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how art photography looks like.

FORUMS Photography Talk by Genre General Photography Talk
Thread started 22 Feb 2012 (Wednesday) 13:10   
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krb
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BaghdadFred wrote in post #13949484external link
So this school teaches good photographers to how to create ****ty crooked uninspired snap shots with people cut off?

http://www.itf.cz ...tr_hasal/g2004-nahled.jpgexternal link

Funny thing is that the series that includes that shot is the only one in the OP that appeals to me at all. The pics remind me of Magritte's "Son of Man", the painting of the business man with an apple in front of his face. We don't need to see their faces or even their upper bodies because they are just generic tourists in tourist places doing tourist things.

Post #46, Feb 23, 2012 20:23:43


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sjones
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shniks wrote in post #13955013external link
200 years from now they will be calling Harry Potter a classic. Wasnt the hobbit a children's book? They now consider it to be a literary classic. Weren't the beatles a pop group?...

Not all that is successful is bad, but units sold is not an accurate measure of quality. Really, do we need to list the absolute muck and horror that was (or is) nevertheless popular?

Formulaic vapidity might not always be synonymous with the mainstream, but neither is it always antithetical…sometimes​, they're best buddies.

Post #47, Feb 23, 2012 20:33:29


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airfrogusmc
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krb wrote in post #13955126external link
Funny thing is that the series that includes that shot is the only one in the OP that appeals to me at all. The pics remind me of Magritte's "Son of Man", the painting of the business man with an apple in front of his face. We don't need to see their faces or even their upper bodies because they are just generic tourists in tourist places doing tourist things.

I to think those are interesting in the fact your mind fills in any face that you imagine and its very typical of those kinda family travel snapshots. I'm sure its part of a large series and these people which look to be the same in all the images, their faces are not important because they could be anyone. Its actually kind of funny to see the photographer took a very snap shot approach. It kinda reminds me of the work of Bill Owens or William Eggleston in the fact it is kinda showing middle class, suburban society in a snap shot kinda way. That approach fits the tone and the message well I think.

Post #48, Feb 23, 2012 20:33:40




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airfrogusmc
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sjones wrote in post #13955210external link
Not all that is successful is bad, but units sold is not an accurate measure of quality. Really, do we need to list the absolute muck and horror that was (or is) nevertheless popular?

Formulaic vapidity might not always be synonymous with the mainstream, but neither is it always antithetical…sometimes​, they're best buddies.

Exactly and remember that Van Gogh never sold a painting in his lifetime and Weston lived a very humble existence.

Post #49, Feb 23, 2012 20:35:26




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jra
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I find this overall discussion very difficult. On one hand, we basically have one individual trying to dictate what is good art and what isn't to everyone else. On the other hand, what is good art and what isn't ultimately lies within the viewer and creator.....and yet on the other hand, art isn't completely subjective.....there are certain measures that will hold one artist higher than another. IMO, it all must play together in an effort to create an overall experience.
In fine art, so much value seems to be put upon the name.......simply owning an original piece created by a certain well known name would skyrocket it's value regardless of its artistic merit.
For myself, great artwork is far more of an opinion and feeling than a fact.

Post #50, Feb 23, 2012 23:25:41


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ChrisSearle
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There seem to be quite a few people here with strong opinions about 'what art is'.... It all seems a bit 'Daily Mail' to me. People have been arguing about what art is and what makes good art since the dawn of time and by people I don't mean just academics. One thing is clear though and that is there is no universally agreed clear definition. Only opinion.
When I hear somebody say dogmatically that 'Art is blah blah..' I back away slowly....

Post #51, Feb 24, 2012 00:43:13 as a reply to jra's post 1 hour earlier.


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BaghdadFred
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krb wrote in post #13955126external link
Funny thing is that the series that includes that shot is the only one in the OP that appeals to me at all. The pics remind me of Magritte's "Son of Man", the painting of the business man with an apple in front of his face. We don't need to see their faces or even their upper bodies because they are just generic tourists in tourist places doing tourist things.

I've seen quite a few of the photo streams of some of the active members of POTN and I would rate many of them as Very Good to Outstanding work. This stuff I just don't get. I don't sport a goatee, but my shaved head is somewhat hipster :lol:

Would you have been satisfied to have taken this shot?

My next crooked/missed frame shot coming soon to this thread as "Art"

Post #52, Feb 24, 2012 00:56:14


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mrwalker
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De gustibus non est disputandum

Post #53, Feb 24, 2012 01:17:13


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krb
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BaghdadFred wrote in post #13956726external link
Would you have been satisfied to have taken this shot?

If I chose to do a project that consisted of "spoof" vacation photos then yes I would be satisfied with shots like this. If you cannot understand "parody" then it's best that we end this discussion now.

Post #54, Feb 24, 2012 13:29:53


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tonylong
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krb wrote in post #13959667external link
If I chose to do a project that consisted of "spoof" vacation photos then yes I would be satisfied with shots like this. If you cannot understand "parody" then it's best that we end this discussion now.

Well, do you think it was the intent of the photog of those photos to provide a "spoof", or was the intent more "serious"?

I seriously can't tell.

There are some folks here on POTN that do show some real interest in this type of subject matter, especially some "street" photographers here who have posted numerous "feet shots" and they are not "spoofy". Some compositions I find interesting, some, well, not-so-much.

So, the question is does this photographer approach the "snapshot look" tongue-in-cheek, or with a more seiously "artistic intent", or...?

Post #55, Feb 24, 2012 14:01:20


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sjones
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Maybe it was the photographer's intent to generate the very discussion that is taking place on this thread. Maybe it was just an ill-conceived venture into artsy pretentiousness. Or maybe it was a parody, or some type of commentary (humorous, serious, reflective…) on the vernacular. Maybe it was a sincere but debatably contrived attempt to skirt conventionality.

Whatever the reason, it was the apparent intent of the photographer to produce the photos as they are, and in this sense, it is irrelevant how any other person might feel if they had taken the same lot. And anyway, some folks on here actually like them, should that even matter to the photographer, so there's room for everything.

By the way, this is a very good example of where context can help, meaning that I don't believe that a good photo is one that should be able to stand alone. Explanations, captions, framing: all of these things can elevate the value and certainly the understanding of a photograph.

Post #56, Feb 24, 2012 14:39:53 as a reply to tonylong's post 38 minutes earlier.


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tonylong
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sjones wrote in post #13960104external link
Maybe it was the photographer's intent to generate the very discussion that is taking place on this thread. Maybe it was just an ill-conceived venture into artsy pretentiousness. Or maybe it was a parody, or some type of commentary (humorous, serious, reflective…) on the vernacular. Maybe it was a sincere but debatably contrived attempt to skirt conventionality.

Whatever the reason, it was the apparent intent of the photographer to produce the photos as they are, and in this sense, it is irrelevant how any other person might feel if they had taken the same lot. And anyway, some folks on here actually like them, should that even matter to the photographer, so there's room for everything.

By the way, this is a very good example of where context can help, meaning that I don't believe that a good photo is one that should be able to stand alone. Explanations, captions, framing: all of these things can elevate the value and certainly the understanding of a photograph.

So, how would you apply this to the "bodiless feet/leg" series?

I'm trying to approach this thread from a thoughtful viewpoint, although hellbike (the OP) posted these links with a pretty negative commentary regarding us POTNers and our abiltiy to assess "art".

I admit, I'm no artist or art "critic", but I'm always curious to get some "real world perspective" from folks!

Post #57, Feb 24, 2012 15:09:41


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tgamron wrote in post #13949824external link
The whole serious was pics of no faces, which was the intention of the photographer.

BRILLIANT! The fact that I never thought to do that brings home clearly and with great disappointment that I will never be an artist. :cry:

But seriously, I think all the arts are burdened with a dire need to be original and not derivative. And how can one not be derivative with millions of others plying the same craft? It's tremendously freeing to throw up one's hands in defeat and then go out and do stuff that you find meaningful without worrying about how others are going to take it.

Post #58, Feb 24, 2012 15:17:32


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tonylong wrote in post #13959879external link
Well, do you think it was the intent of the photog of those photos to provide a "spoof", or was the intent more "serious"?

I seriously can't tell.

There are some folks here on POTN that do show some real interest in this type of subject matter, especially some "street" photographers here who have posted numerous "feet shots" and they are not "spoofy". Some compositions I find interesting, some, well, not-so-much.

So, the question is does this photographer approach the "snapshot look" tongue-in-cheek, or with a more seiously "artistic intent", or...?


Now is when someone should point out that if this photographer had a blog, to explain what was happening, what the photographer was thinking or seeing at that moment, a lot of this talk would not be taking place. :confused:

Post #59, Feb 24, 2012 15:18:56




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BobOh
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How are we to sort out this thread? Obviously the OP, and a few others think the linked photographs are "good art". The majority seem to hold a dimmer view. There's where the OP went wrong. This thread should have been a poll. I think we all know what the results would have been. My personal opinion is the OP mixed up the "before" pictures with the "after" pictures, if you know what I mean.

Tony Long's theory that the "art" in these photos is that they are imitations of typical tourist snapshots taken with, maybe, a disposable camera, is the only theory that makes sense to me. But then, who cares? Let's all try to take the most amateurish photos we can and try to pass them off as art? We could really set "photography as art" back years.

Pfft, a total waste of time and effort. That's my vote FWIW.

Post #60, Feb 24, 2012 15:34:03


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