Camera Bag for someone with Neck issues?

[nicksan]

Hello folks,

I am embarrassed to admit at this age (< 40) but I have developed somewhat of a chronic neck problem which is most likely contributing to the balance problems I've had on and off for the last 6 or 7 years. (Culminating in a full-blown Vertigo episode last summer:()

I took a trip to Japan recently and have come to realize that my LowePro SlingShot 200 that I have been using for a few years now, doesn't help with this problem. I love the bag, but since my neck problem is on the left side, it's just not going to work anymore. I felt like absolute garbage with the neck muscle destroyed b/c I carried the SlingShot non-stop for 2.5 weeks. This is not a knock on the bag, but more b/c of the pre-existing neck conditionand the fact that I tend to carry too much gear!:o

So I've been pondering over camera bags...again.

I absolutely love the sling action so I've been looking at some of the backpack/sling combo bags out there from LowePro and M-rock.

I've read about the M-Rock Arches bags, which actually looks perfect. Very configurable and convertible.

I wanted to find out whether there are people like myself out there and what kind of options do I have.

My biggest lens is the 200L f2 IS and it does indeed fit tightly inside my SlingShot...very tightly I might add. But typically, I carry my smaller lenses so size really isn't a huge problem. When I am shooting locally, I usually carry the 200L outside the bag with its own strap anyways.

Any suggestion would be appreciated.

Thanks
Nick

[FlyingPhotog]

A friend of mine carried a severly over-stuffed briefcase on one shoulder for many years and started to develop similar symptoms to what you describe. Once he migrated to a legitimate backpack (with no obvious reduction in weight I might add), his issues began to fade rather quickly.

Bottom Line: Get thee to a balanced load... You may not be able to get at your gear quite as fast, but you'll remain ambulatory!

Good Luck...

[gembobs]

The other thing to do is try to transfer as much of the weight to your hips, rather than your shoulders - the shoulder straps should be there for stability rather than weight carrying. So maybe a larger bag than you need with a proper back system (the best ones I have seen (IMO) are on the Tamrac Expedition 7 or larger bags - they seem better than the Lowepro Rover, or the Vertex bags, didn't look at the nature trekker etc as they were out of my budget)

I have a bad back and I find this is the best thing for me. I actually use a proper walking back pack as I couldn't find a bag which had a decent back system, room for camera gear and enough walking gear for a day in the UK hills in winter.

[Mr. Bill]

I would suggest taking a look at the Kata 3n1-30
http://www.kata-bags.com/product.asp?Version=photo&p_Id=433

I got mine on Ebay for about $75.
Works great as a backpack and as a sling bag too.

[ImRaptor]

x2 for the Kata 3n1-30

Sling bag for when you are out and about and want the immediate access to your camera, or swing the bag back and cross strap it to balance the load. I love my 3n1 for the ability to put the load on both shoulders and be able to swing the bag to my side to get my camera out without taking the bag off.

[Saint728]

Try the Cotton Carrier chest harness and a belt system to hold the extra lenses. I use one to carry my camera and I do some extreme hiking where I need my arms to pull myself up a rope on the steep rock sections. Check my flickr page and see some of the hikes we go on. http://www.flickr.com/photos/37014341@N03/

Take Care,
Cheers, Patrick

[bohdank]

I have a Lowepro ProMag2.

You can just use the waist belt and it works fine (comfortable).

I carry a 5DII/gripped, Tamron 28-75, Canon 17-40, Canon 70-200 f4IS, 85/1.8, 135L + accessories. The 5DII can be stored with any of those lenses mounted.

I like the bag because I do not have to put it down or take it off to change lenses.

The shoulder strap is also contoured and well padded if you want to use it in tandem with the waist belt. I use it cross shouldered but most of the weight is carried by the waist belt.

I had a Fastpack 200 previously and, imo, it was useless. Lousy for transport (uncomfortable and little padding) and lousy for change on the fly unless you have only 3 lenses.

[nicksan]

Thanks for all the suggestions fellas!

It's been difficult dealing with the neck pain. I noticed while in Japan, when I stuffed the SlingShot with gear and carried it, my left neck would become painful and I would become "dizzy" for a lack of a better word. As soon as I put it down, I felt better.

The ideal bag would be a regular backpack that can be slinged on a shoulder and be able to take my camera out from the side. While the Kata back looks promising, I would need to unclip one of the straps to sling it over. Not sure I like that design.

Something like the Fastpack would be fine, but I don't like that bag too much because the main compartment is on the smallish side.

The M-Rock bag looks ideal since I can use it as a regular backpack, but then I can sling it over and have access to either side of the bag. Plus the upper compartment is removable in a sense that the divider between it and the main compartment can be removed. So this bag has lots of potential.

Just wanted to see if there are other options out there. I liked the Temba shootout but the sling is a true sling, not a combo.

[FlyingPhotog]

Thanks for all the suggestions fellas!

It's been difficult dealing with the neck pain. I noticed while in Japan, when I stuffed the SlingShot with gear and carried it, my left neck would become painful and I would become "dizzy" for a lack of a better word. As soon as I put it down, I felt better.

Are you sure you weren't cutting blood flow to your brain?
(Only partially joking here...)

Get the bag too heavy and the strap too far up on the neck and you're liable to be pinching an artery.

[Heath]

There is some bag out there that is convertible from a backpack to a right side sling or a left side sling.

I really wish I could remember where I saw that now.

[nicksan]

Are you sure you weren't cutting blood flow to your brain?
(Only partially joking here...)

Get the bag too heavy and the strap too far up on the neck and you're liable to be pinching an artery.

I've been having some inner ear issues on and off for several years now, but the extra weight on the left shoulder, which happens to be side of the ear I usually have issues with, definitely contributes to the sensation of feeling uneven and unsteady on my feet. The frustrating part is that it comes and goes. I did have that one and only episode of full blown vertigo (spinning) which put me in the emergency room.

So I think for my future health, I should look for something other than the SlingShot. Too bad. I really like the bag. I just don't know how to not put too much stuff in it!:o

[FlyingPhotog]

I've been having some inner ear issues on and off for several years now, but the extra weight on the left shoulder, which happens to be side of the ear I usually have issues with, definitely contributes to the sensation of feeling uneven and unsteady on my feet. The frustrating part is that it comes and goes. I did have that one and only episode of full blown vertigo (spinning) which put me in the emergency room.

So I think for my future health, I should look for something other than the SlingShot. Too bad. I really like the bag. I just don't know how to not put too much stuff in it!:o

It may not be the most fashionable thing for a NYC street shooter but what about a belt system? Give your shoulders/neck a break completely...?

[nicksan]

It may not be the most fashionable thing for a NYC street shooter but what about a belt system? Give your shoulders/neck a break completely...?

Not really into the belt system, at least not at this stage.
But if I run out of choices, certainly, it's an option.

[ImRaptor]

There is some bag out there that is convertible from a backpack to a right side sling or a left side sling.

I really wish I could remember where I saw that now.

Kata 3n1 does that.

[whirligig]

x2 for the Kata 3n1-30

Sling bag for when you are out and about and want the immediate access to your camera, or swing the bag back and cross strap it to balance the load. I love my 3n1 for the ability to put the load on both shoulders and be able to swing the bag to my side to get my camera out without taking the bag off.

i agree... i am actually looking at the 3n1-20 version of this bag, not for its support cross-straps, which are super cool, but because i think this is an all-around rockin' bag!

[tvphotog]

The Thinktank Rotation 360 backpack (http://www.rotation360.com). Lets you access it while still wearing it. Depends if you want to spend for that feature, but not having neck problems may be worth it.

[nicksan]

Kata 3n1 does that.

I like the LowePro Fastback design better because it's really a backpack with wide access. I don't have to unhook a strap to convert it from a backpack to a sling.

[nicksan]

The Thinktank Rotation 360 backpack (http://www.rotation360.com). Lets you access it while still wearing it. Depends if you want to spend for that feature, but not having neck problems may be worth it.

That's pretty interesting...but not for me.:(

[ImRaptor]

I like the LowePro Fastback design better because it's really a backpack with wide access. I don't have to unhook a strap to convert it from a backpack to a sling.

The way the Fastback is setup you can do the exact same thing with the Kata 3n1.
You just set the straps from top to bottom rather than cross strap. Then it's worn as a regular backpack that has side access.

Kata has 3 basic strap layout options, sling, cross, and back pack. You can easily set it up in the way you prefer.

[bohdank]

I like the LowePro Fastback design better because it's really a backpack with wide access. I don't have to unhook a strap to convert it from a backpack to a sling.

Except that, unless you carry less than 4 lenses, you have to put it down to change lenses.

I had one..... got rid of it prertty fast. Also, uncomfortable. Not recommended, imo.

[dpark]

I'd steer clear of Kata's 3n1 bags. I love the idea, but the implementation is not great, especially on the larger versions. The straps are just too thin. And honestly, if you've been having trouble with sling bags, there seems to be no point in getting another. Get a proper backpack.

Get something that has nice thick, comfortable shoulder straps. Bonus points if it's got a good hip belt to get more of the weight off the shoulders.

If you want quick access, get a bag with d-rings on the shoulders. You can attach the camera directly to that. Carry it that way and there's no need for a sling-style pack anyway. If you're really set on the side access, check out the Tamrac Aero series. They get consistently good reviews. (I haven't used one personally.)

[nicksan]

Thanks for all the great info fellas.

I didn't know that the kata can operate much in the same way as the Fastpack. Good to know.

I will look into the Aero.

I agree. I might be in need of nicely paded straps. I have an optech strap for the camera and it makes a ton of difference in taking off the load so I suppose it's the same concept.

I guess I'm going to head over to B&H sometime next week. The good thing about it is that since it's for health reasons, my wife is being quite agreeable to buying yet another bag. (not that I can compete with her rather large collection of purses!)

[ImRaptor]

Bonus points if it's got a good hip belt to get more of the weight off the shoulders.


3n1 has that too. :)

[ImRaptor]

my wife is being quite agreeable to buying yet another bag. (not that I can compete with her rather large collection of purses!)

Whenever my wife starts becoming agreeable with anything I am buying, regardless of reason, I start to get suspicious because usually it means she wants something too.

I could see it now, you buy a new bag, and all of a sudden there is a new purse or two appearing in the house. :D

Anyway, good luck with the shopping, in your case I'd say that trying the bag out is important. Remember not to settle with something that seems like it might work, be confident that it will help your neck.

[dpark]

3n1 has that too. :)
The shoulder straps suck, though. I've handled these in person and was really disappointed. I really wanted to like these, but the straps were just too thin and flimsy. I also don't remember the hip belt being anything special, but I decided no as soon as I tried the shoulder straps so I might have missed that.

Maybe those straps would be okay on the 3n1-10, but on the 3n1-30, they're just not enough.

[ImRaptor]

There plenty for me on the 30.
Right now my 30 is a bit over 20 pounds of weight and I haven't had a problem with the straps feeling two skinny.

[dpark]

To me, the straps look and feel cheap and thin. I think they intentionally kept them small so they could tuck behind the padding easily, but I think for a decent-sized backback like the 3n1-30, they're just too thin. I've seen other reviews to this affect as well. There's also no sternum strap or d-rings, but that's more of a peripheral issue. Obviously it comes down to personal preference.

If the 3n1-33 was available with good shoulder straps (and carried a full-size tripod), I'd be all over it.

[whirligig]

the kata 3n1 bag can be found online for like 70 or 80 bucks, which is not too shabby. i'm curious to know more about the bag, though, and any other reasons why people who have owned it either did or didn't like the bag (save for the straps).

[ImRaptor]

I just remembered an ad from a magazine I just got: it was for one of Tamrac's new bags.
Called the Aero Speed series. Likely another good one to check out.

[dpark]

the kata 3n1 bag can be found online for like 70 or 80 bucks, which is not too shabby. i'm curious to know more about the bag, though, and any other reasons why people who have owned it either did or didn't like the bag (save for the straps).
My biggest problem was with the straps. It really is a nice bag if you don't mind the straps (and don't mind the style). I also don't like the fact that the tripod cup is both low-capacity (5lb) and not included, but I could deal with that.

[ed rader]

Thanks for all the suggestions fellas!

It's been difficult dealing with the neck pain. I noticed while in Japan, when I stuffed the SlingShot with gear and carried it, my left neck would become painful and I would become "dizzy" for a lack of a better word. As soon as I put it down, I felt better.

The ideal bag would be a regular backpack that can be slinged on a shoulder and be able to take my camera out from the side. While the Kata back looks promising, I would need to unclip one of the straps to sling it over. Not sure I like that design.

Something like the Fastpack would be fine, but I don't like that bag too much because the main compartment is on the smallish side.

The M-Rock bag looks ideal since I can use it as a regular backpack, but then I can sling it over and have access to either side of the bag. Plus the upper compartment is removable in a sense that the divider between it and the main compartment can be removed. So this bag has lots of potential.

Just wanted to see if there are other options out there. I liked the Temba shootout but the sling is a true sling, not a combo.


how about lighter gear :D?

ed rader

[Beachcomber Joe]

Have you looked at the Tamrac convertible series (704, 706, 709) or Velocity 5765? They are traditional shoulder bags that have the option of being used as a hip/fanny packs.

[hfgarris]

Think Tank make some nice belt bags in addition to their modular belt system. I like the Change Up which can be a small shoulder bag, and quickly convert to transfer the weight to your hips when it gets heavy. The new multimedia belt bags are also nice with just a bit more room at the top for full size non-gripped cameras like the 5D or 7D.

http://www.thinktankphoto.com/categories/camera-beltpacks.aspx

-howard

[nicksan]

Looks like the Tamrac Aero is conceptually the same as the Fastpack. Just don't like the setup where the upper compartment can't be used for gear.

In that sense, the m-rock bags look to be ideal.

[nicksan]

OK, so I researched Kata, LowePro, Tamrac, ThinkTank, etc, etc, and to my surprise, at least on paper, the M-Rock 676 bag is what does it for me.

If you read up on the bag, you will see it is extremely configurable. I think the 676 is between the Slingshot 200 & 300, perfect actually. I can configure it as a traditional sling, a backpack, or a hybrid. What really sold me is the fact that the partition between the main and upper compartments is removable so I can even fit my 200L with hood in the shooting position and mounted on a body. It's got a built in rain cover and all the straps are removable.

I will go to either Adorama and B&H to check the bag out in person. I really don't care about the brand name as long as it's comfortable, durable, and it protects my gear.

I think what's clear is that it is time to retire my SlingShot 200. It served me well...

[AlanU]

Nick-san,

I like my Flilpside 400. With the waist belt support on it really evenly distributes the weight. With the waist belt on I can take my shoulder straps off and flip the bag infront of me "like a table" open up the compartment and easily swap lenses and grab my camera/lens setup. This bag has access on the back side NOT accessible by the the exposed outer part of the bag.

this bag does not have the side access but to me thats NOT a problem. Use the waist belt as a lever point and twist the bag to the front. My friend at the camera store showed me this "trick" and Ilove it.

[nicksan]

Nick-san,

I like my Flilpside 400. With the waist belt support on it really evenly distributes the weight. With the waist belt on I can take my shoulder straps off and flip the bag infront of me "like a table" open up the compartment and easily swap lenses and grab my camera/lens setup. This bag has access on the back side NOT accessible by the the exposed outer part of the bag.

this bag does not have the side access but to me thats NOT a problem. Use the waist belt as a lever point and twist the bag to the front. My friend at the camera store showed me this "trick" and Ilove it.

Yeah, the Flipside is something I took a look at a while ago and decided that it just wasn't for me and my gut!

But I'll check it out at the shop again.

[c2thew]

From the way i am reading your responses, the flipside would probably not suit your conditions as it's flip technique will probably cut into your lower back. Users should be recommending comfortable backpacks. once you damage your shoulder, it's very hard to recover.

[dpark]

The M-rock 676 straps really don't look comfortable to me. Maybe it's just the pictures online, but I'd make sure to try that on in a store before buying.

[nicksan]

Yeah, that's a concern. I need to check it out in person.

[AlanU]

I dont understand why Lowerpro calls it flipside.

The backpack opens from the inside. The outer zipper is just more storage space.

Bag selection is such a pain in the a_ _. I think its wise to look online for video reviews.

I've never seen an online video describing how I pull my gear out of my flipside using the waist belt as a lever. I guess it pays to read forums and sales guys.

I posted on another thread but when I want to alleviate weight in the backpack I'll put my Thinktank modular belt and put some lenses on my waist. The modular belt serves as a purpose when I want to quickly swap lenses while shooting.

[Mr. Bill]

I went to the M-rock site and while looking at the pictures of the bag, came across this image. Somebody there has a sense of humor. Just had to post it. :lol:


http://www.m-rock.com/images/productImages/LG-676_3.jpg

[nicksan]

So I took the drive to Adorama. Despite the fact that I work in NYC I've only been there once the last few years and it was nice to see they renovated the store.

So I checked out a few bags including the Fastpack, Tenba, Tamrac, and m-rock.

I came home with the m-rock 676, which sits right inbetween the slingshot 200 & 300. The bag is rather rigid and at 5 lbs it's not exactly like the sligshot which is a feather weight. I put it in backpack mode and checked out the sling action and it works well. The only iffy part was the straps. Because they are removable, they aren't as thickly as padded as the other bags however still comfortable and very adjustable. You can remove one strap for traditional sling setup. The waiste belt was a nice touch and there was plenty of space. I really like the fact that the divider between the upper an lower compartments canbe removed. Very versatile.

I made sure of their 7 day return policy and will try the bag put at home for the next week to see how it feels.

I feel rather stupid. I realized at the store that the slingshot actually lies on the right shoulder when in carry position, which is th opposite shoulder. I have issues withy left neck so it had nothing to do with the slingshot.

However, I am best served with a backpack.

I will report hack once I put some gear in the bag at home.

Oh, and the trip was extra productive sincevi managed to finally buy ilford 13x19 gallerie smooth pearl paper. Pack of 25 cost me $35.

Time to break open the 9000mkII printer that's been sitting in the box the last month!!!

[nicksan]

OK, so I've been playing around with the M-Rock 676 at home I think I'm going to like this bag.

As mentioned before, the area of concern, namely the straps, aren't as thickly padded as other bags, however a quick load test using a 5DMKII, 24-70L and 70-200 f2.8 IS revealed that it was still comfy.

It took a little bit of time adjusting the straps to where it's just right, but I think I've got it now. In the backpack mode, all I have to do is "undo" the right shoulder strap (not disconnect anything) then I can have side access. Tested it with a 5DMKII + 70-200 f2.8 IS mounted with hood reversed and no problem.

What I really like about this bag is how everything is adjustable. As I say over and over again, the partition between the upper and lower compartment can be removed which gives it that extra versatility. Everything is well cushioned and the velcro is extemely strong...annoyingly so at times!

I snapped some pics. Since this will replace my SlingShot 200, I took some comparo shots. I will keep my SlingShot 200 around because it's really a great bag and I'll use it when I go really lite...as in 1 body and 1 or 2 lenses, etc.

LowePro SS 200 & M-Rock 676 side-by-side. Notice that the 676 has the flexible ties and tripod holder.
http://nicksan.zenfolio.com/img/v3/p935593747.jpg

http://nicksan.zenfolio.com/img/v6/p634433670.jpg

Upper compartment has side access too. It's just as well padded as the lower compartment so a lens can be stored there as well. It's big enough that my 70-200 f2.8 IS can be taken out easily.
http://nicksan.zenfolio.com/img/v3/p603673607.jpg

Default configuration. (What's with the blue dividers?!?)
http://nicksan.zenfolio.com/img/v6/p651212513.jpg

200L & 70-200 f2.8 IS as a size reference.
http://nicksan.zenfolio.com/img/v4/p755070569.jpg

200L with reversed hood. 70-200 f2.8 IS in the upper compartment.
http://nicksan.zenfolio.com/img/v3/p1030421087.jpg

200L with hood in the shooting position. Don't have a second body, but it looks like it will fit with it attached. This is what's great about being able to remove the partition.
http://nicksan.zenfolio.com/img/v1/p925273454.jpg

[ImRaptor]

Looks a lot like the 3n1 from the outside, but offers a much better compartment design and better overall access from the looks of things.
The Kata top compartment is a bit of a pain to work with from the side.

[nicksan]

Looks a lot like the 3n1 from the outside, but offers a much better compartment design and better overall access from the looks of things.
The Kata top compartment is a bit of a pain to work with from the side.

Yeah, I think the Kata was pretty close to what I had in mind but you are right. With the M-Rock, there's so many ways to access the gear inside. I will review them here.

Main compartment from the left side. Can be accessed either via sling or backpack configurations.
Main compartment from the front.
Upper compartment from the left side. Big enough that a 70-200 2.8 IS can fit through. Can be accessed either via sling or backpack configurations.
Upper compartment from the front.
The entire thing from the front...just like a typical backpack.

I guess the only downside to this versatility is that there are so many zippers on the bag! :lol:

I did a few "dry runs" as far as putting my typical gear inside and in the backpack configuration. I managed to use the side access panel to take out the camera with lens attached, switch some lenses, etc.


I've also managed to tidy up the straps to a point where the "leftover" strap isn't an issue. Strap feels comfy as well and in fact I compared it to the SlingShot 200 strap and they are similar, with maybe the M-Rock with a slight advantage in the cushion.

At this time, the width of the strap does not seem to be an issue at all for me.

I guess the one thing it is lacking is a laptop comartment but of course I bought this bag for actually using it on the field and not so much a transport bag. (Looking at Think Tank products for that)

So overall, I think I may have found the right bag. Of course I won't really know until I begin using it for real.

[MDJAK]

Are you sure you weren't cutting blood flow to your brain?

I know your name is Flying, but don't you think you're making a huge leap when you assume he's even got a brain to cut blood flow from? ;)

It may not be the most fashionable thing for a NYC street shooter but what about a belt system? Give your shoulders/neck a break completely...?

They don't make a belt large enough for that fat bastard. :lol:

Yeah, the Flipside is something I took a look at a while ago and decided that it just wasn't for me and my gut!

See? :lol:

I went to the M-rock site and while looking at the pictures of the bag, came across this image. Somebody there has a sense of humor. Just had to post it. :lol:


http://www.m-rock.com/images/productImages/LG-676_3.jpg

Even that wouldn't get around his enormous gut. :lol:


I feel rather stupid!!!

Feel stupid? Duh!! Truer words were never spoken. :lol:

me

[nicksan]

I know your name is Flying, but don't you think you're making a huge leap when you assume he's even got a brain to cut blood flow from? ;)



They don't make a belt large enough for that fat bastard. :lol:



See? :lol:



Even that wouldn't get around his enormous gut. :lol:



Feel stupid? Duh!! Truer words were never spoken. :lol:

me

I can always count on MDJAGOFF to poke fun at the expense of my misery.:lol:;)

If a 34" waist line is considered fat, then let me be a fat bastid!:lol:

[MDJAK]

Wouldn't want to disappoint ya, pal. :lol:

And misery loves company.

And English IS your first language, so please learn to spell, will ya, huh? There's no such word as waiste, you dolt. ;)

34? Yeah, if you measure around your hairy cujones. Measure around your umbilicus and it's more like a 48. :lol:

me

[Mr. Bill]

http://www.m-rock.com/images/productImages/LG-676_3.jpg

Wasn't referring to the belt size. Was talking about the sad face the backup makes. Nobody else sees it? Droopy eyes, long nose, frown?

[nicksan]

Wasn't referring to the belt size. Was talking about the sad face the backup makes. Nobody else sees it? Droopy eyes, long nose, frown?

Yep, I see it now. Funny!:lol:

[asysin2leads]

While I think that a proper backpack might be the best solution, remember that in order for a backpack to work effectively, it has to be worn properly. Just throwing a backpack on your shoulders and letting it hang in the back is just as bad as a slingback. If it's not worn properly, it will torque your shoulders back causing other back/neck issues. Keep that in mind.

[nicksan]

While I think that a proper backpack might be the best solution, remember that in order for a backpack to work effectively, it has to be worn properly. Just throwing a backpack on your shoulders and letting it hang in the back is just as bad as a slingback. If it's not worn properly, it will torque your shoulders back causing other back/neck issues. Keep that in mind.

Can you explain how to properly wear a backpack?

I adjusted the straps so that the rear of the backpack is against my back in a straight fashion. No gap between the pack and my back.

On heavier loads, I intend to use the waist belt.

[asysin2leads]

Can you explain how to properly wear a backpack?

I adjusted the straps so that the rear of the backpack is against my back in a straight fashion. No gap between the pack and my back.

On heavier loads, I intend to use the waist belt.

That's the proper way. A lot of people let the straps out all the way and sling it on their back letting it hang to their butt. That's what causes shoulder and lower pack issues. If the backpack also has a chest strap, use it. It helps distribute the weight. Oh, btw, if you ever see me with my backpack, don't look at me. I am the worst example of how to wear one. Always have been.