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FORUMS General Gear Talk Camera Vs. Camera
Thread started 23 Mar 2017 (Thursday) 19:40
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5D SR, 5D S, 5D MkIV - Confusion.

 
Naturalist
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Mar 23, 2017 19:40 |  #1

As an outdoor photographer I'm looking for a full frame to supplement my 7D MkII.

I see 5D SR, 5D S, 5D MKIV - these each cost within a couple hundred dollars of one another at ± US$ 3500

Which would be the better choice for outdoor photography??


Doug
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TeamSpeed
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Post has been edited 6 months ago by TeamSpeed.
Mar 23, 2017 20:37 |  #2

The only advantage of the 5DS/R models is that they have 20Mpx more resolution, all other aspects go to the 5D4: ISO, AF, Features, etc. Do you need resolution or do you need all the other features and better high ISO IQ of the 5D4?

Also, I believe you can do better than $3500 for the 5D4.

http://www.canonpricew​atch.com ...IV-price.html?streetprice (external link)


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Lyndön
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Post has been edited 6 months ago by Lyndön.
Mar 23, 2017 20:59 |  #3

Yep, what ^ he said. It's super high MP specialty (S/Sr) VS a more balanced all-around camera at more moderate MP.

If you're open to refurbished items direct from Canon (same warranty and accessories, just a generic box), you can save a bundle over new on the 5D S/Sr models. You can compare prices at canonpricewatch.com and see what's in stock. I wouldn't pay several hundred dollars more just for a pretty box... but that's just me. The 5DIV's aren't available refurbished yet, so this won't be any help if you decide to go that direction.


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BigAl007
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Mar 24, 2017 10:40 |  #4

Lyndön wrote in post #18309146 (external link)
Yep, what ^ he said. It's super high MP specialty (S/Sr) VS a more balanced all-around camera at more moderate MP.

If you're open to refurbished items direct from Canon (same warranty and accessories, just a generic box), you can save a bundle over new on the 5D S/Sr models. You can compare prices at canonpricewatch.com and see what's in stock. I wouldn't pay several hundred dollars more just for a pretty box... but that's just me. The 5DIV's aren't available refurbished yet, so this won't be any help if you decide to go that direction.


But remember that Canon Refurb is only available in the USA. Oh and as said a bit more information would be required to make a more detailed response.

Alan


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Naturalist
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Mar 24, 2017 15:51 |  #5

Obviously, I'll shop for the best price what I am wondering is which truly is the better body?

I hate to get wooed by the megapixels but shooting 5D SR I feel would be better for outdoor work.

Which do you think would be the better body?


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bigVinnie
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Mar 24, 2017 17:15 |  #6

I thought the big deal about the 5dsr was the lack of anti-aliasing filter? Better sharpness at the expense of Moire.


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jcothron
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Mar 24, 2017 17:32 |  #7

I faced the same decision upgrading from 5DII. I eventually chose the 5DIV due to the newer sensor technology. Now, if they use that technology in the next version of a 5DSr, I may be sorely tempted. I'm happy with my decision so far, and loving the 5DIV.


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BigAl007
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Mar 24, 2017 19:46 |  #8

Naturalist wrote in post #18309877 (external link)
Obviously, I'll shop for the best price what I am wondering is which truly is the better body?

I hate to get wooed by the megapixels but shooting 5D SR I feel would be better for outdoor work.

Which do you think would be the better body?


Outdoor is just to general, what specific types of subjects are you photographing? The S and Sr are kind of close together in that the major difference is the reversal of the AA Filter, which increases the potential maximum resolution that is possible for the sensor to record, at the expense of the potential for additional moire on high frequency detail. Remember that it is impossible to truly fix moire, without also losing low frequency information in that area. Personally if I were shooting subjects with lots of very fine detail, especially birds feathers, which tend to combine both lots of high frequency data, along with low frequencies, I would be inclined to avoid the Sr. Given the resolving power of the current crop of VII big whites, and certain other Canon lenses I personally would want a 35mm format sensor to have at least 75 MP, and preferably 100 MP before removing the AA filter.

The two S series bodies are quite specialist bodies, which are more suited to use in better light, as Canon have limited the maximum ISO, because of fears about interpixel noise levels. The 5DS/Sr bodies are pretty much 5DIII's with a higher resolution sensor, and would certainly have very close to the same level of total image noise to the 5DIII at any ISO, when the whole image is compared at any fixed size, be that 12×8 or 36×24. The sensel density of the 5DS is pretty much the same as the 7DII, in that an APS-C crop from the full sensor will give you 19.7 MP

The 5DIV on the other hand is a completely new model, that has brought significant improvements to the already quite good AF system in the 5DIII/S, as well as significant improvements in high ISO performance and also low ISO DR. The 5DIV's 30 MP sensor gives you an APS-C crop of only 11.7 MP in comparison to the 50 MP sensor.

Which camera to go for then becomes very dependent on subject matter. Personally I would tend to favour the 5DS for my main subject matter, since I still often end up having to crop my APS-C body by a further 1.5×, even when shooting at 600mm. For me this would give me 5.2 MP from the 15×10mm area of sensor I would be using on the 5DIV, and 8.8 MP from the 5DS. I could use a 1.4× teleconverter with either camera at f/8, and since I am using the Sigma 150-600 AFAIK I would still be limited to using just the center AF point with both bodies. I think though that the general AF improvements would be such that the 5DIV in that situation would probably still give it the edge in focus ability.

I think that for general non specific uses the 5DIV is probably the better all round camera, by a fair margin. So when considering my specialist subject, aviation in flight, I would probably go with a 5DIV over the 5DS now, and use the 1.4× converter to keep the final resolution up. The 5DIV would give me 10.2 MP with the converter, and I would have the better all round body.

Unfortunately all of the current 5D versions are way out of my budget, so I will be sticking with my 50D for the foreseeable future. Remember though this is what would suit me personally, your mileage will vary, but I hope my reasoning is of some help.

Alan


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mikeearly
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Mar 24, 2017 19:47 |  #9

I've had my 5DSr for over a year now and love what it can do. For scenics it is fantastic in that what I care most about is definition and detail and the 51mp make that an easy task to accomplish. It also works great for anything that needs, and can support, a lot of detail/definition. The downside of all those mp is file size - they are BIG. They make extensive post processing a bit more of a challenge in many instances.

It would not be my first choice to take into the field for action work - birds in flight, critters, air shows, races, etc. as the focus acquisition is not anywhere near my 1Dx.

I am very happy I have the option of using it when I want the detail but I am also glad it is not my only body. (Other bodies are a 1Dx, 80D and an IR converted 5D).

I don't think you could go wrong with any of the three !


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John ­ Sheehy
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Mar 24, 2017 20:32 |  #10

BigAl007 wrote in post #18310097 (external link)
Given the resolving power of the current crop of VII big whites, and certain other Canon lenses I personally would want a 35mm format sensor to have at least 75 MP, and preferably 100 MP before removing the AA filter.

Even that is not as much resolution as it might sound. If a lens aliases on a 5Dsr with a 1.4x TC, it will also alias on a 100MP FF sensor without the TC. In fact, it should have a little bit more acuity without the extra TC glass.




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MalVeauX
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Mar 24, 2017 21:09 |  #11

Hey Doug,

It really depends on what you are shooting and what you favor. All those bodies are excellent, the main feature of each is basically the selling point to divide them.

You know your way around a camera, so you should already know what features are important to you, regardless of sensor size. Think on that. It will answer what you're after.

Just looking at your gallery & flickr, I don't see a ton of dynamic motion, instead I see a lot of texture. So to me, I would think the 5DSR would be a great system for you, with the massive resolution and the lack of AA filter.

Very best,


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Lyndön
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Mar 24, 2017 22:27 |  #12

BigAl007 wrote in post #18309602 (external link)
But remember that Canon Refurb is only available in the USA.

The OP's location is listed as Minnesota on his profile... so it should be available to him.

As for which camera? IMO it basically boils down to: is your subject moving or in terrible light?
Yes= 5DIV, No = 5DSr


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Naturalist
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Mar 25, 2017 12:56 |  #13

Great comments by all and thanks for the perspective and reasoning. You've all cleared the muddy waters up a bit for me. :)


Doug
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DreDaze
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Post has been edited 6 months ago by DreDaze.
Mar 25, 2017 13:01 |  #14

Why not go for a refurb 1DX

Actually forget that, i dont know why i was thinking wildlife...after looking at your shots, and gear list, i say get a cheaper body, and more lenses


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northdallas
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Mar 25, 2017 15:33 |  #15

I've owned a 5DsR for 18 months and love it. I have no experience with the 5D4, but decided to stick with my SR when the 4 was announced since the SR really does everything I need it to do. I use it for pretty much everything including landscape, family activities, portraits, travel, wildlife, etc. Landscape and nature photography has always been my first love and the SR is excellent for those uses. I like to make large prints and having 50mp allows me to crop quite a bit if I choose to and still make large prints.

I've heard it said the 5Ds and sR are poor low light/high ISO camera's, but I haven't found that to be true. I shoot up to 6400 ISO with no reservations and when down sampled the pictures are cleaner than those off the 5D3 I owned previously. I'm sure the 5D4 is better for high ISO shooting, so it depends on what you primarily use it for.

If I wasn't primarily a landscape photographer and was buying new today, I would probably buy a 5D4 since its a great general purpose body. But, if you want the best sharpness and detail possible in a full frame camera, the 5DsR is great!




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5D SR, 5D S, 5D MkIV - Confusion.
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