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FORUMS Photography Talk by Genre Weddings & Other Family Events Talk
Thread started 23 Jun 2017 (Friday) 13:57
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Does my bride look 70? advice needed.

 
DaviSto
... sorry. I got carried away!
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Abuja Nigeria
Jun 28, 2017 04:54 as a reply to post 18388709 |  #31

Save the Raw file on a free cloud-based filesharing service like GoogleDrive or DropBox and then post the link.

For a bit of extra security you could PM the link to actively interested participants in this conversation rather than post it publicly. Either way, it would probably make sense to delete the file from the cloud server after a day or two.


Comment and (constructive) criticism always welcome.

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nathancarter
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Post has been edited 4 months ago by nathancarter.
Jun 28, 2017 08:25 |  #32

Another thought: Judicious use of a localized lighten and darken adjustment brush will help a lot. In that most recent shot you posted, lifting the dark lines under her eyes will take off five or ten years.

Here are some skin retouches that I've done in Lightroom that you might find useful. For many of them, I'm using custom presets for the Lightroom adjustment brush - but rest assured that this is easier than it sounds.

These aren't recent work, but the first link is probably pretty close to what I'd do on that last photo you posted:

http://photography-on-the.net ...showthread.php?p=17​094966

http://photography-on-the.net ...showthread.php?p=16​891903

http://photography-on-the.net ...showthread.php?p=17​535032


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welshwizard1971
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Jun 28, 2017 15:14 |  #33

Colin Glover wrote in post #18388481 (external link)
This is one edit with skin softening. Went back to raw. It's a bit too matte for me. Need help tweaking it. Went back to raw. WelshW. Iso differed between shots. This one was 400. Some were 3200 for some reason, as was set to auto 3200. This from a resized JPEG in PS. Not Facebook.
thumbnailHosted photo: posted by Colin Glover in
./showthread.php?p=183​88481&i=i262650739
forum: Weddings & Other Family Events Talk

That image is soooo much cleaner, some of the previous shots are so oversharpened and pixelated with noise they're bordering on a watercolour/oils painting type filter, especially the people in the background, alas I don't have the expertise to reverse engineer them to figure out why, I just know this shot is 1000 times cleaner....


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DaviSto
... sorry. I got carried away!
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Joined Nov 2016
Abuja Nigeria
Jun 28, 2017 15:42 as a reply to welshwizard1971's post |  #34

I agree completely. But I think Colin likes to work the controls pretty hard in LR/PS when maybe a subtler approach would work better (to my eye). Mostly in photo-editing 'less is more' I think. Tweaking a few things a little this way or a little that can make a huge difference to an image. I rarely do much more than nudge things from the default settings one way or another. Going back through the email chain, I think Colin's approach involves twisting more dials (or sliding more sliders) a lot further than that.

The current image is way cleaner but the 'reds' are still turned up very high, somehow. I think backing off most of the settings, except for basic exposure correction, would still be a good starting point. After that, with full respect to the posters who have advised against, I'd slightly declarify and defocus the bride's face and neck.


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Colin ­ Glover
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Jun 29, 2017 07:08 |  #35

Thanks for the input. So here's an udate. It's good to have a friend who has a 32" Mac who can help. So straight from the SD card into LR. She's working on around 100 images. Basic tab adjustments as needed, Saturation stays the same, NO CLARITY, sharpen to 60, skin soften adjustment brush to face and neck and then noise reduction to reduce wrinkles. Looks good. Nice and clear. Love her Mac. Beats my 17 inch laptop hands down. Looks good. Sent my bride some edit's yesterday (not these) and will arrive today. Let her know that more edits on her and her hubby are being done and will take 4-5 days before I get them. I'll run them through Premier for a slideshow DVD as well. As you know, with ETTL, a few images come out dark due to recycling time etc, so she's only editing a couple of those with good facial expressions. My friend, Louise, reckons if my bride doesn't like these, then it's down to her being picky. It's good to have a woman's input here for this. It's a lesson learned the hard way. I'll post a couple when I get them back so you can see what has been done. Thanks for your valuable input guys and girls.


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DaviSto
... sorry. I got carried away!
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Joined Nov 2016
Abuja Nigeria
Jun 29, 2017 08:36 |  #36

Colin Glover wrote in post #18389624 (external link)
It's good to have a friend who has a 32" Mac who can help. So straight from the SD card into LR. She's working on around 100 images. Basic tab adjustments as needed, Saturation stays the same, NO CLARITY, sharpen to 60, skin soften adjustment brush to face and neck and then noise reduction to reduce wrinkles. Looks good. Nice and clear.

Good to hear you are making progress. A friend in need is a friend in deed ... especially when they know how to work Lightroom and have a big clear screen to go with that.

Hard lesson, indeed ... but at least you have learned some stuff that should be a big help in your post-processing in future. Onwards and upwards!


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Colin ­ Glover
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Jun 29, 2017 09:43 |  #37

Indeed she is. I do want o e of those Macs, but at £1200 they're out of reach for now. The amount of photo she could fit in that box at 4:1 was more than I could fit on my 17 inch at 1:1. Big thumbs up to Louise. Out of interest, what size screens do you guys use. A monitor has a big advantage over a laptop in that it's easier to get contrast right. On a laptop, the angle of the screen alters it, making it harder. Cheers everyone.


Canon EOS 70D, Canon EOS 600D, EF-S 18-55 ii, EF 55-200 USM ii, EF-S 75-300 iii, Tamron 28-80, Sigma 70-210. Pentax 50mm, Pentax 135mm, EF-S 55-250, Raynox Macro adapter, Neewer filters (CPL, UV, FLD & ND4), Fuji HS20 EXR (30X zoom ) & cable release, Yongnuo 560 iii & Luxon 9800A manual flashguns for the Fuji, Hama Star 63 tripod, Hongdek RC-6 remote control, Velbon DF 40 www.point-n-shoot.co.uk website.

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DaviSto
... sorry. I got carried away!
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Joined Nov 2016
Abuja Nigeria
Jun 29, 2017 09:56 |  #38

Colin Glover wrote in post #18389728 (external link)
Indeed she is. I do want o e of those Macs, but at £1200 they're out of reach for now. The amount of photo she could fit in that box at 4:1 was more than I could fit on my 17 inch at 1:1. Big thumbs up to Louise. Out of interest, what size screens do you guys use. A monitor has a big advantage over a laptop in that it's easier to get contrast right. On a laptop, the angle of the screen alters it, making it harder. Cheers everyone.

I rely on my 15.6" laptop screen. It is a 4k display so the resolution is high and it renders colours accurately, which is very important to me. I'd love to have a big external monitor but it's not a practicable option in my current circumstances.


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Patbil10
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Aylmer, Quebec
Post has been edited 4 months ago by Patbil10.
Jun 29, 2017 13:25 |  #39

davesrose wrote in post #18385647 (external link)
IMO, it's going to be hard because they're apparently expecting something not within their price range. I think you should select the pics that are the most flattering.

Price range has nothing to do with it...that's what she looks like ! The bride should take long hard look in the mirror ! :-P

Unless she wants to spend more money to have all the photos fixed through skin smoothing, I think she needs a reality check !


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Patbil10
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Joined Apr 2014
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Jun 29, 2017 13:36 |  #40

DaviSto wrote in post #18388130 (external link)
Hi, I'm not 100% sure which presets you are looking for but I'll provide as much info as I can, hoping some of it might be what you are looking for.

The picture that I copied from FB of my little boy is not going to be a lot of use, I think. It was cropped in Lightroom but I did almost nothing else to it: some general adjustments to the colour balance right across the image (not significant) and a half stop of extra exposure/brightness again across the piece. I didn't apply any sharpening and I left presence (clarity, vibrancy, luminosity) at default zero values. I spot removed one tiny dirt smudge in the white of one eye. I didn't apply any LR presets.

But no bride is going to have the skin of a two-year-old and there are no tricks in the book short of complete plasticization in post-processing (very undesirable) or a pact with the devil (even more undesirable) that are going to help with that.

The settings I used in Nik could be more useful and (I think) are what you were looking for. I used two Nik filter presets, both available from the portrait sub-set in the Color Efex Pro 4 module: Classical Soft Focus; and Dynamic Skin Softener. In both cases (for the example below) I added two control points approximating to a circle covering the bride's face and a smaller circle covering her neck. You don't have to be very precise in Nik because the program decides, from the limited information you provide, where the edges of the area to be adjusted are (hence no masks or brushes). The effect of using the control points is to localize the adjustments that you are making rather than apply them to the whole photo. [For shots where a lot of other skin is on view, such as the arm, it may be useful to add some control points there as well].

I may also have slightly reduced the brightness slider in the soft focus preset (can't remember now ... but it wasn't critical). The effect of this (admittedly based on the easiest of your files to work with) is to go from this:
thumbnailHosted photo: posted by DaviSto in
./showthread.php?p=183​88130&i=i165795857
forum: Weddings & Other Family Events Talk
to this:
thumbnailHosted photo: posted by DaviSto in
./showthread.php?p=183​88130&i=i10228283
forum: Weddings & Other Family Events Talk
To my eye this amount of smoothing is acceptable and doesn't look too artificial but, if anything, I'd back-off the Nik presets strength just a little. I know a few people have commented that any adjustment should be unnecessary and is, potentially, insulting and I do understand that. My gut feeling is that in this case photo-journalistic accuracy is not high on your main customer's priority list and she really wants to look what she feels is her best.

I should add to all this: 1) I am not an expert in Nik or post-processing more generally and am still earning the ropes; 2) although I got improvement from applying this technique to the other images you posted, the Nik software couldn't really cope with all the artifacts in those case. I think if you start off with a cleaner less-processed image to begin with you should be able to get significant improvements here too, though.

Finally, I'd consider dropping the B&W shots ... they are not likely to be flattering enough.

Finally, finally, I don't think your bride is going to be nearly so worried about shots in which she does not feature. I'd focus my attention on her.

Nope....face looks worse...like plastic ! It is what it is. The bride's no longer in her 20s...she must accept that fact....


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DaviSto
... sorry. I got carried away!
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Joined Nov 2016
Abuja Nigeria
Jun 29, 2017 13:43 |  #41

Patbil10 wrote in post #18389963 (external link)
Nope....face looks worse...like plastic ! It is what it is. The bride's no longer in her 20s...she must accept that fact....

I don't really disagree. But I think she would like the second much better ... realism is not her priority.


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MigsVuitton
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San Diego
Jul 23, 2017 03:40 |  #42

Not sure what she expected with such a low budget for her wedding photography. That is a similar budget for a 30 minute portrait session. She seems a bit rude too. PP mistakes aside, she does look old. And it's not a bad thing. It's just life. Not like you'll look magically younger just because it's your wedding day. Anyway, good luck. Hope it all works itself out to where both parties can walk away feeling at the very least, ok.

We document life, not make miracles happen lol.


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Colin ­ Glover
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Jul 26, 2017 17:52 |  #43

Well, I delivered the finished images. Big thanks to Louise for her help.

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She did a great job.
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Colin ­ Glover
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Jul 26, 2017 17:56 |  #44

And Here's a couple more.

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I think she looks a lot younger now.
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Canon EOS 70D, Canon EOS 600D, EF-S 18-55 ii, EF 55-200 USM ii, EF-S 75-300 iii, Tamron 28-80, Sigma 70-210. Pentax 50mm, Pentax 135mm, EF-S 55-250, Raynox Macro adapter, Neewer filters (CPL, UV, FLD & ND4), Fuji HS20 EXR (30X zoom ) & cable release, Yongnuo 560 iii & Luxon 9800A manual flashguns for the Fuji, Hama Star 63 tripod, Hongdek RC-6 remote control, Velbon DF 40 www.point-n-shoot.co.uk website.

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Colin ­ Glover
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Jul 26, 2017 17:59 |  #45

And here's 5 & 6.

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Does my bride look 70? advice needed.
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