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Thread started 02 Jan 2016 (Saturday) 13:36
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Boot Drive Size?

 
tim
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Jan 04, 2016 22:45 |  #16

Just put your images onto a big spinning disk running on thunderbolt then, with the catalog on the SSD. I doubt you'll notice any difference in speed - most things will be CPU Limited.

This is one area a PC or maybe the mac pro is easier - buy whatever drives you want, put them in the case, they're all fast and no external power bricks. I have five drives inside my PC - boot SSD, data SSD, 2x4TB RAID mirror for data, 1x2TB for other media.


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drisley
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Jan 05, 2016 00:58 |  #17

Yes OK thanks!

In the past building my own PC's I would put drives inside. Now I kind of liked the idea of external drives, easier to upgrade down the road I guess. With Thunderbolt (and USB 3) no need for power bricks either (for many drives anyway).

This is all good info! Thanks so much for all your help!!! Now to decide on the drives.


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Bob_A
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Jan 05, 2016 01:14 |  #18

tim wrote in post #17842161 (external link)
My Windows 10 install with Office, Photoshop/Bridge, some development tools, WAMP (development server of MySQL, Apache, etc), a bunch of random stuff like web browsers, email program, and swap file is 30GB. Can't help with mac stuff sorry.

I'd keep the one you have and just add the external drive. I really don't think you need another SSD, spinning disk is totally fine, your internal SSD is huge.

Why do you think you need another SSD? What would you put on it that requires and makes use of the low latency and high throughput? Remember in many cases you're processor, IO, or user limited.

One day you need to show me how you get down to such a low number Tim. I've moved Windows folders (Documents, Downloads, Music, etc) and my iTunes library off of my boot drive and I can't come close to 30GB.

24GB Windows
8.7GB Prog Files (x86)
7.3GB Prog Files
7.5GB Sys Volume Info
5.8GB $Windows._WS (I'm not convinced it's safe to delete this)
8.7GB Users (a good part of this is likely pst files for Outlook)
4.8GB pagefil.sys (system managed, and I have 32GB RAM)
3.8GB ProgramData
2.4GB AMD

Total = 73GB


Then, on top of this I also have my Lightroom Catalogs and Previews = 35.5GB, bringing the total to 108.5GB. If I had my iTunes library on the boot drive it would add another 34GB.

If I relocate my pst files, split my pagefile, and get rid of the AMD bloatware I could probably reduce by 12-13GB, but that still doesn't get me anywhere close to 30GB.

I think what I should have done is partition my boot drive to 2 x 125GB, and use one partition for Windows, programs, etc and the other partition for Lightroom catalog and previews and pagefil.sys.


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Bob_A
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Jan 05, 2016 01:18 |  #19

tim wrote in post #17842286 (external link)
Lightroom is just another application, maybe a GB. The catalog goes onto the data disk/partition. iTunes library is data, it goes on another partition. All that other stuff will take up space, might get you to 100GB if it's MASSIVE, probably more like 5GB each max. Programs aren't that big. Data's big.

Running a dual boot will take more space. I'd allow 16GB for Windows 10 (as per Microsoft recommendations) then space for your game and a swap file. 40GB would be very generous.

You don't want to have LR catalogs and previews on a spinning disk as it really slows things down. It should be on an SSD. And since Adobe hasn't come up with an automated approach to purge old backups (even though most of us do backups of the drive anyway) you can really fill a small SSD up if you don't stay on top of things.


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Jan 05, 2016 01:25 |  #20

Back in NT/95/98 I would hack the registry make the default install location a separate hard drive (or separate partition) from the C: and have ALWAYS kept all Data off the C: drive so that I could keep the OS install small enough to fit on a CD-R ( pre-DVD days :) )
C: Boot OS, D: Apps, E: Data.


With XP I gave up the practice of moving the app install location, and understood I'd need 20Gb or more for OS and Apps,. but still moved My Docs etc, to separate HD.

My current Windows 7 pro install looks a lot like yours, with slightly fewer Gb for the apps, and a lot less for the "USER" files as I moved ALL of that over to my D: drive.


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tim
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Post has been edited over 1 year ago by tim.
Jan 05, 2016 02:24 |  #21

Bob_A wrote in post #17845027 (external link)
One day you need to show me how you get down to such a low number Tim. I've moved Windows folders (Documents, Downloads, Music, etc) and my iTunes library off of my boot drive and I can't come close to 30GB.

24GB Windows
8.7GB Prog Files (x86)
7.3GB Prog Files
7.5GB Sys Volume Info
5.8GB $Windows._WS (I'm not convinced it's safe to delete this)
8.7GB Users (a good part of this is likely pst files for Outlook)
4.8GB pagefil.sys (system managed, and I have 32GB RAM)
3.8GB ProgramData
2.4GB AMD

Total = 73GB

Then, on top of this I also have my Lightroom Catalogs and Previews = 35.5GB, bringing the total to 108.5GB. If I had my iTunes library on the boot drive it would add another 34GB.

If I relocate my pst files, split my pagefile, and get rid of the AMD bloatware I could probably reduce by 12-13GB, but that still doesn't get me anywhere close to 30GB.

I think what I should have done is partition my boot drive to 2 x 125GB, and use one partition for Windows, programs, etc and the other partition for Lightroom catalog and previews and pagefil.sys.


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That's without doing a cleanup recently - I could probably knock a few more GB down. Note that that doesn't include my 17GB swap file, which is on a different SSD - for no good reason to be honest. Legacy of another setup and it makes little difference where it is, they're both 120GB Samsung pro drives, one's an 840 one's an 850. Total 55GB with swap.

You do a few things:
- run "disk cleanup" - once the regular way, once tell it to clean up system files.
- turn system restore down to 1% or 0%, then turn it off. If you just turn it off without reducing the number it keeps the disk space. I don't need this because I take regular disk images, but most people would benefit from it.
- delete temp files (I have a script that does it every day)
- delete old windows upgrade files (I can't remember how, I googled it once)
- you probably do have data on the disk, you just have to find it

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tim
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Jan 05, 2016 02:25 |  #22

Bob_A wrote in post #17845030 (external link)
You don't want to have LR catalogs and previews on a spinning disk as it really slows things down. It should be on an SSD. And since Adobe hasn't come up with an automated approach to purge old backups (even though most of us do backups of the drive anyway) you can really fill a small SSD up if you don't stay on top of things.

You keep the working catalog on your SSD, it's just old catalogs that you're not working on can be archived. I assume most people would export jpeg files or something, and it makes sense to export xmp files to live alongside the image files in case the catalog is lost or damaged. It's a bit of insurance.


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Bob_A
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Jan 05, 2016 08:52 |  #23

tim wrote in post #17845056 (external link)
You keep the working catalog on your SSD, it's just old catalogs that you're not working on can be archived. I assume most people would export jpeg files or something, and it makes sense to export xmp files to live alongside the image files in case the catalog is lost or damaged. It's a bit of insurance.

Backups only take up about 2.7GB out of the 35.5GB, the rest is for previews. If I used LR to run a photography business I could get previews way down, probably to about 1GB, as I'd purge everything when I'm done with a project. For my use I'm all over the place (all the time) in my catalog of over 32,000 images, so I don't purge previews very frequently.

It would sure be nice if Adobe added some archiving and cleanup options to LR (deleting old backups, purging old previews, etc).


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Bob_A
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Jan 05, 2016 08:58 |  #24

tim wrote in post #17845054 (external link)
thumbnailHosted photo: posted by tim in
./showthread.php?p=178​45054&i=i36207183
forum: Computers

thumbnailHosted photo: posted by tim in
./showthread.php?p=178​45054&i=i100226575
forum: Computers
That's without doing a cleanup recently - I could probably knock a few more GB down. Note that that doesn't include my 17GB swap file, which is on a different SSD - for no good reason to be honest. Legacy of another setup and it makes little difference where it is, they're both 120GB Samsung pro drives, one's an 840 one's an 850. Total 55GB with swap.

You do a few things:
- run "disk cleanup" - once the regular way, once tell it to clean up system files.
- turn system restore down to 1% or 0%, then turn it off. If you just turn it off without reducing the number it keeps the disk space. I don't need this because I take regular disk images, but most people would benefit from it.
- delete temp files (I have a script that does it every day)
- delete old windows upgrade files (I can't remember how, I googled it once)
- you probably do have data on the disk, you just have to find it


Thanks. I'll squint at this some more tonight. :)

I have deleted old Windows upgrade files, run disk cleanup, turned off hibernate (no hibfil). I'll look at system restore though and delete temp files (I probably mistakenly thought disk cleanup looked after this). I also use Hyper-V regularly (virtual drive on another disk), which may explain partially explain why I have 5.5GB more for Windows than you.


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tim
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Jan 05, 2016 13:00 |  #25

I use VirtualBox, but I have my VM images on another SSD.


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drisley
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Post has been edited over 1 year ago by drisley.
Jan 05, 2016 17:06 |  #26

I forgot about the LR image caching size. A lot of this stuff is what I want to steer clear of... having to manually manage things like LR catalogues and such all the time.

Where does LR keep all it's backups for image previews and catalogues?

Edit: OK I see in Catalog Settings the location can be changed. Nice


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Bob_A
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Jan 06, 2016 01:17 |  #27

drisley wrote in post #17845915 (external link)
I forgot about the LR image caching size. A lot of this stuff is what I want to steer clear of... having to manually manage things like LR catalogues and such all the time.

Where does LR keep all it's backups for image previews and catalogues?

Edit: OK I see in Catalog Settings the location can be changed. Nice

Yup, you can change the location to where ever you want. They should be on an SSD though to get the best performance from LR.


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Jan 06, 2016 09:46 |  #28

tim wrote in post #17844257 (external link)
What do you keep on yours? What is it used for? Something like TreeSize free would tell you. Lots of games, lots of media? Windows 10 requires 16GB according to Microsoft.

On my 60Gb:
my IOS with Office, Lightroom 5 and Element 9, was at 21Gb

I had about 5Gb of photos I kept there permanently.
I have about 10Gb of music at a time on there.
And about another 10Gb of movies I would have there from time to time.

I was a light users usually around 40-45Gb used, but my issue came to batching files or moving media between my Mac and my externals.
Hitting that wall of having 18Gb free and needing 20Gb meant stoping, considering, taking some foes off then back on, became an inconvenience.


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Jan 07, 2016 14:46 |  #29

tim wrote in post #17844664 (external link)
500GB is *HUGE*. 1TB is crazy. If you're rich then sure, otherwise I still think you're wasting money. I really see no need to have your archives on SSD.

In your place I'd:
- Partition the disk into (OS + programs) and (other data), if possible and easy - I don't know macs
- Keep OS, programs on the internal disk (main partition if partitioned)
- Put catalog, cache, and current working set of data on the internal disk (second partition if partitioned)
- If your media (iTunes etc) is less than 50GB I'd keep on the main disk, otherwise on Thunderbolt spinning disk

Once you start running low on disk space or when you're finished with files move the files and catalog out to a standard spinning disk running thunderbolt.

Of course you need backups too.

So is my 16TB going to be overkill? :D

500GB is almost enough for my rMBP. I have a 200GB Windows 10 partition with several games, all my school stuff (Network Engineering), and most of my work files/tools/programs. I have a 300GB OS X parition with the Adobe essentials, and misc movies and what not. I mainly find myself running out of space on the OS X partition due to keeping photos on there longer than I need to and the Windows parition because I can't just play one game all the way through and end up playing 5 at one time.


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tim
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Jan 07, 2016 15:59 |  #30

Village_Idiot wrote in post #17848728 (external link)
So is my 16TB going to be overkill? :D

500GB is almost enough for my rMBP. I have a 200GB Windows 10 partition with several games, all my school stuff (Network Engineering), and most of my work files/tools/programs. I have a 300GB OS X parition with the Adobe essentials, and misc movies and what not. I mainly find myself running out of space on the OS X partition due to keeping photos on there longer than I need to and the Windows parition because I can't just play one game all the way through and end up playing 5 at one time.

Some people want to drag a lot of stuff around with them. Games and technical stuff use a lot of space. People seem to also want to drag around entire media libraries. This stuff doesn't all need to be on SSD, but given a lot of people prefer laptops (more expensive, slower, less expandable) people may have to pay for the big SSDs.


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