5dmarkII focusing in poorly lit small venues?

[datadump]

For those of you with 5dm2 and shoot concerts,

I've been on the hunt for buying a smaller body .. the 7D does look enticing but i've always wanted to use a 5dm2 for concert photo shooting. ... until i read about the focusing issues in low lighting ... people post how horrible it is in low lighting... hunts constantly. its nice to have clean images but if you keep getting focus hunting then it seems that would be really annoying in small venues where i'm shooting at iso 3200-6400 f/1.8 1/30s

is this really true? coming from a 1dm3 (which i'm selling), i'm used to superb focusing in low light at any AF point.. Does the center point of a 5d mark2 compare with the sensitivity of the AF points in 1dm3?

[narlus]

i haven't used the 1D3 but am more than happy w/ the 5D2. i've had it since ~Feb or so, and if you want to see results from ~140 bands i've shot in the meantime, check out galleries here:
http://narlus.zenfolio.com/f1072397664

[datadump]

narlus, i've seen your photos before. and that 2009 set is awesome.
all of that after feb was 5dm2? sweet.

do you focus and recompose? or can u actualy use the off-center points in a really low light setting?

[narlus]

thanks for the kind words.

i usually bring two bodies (original 5D too) but shoot at least 60% w/ the 5D2.

i don't usually use the outer points unless the light is pretty good, and the person's not moving around much. by pretty good i mean about ISO 1600, f/2.8 and a shutter of 1/250 or faster. that doesn't happen a lot. so yeah, i use the center point and recompose. it's not ideal but works pretty well for the most part.

[PMCphotography]

I have nothing but problems with the focus of my 5d mk2. It takes forever to lock on to focus in bright daylight, forget it in lowlight, especially if the subject is moving.

The image quality in low light is fantastic, so i can really only use it in low light if the subject is stationary or i feel like manual focusing the entire way.

[narlus]

that sounds atypical.

[PMCphotography]

I've talked about it a lot, narlus. It's been sent back to Canon twice for focus, and once for lenses falling off the mount.

Canon says there's no problems with anything, and admits the auto focus is a "tad" slower than the cropped sensor models. I'm using a 40d as my main, and the 5d2 as my backup at the moment.

[Markitos]

I have a 1DmkIII and the 5D classic, which has similar AF... last Saturday I shot a wedding reception that was so dark that BOTH cameras were having trouble with AF--that said, all AF points were more reliable/quicker to focus on the 1D, but the 5D did okay (center point only).

I would assume that the 5DmkII might be a bit better, but probably not substantially, which is why I got a 1DmkIII over the 5DmkII. Having experienced the joy and freedom of being able to use any focus point with equal performance, it's hard for me to go back to focus/recompose.

That being said, the 5D's AF is pretty good, and very accurate, just slower. And I would never give up my 5D--it's more than the sum of its parts.

[datadump]

argh
highly disconcerting.. i have a 1dm3 right now but for my current needs, i really really need something smaller in size and weight. hard to let this 1dm3 go (forsale btw) but it just have to right now. so i am looking for a smaller body so i can use it both for the 8-10 concerts per year, plus some studio work and numerous nature hikes i do with the family. i need a really versatile body with great focusing in really low ambient light settings... i was hoping 5dm2 was the ticket, but i might need to go with a 7d.

[datadump]

I have a 1DmkIII and the 5D classic, which has similar AF... last Saturday I shot a wedding reception that was so dark that BOTH cameras were having trouble with AF--that said, all AF points were more reliable/quicker to focus on the 1D, but the 5D did okay (center point only).

I would assume that the 5DmkII might be a bit better, but probably not substantially, which is why I got a 1DmkIII over the 5DmkII. Having experienced the joy and freedom of being able to use any focus point with equal performance, it's hard for me to go back to focus/recompose.

That being said, the 5D's AF is pretty good, and very accurate, just slower. And I would never give up my 5D--it's more than the sum of its parts.


by any chance is your 5d an earlier build?

[Markitos]

by any chance is your 5d an earlier build?

I have no clue. I doubt it.

[bacchanal]

I use my 5DII in low light pretty frequently. The center point is very good, I'm not sure if it's 1DIII good...maybe not quite as snappy, but it's fast enough and pretty sensitive. However, (as many say) in low light the outer points are slow, often refuse to lock, and just generally leave a lot to be desired...this is especially problematic when shooting with a very shallow dof where focus and recompose is not a preferable option.

The 7D is definitely not going to give you the IQ of the 5D2, but if the AF is good it might be a viable option. I'd wait awhile though until there are more reports about AF performance. I kind of wonder how it will perform with a low contrast subject in front of backlighting or high contrast background.

[bohdank]

The outer points are weaker in lower light but we have to define what is lower light.

I have no problems shooting stage events under lights with the outer points. Maybe they are just better lit than the ones other people shoot. I don't know.

ISO1600, f4, 1/200s (200mm) often pushed 1 stop is my typical starting point at all the venues I shoot. Not the lowest lighting but the outer points don't have a problem in that kind of lighting. I shoot shows in AI Servo.


http://www.bwkphotography.com/photos/624916042_gvYjm-L.jpg

[bacchanal]

Here are a couple of ambient shots...

(notice they're from relatively stationary moments...but what can you do at 1/40 or 1/50)

http://www.photos.fahrenheit128.com/img/v4/p241085127-4.jpg


http://www.photos.fahrenheit128.com/img/v0/p383526144-4.jpg

[datadump]

thank you for the comments and sample shots.

bohdank, to define low lighting, i'm in small venues where i shoot iso1600-3200 all night and at f/2, 1/20-1/30s ... its it really challenging as i have to wait for a static moment, otherwise, motion blur:) i assume 5dm2 outer points will not work very well in this environment. 7d does sound interesting but since i often shoot at higher iso shots and my prints are around 10x13 or 13x17... i prefer the IQ of a 5dm2... but the Focusing! gahh!!

[narlus]

just a qualifier, iirc bohdank's shot used flash, so the flash grid could have certainly aided focusing.

[bohdank]

True but at that focal length, and angle, if anything, the grid would not have been dense enough to cover what I was shooting at. I certainly didn't see any grid in the viewfinder while focusing. I'll have to check, when I get home, but I do not think the assist went on.

I have others where I know the flash was not mounted or turned off but I'll need to get home to dig one up.

PS: the fill flash is something I have only recently started to play with, shooting shows.

PPS. I just realized. I beiieve the shot was in AI Servo. I'll check when I get home. The assist beam does not turn on it that mode. Someone can correct me if I am wrong.

[bacchanal]

Yep, the assist beam won't work in Servo, but I find that in just about any case where you have a reasonable amount of stage lighting on the performer, the 5D/5DII should do just fine.

Also, I think when you're dealing with tight shots and long lenses (big focus difference between subject and bg) there is less tendency to jump to the bg.

On that note, I've actually had problems with the hidden AF assist points causing focus to jump to a brighter or more contrasty bg, and I now typically shoot with them disabled.

[narlus]

PPS. I just realized. I beiieve the shot was in AI Servo. I'll check when I get home. The assist beam does not turn on it that mode. Someone can correct me if I am wrong.

:lol: i was wondering why i never saw the red grid when using flash...i typically always shoot in Servo.

doh! :D

[datadump]

u guys use af-assist beam!??! one guy got annoyed at me when i tried that hehehe i never used it again.

hmm i wonder if i should start a new thread for "post your 7d + concert shots!" heh heh.

[bacchanal]

u guys use af-assist beam!??! one guy got annoyed at me when i tried that hehehe i never used it again.

hmm i wonder if i should start a new thread for "post your 7d + concert shots!" heh heh.

I use the AF assist beam when I'm in really dark venues, but I wouldn't use it anywhere that I wouldn't also be comfortable (and welcome) using flash. I really only use it at one particular venue that I tend to shoot at quite often...and if anyone there is annoyed with me it is generally a matter of either not enough or too much consumption of PBR.

[datadump]

man i'm having a hard time deciding between 7d and 5dm2.

the main reason for me parting with my 1dm3, for either a 7d or 5dm2 is because i really would like to go back to a smaller body. ideally if i could afford it, i would like to keep my 1dm3 and buy a second body heh heh. Anyway , outside of just concert shooting, i love to hike with my SLR, allow my wife to use the camera from time to time, and take it on vacations where i do a good amount of excursions. the 1D is a dream but with the scenarios i just mentioned, it is just too heavy/large-footprint in the bag, and a bit cumbersome to travel/hike with... my wife simply cannot hold this 1D so she stopped using SLR altogether and opts to shoot with her cellphone! :( she used to pickup the 30D willingly ...

i also do a good amount of studio shooting in the basement for which i have no issues using a large 1D body.. so this isnt a factor in going smaller body.

ahhhh someone kill me.