Why do a lot of people have this desperate need to make money from photography?

[Tim S]

Originally Posted by va_rider

What other hobby sustains itself?

I enjoy riding my motorcycle as a hobby... I don't expect people to pay me to do so....

I enjoy cooking as a hobby.... I don't open a restaurant...

No hobby really pays for itself. That's why it's a hobby and not a job. Running a business isn't fun. It isn't something you do to pass the time. For me, there's no way to kill something I enjoy doing more quickly than by making it my job.

I enjoy taking photos... therefore.. I pay for the equipment I want to use to take those photos.

I'm curious.. name a hobby that pays for itself.

While you ride as a hobby, if you raced and won would you expect part of the purse? Or would you just say "No thanks, I'm just an amateur."?

If all your friends told you your dinner parties were amazing and the food was fabulous, the thought would never enter your mind about possibly opening a restaurant?

This smells a little elitist, did a GWAC tick you off?

[S.Horton]

Originally Posted by fotoworx

I wanted to shoot for Playboy and Penthouse, but my wife put the Kibosh on that

I wanted to be an exotic dancer, but the old age homes don't pay that well. Audience keeps falling asleep. Poor tippers.

[ChunkyDA]

A guy I work with goes fishing every weekend and has a freezer full of fish, which I suppose he eats. He has never once offered to give me any. Should I be upset when he asks me to take a picture of his kids playing soccer?

[z0diac]

Originally Posted by fotoworx

Why do a lot of people have this desperate need to make money from photography? Not talking about professionals of course who make a living from photography, just the hobbiests that seem to have an almost desperate need to get back something monetarily from photography.

I ponder this often when reading a lot of people threads on different photography forums worldwide, this 'need' to make money from photography. Why do so many people have this drive to make money from their hobby? Why do so many people see photography (their hobby) as some sort of cash cow?

Don't say it's a way to recoup monies spent on pricey equipment. There's many many costlier hobbies and pursuits than photography and people don't see the need to charge (even family members!) others to get some money back on their expenditure like many photographers seem to do.

Because they've 'produced' something? Honestly, you've pushed a button on an electronic handheld computer and it's captured an image......good for you () (ok I've taken some liberty there, but you get the idea).

I've given away so many framed prints of images to people who have commented that they liked a photo of mine. I was tickled pink to do this. I didn't start adding up the cost of the equipment used to capture the image, the cost of the software to manipulate it, the cost of the paper to print it, the cost of the ink to print it, the cost of the printer that was printing it. I was just happy being generous to a family member or a friend.

One of my other hobbies is woodturning. XXXXX amount of dollars tied up in machinery, tools and exotic wood blanks. When you've spent hours and sometimes days making something from a rough piece of wood into a beautiful and functional piece of 'art' you can really say you 'made it'. I've made hundreds of pieces and given every single one of them away. I'm not unusual here, in my group of "woodies" they all give their 'art' away for free. They don't see the need to recoup on their outlay of machinery and wood, nor make money from their 'art'.

Another pastime is water skiing and wakeboarding. My boat is worth XXXXXX the thought has never crossed my mind when family, friends and friends of friends are being towed behind me to ask them for a cheque or better yet have a credit card point of sale device on board so that after their go they can pay me for the privilege.......so that I can recoup some of my outlay.

The examples of hobbies and pastimes that cost a lot of money to do could go on and on.

So what is this inexplicable (at least to me) need for lots of people to charge money for photography? What stops people from being generous, even with their own family members when it comes to taking photos and giving images away?

What is it that overcomes some people as soon as they purchase a camera, unbox it and think "I'm going to make some money from this"?

When it comes to photography, some of us do seem a little precious.

One word: GREED

I don't think many people try to sell their photos to simply recoupe their costs of camera gear. That's about as stupid as someone taking a job simply to pay for the gas it takes them to drive to work.

Generally, if people think they can make a dime off something, they'll try to do so. Always has been that way, always will be.

The day people stop liking money is the day they'll stop trying to make it off their photos. Plain and simple.

[j-dogg]

troll thread is troll

[kevkong]

if someone is willing to pay, why not?
making $ with your hobby is the best job in the world

[Clean Gene]

Originally Posted by z0diac

One word: GREED

I don't think many people try to sell their photos to simply recoupe their costs of camera gear. That's about as stupid as someone taking a job simply to pay for the gas it takes them to drive to work.

Generally, if people think they can make a dime off something, they'll try to do so. Always has been that way, always will be.

The day people stop liking money is the day they'll stop trying to make it off their photos. Plain and simple.

You can say that it's greed, but I doubt that most of the amateurs (or people for whom it's not their primary form of income) are really raking in the big bucks.

BTW, I don't think your first analogy really works. Because the topic creator specifically said that he WASN'T talking about people for who photography is their primary income. You're right, I certainly DON'T go to work to recoup the money on gas, because my job is my job. That's not equivalent to those who DON'T have a job in photography, and yet still want to bring in some money doing it. A better analogy would be a chili enthusiast going to a chili festival with the hopes of maybe selling some of his chili.

Anyway, greed? Who's greedy? We can point the finger all day. We can say that the photographer is greedy for wanting money, and we can say that other people are greedy for wanting free photos. But considering that most of the people we're talking about probably aren't getting much out of it, I'm not even sure that "greed" is the right word.

I think the more correct and abstract way of looking at it is simply this: people generally don't do stuff for other people unless they're looking to get something out of it. One dude might say, "hey...this guy is getting prints that he loves, there's nothing wrong with me asking for a few bucks in return. That's not so unreasonable." Another guy might happily give away free prints to people, happy in the knowledge that he's causing the recipient to feel some joy. But if that recipient then starts talking about how awful and crappy those pictures are, then the photographer who gives his stuff away for free is likely to change his mind. He's likely to say, "if that dude doesn't appreciate what I'm giving him, then **** him. No more free prints for him."

In either case, we are merely talking about incentives. Nothing more, nothing less. Money is an incentive, and it is not inherently any more or less valid than any other.

Here's the funny thing: look over the threads that have been on the first page today. You've got this topic, about how asking money in exchange for photographs/etc is greedy. We've got another topic, about how doing photography for free is devaluing photography as a whole. We've got a professional photographer giving 100 little snippets of advice and truisms, one of which is "photography isn't a hobby, it's a lifestyle."

And I think that last one really sums up what's going on here. Because THAT is the one that clearly and explicitly states the "photography is X, and if you don't do it that way, you're doing it wrong." THAT is the problem. That we've got a LOT of "photographers" who've found the right path for themselves. The path that fits their motives and incentives and is working very well for them. And that's fine and good. But then they sort of get the idea that...if it's working for me, that's the way to do it.

And...no. One dude will tell you that photography is a hobby. Another dude will tell you that it's a lifestyle. One dude will tell you that you're an idiot to give away your work for free. Another dude will tell you that your work is worthless, so if you want people to see it then you'd might as well give it away for free. That's just a *shocking* consequence of the fact that not everyone wants to get the same thing out of photography. Yes, most people have different motives and incentives for doing photography, and it is the VERY rare case in which I tell someone that they're just wrong. That's almost sort of like telling someone that their religion is stupid. Sure, I might not believe it. But if it's working for them and they're getting out of it what they want to get out of it, then trying to convince them otherwise is usually just foolish.

Concern oneself with oneself, not everyone else. If giving away free photos gives you what you want to get out of photography, then have at it. Likewise, if asking money for photos gives you what you want out of photography, then have at it. In either case, as long as neither party is getting screwed, then I don't see anything wrong. The good thing about photography is that it isn't X or Y. It's whatever the photographer wants it to be, provided that they get out of it what they want to. Incentives differ. Some people want money, some people want respect (or whatever). None of that bothers me one bit. A "my way or the highway" mentality sure as hell doesn't work, especially when talking about something that EVERYONE can do. That's an easy freaking way to clog that route up so much that no one ever gets anywhere. If EVERYONE did things the right way (whatever that way is) and followed rules about how "photography should be this or that", then I doubt that ANYONE would be happy about the result.

[Nmcgrew]

^ lots of words

[Amamba]

I think it has more to do with trying to justify to self the cost of "pro" gear (whatever pro means for different people), than with actually wanting to make a profit. Somehow buying a $$$ "professional" tool causes some people to feel guilty & seek some sort of validation, even as they spend $$$$$ for obvious toys like cars and boats without feeling any need to explain it.

[V4her]

First, I am not a thin skinned photographer. Oops! Wrong thread!

I have actually been a very casual photographer for the past three three years and on and off over the past 25 years. I am getting tired of my regular job, but know I can't outright retire early

Maybe. With some help from NYIP and a few more years of real practice, I'll have some income from the avocation. Otherwise, I will be, hopefully, better at this art of photography.

[paulymaccc]

Well, speaking as a strictly hobbyist, some of it could come from their significant others. I have no desire to go out and find a client to shoot. On the other hand, my wife wants for me to spend all my free time trying to find someone to shoot to help recoup expenses. I get away with photographing the grandbaby just enough to keep her off my back sometimes. It seems that spouses don't understand that a filter or a new tripod can cost the same as a cart of groceries. But that is just my .02 cents.

[S.Horton]

Maybe they admire professionals so much, they want to be just like them. Minus the assignment requirements. Without the deadlines. Without uploading from the nearest Starbucks at midnight to get paid. Without having to color correct and send for print. Or the custom framing, custom post processing. No CS5 expense, insurance, backup gear, long glass, specialty lenses. And, of course, without the obligation to a actually write and perform to a contract.

You know, play professional only on TV.

[Clean Gene]

Originally Posted by haozoudao1988

I think some people get into photography for the wrong reasons.

If you don't love it, you won't make much money anyway so why bother.

I started it because I love it and I love the way looking through a lens changes your view of life and things we normally take for granted.

If I make a buck or two here and there for nice shots,

it's just a bonus but not a goal

I'm not even sure that there ARE any "wrong" reasons (unless it's hurting someone, be it the photographer or anyone else).

The nice thing about photography is that everyone has their own reasons. You decide your own level of involvement. It's not the same thing for me as it is for you, him, or that other guy. And that's a wonderful, marvelous thing.

I hate to be a parrot, but I've just gotta say it again...I think that more people could stand to stop worrying about what the other guy is doing, and concern oneself with oneself. Am I getting out of photography what I want to get out of it? If the answer is "yes", then that's wonderful. And if the answer is "no", then I should ask myself what I am doing wrong.

[fotoworx]

Originally Posted by paulymaccc

my wife wants for me to spend all my free time trying to find someone to shoot to help recoup expenses.

That's interesting. Why does she think there is money to be made from photography?

[familyphil]

Hi
I think its because it allows you to be your own boss, work your own hours and be creative. But, there are others who see photography as a hobby to enjoy. Of course there is a huge market for photography today and its all about marketing it. Some sites I've been on give their photos for free. But of course have affiliate links on their sites and maybe making some money off them.
Family Phil
family-portrait-poses.com