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FORUMS Photography Talk by Genre General Photography Talk
Thread started 31 Mar 2008 (Monday) 16:11
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At what point do you consider yourself a "Professional" photographer?

 
CyberDyneSystems
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Apr 08, 2017 18:21 |  #76

Hogloff wrote in post #18322947 (external link)
Yeh, it is strange that photographers seem to search for this title more than just about any other profession.

My barber does not call himself a professional barber. My dentist does not call herself a professional dentist. My doctor is just my doctor. My burger flipper doesn't call himself anything. My mechanic is just a mechanic.

All professionals of course,. and even if the mechanic is developing a bad reputation, overcharging for poor work, he is still a professional.

Me mum is the best cook in the world,. yet she's only ever been an amateur at it,. meanwhile there are many many many professional cooks that are not very good at all. (Even though they have much better kitchen equipment ;) )

Why do we photographers get so hung up on wanting to have the professional title? It's not like engineers that have to adhere to standards to bear the professional title...photography has zero regulations...even less than burger flipping. ;-)a




It is odd.


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Wilt
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Apr 08, 2017 18:29 as a reply to post 18321841 |  #77

No, unless literally done by Kincaid's own hand, that is a 'replica'


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Tom ­ Reichner
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Apr 08, 2017 18:51 |  #78

Hogloff wrote in post #18322947 (external link)
Yeh, it is strange that photographers seem to search for this title more than just about any other profession.


Why do we photographers get so hung up on wanting to have the professional title?

The the best of my knowledge, photographers do not seek the professional title. It is the public at large that seems to want to categorize photographers into "amateurs" and "pros".

I have known a heck of a lot of photographers, many of whom worked at it full-time as their sole means of support.......and I don't know that any of them cared one whit whether anyone else considered them to be a "professional" or not.

Hogloff, why do you think that photographers want this title? Have you ever known even one photographer who wanted to be called a professional?

.


"Your" and "you're" are different words with completely different meanings - please use the correct one.
"They're", "their", and "there" are different words with completely different meanings - please use the correct one.
"Fare" and "fair" are different words with completely different meanings - please use the correct one. The proper expression is "peace of mind", NOT "piece of mind".

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iowajim
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Apr 08, 2017 19:24 |  #79

I'm disappointed that we've ignored an important aspect of this debate.

SEMI-Professional

I saw a movie on the topic. Lots of crude language, and some humor to boot. I think it must be the definitive work on the subject, as I see no competing movies out there.

There is a common perception that 'professional' means one earns income from the work. And the inference is that if a person is feeding himself, he must have some skills in order to stay in that field. But as Jake has indicated, there can be professionals that are hacks. Perhaps the hacks survive by being excellent marketers rather than by being excellent at their profession. Either way, I agree that 'professional' refers to earning income from the activity.


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Bassat
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Apr 08, 2017 20:14 as a reply to iowajim's post |  #80

I was a SEMI-professional from '74 to '83 when I drove a truck for a living.


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TeamSpeed
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Apr 08, 2017 21:06 |  #81

Tom Reichner wrote in post #18322976 (external link)
The the best of my knowledge, photographers do not seek the professional title. It is the public at large that seems to want to categorize photographers into "amateurs" and "pros".

I have known a heck of a lot of photographers, many of whom worked at it full-time as their sole means of support.......and I don't know that any of them cared one whit whether anyone else considered them to be a "professional" or not.

Hogloff, why do you think that photographers want this title? Have you ever known even one photographer who wanted to be called a professional?

.


Interestingly, it hasn't been the public keeping this thread alive these 9 years... :D


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Tom ­ Reichner
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Apr 08, 2017 22:50 |  #82

TeamSpeed wrote in post #18323069 (external link)
Interestingly, it hasn't been the public keeping this thread alive these 9 years... :D

Keeping the thread alive, or having an interest in discussing the issue, does not necessarily mean that anyone wants to be credited with being 'a professional'. I discuss many topics in which I have nothing at stake whatsoever. People simply like to debate things and discuss them, particularly when semantics are involved.

.


"Your" and "you're" are different words with completely different meanings - please use the correct one.
"They're", "their", and "there" are different words with completely different meanings - please use the correct one.
"Fare" and "fair" are different words with completely different meanings - please use the correct one. The proper expression is "peace of mind", NOT "piece of mind".

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OhLook
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Apr 08, 2017 23:03 |  #83

I couldn't help reading that last sentence a little differently:

Tom Reichner wrote in post #18323131 (external link)
People simply like to debate things and discuss them, particularly when some antics are involved.


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TeamSpeed
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Apr 08, 2017 23:22 |  #84

Being a great photographer doesnt make one a professional, and being a professional doesnt mean one is a good photographer, so the differentiator has to be something other than skill, ie the money.


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drmaxx
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Apr 09, 2017 01:55 |  #85

TeamSpeed summarized it pretty well. I think the more interesting question would be when are you an 'expert photographer' (the second inherit meaning of the prefix 'pro'). I know that the word expert has currently some bad press - but it actually means something. E.g. https://hbr.org ...7/the-making-of-an-expert (external link) is an interesting read.

E.g. I would call an expert photographer somebody who can consistently produce great/pleasing results also under difficult situations. A second measure could be, that he is able to reliably reproduce a desired look requested by a customer (e.g. can you create the look of this example type of thing).


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Nogo
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Apr 09, 2017 02:47 |  #86

I have wondered about how much people bend the rules on who is a professional for Canon's Professional Services Program? (external link) It states it is for full time professionals. I myself, for example, am a full time amateur. I do not attempt to earn any money from photography. But, if you went by the gear qualifications, I have enough points to qualify for the programs except for the Cinema program..

Do all these photographers with a free Facebook Page and enough equipment to sign up for the CPS program sign up for this program even if they really are no better photographers than the average active amateur? Is it common for advanced amateurs (who sell a photo every now and then) to belong to this program or is it truly just for the people who genuinely are, full time professionals.


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TeamSpeed
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Apr 09, 2017 05:41 |  #87

It is easy to join CPS even if you make no money doing photography but have all the gear, this despite Canon's definition of a professional which mirrors what has been stated.

1. Membership is available only for those individuals, (a) that are full time self-employed, or an employee of a professional imaging business, who plays a direct role in the creation of moving or still images for third parties on a professional basis.


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kf095
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Apr 13, 2017 22:34 |  #88

I'll just drop it here:

"Forget about the profession of being a photographer.
First be a photographer and maybe the profession will
come after. Don’t be in a rush to pay your rent with your
camera. Jimi Hendrix didn’t decide on the career of
professional musician when he learned to play guitar.
No, he loved playing music and created something
beautiful and that then became a profession. Larry Towell,
for instance, was not a ‘professional’ photographer
until he was already a ‘famous’ photographer. Make the
pictures you feel compelled to make and perhaps that will
lead to a career. But if you try to make the career first, you
will just make shitty pictures that you don’t care about.”

— Christopher Anderson


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rxjohn
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Apr 16, 2017 08:50 |  #89

All of yall are wrong.

We all know when one uses a FF body and has at least 3 shiny L-lenses, and has a backup crop sensor body, that's what a pro photog is.

:-P




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CyberDyneSystems
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Apr 16, 2017 13:51 |  #90

Oh no, you've got it only partly right;



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At what point do you consider yourself a "Professional" photographer?
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