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FORUMS General Gear Talk Camera Vs. Camera 
Thread started 12 Oct 2017 (Thursday) 18:27
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You've got no gear at all - Would you get a 5DMKIV or D850

 
aladyforty
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Oct 19, 2017 07:20 |  #121

Charlie wrote in post #18475674 (external link)
that's ok, the sigma 135A blows the L out of the water. I wouldnt even be surprised if it were sharper than the 200 f2L. I dont like using it due to the size, but it's hell of a stunner.

only downside is the cost, being quite a bit more than the L.


True, but how many of us really need to spend that sort of cash, the reality is not that many people are actually making their main living from photography, yet its those who are not that seem so obsessed with the latest greatest cameras etc. I have a friend who shoots both canon and Nikon, has the latest cameras ( not the latest Nikon though) yet his photos are no different from a couple of models back. In the end if you have the money go for whatever you want but I seriously dont believe it makes one a better photographer, I see evidence of this every day online


5DIII 7DII Fuji X100 Fuji X10 17-40L 135L 70-200F4ISL Tamron 150-600
My Flickr https://www.flickr.com​/photos/25426422@N00/ (external link)
Birding page (archives cant add to them, lost password) https://www.flickr.com​/photos/59111660@N08/ (external link)

  
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Patbil10
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Oct 19, 2017 08:43 |  #122

TeamSpeed wrote in post #18473968 (external link)
And somebody from the Nikon camp would say they would have an uphill climb to get used to Canon.

Not true...most Nikon users admit that Canon's menu system is easier and more intuitive.


Canon 5D Mark IV, Canon EOS M5, Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L II,Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II,Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 macro, Sigma 35mm Art, Tamron SP 85mm f/1.8, EF-M 22mm f/2, Canon ef-m 15-45, Rokinon 14mm f2.8 and other stuff...

  
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wallstreetoneil
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Oct 19, 2017 09:13 |  #123

Ah-keong wrote in post #18475797 (external link)
with such high resolution from D850 / 5DsR.

I read that the minimum shutter speed recommended would be two times of the inverse focal length :

i.e: 50mm -> 1/ 125s


The main reason I sold my Canon 50L for the Tamron 45 1.8 VC for use on my 5DSR
- if you want repeated tack sharp results, i.e. 8-9 out of 10 on a consistent basis, and I have completely and thoroughly tested this, that at least with the 5DSR HANDHELD, you need 1/400 @ the 50mm FL
- that is not to say that you can't do it at lower shutter speeds - you absolutely can - and obviously so with flash
- the question is, if you are going to set your minimum, non flashed SS, so that you know when you are reviewing your pictures later in LR, what is the SS where you are going to see 80%+ tack sharp images that are getting you the 50 megapixels of detail, what is the SS you need to use?
- i want to repeat, you do not need this SS to achieve 'sharp' 20 megapixel in detail images handheld for posing models - but you certainly do if you are trying to extract near 50 megapixels in detail repeatedly
- after my months of testing a few years back, I sold all the following lenses (35L, 50L, 85Lii and 135L) - because for me, they just don't work, handheld, at shutter speeds I need and want to use, on the 5DSR

When I shoot the 5DSR with the Tamron 45 1.8 VC, I generally shoot posing people, between 1/60 - 1/80th, and I easily hit the 80%+ tack sharp rate. Below is one of a series of pictures I took of my daughter, all were at 1/60th - none of them missed. If you want to see how sharp the actual image is, you have to download the Original from the Flickr link as the displayed image on Flickr is no where near as sharp. When you zoom in, even from that range with a 45mm FL, each of her left eye eyelashes, is tack sharp @ F2 - not saying this is 'important' about whether or not this is a good picture, but if you care about filling your hard drive with big files, and the ability to crop that large megapixel cameras give you, then you will care.

IMAGE: https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8637/29585109634_0bf604c5e0_c.jpg
IMAGE LINK: https://flic.kr/p/M5kq​n9  (external link) watching_tv (external link) by Paul O'Neil (external link), on Flickr

Hockey and wedding photographer. Favourite camera / lens combos: a 1DX II with a Tamron 45 1.8 VC, an A7Rii with a Canon 24-70F2.8L II, and a 5DSR with a Tamron 85 1.8 VC. Every lens I own I strongly recommend [Canon (35Lii, 100L Macro, 24-70F2.8ii, 70-200F2.8ii, 100-400Lii), Tamron (45 1.8, 85 1.8), Sigma 24-105]. If there are better lenses out there let me know because I haven't found them.

  
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Patbil10
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Oct 19, 2017 09:53 |  #124

Scoobert wrote in post #18475725 (external link)
3. Tamron and sigma are making so many good lenses now that you are not stuck with the super expensive lenses made by Canon/Nikon (ie the $4K 70-200 VR) .

Funny you mention this. I currently have two 3rd party lenses of significance. The Sigma 35A and the Tamron 85 f1.8. I can say now that I'm done with buying 3rd party lenses.

While optically they're awesome performers and easily compete with the Canon L lenses, I've had to work really hard at getting the focus accuracy spot on. I'm just now getting comfortable using them for paid gigs. With Canon lenses, there are no adjustments required...at least not for me and I am a pixel peeper.

I can only imagine the nightmare of trying to calibrate focus on a 3rd party zoom lens...getting a headache just thinking about it ! :-P


Canon 5D Mark IV, Canon EOS M5, Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L II,Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II,Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 macro, Sigma 35mm Art, Tamron SP 85mm f/1.8, EF-M 22mm f/2, Canon ef-m 15-45, Rokinon 14mm f2.8 and other stuff...

  
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Patbil10
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Oct 19, 2017 10:00 |  #125

aladyforty wrote in post #18475895 (external link)
True, but how many of us really need to spend that sort of cash, the reality is not that many people are actually making their main living from photography, yet its those who are not that seem so obsessed with the latest greatest cameras etc. I have a friend who shoots both canon and Nikon, has the latest cameras ( not the latest Nikon though) yet his photos are no different from a couple of models back. In the end if you have the money go for whatever you want but I seriously dont believe it makes one a better photographer, I see evidence of this every day online

Totally agree...other than the increased DR, little higher resolution and DPAF, my photos don't look night and day better than when I had my 5D3. GAS (gear acquisition syndrome) is big problem of mine... :-P


Canon 5D Mark IV, Canon EOS M5, Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L II,Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II,Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 macro, Sigma 35mm Art, Tamron SP 85mm f/1.8, EF-M 22mm f/2, Canon ef-m 15-45, Rokinon 14mm f2.8 and other stuff...

  
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904canon
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Oct 19, 2017 10:12 |  #126

I would go Canon.




  
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Charlie
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Oct 19, 2017 10:13 |  #127

aladyforty wrote in post #18475895 (external link)
True, but how many of us really need to spend that sort of cash, the reality is not that many people are actually making their main living from photography, yet its those who are not that seem so obsessed with the latest greatest cameras etc. I have a friend who shoots both canon and Nikon, has the latest cameras ( not the latest Nikon though) yet his photos are no different from a couple of models back. In the end if you have the money go for whatever you want but I seriously dont believe it makes one a better photographer, I see evidence of this every day online

it's a passion for me, I love photography and with that I'm passionate about my gear. I can correlate more gear with more shooting, and more happy with said shooting. I mean, I can shoot a 24-70 and 70-200 f2.8 and call it a day.... but I wouldnt be totally happy about it :-)

photography is a hobby, and the learning process I go through from trying out gear was a big part of the learning process.

What I like is to find small and very high performing gear. They seem to be at odds for the most part, but I'm happy to find the exceptions. Big and heavy I dont enjoy.


Sony A7rii/A7riii - FE 12-24/4 - FE 24-240 - FE 28/2 - FE 35/2.8 - FE 50/1.8 - FE 85/1.8 - EF 135/1.8 Art - F 600/5.6 - CZ 35-70, 100-300 - Astro Rok 14/2.8, 24/1.4 - Tamron 28-75 f2.8, 70-200 f2.8 VC

  
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Scoobert
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Oct 19, 2017 10:34 |  #128

Patbil10 wrote in post #18475982 (external link)
Funny you mention this. I currently have two 3rd party lenses of significance. The Sigma 35A and the Tamron 85 f1.8. I can say now that I'm done with buying 3rd party lenses.

While optically they're awesome performers and easily compete with the Canon L lenses, I've had to work really hard at getting the focus accuracy spot on. I'm just now getting comfortable using them for paid gigs. With Canon lenses, there are no adjustments required...at least not for me and I am a pixel peeper.

I can only imagine the nightmare of trying to calibrate focus on a 3rd party zoom lens...getting a headache just thinking about it ! :-P

The only 3'rd party lens I have had a problem with was the 18-35 sigma.

The Tamron lenses are far better when it comes to af accuracy (vs sigma) IMO. I have had zero issues with them. 15 minutes with Reikan Focal and I am done. I have had more problems with Canon lenses than I have had Tamrons. Plus with Canons short warranty period every lens I have had a problem with had to be paid to be repaired where the 6 year warranty of the tamron means you just send it in.

I find it funny that a lowly third party lens maker can offer a 6 year warranty yet the great canon only trust their lens for 1 year.




  
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Charlie
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Oct 19, 2017 10:39 |  #129

Scoobert wrote in post #18476010 (external link)
The only 3'rd party lens I have had a problem with was the 18-35 sigma.

The Tamron lenses are far better when it comes to af accuracy (vs sigma) IMO. I have had zero issues with them. 15 minutes with Reikan Focal and I am done. I have had more problems with Canon lenses than I have had Tamrons. Plus with Canons short warranty period every lens I have had a problem with had to be paid to be repaired where the 6 year warranty of the tamron means you just send it in.

I find it funny that a lowly third party lens maker can offer a 6 year warranty yet the great canon only trust their lens for 1 year.

I had to use the tamron warranty on my old 17-50, it was on its 5th year when I used it!

When I had coating issues with the 24-70ii, canon wanted 600 :-(

that super long Tamron warranty should not be taken lightly, it can be real handy!


Sony A7rii/A7riii - FE 12-24/4 - FE 24-240 - FE 28/2 - FE 35/2.8 - FE 50/1.8 - FE 85/1.8 - EF 135/1.8 Art - F 600/5.6 - CZ 35-70, 100-300 - Astro Rok 14/2.8, 24/1.4 - Tamron 28-75 f2.8, 70-200 f2.8 VC

  
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Patbil10
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Oct 19, 2017 10:50 |  #130

Scoobert wrote in post #18476010 (external link)
I find it funny that a lowly third party lens maker can offer a 6 year warranty yet the great canon only trust their lens for 1 year.

Good point. That's how Sigma/Tamron are enticing new buyers. Canon/Nikon will never match this !


Canon 5D Mark IV, Canon EOS M5, Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L II,Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II,Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 macro, Sigma 35mm Art, Tamron SP 85mm f/1.8, EF-M 22mm f/2, Canon ef-m 15-45, Rokinon 14mm f2.8 and other stuff...

  
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Scoobert
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Oct 19, 2017 10:52 |  #131

Charlie wrote in post #18476013 (external link)
I had to use the tamron warranty on my old 17-50, it was on its 5th year when I used it!

When I had coating issues with the 24-70ii, canon wanted 600 :-(

that super long Tamron warranty should not be taken lightly, it can be real handy!

Had the 24-70 L original version it went to canon twice when it was 3 years old. Once with a focus issue the other with focus/calibration issue. Between them it cost me $580 plus shipping and insurance. When I got it back it went straight to craigslist and I used the money to buy a used Tamron 24-70 VC. Even at 5 years old and bought used tamron took it in under warranty for firmware upgrade and cleaning /calibration for free.




  
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Patbil10
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Oct 19, 2017 10:56 as a reply to  @ Scoobert's post |  #132

Sorry to see you've had rough luck with Canon glass. I'm experiencing quite the opposite....:-)


Canon 5D Mark IV, Canon EOS M5, Canon EF 24-70mm f/2.8L II,Canon EF 70-200mm f/2.8L IS II,Canon EF 100mm f/2.8 macro, Sigma 35mm Art, Tamron SP 85mm f/1.8, EF-M 22mm f/2, Canon ef-m 15-45, Rokinon 14mm f2.8 and other stuff...

  
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Scoobert
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Oct 19, 2017 11:03 |  #133

Patbil10 wrote in post #18476026 (external link)
Sorry to see you've had rough luck with Canon glass. I'm experiencing quite the opposite....:-)

Oh I have had good luck too, I love my 135 f2. Never an issue.

Just that overall I find them no more or less reliable (including focus issues) then the tamron lenses. Only difference being that after just 1 year one of those cost a LOT of money to repair while the other is free for 5 more years.




  
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Post edited 6 months ago by TeamSpeed. (2 edits in all)
     
Oct 19, 2017 11:05 as a reply to  @ Patbil10's post |  #134

It seems Nikon has steadily been improving the menu structure and even the D850 brings some additional changes. I simply do not see the same complaints these days as in past years regarding this topic in the Nikon communities.

So I counter your "not true" with "I think it is true", unless you have a list of current list of active topics on the web where established Nikon owners (and not some Canon users that switched to Nikon for a while and want to come back) are still complaining about menus and how Canon is better with the most recent Nikon offerings? :)


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TeamSpeed
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Oct 19, 2017 11:08 as a reply to  @ wallstreetoneil's post |  #135

To add to what was already stated, I will ask this question: So a 16x20 print taken with a 20Mpx camera vs a 50Mpx camera is going to show more blur with the higher res version? The only way you can see increased blur on a high res body is if you are cropping heavily, are pixel peeping deeply, or are printing very, very large.

Otherwise the blur across both outputs occupy the same physical distance on both with the same settings.

You only need to raise your shutter speeds if you go 80% or further into the image file when viewing, when cropping out heavily (which is the same result as pixel peeping), or are printing extremely large, and I would even argue that isn't really an issue, because the larger the print, the farther the viewing distance...


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