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Old 14th of January 2014 (Tue)   #1
Azuma
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Default 70D focus issue & blurred pictures

Hi 70D user,

may you could check if your 70D has issues with lens apertures of 1.2 to 2.8 !
In Germany nearly 30-50% of all 70D's have a bad focus problem with lens apertures of 1.2 to 2.8 !

The Cameras are not able to produce sharp pictures if you make them at a distance of 17+ feet

Issues are:

-Mostly in small (compared to the overall picture) to be focused objects
- So often at remote distances
- When lens aperture of 1.2 to 2.8 the problem has been observed and is at low depth of focus most clearly or at all visible
- Often the problem occurs only with the Middle AF sensor

if you make pictures via LiveView the pictures are much shaper!

here are some videos which show the issues:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DjGgKI4tIhw

http://www.bluetopas.com/Fotograf/fo...st_70D_10.html


Canons statement is: There is no issue....

Last edited by Azuma : 14th of January 2014 (Tue) at 14:57.
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Old 14th of January 2014 (Tue)   #2
artyH
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Default Re: 70D focus issue & blurred pictures

Did you have this problem? I read about this on another forum and wondered how frequent it really is.
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Old 14th of January 2014 (Tue)   #3
Azuma
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Default Re: 70D focus issue & blurred pictures

yes, I have it too. Mine is at the Canon service right now
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Old 14th of January 2014 (Tue)   #4
Azuma
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Default Re: 70D focus issue & blurred pictures

We're wondering why in other countries no one has this issues, so I would like you ask you guys dirctly if you could check it. With the normal kit lens aperture, this issue isn't evident
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Old 14th of January 2014 (Tue)   #5
hairy_moth
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Default Re: 70D focus issue & blurred pictures

Welcome to the Forum.

A friend of mine has a 70D and uses the 70-200 F/2.8L II -- she is getting stunning results at f/2.8.

I would suggest that you search the net and/or forum for instructions on how to calibrate your lens (AKA microadjust). The techniques used to calibrate will give you measurable results in a controlled environment that will prove or disprove your theory that your camera/lens is not able to achieve focus. Note: I am not suggesting that you actually go in and change the settings, just that the calibration setup provides good diagnostics.

It is fairly common that people with new cameras or lenses (especially ones that are difficult to use because of the narrow Depth of Field afforded with f/1.2) blame the equipment, when the problem turns out that they have not mastered the techniques required to handle the equipment, so please forgive me if I am skeptical that you actually have a hardware problem.
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Last edited by hairy_moth : 14th of January 2014 (Tue) at 08:17.
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Old 14th of January 2014 (Tue)   #6
Azuma
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Default Re: 70D focus issue & blurred pictures

Quote:
Originally Posted by hairy_moth View Post
Welcome to the Forum.

A friend of mine has a 70D and uses the 70-200 F/2.8L II -- she is getting stunning results at f/2.8.

I would suggest that you search the net and/or forum for instructions on how to calibrate your lens. The techniques used to calibrate will give you measurable results in a controlled environment that will prove or disprove your theory that your camera/lens is not able to achieve focus. Note: I am not suggesting that you actually go in and change the settings, just that the calibration setup provides good diagnostics.

It is fairly common that people with new cameras or lenses (especially ones that are difficult to use because of the narrow Depth of Field afforded with f/1.2) blame the equipment, when the problem turns out that they have not mastered the techniques required to handle the equipment, so please forgive me if I am skeptical that you have a hardware problem.


Hi hairy_moth,

everything was done.
Professionals have this issue too, we're trying since 2 months to handle this issue. Some guys had up to 8 Cams and just one of this had no focus issue.

In our german forum, we have right now up to 45 users with this issue.

houndred of test were done, comparable to the 7D, 100D, 1000D, 650D... every of this cameras had sharp pictures.
But the 70D has up to 50-60% defective pictures

Last edited by Azuma : 14th of January 2014 (Tue) at 08:22.
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Old 14th of January 2014 (Tue)   #7
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Default Re: 70D focus issue & blurred pictures

I'm curious: is it front focusing, back focusing or is it inconsistent.
When you switch to manual focus, and use the LCD screen at 10X, are you able to achieve sharp results (i.e., is this just an AF problem) or is the problem persistent no matter what method was used for focusing?

Is anything in focus or are you just getting blurry shots?
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Last edited by hairy_moth : 14th of January 2014 (Tue) at 09:37.
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Old 14th of January 2014 (Tue)   #8
gabebalazs
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Default Re: 70D focus issue & blurred pictures

Azuma, does this happen more often with shorter focal length lenses, such as 35mm, 50mm f/1.4, f/1.2 etc?

My first 7D about 4 years ago had the same problem. Center point AF sucked with certain fast lenses, but not all (more often with shorter FL fast primes shooting at greater distances). Most often it was severe front focus (e.g. trying to focus on the house across street and the camera + lens focused 8 feet away AND gave a nice AF confirmation.) Interestingly, one of those lenses was the Canon 17-55 2.8 IS. Off-center points were fine. It must have been the extra sensitive center point system that screwed up. I sent it to Canon twice and came back the same way. My refurb Canon 7D (the one I'm selling now) did not have this problem.
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Last edited by gabebalazs : 14th of January 2014 (Tue) at 09:33.
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Old 14th of January 2014 (Tue)   #9
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Default Re: 70D focus issue & blurred pictures

Azuma . . . I see that you posted on my thread with regards to focus in another section. I thought I'd add my 2 here.

This is interesting. I'm working on MFA on my lenses for my 70D using FoCal. My 40/2.8 calibrated just fine with FoCal at 2.8. My 50/1.4 on the other-hand did, not calibrate properly at 1.4. FoCal complained of "unexpected results" and the focus was all over the map. FoCal was unable to come back with an MFA number for the lens.

I figured that I had made an error in my setup. I had used my "light duty" tripod (Manfrotto 293 with ballhead), which isn't particularly sturdy. I had also printed up the calibration charts myself on regular bond on an inkjet. I had the calibration chart brightly lit, but the poor chart and potentially shaky tripod might have affected the results.

I'm going to try to improve my FoCal process to see if it works out better the second time around. I may also try on a T1i to see if FoCal can come up with an MFA number for my 50/1.4 on that.

If my 70D needs to go in for warranty work, I won't be able to send it in for a couple of months yet.
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Old 14th of January 2014 (Tue)   #10
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Default Re: 70D focus issue & blurred pictures

Quote:
Originally Posted by neacail View Post
This is interesting. I'm working on MFA on my lenses for my 70D using FoCal. My 40/2.8 calibrated just fine with FoCal at 2.8. My 50/1.4 on the other-hand did, not calibrate properly at 1.4. FoCal complained of "unexpected results" and the focus was all over the map. FoCal was unable to come back with an MFA number for the lens.
In my experience, FoCal has returned failed results for a number of body and lens combinations so I wouldn't put too much stock in that.

Also, the 70D is a newer body and there have been reports that FoCal doesn't work properly with the 5D3.
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Old 14th of January 2014 (Tue)   #11
neacail
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Default Re: 70D focus issue & blurred pictures

Quote:
Originally Posted by joeblack2022 View Post
In my experience, FoCal has returned failed results for a number of body and lens combinations so I wouldn't put too much stock in that.

Also, the 70D is a newer body and there have been reports that FoCal doesn't work properly with the 5D3.
Good to know. If it fails again, I'll pull out the playing dice and see if I can get it calibrated manually with consistent results.

I've printed up the charts with one of the good laser plotters here at work, which I probably should have done in the first place anyway to ensure the best results possible.
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Old 14th of January 2014 (Tue)   #12
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Default Re: 70D focus issue & blurred pictures

The problem with calibration, which is in itself a good thing, is that in my experience many Canon bodies AF slightly differently under different light conditions. If you set your MFA perfectly in natural daylight, it may be off next time you use the same body + lens under incandescent light indoor.
Not sure if anybody else has the same experience.
but this has nothing to do with the AF problems discussed in this topic, I thought I would just add it to the calibration discussion.
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Old 14th of January 2014 (Tue)   #13
hairy_moth
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Default Re: 70D focus issue & blurred pictures

Here is a thread that discusses some techniques of micro adjustment.
http://photography-on-the.net/forum/...ad.php?t=10526
It is easy to diagnose the problem you are having yourself.
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Old 14th of January 2014 (Tue)   #14
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Default Re: 70D focus issue & blurred pictures

Very good procedure for carry out microadjust on an EOS is at http://www.birdphotographers.net/for...ustment-tricks.

Canon has a good write up as well at
http://www.learn.usa.canon.com/resou..._article.shtml.
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Old 14th of January 2014 (Tue)   #15
Azuma
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Default Re: 70D focus issue & blurred pictures

Test series 1a with Sigma 17-50 / 2.8 OS HSM on a carbon stative
One Shot AF, Manual AF point selection, mean field
Result: 2 of 10 so sharp that I would be satisfied. The rest pretty much next to it, none of them extremely wrong.

Test series 1b with Sigma 17-50 / 2.8 OS HSM on a carbon stative
One Shot AF, Manual AF point selection, middle panel, dimmed f4.0
Result: all 10 images identical sharp. Not great, but the lens is also not great.

Test Series 2 with Sigma 17-50 / 2.8 OS HSM above the mean field
Result: all 10 images identical sharp despite open aperture

Test Series 3 with Sigma 17-50 / 2.8 OS HSM on a carbon stative
One Shot AF, Manual AF zone selection, middle zone
Result: 2 of 10 unacceptable, the rest could be worse, 1-2 of them halfway okay. Looking at the AF points used in Aperture to varies the 70D field between two elections.

Test Series 4 with Canon 100 / 2.8 Macro, f2.8 on a carbon stative
One Shot AF, Manual AF point selection, mean field
Result: sharpness at all acceptable, the images appear 7-9 "foggy", the rest sharp.

Test series 5 with Canon 100-400L @ 200mm, f5.0 (minimum)
One Shot AF, Manual AF point selection, mean field
Result: very similar images sharp, with good will two "outliers"

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...ihen_CBaum.zip



Test series 6a with Canon 50 / 1.8 II,
One Shot AF, Manual AF point selection, middle panel, f1.8
Results: 20 images (10 am, 10 pm) reaches no useful sharpness. Aside from the basic blur the lens at the OB fails here the AF. However, there are a few "outliers", the result is uniformly bad.

Test series 6b
One Shot AF, Manual AF point selection, AF point above the central field, f1.8
Result: all 20 images comparable, slightly sharper than 1a, but not really good. Nevertheless, when using this AF field of the AF hits better and more consistently than in the middle field. Here again, 10 shots in the morning, 10 in the afternoon.

Test series 7
One Shot AF, Manual AF point selection, mean AF, f2.2
Result: minimally sharper than 1.8, with two wild outliers any way bad results

Test series 8
One Shot AF, Manual AF point selection, mean AF, f2.8
Result: 2 desert outliers in total lean sharpness, slightly better than OB, comparable f2.2

After that, I took my Sigma 17-50 / 2.8 again.

Test number 9, Sigma 17-50
One Shot AF, Manual AF point selection, middle panel, f2.8
Result: almost unusable sharpness. But this time at least no outliers, but lean throughout.

Test number 10, Sigma 17-50
One Shot AF, Manual AF point selection, AF point above the middle, f2.8
Result: very similar images sharp, no outliers, significantly better than in the middle field, consistently useful for a cheap lens.

Link to a zip with all the test series:

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...6-10_CBaum.zip
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