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FORUMS Photography Talk by Genre Transportation Talk
Thread started 21 Apr 2008 (Monday) 10:35
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Official Automotive Rigs - DIY Thread

 
mjagiellicz
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61 posts
Joined Mar 2012
Walbrzych, Poland
Feb 01, 2017 16:14 as a reply to post 18259902 |  #11926

Really carbon fiber can more bounce than aluminium? Even 2 x 2 meters length for example ? Could You suggest something with aluminium? I'm thinking about 2 x 2 meters pipe or 3 x 1,5 m


Marcin Jagiellicz Photography - https://facebook.com/m​jagielliczexternal link

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VisualEchos
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Joined Feb 2010
Missouri
Feb 01, 2017 19:13 |  #11927

mjagiellicz wrote in post #18261904 (external link)
Really carbon fiber can more bounce than aluminium? Even 2 x 2 meters length for example ? Could You suggest something with aluminium? I'm thinking about 2 x 2 meters pipe or 3 x 1,5 m

Yes, much worse than the right aluminum. I have many friends, from way back, that have had issues.

Years ago, when I first got into rigging, I was fearful of putting such a heavy boom on my fragile car, so I did a mountain of research on what material was best. Carbon fiber was the natural choice, but it was so flexible, and so hard to handle the bounce, I settled on aluminum.

What you have to realize is that you will only have 10-12 feet unsupported, the rest doesn't even matter. So what does 10-12 feet of the proper aluminum weigh? 9 lbs. Literally nothing. It's MUCH more important to have a light camera KIT. So, a crop sensor camera with a 10/11/12mm prime lens. Next would be a full-frame camera with a 16/17/18mm prime lens.

So the length of your boom depends on the camera/lens you're planning to use, and the cars you are planning to shoot. I shoot mostly my own car, so I use a 19-ft boom with 8 feet unsupported, a full frame camera and 20mm prime lens. Adding a stabilization cable and 3rd cup makes the system rock solid.

https://www.facebook.c​om ...&album_id=804471499​649213 (external link)


~Andrew from Rig-Proexternal link Galleryexternal link

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Gas ­ Hog
I like a good quack in the morning.
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Joined Jan 2014
Lost and found
Feb 03, 2017 04:16 |  #11928

When I first heard about this stuff I thought of carbon right away. I have a cnc machine shop+ use composites every day. So machine all of the hardware out of 6061 and layup the tubes..(get Andrew to sell it :-))...but carbon that long is bouncy. You can thicken up the tubes but my idea was to have a boom section that is uber light weight and small sections that you could break down and put in a trunk.

Now I think that you could include a layer of kevlar in the layup, but that is so hard to work with, maybe some bidirectional lava rock. I just havent had the time to do more testing.
Maybe some very thin alum tube and do a wrap on that, and or some honeycomb filler to dampen the bounce. But those ounce's add up quick. You go to all the work and effort and it comes out the sameish as just cutting some alum tube..that would suck.
Gary


All Nikon all the time :cool:
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crgcaptures
Hatchling
4 posts
Joined Jan 2017
Feb 03, 2017 05:40 |  #11929

So Guys and Gals,

I had my first attempt and not happy with the result at all. The image is very soft around the edges and there was a fair amount of bounce when pushing the Jag. Im not expecting great reviews but let me know what you think. Its a boom pole that is in sections of 4ft with a 32cm outer diameter and a 1.6mm wall. I have 2 of the avenger 1100 and 3 of the superclamps. The poles are held together using 2 pieces of metal and then clamped together (forming a sleeve) and then I have a magic arm and the Canon 6D on there. Anyway heres the finished photo and a photo of the rig attached.

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VisualEchos
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Joined Feb 2010
Missouri
Feb 03, 2017 18:19 |  #11930

Gas Hog wrote in post #18263348 (external link)
When I first heard about this stuff I thought of carbon right away. I have a cnc machine shop+ use composites every day. So machine all of the hardware out of 6061 and layup the tubes..(get Andrew to sell it :-))...but carbon that long is bouncy. You can thicken up the tubes but my idea was to have a boom section that is uber light weight and small sections that you could break down and put in a trunk.

Now I think that you could include a layer of kevlar in the layup, but that is so hard to work with, maybe some bidirectional lava rock. I just havent had the time to do more testing.
Maybe some very thin alum tube and do a wrap on that, and or some honeycomb filler to dampen the bounce. But those ounce's add up quick. You go to all the work and effort and it comes out the sameish as just cutting some alum tube..that would suck.
Gary

I've researched this to the ends of the earth, and all things considered, nothing beats 6061 T3, joined via threaded couplers, which is what I use. My only problem with it is that it's very hard to get, so I get it from a major client, not from the source, and a normal person can't even get it at all.

The mystery has been solved, Rig-Pro FTW. lol

crgcaptures wrote in post #18263376 (external link)
So Guys and Gals,

I had my first attempt and not happy with the result at all. The image is very soft around the edges and there was a fair amount of bounce when pushing the Jag. Im not expecting great reviews but let me know what you think. Its a boom pole that is in sections of 4ft with a 32cm outer diameter and a 1.6mm wall. I have 2 of the avenger 1100 and 3 of the superclamps. The poles are held together using 2 pieces of metal and then clamped together (forming a sleeve) and then I have a magic arm and the Canon 6D on there. Anyway heres the finished photo and a photo of the rig attached.

No offense, bu there is so much wrong with this man, like literally every single thing I see, from the cups to the magic-arm configuration, you're making this way too damn hard on yourself. But hey, as long as you're safe, more power to you! But while you're at it, let me give you some advice.

1. Ditch the junk Manfrotto cups and get yourself some safe cups. Woods Powr Grip are the only way to fly. You can get them from Filmtools, or from me, same price.

2. SPREAD THEM OUT as far as you can. If you're using one panel, as you are here, one should be on one fender, and the other should be as far as possible away on the other fender.

3. Use some proper material for your boom, or give up and go Rig-Pro, you'll be glad you did.

4. Extend your magic arm ALL THE WAY down...the further it is away from the boom, the smaller it is in the frame.

5. EVERY rig-shot should be taken between f9 & f11 to make the entire car sharp. NEVER go under f9.

6. Fashion yourself a cable pull and literally pull the car, it'll make everything sharper x10.

7. Choose a SMOOTH surface...

8. Choose a place with a lot of light, but rig in the shadows (or if you're smart, at sunset).

If you have any other questions, let me know.

BE SAFE!!!

IMAGE: https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8040/7963766414_05d4ba31b9_o.jpg
[IMAGE'S LINK: https://flic.kr/p/d8Jo​iu] (external link)Turn to the Sky II (external link) by Andrew Thompson (external link), on Flickr

~Andrew from Rig-Proexternal link Galleryexternal link

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crgcaptures
Hatchling
4 posts
Joined Jan 2017
Feb 04, 2017 13:25 as a reply to VisualEchos's post |  #11931

It was my first attempt man and I saw everyone else making there rigs so thought I would give it a try. Thanks for the pointers though. If I decide to give it another shot then I'll see what happens




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VisualEchos
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Joined Feb 2010
Missouri
Feb 04, 2017 14:34 |  #11932

crgcaptures wrote in post #18264548 (external link)
It was my first attempt man and I saw everyone else making there rigs so thought I would give it a try. Thanks for the pointers though. If I decide to give it another shot then I'll see what happens

This thread isn't as lively as it used to be, but there are a few of us left, and we're more than happy to help, so just ask!


~Andrew from Rig-Proexternal link Galleryexternal link

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crgcaptures
Hatchling
4 posts
Joined Jan 2017
Feb 04, 2017 15:02 as a reply to VisualEchos's post |  #11933

Which is much appreciatted. I was just shocked to see no kind of positive response there. I messaged you the other day about getting the boom pole sent to the UK and just awaiting pay day so will provide sort it out then




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VisualEchos
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Joined Feb 2010
Missouri
Feb 04, 2017 17:42 |  #11934

crgcaptures wrote in post #18264621 (external link)
Which is much appreciatted. I was just shocked to see no kind of positive response there. I messaged you the other day about getting the boom pole sent to the UK and just awaiting pay day so will provide sort it out then

Again, this thread has kinda' died over the years.

With the tips I've given you, your next pic should get a better response. Just make sure that you pick a nice background, I like parks the best, they usually keep up the road and backgrounds nicely.

IMAGE: https://c1.staticflickr.com/9/8702/28935652406_f0465f14ba_o.png
[IMAGE'S LINK: https://flic.kr/p/L5WM​mJ] (external link)Edge of the Deep Green Sea. (external link) by Andrew Thompson (external link), on Flickr

~Andrew from Rig-Proexternal link Galleryexternal link

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98kellrs
Senior Member
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Joined Oct 2012
Perth, Australia
Feb 04, 2017 17:53 |  #11935

Debates used to fire up too quickly about boom types, mounting techniques and other things, not worth the aggro so I don't bother posting in here often. I suspect others are similar.


Ryan
Nikon D800
Fujifilm X-T1
RSK Photography Facebook - Automotive Photography page (external link)
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Gas ­ Hog
I like a good quack in the morning.
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Joined Jan 2014
Lost and found
Feb 05, 2017 04:17 |  #11936

Debates on the internet..about gear..mmm I have never heard of such a thing.
If you post a pic right now I promise not to criticize your boom stick :-)
If you wait though..no promises.

I would post one of my own, but I don't own one :-x When you have the knowledge, tools, and facility's to do your own you just cant buy one.
But three years later..still nothing. Not sure what that says, but it's not good
Gary


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VisualEchos
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Joined Feb 2010
Missouri
Feb 05, 2017 08:42 |  #11937

I came to this thread 8 years ago seeking the same answers that a lot of people still ask to this day. Having found all the answers I required here, and on my own, I feel like it's my duty to help new guys get to where I am without having to a.) go through a 796 page thread, and b.) break the bank. Because of this, I've been an integral part of a lot of those debates because I'm so passionate about safety and performance without wasting a bunch of money.

It boils down to this: make your own rig, as long as it's safe, and if you find that you are lacking in performance or safety, look to those who have figured that out and they will help you.


~Andrew from Rig-Proexternal link Galleryexternal link

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bartc
Goldmember
Joined Jul 2012
Boise, Idaho
Feb 05, 2017 11:27 |  #11938

What are u guys typically doing for shutter speed.. I know lighting conditions dictate this bust just curious to know... wondering if doing longer then 2-3 would be better or not


-Bart
5D mk3 gripped | 7D gripped |EF 28-70mm F2.8L | EF 70-200mm F2.8L IS | Tokina 11-16 f2.8 | Sigma 50mm f1.4 | 3x AlienBees B1600 | 2x AlienBees B800 | Yongnuo 568ex X2 | Sigma 530dg Super | rf-622c x4 | Bunch of light modifiers | canon sx1is

http://bartcepekphotog​raphy.comexternal link

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VisualEchos
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Joined Feb 2010
Missouri
Feb 05, 2017 15:26 |  #11939

bartc wrote in post #18265327 (external link)
What are u guys typically doing for shutter speed.. I know lighting conditions dictate this bust just curious to know... wondering if doing longer then 2-3 would be better or not

Personally, I use the following method.

2-3 seconds for wheels/tires/car/road. This is because you're more likely to have a sharp car, and detail in those areas coveys motion best. You WANT to see the tines of the wheel, you don't want it to appear like smoke. Same with the ground. Look at the pic I posted above. Look at the sharpness of the car, the detail in the ground, wheels, tires, it all conveys motion.

4-10 seconds for background. Backgrounds are just the opposite, you need to have a longer shutter speed to streak it more, and make it as soft as possible against the sharp ground/car/wheels. Sometimes you can get away with a sharper background, like again in my shot above, but the background needs to be even to make it work. If you're rigging in front of 2 trees it's going to look pretty terrible with 2 jagged trees.

This is just a framework, as you said it depends on the light, so that could be 4-6 seconds for the car/wheels/road, and 8-20 seconds for the background.


~Andrew from Rig-Proexternal link Galleryexternal link

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bartc
Goldmember
Joined Jul 2012
Boise, Idaho
Feb 05, 2017 15:41 |  #11940

VisualEchos wrote in post #18265486 (external link)
Personally, I use the following method.

2-3 seconds for wheels/tires/car/road. This is because you're more likely to have a sharp car, and detail in those areas coveys motion best. You WANT to see the tines of the wheel, you don't want it to appear like smoke. Same with the ground. Look at the pic I posted above. Look at the sharpness of the car, the detail in the ground, wheels, tires, it all conveys motion.

4-10 seconds for background. Backgrounds are just the opposite, you need to have a longer shutter speed to streak it more, and make it as soft as possible against the sharp ground/car/wheels. Sometimes you can get away with a sharper background, like again in my shot above, but the background needs to be even to make it work. If you're rigging in front of 2 trees it's going to look pretty terrible with 2 jagged trees.

This is just a framework, as you said it depends on the light, so that could be 4-6 seconds for the car/wheels/road, and 8-20 seconds for the background.

Thx for the pointers will def try them out


-Bart
5D mk3 gripped | 7D gripped |EF 28-70mm F2.8L | EF 70-200mm F2.8L IS | Tokina 11-16 f2.8 | Sigma 50mm f1.4 | 3x AlienBees B1600 | 2x AlienBees B800 | Yongnuo 568ex X2 | Sigma 530dg Super | rf-622c x4 | Bunch of light modifiers | canon sx1is

http://bartcepekphotog​raphy.comexternal link

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Official Automotive Rigs - DIY Thread
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