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FORUMS General Gear Talk Flash and Studio Lighting
Thread started 05 Sep 2017 (Tuesday) 11:29
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External power and canon speed lites

 
faw67
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193 posts
Joined Sep 2008
Richmond Area, VA
Sep 05, 2017 11:29 |  #1

I have a 580 ex ii and an looking for some external power to quicken the recycle rate, had considered the bolt but was told that external power like this would burn up my flash.
Would like to get my recycle rate up and not have to carry a dozen batteries around for every battery change.
Rodeo type events with limited lighting are my main work right now, my budget wont allow me to spend a pile of money on strobes esp battery ones id need
Thanxs for any help and direction




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FarmerTed1971
fondling the 5D4
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Joined Sep 2013
Portland, OR
Sep 05, 2017 12:14 |  #2

How fast do you need it to recycle? Can you reduce the power?

Are you using the Black Eneloops?

You might try the Canon external battery packs. The 600 flashes also may help a bit.


Getting better at this - Fuji Xt-2 - 18-55 - 35 f2 WR - 50-140 - 6D - 135L - 70-200 f4L IS - 600EX-RT x2 - ST-E3-RT - flickr (external link) - www.scottaticephoto.co​m (external link)

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faw67
THREAD ­ STARTER
Member
193 posts
Joined Sep 2008
Richmond Area, VA
Sep 05, 2017 12:42 as a reply to FarmerTed1971's post |  #3

Im using a 7d mk2 and would like to get 3 good pops in a row at high speed burst, i know this is asking alot




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MalVeauX
"Looks rough and well used"
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Joined Feb 2013
Florida
Sep 05, 2017 13:22 |  #4

Heya,

Speedlites aren't meant to do several back to back high speed recycles. Your 7D2 will expose much faster than the flash can maintain. You're asking for more than what a typical flash can do. Now, to make it work more in your favor, you can:

1) Reduce the power output of the flash and increase ISO to make up for it, to allow for really low power, but high recycle flash times.
2) Use an external battery source, instead of just the 4 in the flash (look at the 8~12 battery banks); this will give you a little faster recycle time too and more pops without changing batteries.
3) Use more than one flash to get more output at a low power (not gonna happen on a hotshoe I know).

If you slow down the FPS on your 7D2 and not shoot at the full unleashed FPS its capable of, you can do it more reliably. But you'd have to be at lower power flash output for it to recycle fast enough.

It simply will never recycle fast enough at 1/4th power, 1/2 power, 1/1 power, to keep up with the 7D2's capabilities for FPS.

This is where a high powered monolight comes into play; so that it's low power (1/32, 1/64, etc) is enough output for your needs, but with a blazing fast recycle time. Just won't be on camera most likely so may not be useful for you.

Very best,


My Flickr (external link) :: My Astrobin (external link)

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Left ­ Handed ­ Brisket
That's my line!
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Joined Jun 2011
The Uwharrie Mts, NC
Sep 05, 2017 13:38 |  #5

It isn't the battery necessarily that will burn up the flash, it is just that once you get recycle rates up if you don't give it time to cool down it burns itself up.

If I were you I'd be looking at a Godox 360 or 200


PSA: The above post may contain sarcasm, reply at your own risk | Formerly he's gone before apostrophe-gate | Not in gear database: Canon 70-210 3.5-4.5, Auto Sears 50mm 2.0 / 2x CL-360, Nikon SB-28, SunPak auto 322 D, Minolta 20

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faw67
THREAD ­ STARTER
Member
193 posts
Joined Sep 2008
Richmond Area, VA
Post has been edited 17 days ago by faw67.
Sep 05, 2017 15:15 |  #6

I was looking at the Bolt Cyclone DR PP-400DR Dual Outlet Power Pack, I usually have a couple of minutes in between riders for cool down, I love the idea of a monolight but my budget doesnt allow for one right now, I have a couple of gang flashes ive put together for added light for the night events that I run off of pocket wizards, which eventually id like to figure on making these my main source of light, Im already shooting at 250-320 shutter speed and f5-f6 at 4000iso with this as result, with some edditting.
this is with flash mounted on camera and the only flash, I would like to be able to back it down some to eliminate the dreaded red eye, ediiting that out isnt my favorite past time.
iso 4000 64mm f5.6 1/320sec rough guess approx 30-40 feet away heavy overcast and rain, dim very high lights in arena

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MalVeauX
"Looks rough and well used"
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Joined Feb 2013
Florida
Sep 05, 2017 15:39 |  #7

Heya,

I would run a speedlite under the camera, like shooting football, if possible (on a monopod for example; may not be possible for you). It will be off the exact axis, firing from below and help with filling faces/eyes/etc. I would stick to what you're doing, but I would push ISO harder and lower the flash power, and I'd probably set it to -1/3rd or even -2/3rd EC based on what you've got here so that it looks more natural as fill light and less just flashed in a dark area. This will also allow for faster recycle times due to lower power flash output.

Otherwise, you can get a bracket a put the flash off axis to help with the look when it comes to eyes. And then just use an ETTL capable flash cable to control it off camera on that bracket. But the above still applies, I'd use a flash battery pack (decrease recycle time and increase capacity), lower flash output and raise ISO to compensate (will also lift those shadows in the dark arena to help get a more natural looking blend to ambient), and run your EC in ETTL/HSS -1/3rd to -2/3rds even what you're doing here, but raise overall exposure a touch (via ISO); goal being more fill than just plain key. I think you'll like the results of the blend more. Just a thought.

Very best,


My Flickr (external link) :: My Astrobin (external link)

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faw67
THREAD ­ STARTER
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193 posts
Joined Sep 2008
Richmond Area, VA
Sep 05, 2017 15:41 as a reply to MalVeauX's post |  #8

thank you




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faw67
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Member
193 posts
Joined Sep 2008
Richmond Area, VA
Post has been edited 17 days ago by faw67.
Sep 05, 2017 15:52 |  #9

My biggest worry about pushing the iso up more is the grain , I feel that at a 8x10 size print with any crop its starting to show
I would love to light these from the side with the multiple flash setup, im working on and use a diffuser on the camera mounted flash to ease up on the eyes , but back to the subject at hand , will something like the bolt be safe to use with my flash?




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Nick5
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2,881 posts
Joined Mar 2007
Philadelphia Suburbs
Post has been edited 7 days ago by Nick5.
Sep 15, 2017 09:01 |  #10

faw67 wrote in post #18445084 (external link)
I have a 580 ex ii and an looking for some external power to quicken the recycle rate, had considered the bolt but was told that external power like this would burn up my flash.
Would like to get my recycle rate up and not have to carry a dozen batteries around for every battery change.
Rodeo type events with limited lighting are my main work right now, my budget wont allow me to spend a pile of money on strobes esp battery ones id need
Thanxs for any help and direction

67.
You are now seeing why many of us have multiple Speedlites.
Recycle times, more power, different positioning around the subject and on and on.
My Speedliting life really took off with the introduction of the Canon 600 EX-RT, ST-E3 RT Radio Communication system in 2012. Eliminating Pocket Wizards, shooting E-TTL and being able to adjust most parameters from the ST-E3RT Transmitter really opened the doors for me and being to capture what I need.
Unfortunately, they cost money. I do not have third party flashes since when I started in 2012, there was no other product like it, no real competition. While there is competition at a reduced price, I can not afford to have a bad experience with third party history. Whether it be bad quality, doors falling off or Camera updates etc.
since you know the limitations of just one flash, why not invest down the road. Trade in the 580 like I did years ago.
A nice less expensive option for now is the Bolt Battery Pack with 8 AA NiMH batteries (Eneloop White) plus 4 Eneloops in the Speedlite and you can reduce your recycle time.

https://www.bhphotovid​eo.com ...act_Battery_Pack_fo​r.html (external link)


Yes you have to carry a dozen batteries for back up. That's nothing as far as I am concerned. You can then think out your long term investment plan of attack in the world of Speedliting.
Enjoy the ride!


Canon 5D Mark III (x2), BG-E11 Grips, 7D (x2) BG-E7 Grips, Canon Lenses 16-35 f/4 L IS, 17-40 f/4 L, 24-70 f/4 L IS, 24-105 f/4 L IS, 70-200 f/2.8 L IS II, 70-200 f/4 L IS, 100-400 f/4.5-5.6 L IS, TS-E 24 f/3.5 L II, 100 f/2.8 L Macro IS, 10-22 f3.5-4.5, 17-55 f/2.8 L IS, 50 f/1.4, 85 f/1.8, Canon 1.4 Extender III, 5 Canon 600 EX-RT, 2 Canon ST-E3 Transmitters, Canon Pixma PRO-10 Printer

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abbadon31
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Joined Jul 2009
SOCAL
Sep 15, 2017 10:39 |  #11

Godox PB820 2500mAh External Flash Power Battery Pack for Camera Flash Speedlite

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External power and canon speed lites
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