby12/2009-08-18-0141-323-Edit-1-3.jpg

So how'd you get a motorcycle into a basement studio? :lol:

[Fabian9931]

So how'd you get a motorcycle into a basement studio? :lol:

Originally Posted by slowdad http://photography-on-the.net/forum/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?p=8770043#post8770043)
my studio is 11ft wide,,36ft long with 8ft ceilings ( my basement). i have 4 ab400 lights,soft boxes and umbrellas. i agree with the others , the 400's work fine and i have plenty of light getting up to f/11

first is a set up with an umbrella,softbox and 2 reflectors and a back light,,,,3 lights total. the 2nd shot was in my garage,2 umbrellas and 2 ab 400's......only issue i ever had was on a white background tring to get it to f/11 . wanted it evenly lit so i bounced with umbrellas and could only get the background to f/8...that was with 12 ft ceilings,,,i think i shot her at f/5.0. third shot was the only time i felt i would like more power than i had for the background.

http://i195.photobucket.com/albums/z19/karenbaby12/2009-08-18-0141-323-Edit-1-3.jpg

[klynam]

sorry missed that part - lol - would have been a neat trick though...

[umphotography]

it fell over and landed on the saddle bag,,took 2 men and 3 boys to get that pig back upbw!

it aint going down them stairs,,trust me