Approve the Cookies
This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies. Read More.
OK
Index  •   • New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear  •   • Reviews
Guest
New posts  •   • RTAT  •   • 'Best of'  •   • Gallery  •   • Gear  •   • Reviews
Register to forums    Log in

 
FORUMS Post Processing, Marketing & Presenting Photos The Business of Photography 
Thread started 26 Feb 2013 (Tuesday) 19:33
Search threadPrev/next
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)

Cheap Competitors - How do they do it?

 
cdifoto
Don't get pissy with me
Avatar
34,039 posts
Likes: 12
Joined Dec 2005
     
Apr 05, 2013 17:55 |  #181

Shooting wrote in post #15795006 (external link)
Compared to those pros around me, I'm very cheap because the business don't come if you're not, the other studios are finding that out the hard way because they fail to mess with their prices.

I don't have liability insurance cause I can't afford it.
I own all my equipment, if I don't have the money for it I don't buy it.
I have plenty of backup equipment I worked and paid for
My wife and I do not have other jobs.
I have plenty of experience and confidence.
Did not have the money for training so self taught over the many years.

Charge a lot around here and you are out of business. Many studios who are concrete in their ideas and prices are going out of business because failing to change with the times.

CPI, the company behind Wal-Mart and Sears Portrait is out of business. They were cheap. They found out the hard way that extremely low prices are not sustainable.

http://www.cpicorp.com​/ (external link)

If you can't do it well and get fair prices, there's basically no point.


Did you lose Digital Photo Professional (DPP)? Get it here (external link). Cursing at your worse-than-a-map reflector? Check out this vid! (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)
Curtis ­ N
Master Flasher
Avatar
19,129 posts
Likes: 4
Joined Apr 2005
Location: Northern Illinois, US
     
Apr 05, 2013 21:57 |  #182

Shooting wrote in post #15795006 (external link)
I don't have liability insurance cause I can't afford it.

That means both you and your clients are taking some big risks.

Maybe you'll be lucky.

Or maybe something really bad will happen and you'll lose everything you own.

When a light stand tips over and burns some pretty young girl's face, she won't be amused when you say, "I couldn't afford liability insurance."


"If you're not having fun, your pictures will reflect that." - Joe McNally
Chicago area POTN events (external link)
Flash Photography 101 | The EOS Flash Bible  (external link)| Techniques for Better On-Camera Flash (external link) | How to Use Flash Outdoors| Excel-based DOF Calculator (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Shooting
Goldmember
Avatar
1,552 posts
Likes: 3
Joined Jan 2008
     
Apr 06, 2013 15:05 |  #183

I don't do lightstands, cords or extra flashes..I even keep my bag locked up in the car. Yes, things happen and if anything like that would have happen you are right, I'd tell them sorry, I can't afford it and if you want to sue me and take my Doublewide you are welcome to it. Without much business and no one else working in the home, funds are very limited and I don't pay for what I can't afford. Just for instance, if you only have $300 and insurance is $400...can't afford it..medications for the wife come first..purchase insurance and let her meds go for a few months and I'd no longer have a wife living ..sorry, liability insurance is not on my list of priorities.

Curtis N wrote in post #15795858 (external link)
That means both you and your clients are taking some big risks.

Maybe you'll be lucky.

Or maybe something really bad will happen and you'll lose everything you own.

When a light stand tips over and burns some pretty young girl's face, she won't be amused when you say, "I couldn't afford liability insurance."




  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Channel ­ One
Goldmember
Avatar
1,649 posts
Likes: 1
Joined Nov 2010
Location: Fort Lauderdale
     
Apr 06, 2013 15:59 |  #184

Shooting wrote in post #15797728 (external link)
Just for instance, if you only have $300 and insurance is $400...can't afford it..medications for the wife come first..purchase insurance and let her meds go for a few months and I'd no longer have a wife living ..sorry, liability insurance is not on my list of priorities.

And that is the reality for a lot of people, way back in my youth I began doing electrical contracting, no license, no insurance, no corporation, then one fine day the wind blew over my 24 foot extension ladder that was leaning against a wall, the ladder landed across the hood of my customers Jaguar, he was really pissed off and not only did he refuse to pay me for any of the work I had done, he sued me for the damage to the car…

That was something like 30 years ago and to this day he has never collected a dime on that judgment and about all he did with the judgment was screw up my credit rating for a few years, which at the time didn’t matter a cats fanny to me, I was living hand to mouth and had no use for credit.

Wayne


Madness takes its toll, please have exact change. (external link)

NPPA Member District 6.
SMPTE Atlanta.

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
DocFrankenstein
Cream of the Crop
Avatar
12,324 posts
Likes: 6
Joined Apr 2004
Location: where the buffalo roam
     
Apr 06, 2013 16:02 |  #185

Curtis N wrote in post #15795858 (external link)
Or maybe something really bad will happen and you'll lose everything you own.

When a light stand tips over and burns some pretty young girl's face, she won't be amused when you say, "I couldn't afford liability insurance."

What's the difference between tripping a light stand in a wedding and in a TFP photo shoot?

Does the fact that you're doing a TFP shoot as an amateur and your elinchrom explodes and electrocutes a little angel relieves you of liability?

Should everything be insured? If I move my couch with a friend, there's a risk we drop it on a baby. Should insurance company get a chunk of my money?

Why can't I operate through a limited liability business? This way I lose the business camera and two zooms, even if the whole wedding party burns down.

I'm actually curious. Is everything legislated this badly?


National Sarcasm Society. Like we need your support.

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
DocFrankenstein
Cream of the Crop
Avatar
12,324 posts
Likes: 6
Joined Apr 2004
Location: where the buffalo roam
     
Apr 06, 2013 16:06 |  #186

Channel One wrote in post #15797850 (external link)
ladder landed...

not only did he refuse to pay me for any of the work I had done, he sued me for the damage to the car…

Shouldn't one be subtracted from the other?

You pay for the car. He pay for the work?


National Sarcasm Society. Like we need your support.

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
mobei
Senior Member
293 posts
Joined Nov 2009
     
Apr 06, 2013 17:22 as a reply to  @ DocFrankenstein's post |  #187

Curtis N,
The above posts exemplify why I go after the cheats.
Do business right or pay the price.
Is it any wonder why there are hardly any pros left on this site:cry:




  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Bear ­ Dale
"I get 'em pregnant"
Avatar
4,644 posts
Gallery: 7 photos
Likes: 165
Joined Mar 2009
Location: Australia
     
Apr 06, 2013 17:40 |  #188

Channel One wrote in post #15797850 (external link)
[COLOR=black][FONT=Ver​dana]

That was something like 30 years ago and to this day he has never collected a dime on that judgment and about all he did with the judgment was screw up my credit rating for a few years, which at the time didn’t matter a cats fanny to me, I was living hand to mouth and had no use for credit.

Wayne

Your proud of that?


Cheers,
.
Bear Dale
.
Some of my photos featured Bear Dale (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Channel ­ One
Goldmember
Avatar
1,649 posts
Likes: 1
Joined Nov 2010
Location: Fort Lauderdale
     
Apr 06, 2013 17:49 |  #189

fotoworx wrote in post #15798050 (external link)
Your proud of that?

No, but that is reality.

Wayne


Madness takes its toll, please have exact change. (external link)

NPPA Member District 6.
SMPTE Atlanta.

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Shooting
Goldmember
Avatar
1,552 posts
Likes: 3
Joined Jan 2008
     
Apr 06, 2013 19:04 |  #190

And I know 3 pros, with studios and the whole bit who do not have liability insurance..they cannot even afford a little health insurance for their wives and kids. Yes, anything can happen but if you can't afford it, you can't afford it. Has nothing to do with "do it right or don't do it", you do it the best way you can.

Channel One wrote in post #15797850 (external link)
And that is the reality for a lot of people, way back in my youth I began doing electrical contracting, no license, no insurance, no corporation, then one fine day the wind blew over my 24 foot extension ladder that was leaning against a wall, the ladder landed across the hood of my customers Jaguar, he was really pissed off and not only did he refuse to pay me for any of the work I had done, he sued me for the damage to the car…

That was something like 30 years ago and to this day he has never collected a dime on that judgment and about all he did with the judgment was screw up my credit rating for a few years, which at the time didn’t matter a cats fanny to me, I was living hand to mouth and had no use for credit.

Wayne




  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Bear ­ Dale
"I get 'em pregnant"
Avatar
4,644 posts
Gallery: 7 photos
Likes: 165
Joined Mar 2009
Location: Australia
     
Apr 06, 2013 19:12 |  #191

Channel One wrote in post #15798072 (external link)
No, but that is reality.

Wayne

30 years.....did it ever cross your mind to make restitution?


Cheers,
.
Bear Dale
.
Some of my photos featured Bear Dale (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Mike ­ R
Goldmember
4,319 posts
Likes: 2
Joined May 2006
Location: 06478, CT
     
Apr 06, 2013 20:01 |  #192

DocFrankenstein wrote in post #15797858 (external link)
What's the difference between tripping a light stand in a wedding and in a TFP photo shoot?

Does the fact that you're doing a TFP shoot as an amateur and your elinchrom explodes and electrocutes a little angel relieves you of liability?

Should everything be insured? If I move my couch with a friend, there's a risk we drop it on a baby. Should insurance company get a chunk of my money?

Why can't I operate through a limited liability business? This way I lose the business camera and two zooms, even if the whole wedding party burns down.

I'm actually curious. Is everything legislated this badly?

You might be surprised how easily attorneys can still go after your personal assets. It's called "Piercing the veil" Too many people think that by being an llc, their protected. There's a lot that you must do to prove your a legitimate business, such as have insurance, collect sales tax if required, pay taxes, keep accurate business records..........


Mike R
www.mikerubinphoto.com (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
DocFrankenstein
Cream of the Crop
Avatar
12,324 posts
Likes: 6
Joined Apr 2004
Location: where the buffalo roam
     
Apr 06, 2013 21:09 |  #193

Mike R wrote in post #15798364 (external link)
You might be surprised how easily attorneys can still go after your personal assets. It's called "Piercing the veil" Too many people think that by being an llc, their protected. There's a lot that you must do to prove your a legitimate business, such as have insurance, collect sales tax if required, pay taxes, keep accurate business records..........

Ok. What I'm asking is this.

What law is there that says that you need to have insurance to be a "legitimate business"?

AFAIK to be a business, you need to register your business.


National Sarcasm Society. Like we need your support.

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Mike ­ R
Goldmember
4,319 posts
Likes: 2
Joined May 2006
Location: 06478, CT
     
Apr 06, 2013 21:18 |  #194

DocFrankenstein wrote in post #15798534 (external link)
Ok. What I'm asking is this.

What law is there that says that you need to have insurance to be a "legitimate business"?

AFAIK to be a business, you need to register your business.

You're right but it could be one more thing that could be argued in court to try and prove you're not serious about your business and therefore a way to go after your personal assets. Just don't think being an llc protects your personal assets.


Mike R
www.mikerubinphoto.com (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
Curtis ­ N
Master Flasher
Avatar
19,129 posts
Likes: 4
Joined Apr 2005
Location: Northern Illinois, US
     
Apr 06, 2013 21:55 |  #195

DocFrankenstein wrote in post #15797858 (external link)
What's the difference between tripping a light stand in a wedding and in a TFP photo shoot?

Does the fact that you're doing a TFP shoot as an amateur and your elinchrom explodes and electrocutes a little angel relieves you of liability?

Should everything be insured? If I move my couch with a friend, there's a risk we drop it on a baby. Should insurance company get a chunk of my money?

Why can't I operate through a limited liability business? This way I lose the business camera and two zooms, even if the whole wedding party burns down.

I'm actually curious. Is everything legislated this badly?

For most of us, our homeowner's insurance covers a multitude of bad things that might happen to us, except things that happen in the course of trade or business. My agent made that quite clear to me.

If you want to know how an LLC might protect your personal assets, I think you need to talk to a lawyer.


"If you're not having fun, your pictures will reflect that." - Joe McNally
Chicago area POTN events (external link)
Flash Photography 101 | The EOS Flash Bible  (external link)| Techniques for Better On-Camera Flash (external link) | How to Use Flash Outdoors| Excel-based DOF Calculator (external link)

  
  LOG IN TO REPLY
sponsored links
(this ad will go away when you log in as a registered member)

21,078 views & 0 likes for this thread
Cheap Competitors - How do they do it?
FORUMS Post Processing, Marketing & Presenting Photos The Business of Photography 
AAA
x 1600
y 1600

Jump to forum...   •  Rules   •  Index   •  New posts   •  RTAT   •  'Best of'   •  Gallery   •  Gear   •  Reviews   •  Member list   •  Polls   •  Image rules   •  Search   •  Password reset

Not a member yet?
Registered members may log in to forums and access all the features: full search, image upload, follow forums, own gear list and ratings, likes, more forums, private messaging, thread follow, notifications, own gallery, all settings, view hosted photos, own reviews, see more and do more... and all is free. Don't be a stranger - register now and start posting!


COOKIES DISCLAIMER: This website uses cookies to improve your user experience. By using this site, you agree to our use of cookies and to our privacy policy.
Privacy policy and cookie usage info.


POWERED BY AMASS forum software 2.0forum software
version 2.0 /
code and design
by Pekka Saarinen ©
for photography-on-the.net

Latest registered member is binyahmmad
614 guests, 306 members online
Simultaneous users record so far is 6430, that happened on Dec 03, 2017

Photography-on-the.net Digital Photography Forums is the website for photographers and all who love great photos, camera and post processing techniques, gear talk, discussion and sharing. Professionals, hobbyists, newbies and those who don't even own a camera -- all are welcome regardless of skill, favourite brand, gear, gender or age. Registering and usage is free.