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HELP ME!!! I am about to throw my flash under a truck.

FORUMS General Gear Talk Flash and Studio Lighting
Thread started 09 Mar 2008 (Sunday) 18:10   
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Thomas ­ Lunt
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Guys and Gals. I am thoroughly disgusted. I am not an expert by any stretch in fact I have relied on auto settings (both flash and camera) for most of my weddings but I cannot get my system to stop underexposing my shots particularly reception shots. I am also not a newbie, I have shot wedding for 17 years. I have had a constant problem with by flash exposure since switching to digital 5 years ago. It happened with my 20D, 1d MKII, and now the 1DS MKIII. I have gone through 420, 580ex, and now 580EXII. I shoot the 1dsMKIII in P and set the 580II on ETTL with the Lightsphere clear and a newton bracket. these shots were FEC +2/3 using the Quantum Turbo battery. WHAT AM I DOING WRONG!?!?!? This is ridiculous. These shots are terrible.

IMAGE: http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa160/Thomaslunt/141R6162.jpg

ISO 1000 F2.8 42mm. I was only 10 feet away.

IMAGE: http://i197.photobucket.com/albums/aa160/Thomaslunt/141R6081.jpg

iso 1000 f 4.5 42mm 10 feet away.

Post #1, Mar 09, 2008 18:10:53


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Zonieart
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Just so we have all the facts, can you post the EXIF data.

Post #2, Mar 09, 2008 18:13:04


Lots of cameras, lights and lenses.

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Thomas ­ Lunt
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both were at 1/125th of a second and split metering

Post #3, Mar 09, 2008 18:16:48 as a reply to Zonieart's post 3 minutes earlier.


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drPheta
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I'm a total newb, but am I right to say that your exposure could have been a couple stops slower? Also, where are you bouncing your flash? Lastly, maybe ditch the sphere and just bounce the flash off the walls and ceiling, cause to me it looks like the room you're in is bright enough in color to reflect plenty of light and soften your image a whole lot better.

Oh yeah, don't forget that if you're bouncing flash straight up, use the built in catch card on the 580EX II. It's very useful for the slight bit of fill.

Post #4, Mar 09, 2008 18:19:59



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Perry ­ Ge
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Wait wait wait. You've been shooting weddings for 17 years and you're using auto? :confused:

Well...try ditching the lightsphere (gary fong is a joke), bounce, and set your ETTL-II metering to average instead of evaluative. The last one'll make a big difference, but it'll help to try and understand why.

Post #5, Mar 09, 2008 18:23:31


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Curtis ­ N
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When ever there is significant white in the shot, you'll likely need more than +2/3 FEC.

You may have better luck by switching to Average E-TTL metering (custom function on the camera). The default setting (Evaluative E-TTL) will almost always make white stuff grey.

Post #6, Mar 09, 2008 18:26:09


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drPheta
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Well, I mentioned shutter speed in terms of the ambient light int he bg, but I overlooked the ISO aspect of that equation to compensation for the dark background. Just playing devil's advocate and keeping the information in this thread relevent, wouldn't it be feasible to say that dropping exposure 1/40 is reasonable (42mm FL) to minimize relying on ISO and noise?

When ever there is significant white in the shot, you'll likely need more than +2/3 FEC.

You may have better luck by switching to Average E-TTL metering (custom function on the camera). The default setting (Evaluative E-TTL) will almost always make white stuff grey.

The black tux doesn't balance it out enough?

Post #7, Mar 09, 2008 18:27:15



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Thomas ­ Lunt
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Wait wait wait. You've been shooting weddings for 17 years and you're using auto?

I shoot TV and AV a lot but rarely all M but for receptions I most often use P with no problem. not sure of your point.

I have had very good luck with the LS. Besides this problem happens with and without the sphere.

Post #8, Mar 09, 2008 18:34:00 as a reply to drPheta's post 6 minutes earlier.


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PacAce
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Curtis N wrote in post #5080997external link
When ever there is significant white in the shot, you'll likely need more than +2/3 FEC.

You may have better luck by switching to Average E-TTL metering (custom function on the camera). The default setting (Evaluative E-TTL) will almost always make white stuff grey.

I agree that +2/3 FEC is not nearly enough when shooting a bride in her satin white gown. Although using Average metering with the +2/3 FEC would have resulted in better exposures only because the background is so far away, if the "correct" FEC had been set for the subject, I think the white gown would have been over-exposed. The correct FEC with Evaluative would probably have resulted in a more properly exposed picture.

BTW, Average metering would make white stuff gray, too. The only difference between Average and Evaluative flash metering is how much of the frame is used for the metering.

Post #9, Mar 09, 2008 18:34:31


...Leo

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cosworth
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[QUOTE=Thomas Lunt;5080902]...I have shot wedding for 17 years. ...I shoot the 1dsMKIII in P./quote]

As has been said already these are your two main issues.

You have to expose for the ambient light and use your flash as fill.

ISO 1000 indoors at a wedding? Uh no. Try 1600, shoot at 3.2 and bounce your flash off the ceiling. Chuck that fong thing in the garbage. And yes, set your ETTL-II metering to average instead of evaluative with say +2/3 of FEC.

1/125 seems a bit high at 42mm with flash. 1/80th would have done it just fine.

Flash is not setup right in your custom function yes but you are not exposing for the ambient. You'll still have ghosts in the dark.

With ETTL you will get a massive reflection off her dress and the +2/3 FEC will come into play. Maybe even +1.

But shoot in M with ETTL. Your life will be much easier. But don't perform this switch at or during a wedding. Shoot a family event or some pets etc and get the hang of M. Doesn't take long and you could probably charge a lot for more your pics after that since the quality will go up.

Post #10, Mar 09, 2008 18:43:34


people will always try to stop you doing the right thing if it is unconventional
Full frame and some primes.

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Thomas ­ Lunt
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Do you think that 1/125th was just too fast or is this a metering issue?

What setting do you guys use during receptions?

Post #11, Mar 09, 2008 18:44:00


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Thomas ­ Lunt
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I want to thank everyone for taking the time to help. This is frustrating. I don't want to come across as defensive about the LS issue but for those of you that have said get rid of it, have any of you shot with it. I actually like it. It really spreads the light around and softens it nicely (when I get the exposure right) but I will say it again, this issue is happening without the ls too.

Post #12, Mar 09, 2008 18:50:24 as a reply to Thomas Lunt's post 6 minutes earlier.


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drPheta
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Look here. The link in this thread really puts a new perspective on bouncing flash rather than using a diffuser.

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthre​ad.php?t=466531

Post #13, Mar 09, 2008 19:05:44



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bieber
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Thomas Lunt wrote in post #5081106external link
Do you think that 1/125th was just too fast or is this a metering issue?

What setting do you guys use during receptions?

You should find and read the EOS flash bible that's stickied here somewhere. Shutter speed doesn't affect flash exposure at all, as long as you keep it below 1/250.

Thomas Lunt wrote in post #5081133external link
I want to thank everyone for taking the time to help. This is frustrating. I don't want to come across as defensive about the LS issue but for those of you that have said get rid of it, have any of you shot with it. I actually like it. It really spreads the light around and softens it nicely (when I get the exposure right) but I will say it again, this issue is happening without the ls too.

It spreads the light around to places it doesn't need to be: unless you're surrounded by reflective surfaces for that light to bounce off of, it's throwing light all over the place where you don't need it and wasting power, while simple ceiling bounce would work just as well.

Anyways, up the FEC. +2/3 is almost normal for regular scenes, that dress is going to call for much more.

Post #14, Mar 09, 2008 19:11:04 as a reply to drPheta's post 5 minutes earlier.


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cosworth
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ETTL doesn't like fongs. It reacts well to ceilings. This was shot at night with crappy, dark fluorescent lights.

+1/3 ETTL.

IMAGE NOT FOUND IMAGE IS A REDIRECT OR MISSING!
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Expose for ambient, let the flash "help" instead of carry the whole shot. M.

Post #15, Mar 09, 2008 20:06:44


people will always try to stop you doing the right thing if it is unconventional
Full frame and some primes.

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