SX10/20/1 Actual Infinity.......

[Pagman]

When In Manual focusing on my 10IS, When I want to photograph something in the distance like airway aircraft, is Infinity as far on the scale as it will go or back off abit? as I understand that on DSLR lenses this allowance is made to allow the lens to move forward past the Infin 8 logo and resets back.
Any Ideas as sometimes I get out of focus shots(not shake) at the full position.

[Pagman]

In response to my post above, I took quite a few pictures today In glorious sunshine of "yes again" my fave subject - Aircraft on airways, but for ease and speed of taking the pictures I left my SX10IS on manual focus and all the way to the end of the scale, but all pictures left like this were out of focus, yet those left In autofocus and small bracket were sharp focus.

Any Ideas why......?

[neimad19]

I have found too that shooting long distances with manual focus can result in out of focus shots when compared to shooting in auto. Im not exactly sure why (hopfully some one can shed some light) but i think it might be that we under estimate how far the reach of Infinite focus is. If infinite focus will focus on something upto, lets just say for example, 1000m away and your shooting something 800m it will be out of focus yet once on auto the camera can properly identify the object is 800m and set the focus a little under infinite. Again, i could be completely wrong..just having a stab in the dark

[exwintech]

Neimad19 - While it's quite usual in DSLRs, the SX10's Focus Bracketing is unusual for P&S. See Manual Page 130 for SX10 ( SX20/p89 - SX30/p90 - SX40/p92.)

It 'brackets' the focus-distance in the setting you make - and in presets nearer and further than that. There are 3 preset distance options. You must be in MF mode to use it, of course.

With the SX10/20 I find the middle setting to be most practical - though with the different lens setup in the SX30/40, that might not be so.

As it brackets the 3 shots at 'Continuous Shooting' speed - using a rest or tripod is advisable.

Perhaps with these SXxx cameras, Canon realised that focus in MF can "float" a bit - and provided Focus Bracketing to help.

The expectation of an 'accurate' infinity setting in a long-zoom digital P&S - that works as well as the infinity setting on, say, an old metal full-manual Takumar 55mm f/1.8 lens, is rather more than a "bit hopeful".

So what Canon has done with these cameras might be as good as can be done.

My Fuji HS10 doesn't have the function - and in longer zoom MF shots I tend to 'rock' the zoom-ring on the barrel either side of "best sharp" to reset the apparent to eye "good" focus. While they look the same in viewfinder - or LCD on tripod - 3 or 4 shots - magged-up a bit - can have rather different focuses.... The Canon idea is better and easier to use - as it gives "3 distances" in one frame-up and shutter press.

Regards, Dave.

[Pagman]

Originally Posted by exwintech

Neimad19 - While it's quite usual in DSLRs, the SX10's Focus Bracketing is unusual for P&S. See Manual Page 130 for SX10 ( SX20/p89 - SX30/p90 - SX40/p92.)

It 'brackets' the focus-distance in the setting you make - and in presets nearer and further than that. There are 3 preset distance options. You must be in MF mode to use it, of course.

With the SX10/20 I find the middle setting to be most practical - though with the different lens setup in the SX30/40, that might not be so.

As it brackets the 3 shots at 'Continuous Shooting' speed - using a rest or tripod is advisable.

Perhaps with these SXxx cameras, Canon realised that focus in MF can "float" a bit - and provided Focus Bracketing to help.

The expectation of an 'accurate' infinity setting in a long-zoom digital P&S - that works as well as the infinity setting on, say, an old metal full-manual Takumar 55mm f/1.8 lens, is rather more than a "bit hopeful".

So what Canon has done with these cameras might be as good as can be done.

My Fuji HS10 doesn't have the function - and in longer zoom MF shots I tend to 'rock' the zoom-ring on the barrel either side of "best sharp" to reset the apparent to eye "good" focus. While they look the same in viewfinder - or LCD on tripod - 3 or 4 shots - magged-up a bit - can have rather different focuses.... The Canon idea is better and easier to use - as it gives "3 distances" in one frame-up and shutter press.

Regards, Dave.

Hi Dave, How do you think focus bracketing would work with my distant(very distant) aircraft subjects, that appear at infinity when i toggle between AF and manual, and not being able to use a tripod because of them flying in different directions and like when at an airshow needing to be free movement to turn in all directions and to gain vantage points.
I tried moving the manual focus bar guide till it fully filled the bar, so was at max-infinity(so i would have imagined) and i also didd'nt expect to find alot of difference in sharpness between just a small amount of movement on the man focus scale of a subject with an AP of f5,7 and with no DOF to worry about. its not like im going from 5ft away to 5/10/15 miles away.

Pagman

[Pagman]

Originally Posted by exwintech

Neimad19 - While it's quite usual in DSLRs, the SX10's Focus Bracketing is unusual for P&S. See Manual Page 130 for SX10 ( SX20/p89 - SX30/p90 - SX40/p92.)

It 'brackets' the focus-distance in the setting you make - and in presets nearer and further than that. There are 3 preset distance options. You must be in MF mode to use it, of course.

Regards, Dave.

Im wondering how the bracketing would get on with manual focus set to full infinity, as surely it could'nt select past their only at that position and 2x closer, as its 3 positions, or would it perhaps say error as it could'nt go - 1 step further?
What do you think?

P



Pagman

[neimad19]

Originally Posted by exwintech

Neimad19 - While it's quite usual in DSLRs, the SX10's Focus Bracketing is unusual for P&S. See Manual Page 130 for SX10 ( SX20/p89 - SX30/p90 - SX40/p92.)

It 'brackets' the focus-distance in the setting you make - and in presets nearer and further than that. There are 3 preset distance options. You must be in MF mode to use it, of course.

With the SX10/20 I find the middle setting to be most practical - though with the different lens setup in the SX30/40, that might not be so.

Thanks for shedding some light!

[canoncreate]

I cannot upload photos from my iPad the choose file options does not light up. Help please.

[hnikesch]

On my powershots I can use infinity setting not manual. In program I have options for closeup, normal and infinity. I also have manual focus but setting to infinity works for the type of shots you are talking about.

Hans

With CHDK you can also force infinity

[exwintech]

Pagman - I think that Focus Bracketing is only going to be functional at a distance where the manual focus is manually changeable. That is - where you're holding steady enough to track the aircraft and manually "visibly" alter the focus while doing so.

At 10 or 15 miles that does seem rather unlikely. Our 560mm-equiv is pretty good - but that's stretching things quite a bit... The intention is probably to get a sharp shot at such distances - then crop to get it larger in the frame. With the type of lens - P&S zoom - and JPEGs - that seems too difficult...

Sharp images of aircraft at 10-miles sounds more like 800mm+ prime lens, and pull it up in RAW processing. Which is several light-years out of my wallet-range, sadly...

But - at air-shows - much of the time the aircraft are very much closer than 10-miles. When you can visibly change the MF while holding on the aircraft, Focus Bracketing should work. The question then becomes - can you hold consistently steady for 3 shots at 1.4fps?

Note that when you're Panning - the SX10-etc have a separate shake-reduction setting for panning-mode - it corrects up-down movement but doesn't apply on horizontal.

Actually - if I was trying to track-pan something moving relatively fast to the camera - I'd put the SX10 aside and use my Fuji HS10... The MF is a ring on the barrel - left thumb - and it has fast-continuous. 12fps is too fast - I'd try 7fps with JPEGs (7 saved) - or 5fps with RAW (fastest it does with RAW, also 3fps), but it only saves 5 RAWs - would be my choice... The darned thing doesn't have Panning-SR. So that'd still be rather "hopeful" - track and do multi shots - and hope 1 or 2 per burst were usable or recoverable.

Regards, Dave.

[Pagman]

Many thanks for the replies, i guess i was trying to establish if infinity is basicaly a case of just pushing the man focus scale up as far as it will go, and leave it their for all distant shots, knowing that with the combination of fairly fast shutter speed and still hand-all shots should be in sharp focus.....

[Pagman]

I guess this is about as good as Im gonna get, used AF Tracking with small frame and centre spot metering, still not sure about manual focusing as my results with that have been to inconsistant as the manul focus scale seems to move quite abit even when It Is supposed to be at Infinity, especially with the safety manual focus.
By the way at an aperature of between f5.7 and f8 wouldnt sutch small amounts of focus at/around Infinity make very little difference because of the hyperfocul focus etc, or do very small movements on the manual focus scale change the d.o.f by mutch......

[Pagman]

Im still a loss with where "True Infinity" Is In relation to the manual focus slide on thease cameras, I cant find mention of It anywhere on the net or In my manual, and experimenting with my camera doesnt resolve the problem.

Cant anyone on here come up with the concise answer as to - Is infinity on thease cameras - sx1/10/20/30/40 achieved by filling the manual focus bar as far to the top as It goes

Sorry to have repeated myself but this Is a small but "out of focus" annoying problem.

[Jon]

No, it isn't. Moving MF as far as it goes just focuses the lens as far as it goes, which is what AF requires, and amounts to beyond infinity.

[Pagman]

Originally Posted by Jon

No, it isn't. Moving MF as far as it goes just focuses the lens as far as it goes, which is what AF requires, and amounts to beyond infinity.

How Is It possible to aquire Infinity In thease cameras quickly and accuaratly and keep set their so anything at the same distance Is In sharp focus, I have tried AFB, and Manual focus lock, bur find myself changing and messing between AF Servo/Manual and I find the DOF different on the same object at the same time, Indicating either MF or AF Is In focus