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Thread started 09 Oct 2015 (Friday) 21:32
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5DS in 1.3x (APS-H) crop mode for moving subjects

 
Perfectly ­ Frank
Goldmember
Joined Oct 2010
Oct 09, 2015 21:32 |  #1

Anyone shoot moving subjects or sports with the 5DS in 1.3x APS-H crop mode?
This mode gives 30mp images.

Although not designed as a sports camera, I've seen some action images taken with the camera and the IQ looks fantastic.
I read were one user claims that the 5DS AF is actually a bit faster than his 5D3. I believe frame rate and buffer size may
be a drawback for the 5DS.

Here's why I'm asking...I shoot aviation with my 1DMKIV, which has a 1.3x APS-H sensor. But at times I wish I had more
than 16mp to crop from. The 5DS will give me 30mp, which is more than enough for me. I'm thinking of renting the 5DS to
use along with my 1DMKIV.

Ok, any comments?


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BigAl007
Cream of the Crop
Joined Dec 2010
Repps cum Bastwick, Gt Yarmouth, Norfolk, UK.
Oct 10, 2015 05:41 |  #2

Frank if you shoot RAW, and really you should for the added DR, then any of the internal crop modes of the 5DS are redundant. All they actually do is apply a soft crop to the full sized file, which can at times be difficult to get rid of if you change your mind. The RAW file stays the same size, even with the APS-c crop mode you get a full sized RAW file.

Personally I would love a 5DS for airshows, with the same linear resolution as a 7DII just about I could crop out a nice frame filling shot using my new 150-600C when the aircraft are still at a distance (Safety distances at the larger shows here in the UK seem to be quite a bit more than at comparable shows in the US) For closer/larger aircraft though you have 2.56× the sensor area to catch them with. Last Sunday I was at the last UK airshow of the year, at the shuttleworth collection, and it was the last formal public display of the Vulcan bomber. I could only just fit that in the frame at the closest point at 150mm. All that extra room would have been nice, I could probably have kept the focal length longer and filled the full 35mm frame. I would buy or rent a 5DS in a heartbeat but unfortunately the place I rent from is charging £203 for a three day rental, although if you order it right you can have it for five days at that price (or six if you pick a bank holiday weekend). It is a lot too expensive for me though, although I suppose I could convince one of my product photography clients that they need to get some super high res images in the correct week for a show :).

Alan


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Perfectly ­ Frank
THREAD ­ STARTER
Goldmember
Joined Oct 2010
Oct 10, 2015 22:45 |  #3

BigAl007 wrote in post #17739810 (external link)
Frank if you shoot RAW, and really you should for the added DR, then any of the internal crop modes of the 5DS are redundant. All they actually do is apply a soft crop to the full sized file, which can at times be difficult to get rid of if you change your mind. The RAW file stays the same size, even with the APS-c crop mode you get a full sized RAW file.

Thanks, I didn't know that. So even in crop mode the camera writes a 50mp image to the memory card. That would really slow things down.

BTW, I just came back from an air show today. I used my 150-600 C with my 1D4. The day before the show I updated the lens firmware, and set it to dynamic OS.
At the show I experimented with Focus-speed & Focus-accuracy priority modes. Tomorrow I'll I download the images and analyze the results.

Thanks BigAl for the info.


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davesrose
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2,788 posts
Joined Apr 2007
Atlanta, GA
Oct 10, 2015 23:38 as a reply to Perfectly Frank's post |  #4

link (external link)

Acording to the digital picture's review of the 5DS, you can either set a "soft" crop that masks a 50MP image, or you can also set a 1.6x image resolution (making 19MP).


Canon 5D mk III , 7D mk II
EF 135mm 2.0L, EF 70-200mm 2.8L IS II, EF 24-70 2.8L II, EF 50mm 1.4, EF 100mm 2.8L Macro, EF 16-35mm 4L IS, Sigma 150-600mm C, 580EX, 600EX-RT, MeFoto Globetrotter tripod, grips, Black Rapid RS-7, CAMS plate and strap system, Lowepro Flipside 500 AW, and a few other things...
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BigAl007
Cream of the Crop
Joined Dec 2010
Repps cum Bastwick, Gt Yarmouth, Norfolk, UK.
Oct 11, 2015 06:30 |  #5

davesrose wrote in post #17740761 (external link)
link (external link)

Acording to the digital picture's review of the 5DS, you can either set a "soft" crop that masks a 50MP image, or you can also set a 1.6x image resolution (making 19MP).

But not in RAW, in RAW you only have soft crop options, that do not reduce the file size. Depending on your choice of RAW software you might or might not be able to recover the soft crop. It is only when recording directly to JPEG that the crop is a hard crop. This is actually a direct result of how Canon's, and most other RAW files work. The sensor has some masked sensels around the edge of the frame, which are important as they are used for things like setting the black point. So they cannot be removed from the file.

It is easy to see this in the camera specifications, if you look at estimated file sizes you will see that in RAW for each of the different crop formats both the file size, on card, and the buffer depth is the same. The only way to reduce the file size is to use M/S-RAW, but with those options you reduce image resolution, you don't crop, and for a situation where you need to maintain the maximum resolution for cropping those are not good choices.

Alan


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davesrose
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Joined Apr 2007
Atlanta, GA
Post has been edited over 2 years ago by davesrose.
Oct 11, 2015 07:17 as a reply to BigAl007's post |  #6

If that's the case, then it seems Canon's implementation is different then Nikon's approach to crop (their RAWs do get smaller in DX mode). Nikon's implementation makes sense, since you can also use DX lenses on FX bodies (and the FX bodies go into crop mode). Canon's approach doesn't seem as useful. Most photographers buying a 5DS are shooting RAW. Maybe some do like having a soft crop for visualizing a 1.3 or 1.6 size. But then that seems pretty pointless since you usually try to maximize resolution by framing as much as you can.


Canon 5D mk III , 7D mk II
EF 135mm 2.0L, EF 70-200mm 2.8L IS II, EF 24-70 2.8L II, EF 50mm 1.4, EF 100mm 2.8L Macro, EF 16-35mm 4L IS, Sigma 150-600mm C, 580EX, 600EX-RT, MeFoto Globetrotter tripod, grips, Black Rapid RS-7, CAMS plate and strap system, Lowepro Flipside 500 AW, and a few other things...
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Perfectly ­ Frank
THREAD ­ STARTER
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Joined Oct 2010
Oct 11, 2015 17:08 |  #7

Well that's a bummer, because I only shoot raw.


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BigAl007
Cream of the Crop
Joined Dec 2010
Repps cum Bastwick, Gt Yarmouth, Norfolk, UK.
Oct 12, 2015 06:21 |  #8

Perfectly Frank wrote in post #17741610 (external link)
Well that's a bummer, because I only shoot raw.

Well you still have all of that resolution to crop from, it's just that you might was well record all of the 36×24mm sensor area, as the file size and buffer depth will be about the same. OK if I were doing this I would need to spend about £100 on some additional CF cards so that I had the same number of exposures available to me, and expand the computer storage a bit, but that seems worthwhile for the possible advantages. It's not like file sizes haven't always been getting bigger, there is almost a 4× increase from my first DSLR, a 300D to my current one, a 50D, so I am not really surprised about another fourfold increase in file size to go from there to the very latest Canon camera.

Alan


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Perfectly ­ Frank
THREAD ­ STARTER
Goldmember
Joined Oct 2010
Oct 12, 2015 15:17 |  #9

BigAl007 wrote in post #17742155 (external link)
Well you still have all of that resolution to crop from, it's just that you might was well record all of the 36×24mm sensor area, as the file size and buffer depth will be about the same. OK if I were doing this I would need to spend about £100 on some additional CF cards so that I had the same number of exposures available to me, and expand the computer storage a bit, but that seems worthwhile for the possible advantages. It's not like file sizes haven't always been getting bigger, there is almost a 4× increase from my first DSLR, a 300D to my current one, a 50D, so I am not really surprised about another fourfold increase in file size to go from there to the very latest Canon camera.

Alan

Right on. The camera does seem interesting. Most likely I'll rent it for a couple of days.


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andywrightphoto
Mostly Lurking
18 posts
Joined Nov 2015
Dec 02, 2015 12:13 |  #10

I shoot a lot of 15mm Fisheye images and I really like the APS-H 1.3x crop with this lens as it takes out a lot of the wackiness the lens produces in the corners of the shots. I didn't know the 5DS had a in-camera crop, this is great news.




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5DS in 1.3x (APS-H) crop mode for moving subjects
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