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FORUMS Other Digital Cameras Fuji Digital Cameras
Thread started 19 Oct 2017 (Thursday) 18:30
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switching to fuji - wireless flash question/red beam assist

 
kaitanium
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Post has been last edited 3 months ago by kaitanium. 10 edits done in total.
Oct 29, 2017 16:21 |  #16

Yes i will be buying a XT2 when prices drop when the rumored XT2s comes out. I just wanted to get as much opinion and thoughts as im not going to go in willy nilly and waste rental or purchase money if it just doesnt stack up to user reviews. But since from what ive seen, reviews are 50/50, i think its a good bet to go out and get one to try. Now if the majority were saying no, then that be a different story. Two Hot Shoes has said that the cam works decently with Godox's red AF beam so thats the go-ahead for me. I may pickup the EFx500 anyways too. I dont really care about the white light. I rather get my shot than to worry about annoying people. It is annoying i agree however.

Two Hot Shoes wrote in post #18483738 (external link)
There is no mirrorless camera that can use IRAF assist, even your Canon DSLR cannot use it in live view. The best you can get is Godox's red AF laser assist. That works OK and I've found the TT685f to be reliable, in the limited time I've used it.

Can you expand on what you mean when you say "OK"? Does that mean, its just ok? Or is ok = excellent or does ok mean it works sometimes but not all the time? Does ok mean good? Any reason you didnt go for the li-ion 860 version?

If in case i need to stick with 2 systems ill probably just hold onto my x100T or upgrade to whatever the equivalent is with flip out screen if fuji ever does it. I dont want another interchangeable lens system. That or ill seriously start considering the canon m5 + adapter to EF (blah). Sidenote, i shot at iso 3200 the other day in a very dark setting and the pics on the x100T are incredible still. I could have never done that with my omd! Fuji is FOR SURE my travel camera of choice. Now if I can say fuji is my work camera of choice that would be doubly awesome.

I also have no tolerance for AF issues when working a hired event. I agree with you Alan that the canons are spot on fast, reliable, and accurate. The 5D2 was a godsend when i finally upgraded from my 5dc years ago. I havent actually noticed a difference going from my 5d2 to 5d3 however. I mostly went with the 5d3 upgrade because of better low light capabilities. I used to use the 5d3 with 50mm f1.2 and another 5d3 with 35mm f1.4 but have since sold the 35 and gotten a 16-35mk3 to consolidate my 35 and 16-35mk1. Less junk in the bag but also dont want to go all zoom either. This setup is blazing accurate and fast like you said. Whatever system that replaces the canon has some big shoes to fill.




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Two ­ Hot ­ Shoes
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Post has been edited 3 months ago by Two Hot Shoes.
Oct 29, 2017 18:26 |  #17

kaitanium wrote in post #18484105 (external link)
Can you expand on what you mean when you say "OK"? Does that mean, its just ok? Or is ok = excellent or does ok mean it works sometimes but not all the time? Does ok mean good? Any reason you didnt go for the li-ion 860 version?

If in case i need to stick with 2 systems ill probably just hold onto my x100T or upgrade to whatever the equivalent is with flip out screen if fuji ever does it. I dont want another interchangeable lens system. That or ill seriously start considering the canon m5 + adapter to EF (blah). Sidenote, i shot at iso 3200 the other day in a very dark setting and the pics on the x100T are incredible still. I could have never done that with my omd! Fuji is FOR SURE my travel camera of choice. Now if I can say fuji is my work camera of choice that would be doubly awesome.

The beam fires when the EV is too low, YMMV. I think it is good enough. Didn't go the 860 route as I have a large bag full of AA batteries and the cost of the flash compared to the TT685 was almost twice the price. The flashes are the same as far as I know other then the power & I haven't run out of power yet in any AA powered speedlight if I did I'd get the 860.

I shot the two systems side by side for for about a year before I decided I could drop the 5D3's in favour of the mirrorless. You can read a lot of things on the internet alright but make up your own mind from your own experience is the best you can do. A lot of people just regurgitate what they have read someone else writing about even if that person has little or no experience in what they say.


Fuji: X-PRO2, X-T1, X-E2 | 16/1.4, 18/2, 23/1.4, 35/1.4, 56/1.2, 90/2, 16-55/2.8, 10-24/4. AD600BM, TT865F, AL-H198, ThinkTank AS2, Peli1514, Ona Bowery, Matthews Grip
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kaitanium
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Post has been edited 2 months ago by kaitanium.
Dec 04, 2017 01:00 |  #18

Curious to hear what you fuji pros will think of the latest v3 firmware release on the XT2. My workplace just got XT2s in as the standard camera so finally ill be able to use them without dropping a dime myself.

I just bought myself 6dmk2s in the latest black friday deals to sort of "parallel upgrade" my 5D3s. Really want a flip out screen at minimum which is why I did that. But still itching for a smaller camera system, aka fuji. Rumors of the XH1 look sweet too but the starting price of that cam will be over my own personal limit.




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Post has been edited 2 months ago by Two Hot Shoes.
Dec 04, 2017 02:44 |  #19

You might do better posting that question in the X-T2 forum
http://photography-on-the.net ...showthread.php?p=18​509872


Fuji: X-PRO2, X-T1, X-E2 | 16/1.4, 18/2, 23/1.4, 35/1.4, 56/1.2, 90/2, 16-55/2.8, 10-24/4. AD600BM, TT865F, AL-H198, ThinkTank AS2, Peli1514, Ona Bowery, Matthews Grip
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AlanU
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Dec 04, 2017 16:02 |  #20

kaitanium wrote in post #18510060 (external link)
Curious to hear what you fuji pros will think of the latest v3 firmware release on the XT2. My workplace just got XT2s in as the standard camera so finally ill be able to use them without dropping a dime myself.

I just bought myself 6dmk2s in the latest black friday deals to sort of "parallel upgrade" my 5D3s. Really want a flip out screen at minimum which is why I did that. But still itching for a smaller camera system, aka fuji. Rumors of the XH1 look sweet too but the starting price of that cam will be over my own personal limit.


I think the V3 update was more for the AFC algorithm in moving subjects. The last firmware was the one that improved faster AF acquistion. My 56 f1.2 not rattles which is more audible than ever before attempting to get focus. I'm ok with that but it's definitely noticeable compared to the previous older firmware with slower AF speeds.

Image stabilization "in body" for fuji still doesn't make the X-t2 a deal breaker. Faster shutter speeds is what many appreciate as you get faster shutter speeds. If the new Fuji body improves the high iso performance as well as ibis that is a different story!!!! If your an available light shooter IBIS will not reduce motion blur. If your using a camera professionally motion blur is quite unacceptable for hired events as Uncle bob is fully capable of producing motion blur too!!! Higher iso capabilities is more important than IBIS IMO for events shooters and even for casual/family documentation. IBIS is great for static subjects or slow moving as long as you have decent shutter speeds. Video also appreciates ibis if your into that sort of thing.

Your 6dmk2 will very unlikely slow down in AF in low light. Use an older 430ex2 or any newer Canon flash and you'll get rock solid incedibly accurate captures in any kind of lighting using red focus assist.

As for Fuji EF-x500 flash........ buy a bunch of cheap Godox flashes as you'll have more for redunancy rather than spending more money on a single Fuji flash. I seldom ever use flash with my fuji and my brand new EF-x500 has already broke it's mechanical head position lock maybe using it 5x ??? I regret buying the fuji flash and not buying a bunch of cheap godox flashes.


5Dmkiv |5Dmkiii | 80D | 24LmkII | 35mm f/2 IS | 85 mkII L | 100L | EF-S 10-22 | 16-35L mkII | 24-70 f/2.8L mkii| 70-200 f/2.8 ISL mkII| 600EX-RT x2 | 580 EX II x2 | Einstein's
Fuji X-T2 w/battery booster | 16mm f/1.4 | 56 f/1.2 | 10-24 f/4.0 | 55-200 | EF-X500

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Two ­ Hot ­ Shoes
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Dec 04, 2017 16:38 as a reply to AlanU's post |  #21

Well IBIS will be great on the 56 and the 90 anyway, and probably handy on the wider lenses. But for events where I not using the flash for shutter I never let the shutter go below 1/125 in case your subject moves and in the case of the 90/2 probably more like 1/250 in case the camera moves, so IBIS will help there for sure. I'm all over the new camera, probably...

Fujifim stated in their press release for FW3:
New AF tracking algorithm for moving subject
Thanks to the newly developed image recognition algorithm, the update enhances AF-C to track moving subjects twice as fast as previous firmware. In addition, the update also enhances tracking to be able to capture up to 50% smaller moving subjects than before.

I don't have an X-T2 right now to test it on = :( Although getting the FW on the X-PRO2 for xmas = :)

PS lucky you getting a free X-T2

Alan, what did Fuji Canada say about your flash for warranty?


Fuji: X-PRO2, X-T1, X-E2 | 16/1.4, 18/2, 23/1.4, 35/1.4, 56/1.2, 90/2, 16-55/2.8, 10-24/4. AD600BM, TT865F, AL-H198, ThinkTank AS2, Peli1514, Ona Bowery, Matthews Grip
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AlanU
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Dec 04, 2017 20:07 |  #22

Two Hot Shoes wrote in post #18510587 (external link)
Well IBIS will be great on the 56 and the 90 anyway, and probably handy on the wider lenses. But for events where I not using the flash for shutter I never let the shutter go below 1/125 in case your subject moves and in the case of the 90/2 probably more like 1/250 in case the camera moves, so IBIS will help there for sure. I'm all over the new camera, probably...

Fujifim stated in their press release for FW3:
New AF tracking algorithm for moving subject
Thanks to the newly developed image recognition algorithm, the update enhances AF-C to track moving subjects twice as fast as previous firmware. In addition, the update also enhances tracking to be able to capture up to 50% smaller moving subjects than before.

I don't have an X-T2 right now to test it on = :( Although getting the FW on the X-PRO2 for xmas = :)

PS lucky you getting a free X-T2

Alan, what did Fuji Canada say about your flash for warranty?

I still haven't heard anything yet from the local Fuji rep :(

I've held off on buying any camera gear as of lately. The Godox TT685F is something to consider for flash......is that the one with good focus assist?


5Dmkiv |5Dmkiii | 80D | 24LmkII | 35mm f/2 IS | 85 mkII L | 100L | EF-S 10-22 | 16-35L mkII | 24-70 f/2.8L mkii| 70-200 f/2.8 ISL mkII| 600EX-RT x2 | 580 EX II x2 | Einstein's
Fuji X-T2 w/battery booster | 16mm f/1.4 | 56 f/1.2 | 10-24 f/4.0 | 55-200 | EF-X500

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Post has been edited 2 months ago by Two Hot Shoes.
Dec 05, 2017 03:09 as a reply to AlanU's post |  #23

Yes. The TT860 and 685 and the remote trigger have the af assist.

I hope Fuji do the right thing with the flash for you.


Fuji: X-PRO2, X-T1, X-E2 | 16/1.4, 18/2, 23/1.4, 35/1.4, 56/1.2, 90/2, 16-55/2.8, 10-24/4. AD600BM, TT865F, AL-H198, ThinkTank AS2, Peli1514, Ona Bowery, Matthews Grip
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Post has been edited 2 months ago by kaitanium.
Dec 05, 2017 17:24 |  #24

AlanU wrote in post #18510561 (external link)
Your 6dmk2 will very unlikely slow down in AF in low light. Use an older 430ex2 or any newer Canon flash and you'll get rock solid incedibly accurate captures in any kind of lighting using red focus assist.

yea which is why this is parallel shift for me from the 5D3. I know the 6D2 will perform just as well (and even better in live view!). I went to the 6D2 from my 5D3 really only because of the flip out screen. Im tired of lying down on the ground trying to get super low shots lol.

XH1 was never a deal breaker for me in considering a XT2. I dont care much for IBIS probably because im used to canon. But as you said, if they up the game in high ISO for the XH1, then the XT2 will be a harder sell for me! XT2 is already good enough for me in high ISO. Even with that said, I need fuji to equal canon in focusing before i can comfortably make a jump.




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kaitanium
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Dec 07, 2017 23:34 |  #25

Would you guys agree to this?

If you mount a EFx500 and use the LED as a focusing assist (not talking about the red light from the godoxs), the XT2 will be just as fast and accurate as a nikon/canon for low-light fast movement photography?

I have no doubts that any camera will hunt focus without proper contrast/light. I think the reviews ive been reading all test the camera naked without any sort of light to help it focus in low light.




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AlanU
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Dec 08, 2017 03:20 |  #26

kaitanium wrote in post #18513096 (external link)
Would you guys agree to this?

If you mount a EFx500 and use the LED as a focusing assist (not talking about the red light from the godoxs), the XT2 will be just as fast and accurate as a nikon/canon for low-light fast movement photography?

I have no doubts that any camera will hunt focus without proper contrast/light. I think the reviews ive been reading all test the camera naked without any sort of light to help it focus in low light.

To answer your question........ absolutely not even remotely close. My sole reason I purchased the EF-x500 $$$$ CDN prices was to test to see if my X-t2 could be comparable to my Canon bodies for fast paced events bounced flash work. The piercing white LED beam is not very effective in preventing !AF (cannot lock AF). It was a great disappointment that my X-t2 is not reliable like my mirrored bodies in AF in low light.

You're very familiar with how your Canon's react with the use of external flash red focus assist. I am NOT the type of photographer that can take over focus by manual focusing when Autofocus fails. This is my main reason why I still shoot with my familiar predictable mirrored Canon systems.

Your adaptation to Fuji AF in low light can be positive or negative. In event documentation I've now resorted to mirrored bodies for that application with full complete confidence in pitch darkness to fast moving subjects. When I have more luxury in time or static/slow moving subjects or if I'm more tolerant in missing some shots here and there I'll happily use my X-t2. I will admit I do find great joy shooting with Fuji but for different reasons.

I will make an assumption that a very high percentage of people at this day and age CANNOT manual focus as fast and accurately as modern day auto focus. When I get !AF message indicating fuji cannot lock on AF I will admit I CANNOT manually take over and capture with the speed of your typical auto focus lock.

I know my 10-24mm and 16mm still will hunt more often than not in low light events while my Canon virtually never hunts with red focus assist beam.

Red focus assist doesn't work in Servo mode with the Canon. However quick dance routines your new 6dmk2 should be able to lock AF on moving subjects in single shot mode with no effort with a speedlight and red focus assist.

I have little confidence in the EF-X500 as my broke with extremely limited use. Even though the EF-X500 is an OE "best" flagship fuji flash the build is questionable IMO. My flash head clicking lock that prevents the head from spinning failed completely on me and my flash is virtually brand new.

Godox is so cheap that it may possibly be better in the sense that you can buy multitple flashes at the price of one Fuji EF-x500. Redundancy will be your friend. I gladly pay Canon flash prices since HSS/TTL is proven "old tech" compared to Fuji's extremely slow evolution to HSS. EF-X500 still needs to have more revisions for prime time for the price you pay IMO.

I'm still open to experimenting with Godox flashes. At this moment in time any critical events work I will only use my Canon gear for bounced/remote flash work with absolutely rock solid AF. This has nothing to do with brand loyalty to Canon either. I'd use any mirrored Nikon body over my mirrorless Fuji for low light fast paced events work. I've yet to get the urge to throw my Canon camera against the wall due to sluggish AF or complete failure in lock. I've had many instances where I was frustrated with my X-t2. My "issue" is that I expect too much from my Fuji as I use my Canon bodies as a bench mark for capturing "ALL" of the moment in events.

Oddly if I'm shooting casually I'm way more tolerant and this is where I just enjoy Fuji ..it is what it is.........

I think if Fuji achieves Sony A9 level in "eye" focus and fast reliable low light focus there will be alot more "switching to Fuji".

On the topic of wireless/remote flash......google the quality of the remote flash bursts of Fuji and Canon. In this regard I prefer Canon mirrored lenses flash burst stars over Fuji flash burst "look". Fuji outdoor sunburst it appears many lenses require at least f/22 to get distinct points on the sunburst while f/11-f/14 is enough for my Canon mirrored bodies.

Here's one of my cars taken with my Canon w/ 16-35mm. I cannot achieve such a sunburst with my Fuji with 10-24mm. However I'll admit I never tried f/22 with my Fuji gear.


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5Dmkiv |5Dmkiii | 80D | 24LmkII | 35mm f/2 IS | 85 mkII L | 100L | EF-S 10-22 | 16-35L mkII | 24-70 f/2.8L mkii| 70-200 f/2.8 ISL mkII| 600EX-RT x2 | 580 EX II x2 | Einstein's
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Dec 08, 2017 03:42 |  #27

I've never used the LED on a strobe to light up for better AF On my cameras I have the AF assist lamp covered with a little bit of black tape so I can use the Godox AF assist beam when it's on the camera and no camera led when the flash is not on the camera. I really dislike those, so distracting.

I have used a LED to throw/bounce/feather a little bit of light during a couple of events, an Aputure Amaran AL-H198, but I prefer MF as it's just as quick once you put a little bit of practice into it, like any other aspect of you photography, and it won't ruin the mood of the event.


Fuji: X-PRO2, X-T1, X-E2 | 16/1.4, 18/2, 23/1.4, 35/1.4, 56/1.2, 90/2, 16-55/2.8, 10-24/4. AD600BM, TT865F, AL-H198, ThinkTank AS2, Peli1514, Ona Bowery, Matthews Grip
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Dec 08, 2017 08:57 |  #28

AlanU wrote in post #18513149 (external link)
To answer your question........ absolutely not even remotely close. My sole reason I purchased the EF-x500 $$$$ CDN prices was to test to see if my X-t2 could be comparable to my Canon bodies for fast paced events bounced flash work. The piercing white LED beam is not very effective in preventing !AF (cannot lock AF). It was a great disappointment that my X-t2 is not reliable like my mirrored bodies in AF in low light.

You're very familiar with how your Canon's react with the use of external flash red focus assist. I am NOT the type of photographer that can take over focus by manual focusing when Autofocus fails. This is my main reason why I still shoot with my familiar predictable mirrored Canon systems.

Your adaptation to Fuji AF in low light can be positive or negative. In event documentation I've now resorted to mirrored bodies for that application with full complete confidence in pitch darkness to fast moving subjects. When I have more luxury in time or static/slow moving subjects or if I'm more tolerant in missing some shots here and there I'll happily use my X-t2. I will admit I do find great joy shooting with Fuji but for different reasons.

I will make an assumption that a very high percentage of people at this day and age CANNOT manual focus as fast and accurately as modern day auto focus. When I get !AF message indicating fuji cannot lock on AF I will admit I CANNOT manually take over and capture with the speed of your typical auto focus lock.

I know my 10-24mm and 16mm still will hunt more often than not in low light events while my Canon virtually never hunts with red focus assist beam.

Red focus assist doesn't work in Servo mode with the Canon. However quick dance routines your new 6dmk2 should be able to lock AF on moving subjects in single shot mode with no effort with a speedlight and red focus assist.

I have little confidence in the EF-X500 as my broke with extremely limited use. Even though the EF-X500 is an OE "best" flagship fuji flash the build is questionable IMO. My flash head clicking lock that prevents the head from spinning failed completely on me and my flash is virtually brand new.

Godox is so cheap that it may possibly be better in the sense that you can buy multitple flashes at the price of one Fuji EF-x500. Redundancy will be your friend. I gladly pay Canon flash prices since HSS/TTL is proven "old tech" compared to Fuji's extremely slow evolution to HSS. EF-X500 still needs to have more revisions for prime time for the price you pay IMO.

I'm still open to experimenting with Godox flashes. At this moment in time any critical events work I will only use my Canon gear for bounced/remote flash work with absolutely rock solid AF. This has nothing to do with brand loyalty to Canon either. I'd use any mirrored Nikon body over my mirrorless Fuji for low light fast paced events work. I've yet to get the urge to throw my Canon camera against the wall due to sluggish AF or complete failure in lock. I've had many instances where I was frustrated with my X-t2. My "issue" is that I expect too much from my Fuji as I use my Canon bodies as a bench mark for capturing "ALL" of the moment in events.

Oddly if I'm shooting casually I'm way more tolerant and this is where I just enjoy Fuji ..it is what it is.........

I think if Fuji achieves Sony A9 level in "eye" focus and fast reliable low light focus there will be alot more "switching to Fuji".

On the topic of wireless/remote flash......google the quality of the remote flash bursts of Fuji and Canon. In this regard I prefer Canon mirrored lenses flash burst stars over Fuji flash burst "look". Fuji outdoor sunburst it appears many lenses require at least f/22 to get distinct points on the sunburst while f/11-f/14 is enough for my Canon mirrored bodies.

Here's one of my cars taken with my Canon w/ 16-35mm. I cannot achieve such a sunburst with my Fuji with 10-24mm. However I'll admit I never tried f/22 with my Fuji gear.

thumbnailHosted photo: posted by AlanU in
./showthread.php?p=185​13149&i=i217372534
forum: Fuji Digital Cameras

What happened to not being "enthusiastic" and sharing pictures of your work for examples?  :p

Also, https://www.amazon.com ...ds=starburst+filter​&psc=1 (external link)

kaitainium: A lot of us don't have any issues with the differences in AF between Fuji and a DSLR, but as Alan is adamant about pointing out, your mileage may vary. The only way to be sure is to try out the equipment yourself. I advise you in doing so to remember that it's not the same as a DSLR and you have to set up the camera with that in mind. You need to make sure it's in "high performance" mode and make sure you're aware of how the AF system works in relation to modes, point sizes, etc.

Lenses are also always a factor in how the cameras will AF. Newer fast glass will outperform older or slower glass when the light gets low.


Fuji X-Pro2 // Fuji X-T1 // Fuji X-100T // XF 18mm f2 // XF 35mm f1.4 // XF 60mm f2.4 // Rokinon 12mm f2 // Rokinon 21mm f1.4 // XF 18-55mm f/2.8-4 // XF 55-200mm f3.5-4.8 // Rokinon 85mm f1.4 // Zhonghi Lensturbo ii // Various adapted MF lenses
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Post has been edited 2 months ago by kaitanium.
Dec 08, 2017 10:21 |  #29

Good stuff. Thanks for the comments all.

Yea, i just picked up the godox and a cheap EFx500 to test with my XT2 work cameras. I cant drop cash on lenses for a camera that isnt mine but I figured dropping some cash to test the flash abilities may help with my decision.

Im also not ok with blasting people with a bright LED but i figured since the videographers at weddings do it, i may as well join in just to get the shot.




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Dec 08, 2017 17:39 |  #30

Report from the field, I use shooting an event & the Godox X1T and the TT685 where both utilising the AF assist tonight. It made focusing faster, the cameras locked on and the shots were sharp. YMMV.


Fuji: X-PRO2, X-T1, X-E2 | 16/1.4, 18/2, 23/1.4, 35/1.4, 56/1.2, 90/2, 16-55/2.8, 10-24/4. AD600BM, TT865F, AL-H198, ThinkTank AS2, Peli1514, Ona Bowery, Matthews Grip
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