Finally getting the 7D dialed in for basketball - GREAT results!

[snyderman]

Not sure any of you guys have been following the saga of a few of us who 'don't get' the 7D yet. A guy was kind enough to provide the secret recipe in terms of choosing the correct focus settings for the 7D. The results last night were the best I've seen.

Drove to this game last night in a freakin' BLIZZARD of a snowstorm because it's a new facility. Was able to shoot at 1/800, ISO 2000 at f/2.0. No strobes, but I'll take these results ANY day of my LIFE!!!

1. Loading up for a quick "2."

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a310/dsnyder160/DPP_2045857.jpg

2. We could do a dental exam on this kid!

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a310/dsnyder160/DPP_2045830.jpg

3. Drive during the JV game. Got there in 4th quarter due to weather issues.

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a310/dsnyder160/DPP_2045799.jpg

4. Another shot that the 7D missed every time in centerpoint only focus mode

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a310/dsnyder160/DPP_2045823.jpg

5. Probably got about 20 shots like this last night. Full speed to the rack

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a310/dsnyder160/DPP_2045832.jpg

6. Another great baseline dribble drive. These were the shots I was totally nailing on timing, but the focus on the 7D was killing me! "Not today!"

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a310/dsnyder160/DPP_2045835.jpg

7. Another example of a static shot where the 7D would focus sometimes, but usually not.

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a310/dsnyder160/DPP_2045866.jpg

8. Last one ... promise.

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a310/dsnyder160/DPP_2045880.jpg

Just darned glad to have the focus issues on the 7D cleared up finally. What a struggle!

dave

[mrgooch]

I am not seeing any problems with your photos.I would lower your ss to 500 and it would give you a little more depth of focus on your lens opening.

[900spg]

These look really nice to me, especially for ambient light. I would be interested in hearing the settings you used to resolve the focusing issues you have experienced.

[snyderman]

These look really nice to me, especially for ambient light. I would be interested in hearing the settings you used to resolve the focusing issues you have experienced.

Thanks! Yep, pretty happy with the results last night. Long story short on the 7D, I'd chosen the centerpoint only focusing option which looks like a single [] in the view screen.

I'd put that [] right on a number or a face, hit focus button (*) and shoot. The camera would snap to focus instantly and on something, but RARELY where the [] was. Very disappointing.

I posted about the focusing issue in the camera section and got the usual litany of 'user-error,' 'send it back,' 'you don't know what you're doing' responses.

Someone was kind enough to recommended using what the 7D calls 'centerpoint expanded' setting which is the [] surrounded by 4 additional active focusing sensors, I guess.

Same principle--put [] on target, focus and shoot. Results were what you see above. The only time I didn't get shots in focus were clearly a result me not getting there quickly enough with the camera. What was killing me was pointing the camera at something that wasn't even moving, hit the focus button and shoot only to come away with OOF shots most of the time.

dave

[Woodfire]

See this thread: http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=822806

[snyderman]

I am not seeing any problems with your photos.I would lower your ss to 500 and it would give you a little more depth of focus on your lens opening.

You know, I thought of that late in the game. Could have also raised the ISO even more given the great high ISO capabilities of the 7D, dropped the SS to 1/640 and probably stopped down to at least 2.8 or maybe even 3.2.

It's not every game that you get a high school gym with this nice lighting! Heck, I only know how to act in the dungeon gyms we have around here!

dave

[The Moose]

See this thread: http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=822806

Ahh, the OP of this thread created that thread to explain his issues to show other people how to fix them?

Nice shots OP, glad you're enjoying the 7D!

[dringess]

Wow, those are some really nice shots. That IS a well-lit gym.

Which of your lenses did you use?

[ChrisK10]

Dave

Those are very nice shots in a very well lit gym. I usually use the center point expaned function as well and have gotten good results. The last two games I tried center point focus, but I haven't had a chance to look through the pics to see the difference.

Again nice shots.

Chris

[snyderman]

Wow, those are some really nice shots. That IS a well-lit gym.

Which of your lenses did you use?

Used the 85mm f/1.8 lens. Also, the gym lighting had these huge, flat-bottomed outward flared metal dishes below the lights that reflected the light upward and off the ceiling. This bounce a great amount of light evenly onto the floor. Quite a lighting concept, I'd say.

And thanks for the kind words on the shots!

dave

[snyderman]

Dave

Those are very nice shots in a very well lit gym. I usually use the center point expaned function as well and have gotten good results. The last two games I tried center point focus, but I haven't had a chance to look through the pics to see the difference.

Again nice shots.

Chris

Thanks Chris and definitely let me know how your shots using the centerpoint only turned out. When I used that mode, the camera might grab accurate focus, but usually didn't for some reason. Still stumped over that.

However, I am going to try it again now that I've put the lenses back to zero on the microadjust. I was using the centerpoint, one shot to MA the lenses and had them totally out of whack due to the focusing issues.

dave

[snyderman]

Ahh, the OP of this thread created that thread to explain his issues to show other people how to fix them?

Nice shots OP, glad you're enjoying the 7D!

Correct Moose. Someone helped me so I thought I'd pass the info along to others as well.

And thanks for the kind words on the shots. Nice to actually get some GOOD shots for a change!

dave

[ChrisK10]

Thanks Chris and definitely let me know how your shots using the centerpoint only turned out. When I used that mode, the camera might grab accurate focus, but usually didn't for some reason. Still stumped over that.

Dave

I used center point focus for the last two games and I didn't see a difference in keeper rate. The only thing I would have to get used to is when I was trying to frame two players side by side. I focused on the team I was shooting, but then the photo didn't always come out centered. Oh well live and learn. After all this is all a big journey for me and I'm loving every minute of it.

Chris

[Olly_K1]

These look great. I take it you've used some noise reduction in your PP workflow ?

[snyderman]

These look great. I take it you've used some noise reduction in your PP workflow ?

Olly:

Absolutely NONE! The high ISO performance on the 7D is incredibly good. No NR on any of the shots! All processing, and minimal, was done in DPP only. Just crop, adjust contrast/brightness and sharpness.

dave

[snyderman]

Dave

I used center point focus for the last two games and I didn't see a difference in keeper rate. The only thing I would have to get used to is when I was trying to frame two players side by side. I focused on the team I was shooting, but then the photo didn't always come out centered. Oh well live and learn. After all this is all a big journey for me and I'm loving every minute of it.

Chris

Chris:

Good to know that yours works as advertised. Mine will likely be going back to Canon for a look-see and hopefully a fix. I was using centerpoint on shots like the two players during foul shots. Neither player was in focus in 9/10 tries. No idea WHERE the focus was but not on the player where the centerpoint was clearly pointed; not on the crowd behind and there was nothing between the players and the lens to grab onto either. The camera just missed accurate focus for whatever reason.

Something definitely out of whack with centerpoint only focusing on my 7D.

dave

[Olly_K1]

Olly:

Absolutely NONE! The high ISO performance on the 7D is incredibly good. No NR on any of the shots! All processing, and minimal, was done in DPP only. Just crop, adjust contrast/brightness and sharpness.

dave

nice one dave, im now wondering if my 7d has more noise than normal !!!

[snyderman]

nice one dave, im now wondering if my 7d has more noise than normal !!!

uh-oh! :o Hopefully this isn't opening a can of worms for another 7D owner!

Usually shoot at ISO 2500 in the home gym and haven't done any NR on those, either.

Just be sure to get proper exposure. Underexposing usually leads to very visible noise the the images. Do what you have to with regard to ISO, but defintely expose the shots well enough to keep the noise in check.

dave

[Olly_K1]

Thanks again, I do try to overexpose a little when using high iso's. Im gonna do some test shots I think over the weekend. im 99% sure there's nothing wrong with the camera :)

[Red Dog]

Interesting comparison between my 7D and my 40D at a soccer match under floodlights. Both set at AV mode, both aiming at a minimum of 1/500 sec shutter speed. The 40D was pushed to 1600 ISO to achieve the desired shutter speed whilst the 7D needed to hit 6400 to reach the same shutter speed.
As I've already mentioned elsewhere the AI servo was already suspect as was the noise even at 800 ISO. Mines been back 3 weeks now and I'm waiting for either a fix or replacement.

[snyderman]

Interesting comparison between my 7D and my 40D at a soccer match under floodlights. Both set at AV mode, both aiming at a minimum of 1/500 sec shutter speed. The 40D was pushed to 1600 ISO to achieve the desired shutter speed whilst the 7D needed to hit 6400 to reach the same shutter speed.
As I've already mentioned elsewhere the AI servo was already suspect as was the noise even at 800 ISO. Mines been back 3 weeks now and I'm waiting for either a fix or replacement.

Something doesn't sound right there. Having replaced a 50D for the 7D, first time out shooting basketball I used pretty much the same settings. Actually, was able to LOWER the ISO on the 7D from the 50D settings to get similar shutter speeds.

the biggest improvements in shooting basketball with the 7D over the 50D is the WB is nearly perfect straight from the camera and the noise levels are pretty much non-existent.

Now that I've got a focus 'work-around' going on with the 7D, the results are pretty good!

Hope things work out with yours. Finickey little ba&tard's, aren't they?!!!

dave

dave

[43 North]

Wow Dave those are great. I am guessing the great lighting had a HUGE role is this, no? I will definitely try the other focusing mode and see what I can turn up.

[SBK1]

awesome lighting...beats the heck out of some of the caves I been shooting in lately. Nice job !

[snyderman]

Wow Dave those are great. I am guessing the great lighting had a HUGE role is this, no? I will definitely try the other focusing mode and see what I can turn up.

Thanks 43 North. Appreciate the kind words. Lighting was everything. Gym is only 2 years old, I believe. The lights had flat-bottomed, cone shaped reflectors pointing back up to a very white ceiling which bounds the light very evenly throughout the entire venue. I was shooting f/2, ISO 2000 and 1/800 in this place!

Nothing like the usual dungeon gyms I usually shoot in! Needed some shots in our team's away (red) jerseys, so went to shoot in a snowstorm! Slow ride home that night!

dave

[snyderman]

awesome lighting...beats the heck out of some of the caves I been shooting in lately. Nice job !

No what you mean. Our home gym is 'ok' at best! However, we have three nearly new gyms in conference high schools that I go to so I can get a) better shots than at home; b) the kids in their road red jerseys.

The posted shots were from Tallmadge HS. The other two newer gyms with GREAT lighting are Highland (Medina) and Barberton.

Our kids are getting a new high-school (and gym!) for the 2012 school year ... one year after my son graduates! Great ....

dave

[LTZ470]

WOW nice shots Dave! That 7D and the 85mm 1.8 is a great combo!

[mckinleypics]

Sweet! 2, 6 and 7 are awesome!

[snyderman]

WOW nice shots Dave! That 7D and the 85mm 1.8 is a great combo!

Yeah, now that I'm using your centerpoint expanded focus mode recommendation! ;)

Thanks again!

dave

[snyderman]

Sweet! 2, 6 and 7 are awesome!

Thanks Dave! And yeah, I love shooting Prescott, (#22) because of his awesome 'gameface' he has going on. He looks tough when he's playing but he's really a shy, quiet and reserved kid anywhere else.

dave

[myoungok]

Nice job....keep up the good work.

[snyderman]

Nice job....keep up the good work.

Thank you sir! Appreciate the kinds words.

dave

[del]

I've had my heart set on a 1D MKII(N) but now I've seen these pics I'm not so sure :confused:

[Ewdiller]

was having the same problems and tried the expansion points with basketball tonight. Here are a few reults.

#1
http://www.ewdiller.com/gallery/data/503/medium/EWD-38601024.jpg

#2
http://www.ewdiller.com/gallery/data/503/medium/EWD-38301024.jpg

#3
http://www.ewdiller.com/gallery/data/503/medium/EWD-37801024.jpg

C and C Welcome.

[Red Dog]

Spot on. You'd be hard pressed to better those.

[snyderman]

I've had my heart set on a 1D MKII(N) but now I've seen these pics I'm not so sure :confused:

The only thing to remember on the shots I posted is the gym is 2 years old and the lighting inside was pretty much daylight and very even everywhere on the court! Heck, the stands were the same as the floor lighting!

The pro at that game shooting for the large circulation regional newspaper had this setup: 7D with 70-200 2.8L; 1D mIII with 24-70. She used the 7D most of the time shooting around the gym and went to the 1D with the 24-70 for the home team around the basket.

We talked between shots and she said she was very impressed with the 7D but it wouldn't replace the 1D models she'd been shooting on for years. Guess it's all about where you've been and what gear you trust and rely upon to get the shots.

Most other pros at the football games I shot this past season all had 1D bodies as well. Couple of Nikon guys, but for the most part I saw Canon 1D bodies.

dave

[snyderman]

Spot on. You'd be hard pressed to better those.

Thanks Red Dog and agree, the lighting conditions there were as good as it gets for HS basketball, period!

dave

[snyderman]

was having the same problems and tried the expansion points with basketball tonight. Here are a few reults.

#1


#2


#3


C and C Welcome.

Any improvement to your eyes using the centerpoint expanded focus mode? I didn't see any before/after images. Yours look pretty good. #3 definitely looks like a bit of motion blur going on. What was your shutter speed? Other settings?

dave

[Ewdiller]

i was using strobe so my shutter speed was 1/250 iso 500 F 3.2 ... this is a big difference in what i was getting prior to using the expansion points.

[snyderman]

i was using strobe so my shutter speed was 1/250 iso 500 F 3.2 ... this is a big difference in what i was getting prior to using the expansion points.

Great to hear. I'm not sure if using the expansion points is a 'work around' for the centerpoint only not performing well (for some of us) on the 7D. I still have yet to call Canon for some discussion on that point.

For now, I'll continue to use the centerpoint expanded and enjoy the 'better' shots!

Yours looked good! I should have seen that they were strobed, too. Doh!!!

dave

[mikeassk]

Those gyms are like game shows! So well lit! nice shots

[snyderman]

Those gyms are like game shows! So well lit! nice shots

Thanks Mike. That particular gym is probably only 2 years old so the lighting was indeed GREAT!!! Such a difference with lots of light.

dave