I've set prices for prints, but now what do I charge for digital copies?

[aepoc]

I've decided on my prices for prints: 4x6 - $6, 5x7 - $8, and 8x10 for $10. Some people that want photos are out of state and aren't sure of what sizes they want, and are requesting digital copies. I don't have a problem with it really, but I'm not sure what to charge. Obviously I'd be letting them know that I'm not responsible for if their prints look like crap as well.

Shouldn't a digital file be more than the price of any of the prints, since they'd be able to make as many prints (in various sizes) off of said files? Most of my photos are 3888x2592 at full resolution... so prints can be made that are pretty large.

Any help would be appreciated.


- j

[Ernst-Ulrich Schafer]

1st off your print pricing is way to low, you won't last very long in this business.

I personally never sell CD's unless I getting paid well with print purchases. I offer my customers a professional product, not just CD's. We all have overhead, do you know what your true costs are?

Best regards, Ernst

[bwolford]

Agreed, your print prices are far too low.

My digital files are 5X, minimum, photo price.

[aepoc]

Thanks for your input guys. I also want to make sure I do make some sales though. I'm the team photographer for the Madison Ice Muskies professional hockey team, and I have 8x10s that I will have for sale out on the merchandise tables during games. Initially I was going to have my prices at 8, 10, and $15... is that more reasonable? People I've talked to about that suggest that the prices are a bit high.

[jacuff]

Price an "editorial license" full resolution file at $150 and watch them make up their mind about what size prints they want.

[sapearl]

+1 for Brice here. You don't want to give the store away.

Once the files leave your hands unfortunately they will go ahead and print them at WalMart, Costco, the drugstore, they're miserable inkject with copier papier.... it's out of your control. But you certainly want to cover the cost of the print sales you will lose once they can do it themselves.

I don't know about the 5X figure - may depend upon your local market - but it probably is quite close. - Stu

Agreed, your print prices are far too low.

My digital files are 5X, minimum, photo price.

[iamjediknight]

I think you will find out that you may actually be losing money with your prices. I would seriously create a spreadsheet to calculate your true costs to see if you are making any money. Factors to consider:

1. Actually print cost from what ever lab you use
2. Shipping costs from the lab (if applicable)
3. Color correction (if you are having the lab handle this)
4. Any coating to the prints
5. Any mounting costs to the prints
6. Your time to do any digital dark room edits (i.e. photoshop)

Also if you project too low of a price you will get the bottom feeders. I wouldn't charge anything less than $30 for an 8x10.

To answer your original question about digital files. I do not allow a client to purchase digital files until they purchased $500 in prints. Once they have purchased $500 in prints, I allow them to buy the digital files at $150 per file.

I do give (gift) my clients a cd with my watermarked logo on it with all orders. The images on the cd are low quality, but suitable for facebook, blogs, etc.

scott.

[aepoc]

Thanks for the post Scott, I appreciate it. You've got some nice work on your site :). I'm not sure I'll be losing much money with my prices, but I'm not doing this full-time as of yet. I do know that it's going to be very difficult to increase my prices in the future though, and that's something I want to be careful of.

Print cost is around $2 for an 8x10 at the max end (mpix.com). Shipping depends on how many of those I'd order at one time. Color correction isn't done, coating done at mpix. No mounting... just the shot. The only thing that concerns me is post production (photoshop). I've written down that $25/hr for editing (pp) is resonable. Any ideas on that?

[aepoc]

Here's a link to a question I threw out in the Sports forum. The photo pricing I'm looking to create is in terms of the Madison Ice Muskies hockey team. Samples in the link:

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=774087

[Tigershark]

Charging $30 for an 8x10 in the T&I business and you won't have any customers. Depending on your area of the country the market will decide the prices for you just look at the local competition. some areas of the country I have seen 8x10s for $8-20$ if you are paying 2.00 then you might need to find a cheaper lab. I think it would be best to find out what the market is around your area and base your price on that, sure your work might be worth more but the area of the country you are in and the competition sets the price

[aepoc]

Tiger - I've been checking out local prices over the past hour or so. Most of what I can find are for portrait/wedding/baby "packages", which makes it difficult to ascertain what exactly they're charging for one print. I agree with you that the competition in location sets the price.

I went with MPIX.com for the initial 18 photos (8x10s) because I know their quality, and I'm happy with them. I have looked into meridianpro.com as well and they're at $1.39 for an 8x10... so I'd be saving money there... and they'd ship directly to the customer... if people wanted to buy directly from my site.

[sapearl]

Wedding photographers will typically be charging at least $9/4x6, $12.50 for a 5x7 and $16.00 for an 8x10. That includes postprocessing of the image, but no postage; client picks it up.

Tiger - I've been checking out local prices over the past hour or so. Most of what I can find are for portrait/wedding/baby "packages", which makes it difficult to ascertain what exactly they're charging for one print. I agree with you that the competition in location sets the price......

[racing-guy]

Tiger - I've been checking out local prices over the past hour or so. Most of what I can find are for portrait/wedding/baby "packages", which makes it difficult to ascertain what exactly they're charging for one print. I agree with you that the competition in location sets the price.


What are the other photographers in the league charging? That's your market; not the portrait / wedding / baby market.

[aepoc]

Racing-guy, I'm trying to find what hockey photographers charge, but that's a pretty difficult thing to find, actually.

[gonzogolf]

It seems to me there is a certain amount of apples and oranges comparisons going on here. Wedding, portrait, and other personal event work prices dont directly compare to prints made in bulk to be sold in a souvenir shop at the games. The price would have to be competitive with other mementos in order to create a market, so his prices may be the most he can charge for that product in that place.

[aepoc]

I fully agree Gonzo. Here's an idea of what else is for sale on the merchandise tables at the hockey games. Also keep in mind that these prices are set by the Onwer/GM, not me. When I asked him if I can sell photos at the merchandise table (via email) he said "yeah, that is not a problem"... he said nothing about a certain % going to the team.

t-shirt: $15
longsleeve t: $30
hoodies: $40
pucks: $6

[NYC2BGI]

Charging $30 for an 8x10 in the T&I business and you won't have any customers. Depending on your area of the country the market will decide the prices for you just look at the local competition. some areas of the country I have seen 8x10s for $8-20$ if you are paying 2.00 then you might need to find a cheaper lab. I think it would be best to find out what the market is around your area and base your price on that, sure your work might be worth more but the area of the country you are in and the competition sets the priceI agree because even here in NYC where everything is over-priced no one is buying a 30.00 8x10.

[BradJohnsen]

Charging $30 for an 8x10 in the T&I business and you won't have any customers. Depending on your area of the country the market will decide the prices for you just look at the local competition. some areas of the country I have seen 8x10s for $8-20$ if you are paying 2.00 then you might need to find a cheaper lab. I think it would be best to find out what the market is around your area and base your price on that, sure your work might be worth more but the area of the country you are in and the competition sets the price


What is a "T&I business"?

[jacuff]

What is a "T&I business"?

Team and Individuals

[amfoto1]

Hi,

Pricing has to vary depending upon the marketplace. For example, I'd price a custom 8x10 from a wedding much higher than a mid-quality, lab-made 8x10 from a sporting event.

For the latter, I charge $20 online, $22 on-site (I'm doing less and less on-site printing, due to quality controls, added cost, etc.). My price for this is pretty much in the middle, in my market place (might be due for a small increase, am still thinking about that).

I also offer a digital file, for personal use only (a JPEG to make a print for personal display, use as a screensaver or wallpaper, display on a personal website) $18

And I offer digital files for editorial use starting at $125.

I don't quote commercial usage, which might be a digital file. That's negotiated depending upon the specific usage.

Anyone who buys a print from me online is welcome download a low resolution image for use on Facebook, free. It's always watermarked in a way that serves as an ad for me, and also contains a live link back to my galleries.

You need to work at finding other photogs in your area doing similar work, and take their prices into consideration. However, realistically, even if part time you should mark up your wholesale price by about 100%, in order to be in the ballpark with your prices.

I use Printroom.com. They have a "suggested" price list (several, actually, for different types of photography). You are welcome to follow the link below, go into any gallery you wish and click on any individual thumbnail to see my prices for 100+ products (when including diff. print sizes and finishes), but keep in mind that I'm in N. Calif. area. Likely you will find other photogs on Printroom (or other, similar vendors) who are more local to you, and should look at their pricing carefully. Combine that with a proper cost-of-doing-business study (that will be a real eye-opener!) to arrive at reasonable and practical prices.

No matter what prices you choose, some customers will always find them too high, while others will consider them reasonable or even a bargain. Of course, the higher your prices are, more people will fall into the first category and less in the latter. But, people do take away a perception of your quality, depending upon what you charge.

And, you can alway offer package discounts, introductory discounts, etc., if you wish. It's quite different in people's minds, discounting off of higher regular prices on a temporary basis, than it is just offering low, low prices. By discounting or having sales you are adding perceived value, yet not undercutting yourself.

[amfoto1]

When I asked him if I can sell photos at the merchandise table (via email) he said "yeah, that is not a problem"... he said nothing about a certain % going to the team.

Get it in writing!

[nwagirl]

I shoot motorsport at a local dirt track mostly. My print prices are considerably cheaper but I feel appropriate for my customers. I basically sell most at a table at the track to the fans (and a lot of times little kids). I do all the "corny" stuff also - keychains, magnets, etc., b/c that's the kind of stuff the fans here want. It's hard to base your prices off the prices of a wedding photog, etc so definitely check around other hockey photogs and see what they are charging. I try to stay at or below the local track photogs around my area. And if I can find something different to offer, then *bonus* for me. Even though most tracks only have one photog, I still feel somewhat competition from other local track photogs b/c the racers travel, as do their fans. Just gotta look into your own market and not think of photography as having overall prices for prints, digital copies, etc. jmo

Editted to add - what family shoots, engagements, etc I do, usually come from the race track or referred from people at the track. Make sure they understand your prices for hockey are not the same as prices for family photos, etc.

[nwagirl]

I fully agree Gonzo. Here's an idea of what else is for sale on the merchandise tables at the hockey games. Also keep in mind that these prices are set by the Onwer/GM, not me. When I asked him if I can sell photos at the merchandise table (via email) he said "yeah, that is not a problem"... he said nothing about a certain % going to the team.

t-shirt: $15
longsleeve t: $30
hoodies: $40
pucks: $6


That makes it difficult when the fan is thinking they can spend $15 on a tshirt or $15 a photo.

[aroundlsu]

The exposure manager blog has some recent articles concerning print pricing and digital files. Their data is aggregated from the thousands of photographers they manage so they are worth listening to.

I am on my iPhone and don't have the link. But google will get you there. Exposure manager blog.

[aepoc]

Thanks for all the replies. I appreciate it greatly. :)

[aepoc]

For other interested parties, I found the link:

http://www.facebook.com/note.php?note_id=153188026470

Very good reading. It helped a lot... thanks again.

[tim]

$10 for an 8x10, hahahahaha. I think I charge $50. Once you sell a high res image the customer will give it to everyone, so charge $150 or so.

[aroundlsu]

Once you sell a high res image the customer will give it to everyone, so charge $150 or so.

That's a myth exposure manager has debunked. People who offer digital downloads at the same price as 8x10s sell MORE than people who don't offer digital downloads at all (or way overpriced).

This is a new age. Your customers want digital files to email and share. Not offering it to them at a reasonable price is ignoring a large market.

[FlyingPhotog]

That's a myth exposure manager has debunked. People who offer digital downloads at the same price as 8x10s sell MORE than people who don't offer digital downloads at all (or way overpriced).

This is a new age. Your customers want digital files to email and share. Not offering it to them at a reasonable price is ignoring a large market.

Doesn't this mean you're only going to get one "sale" on a digital file?

Why whore yourself cheaply?

[aroundlsu]

Even If you are a very busy succesful photographer you don't have access to the mounds of sales data EM has. If they claim their data says you will sell MORE by offering downloads at the same price as an 8x10, well I am not sure why you would argue or discount that so quickly.

The truth is, since I started following their advice my sales have risen 4x and people are buying the digitals which is my highest profit regular item at $20/each. 4x6 and 5x7 are still the sizes most often bought and are the bread and butter of my sales.

Edit: As I was typing this I made $60 in digital sales through EM. No lie.

[tim]

That's a myth exposure manager has debunked. People who offer digital downloads at the same price as 8x10s sell MORE than people who don't offer digital downloads at all (or way overpriced).

This is a new age. Your customers want digital files to email and share. Not offering it to them at a reasonable price is ignoring a large market.

Interesting. I have a minimum order, but i'd waive it for digital downloads, i've just started a thread at picturespro.com to see if this is possible. I'd probably offer digital downloads at 1800px, for a 6x4, or something like that.

[aroundlsu]

I am offering them at around 1280px horizontal and no one is complaining so far (not too small OR too big for them). That is the minimum resolution adobe camera raw outputs without having to open in Photoshop. So that resolution works into my extremely fast workflow (I typically have photos ready to buy same day or next day).

If you guys haven't read the EM blogs concerning this I highly recommend you spend a few minutes reading it. If you don't know who EM is, they manage literally thousands of photographers including myself.

[tim]

If you guys haven't read the EM blogs concerning this I highly recommend you spend a few minutes reading it. If you don't know who EM is, they manage literally thousands of photographers including myself.

Do you have a link?

[aroundlsu]

Go down about four posts:

http://blog.exposuremanager.com/

[tim]

Ta :) Here's the direct links to two useful posts.

http://blog.exposuremanager.com/2009/10/rethink-digital-files.html
http://blog.exposuremanager.com/2009/09/pricing-to-increase-sales.html

[myjunk]

This is a great read. Thanks for this.

BTW, when you give/sell out those digital files, do you also include a "if you don't print it through me, I cannot guarantee how the end results looks like"

[aroundlsu]

This is a great read. Thanks for this.

BTW, when you give/sell out those digital files, do you also include a "if you don't print it through me, I cannot guarantee how the end results looks like"

I haven't seen a need to add that line. Anyone who doesn't already understand that without being told probably thinks the print quality looks fine on their home printer. :D

[sapearl]

I feel the same way also - many folks just don't care or understand about the nuances of quality.

What I WILL do is explain to people what goes into their prints; how I provide additional post processing to each lab print they purchase, removing eyeglass reflections, slightly darkenning/lightening as needed, giving a more pleasing crop....this is part of the salesmanship that goes into the business.

I am fair at this, but I know others who can talk a beautiful 16x20 canvas framed print into the package given half the chance. ;) - Stu

I haven't seen a need to add that line. Anyone who doesn't already understand that without being told probably thinks the print quality looks fine on their home printer. :D